tiamat63 Posted June 19 Report Share Posted June 19 10 years ago, this off season, the Browns marched headfirst into the 2014 campaign with their starting receivers as follows. - Miles Austin's one good hamstring - Nate Burleson - Andrew Hawkins - Travis Benjamin - Some guy named Josh Gordon. As a collective, it might have been the more underwhelming group in the NFL, especially when you factor in Big Smoke Gordon himself basically playing 25% of the season. How time fly's. Fast forward 10 years, the Browns are set to start 2024 with a WR group that could either be the teams strength, or a giant paper tiger that never reaches its potential. Shall we? Amari Cooper. Despite his current contract holdout and absence from OTA's, is your current "#1". By that, I mean beyond just your classic X; can also work all over the formation on the strength of having some of the very best footwork in the NFL. The downside being, like I said, his contract and the occasional drop. Something the Cowboys and the Browns are willing to live with, in exchange for the + abilities he brings to the field. One of the few receivers who can make that claim. He's the man of this group, and provides the Browns with the best option they've had since Odell in 2019 and Braylon in 2007. Jerry Jeudy. The new comer and the Browns skill player target the last two off-seaons. His ability to function as the Z, but also all over the formation, made him such a high priority get. While a lot this is based on potential, the flashes, even in a low-volume offense like the Broncos, were readily obvious when I went to watch their games. Credit to Andrew Berry and the front office for consistently spending little capital and getting players through free agency that can contribute for it. Granted, I have concerns about JJ getting up to speed and finding chemistry in such a quick, single off-season; but the potential, stemming from his days at Bama, is absolutely there. Cedric Tillman. Another victim of an up-and-down passing game in 2023. A promising rookie, coming in from a Vols offense with a steep learning curve heading into the NFL. In the mold of JJ, there were brief glimpses last year of great body control, strong hands and quality footwork. He'll fill that classic, boundary X role in a similar mold of other bigger-bodied WRs that didn't have elite wheels. His emergence would possibly work to further accelerate Amari Coopers eventual departure. As a perimeter receiving threat is a role player currently lacking outside of Coop. Elijah Moore. Production that never matched the hype. Although the ability is there, his numbers (lack of) were a result of QB play, route structure and play calls. Some of the more effective things, such as using him from the backfield, created positive targets. But the route selection, using him more on the perimeter and down field was questionable design by Stef and the rest of the coaching staff. He was routinely squeezed by DBs and his 4.4 speed was misused down field. Along with JJ, it is my hope that Moore sees the next biggest increase to his game with the addition of Ken Dorsey to the staff. David Bell. Not really much to be said. A former B1G 1st teamer and mid round pick. He still has the potential of developing into a reliable NFL receiver, but right now he's 5th in the pecking order in the WR room and 6th in targets (including Nkoju). A taller, smooth, route technician with limited burst. At this point, it would take injury for him to see significant playing time. Jamari Thrash. The speedy rookie out of Louisville. He was the leading receiver at Ga State, then transferred to Louisville and lead the team in receiving his one season there. His best abilities are his work at the line, smooth stride and great burst, along with having a 2nd gear to stretch the field. His work along the intermediate and top of the route, through contact and breaks that don't continue upfield, needs a great deal of work. But his hands and strength to make contested catches is below average, along with an 11.3% drop rate. He's a good athlete with good wheels, but the things that make a good athlete into a good, well rounded NFL receiver, are in need of serious coaching and conditioning. He'll need to add strength and technique if he wants to carve out a role beyond special teams and the occasional gadget snaps. The rest of the lineup is a 'who'? Of who's. Michael Woods James Proche Jalen Camp Matt Landers Practice squad, camp and pre-season bodies. The majority of NFL teams carry 6 receivers on the active roster. The last 4 names will fight for practice squad and auditioning for other teams. It's a bit of an enigma. This group, with the health of Watson, could the the strongest unit on the team apart from the Dline. Or they could be a complete paper tiger where Cooper half hearts his game saving his body for another payday elsewhere, Tillman fails to progress, Moore piles up more injuries and Jeudy never finds chemistry in the passing game. You'd hope more of the former then the latter, so fingers crossed for good health. Here are my questions to you. - Do you think Amari will be given a contract extension with the Browns? - Which WR will lead the Browns in targets? - Which WR will lead the Browns in catches? - Which WR will lead the Browns in receiving yards? - Which WR will lead the Browns in TD receptions? 2 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
syd Posted June 19 Report Share Posted June 19 24 minutes ago, tiamat63 said: Nate Burleson love Nate but he never made the team, as far as Cooper I like him a lot also. But if they could go younger with a guy like Brandon Aiyuk. I know they would Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tiamat63 Posted June 19 Author Report Share Posted June 19 13 minutes ago, syd said: love Nate but he never made the team, as far as Cooper I like him a lot also. But if they could go younger with a guy like Brandon Aiyuk. I know they would The worst part, is that I had Taylor Gabriel on there, and specifically remember that Burleson was a goner with the pre-season goose eggs. But for some reason, still put Nate's name up. That's a solid, My bad. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dutch Oven Posted June 19 Report Share Posted June 19 Man, this group IS one big question mark. Will Cooper be extended? Do the Browns wonder that his age and perhaps that he might be a questionable fit in the revamped offense makes an extension worth it? Can they tap into Jeudy's potential after Denver failed to? Will the new offense show us the Elijah Moore people were promising last training camp? Did Cedric Tillman do the off-season work needed to make the big jump from willing blocker who looked like he had no idea what routes to run during his rookie season to someone who can really contribute? You are right tia, this is a group that could really swing on the ol' proverbial pendulum from 'Strong' to 'Wildly Disappointing'. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
syd Posted June 19 Report Share Posted June 19 6 minutes ago, tiamat63 said: The worst part, is that I had Taylor Gabriel on there, and specifically remember that Burleson was a goner with the pre-season goose eggs. But for some reason, still put Nate's name up. That's a solid, My bad. Na man it's cool. I was so pulling for Nate to make the team. So if you think there was a way to trade for Aiyuk and give him Coopers money would you do it ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
syd Posted June 19 Report Share Posted June 19 3 minutes ago, tiamat63 said: Taylor Gabriel LOL I forgot about him Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
syd Posted June 19 Report Share Posted June 19 2 minutes ago, Dutch Oven said: Tillman from ota's good things have been said Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dutch Oven Posted June 19 Report Share Posted June 19 27 minutes ago, syd said: love Nate but he never made the team, as far as Cooper I like him a lot also. But if they could go younger with a guy like Brandon Aiyuk. I know they would This would be an interesting idea. He's been pretty damn productive in a run-first offense and is four years younger than Cooper. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
syd Posted June 19 Report Share Posted June 19 16 minutes ago, Dutch Oven said: This would be an interesting idea. He's been pretty damn productive in a run-first offense and is four years younger than Cooper. well he is very productive in any kind of offensive scheme. What would it cost us for a trade ? How much should he be paid ? and what to do with Cooper ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
syd Posted June 19 Report Share Posted June 19 don't you just love the off season ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ibleedbrown Posted June 19 Report Share Posted June 19 55 minutes ago, tiamat63 said: The worst part, is that I had Taylor Gabriel on there, and specifically remember that Burleson was a goner with the pre-season goose eggs. But for some reason, still put Nate's name up. That's a solid, My bad. Willie Snead was the dude l liked that year in camp. Browns sorta lucked out in landing 2 udfa rookies who eventually carved out pretty good careers for themselves. Alas, Willie didn’t make the cut that year. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Orion Posted June 19 Report Share Posted June 19 1 hour ago, tiamat63 said: - Do you think Amari will be given a contract extension with the Browns? - Which WR will lead the Browns in targets? - Which WR will lead the Browns in catches? - Which WR will lead the Browns in receiving yards? - Which WR will lead the Browns in TD receptions? Amari Cooper Every receiver on the team needs Amari Cooper on the team. A proven veteran star. When he's on the field, everyone else has it just that little bit easier. It would be quite useful if Tillman would be a good receiver. He's a WR that seems to pride himself on his blocking. An Admirable trait. I'm pullin' for him! Thrash, Moore & Judy. We need a couple of these guys to be good. The ability of this group to work well with Watson is what will determine the 2024 destiny of the Browns. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tiamat63 Posted June 19 Author Report Share Posted June 19 10 hours ago, Dutch Oven said: Man, this group IS one big question mark. Will Cooper be extended? Do the Browns wonder that his age and perhaps that he might be a questionable fit in the revamped offense makes an extension worth it? Can they tap into Jeudy's potential after Denver failed to? Will the new offense show us the Elijah Moore people were promising last training camp? Did Cedric Tillman do the off-season work needed to make the big jump from willing blocker who looked like he had no idea what routes to run during his rookie season to someone who can really contribute? You are right tia, this is a group that could really swing on the ol' proverbial pendulum from 'Strong' to 'Wildly Disappointing'. Coops extension would likely be for two years, 3 max. With a voidable after the first year that will pay him what he's set to hit at - around 20mil. It's the best of both worlds. You keep your #1, you allow the other receivers to develop and grow within the offense before they take over. But the intended future of this squad is Ceddy, JJ and possibly Moore. I'm not worried about Tillman and his work. He's capable and had the flashes. Only how that pairs with the QB situation. 11 hours ago, syd said: Na man it's cool. I was so pulling for Nate to make the team. So if you think there was a way to trade for Aiyuk and give him Coopers money would you do it ? Love Aiyuk, but he's also the beneficiary of a team that gives him a lot of help from their running game. So the question becomes, how much can he produce on a team that will be hit and miss to run the rock at times? I admittedly haven't watched enough coaches on him to give you an answer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tiamat63 Posted June 19 Author Report Share Posted June 19 10 hours ago, Ibleedbrown said: Willie Snead was the dude l liked that year in camp. Browns sorta lucked out in landing 2 udfa rookies who eventually carved out pretty good careers for themselves. Alas, Willie didn’t make the cut that year. Fun part about Snead, he went on to be pretty productive for Breesy and the Saints. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flugel Posted June 19 Report Share Posted June 19 17 hours ago, tiamat63 said: 10 years ago, this off season, the Browns marched headfirst into the 2014 campaign with their starting receivers as follows. - Miles Austin's one good hamstring - Nate Burleson - Andrew Hawkins - Travis Benjamin - Some guy named Josh Gordon. As a collective, it might have been the more underwhelming group in the NFL, especially when you factor in Big Smoke Gordon himself basically playing 25% of the season. How time fly's. Fast forward 10 years, the Browns are set to start 2024 with a WR group that could either be the teams strength, or a giant paper tiger that never reaches its potential. Shall we? Amari Cooper. Despite his current contract holdout and absence from OTA's, is your current "#1". By that, I mean beyond just your classic X; can also work all over the formation on the strength of having some of the very best footwork in the NFL. The downside being, like I said, his contract and the occasional drop. Something the Cowboys and the Browns are willing to live with, in exchange for the + abilities he brings to the field. One of the few receivers who can make that claim. He's the man of this group, and provides the Browns with the best option they've had since Odell in 2019 and Braylon in 2007. Jerry Jeudy. The new comer and the Browns skill player target the last two off-seaons. His ability to function as the Z, but also all over the formation, made him such a high priority get. While a lot this is based on potential, the flashes, even in a low-volume offense like the Broncos, were readily obvious when I went to watch their games. Credit to Andrew Berry and the front office for consistently spending little capital and getting players through free agency that can contribute for it. Granted, I have concerns about JJ getting up to speed and finding chemistry in such a quick, single off-season; but the potential, stemming from his days at Bama, is absolutely there. Cedric Tillman. Another victim of an up-and-down passing game in 2023. A promising rookie, coming in from a Vols offense with a steep learning curve heading into the NFL. In the mold of JJ, there were brief glimpses last year of great body control, strong hands and quality footwork. He'll fill that classic, boundary X role in a similar mold of other bigger-bodied WRs that didn't have elite wheels. His emergence would possibly work to further accelerate Amari Coopers eventual departure. As a perimeter receiving threat is a role player currently lacking outside of Coop. Elijah Moore. Production that never matched the hype. Although the ability is there, his numbers (lack of) were a result of QB play, route structure and play calls. Some of the more effective things, such as using him from the backfield, created positive targets. But the route selection, using him more on the perimeter and down field was questionable design by Stef and the rest of the coaching staff. He was routinely squeezed by DBs and his 4.4 speed was misused down field. Along with JJ, it is my hope that Moore sees the next biggest increase to his game with the addition of Ken Dorsey to the staff. David Bell. Not really much to be said. A former B1G 1st teamer and mid round pick. He still has the potential of developing into a reliable NFL receiver, but right now he's 5th in the pecking order in the WR room and 6th in targets (including Nkoju). A taller, smooth, route technician with limited burst. At this point, it would take injury for him to see significant playing time. Jamari Thrash. The speedy rookie out of Louisville. He was the leading receiver at Ga State, then transferred to Louisville and lead the team in receiving his one season there. His best abilities are his work at the line, smooth stride and great burst, along with having a 2nd gear to stretch the field. His work along the intermediate and top of the route, through contact and breaks that don't continue upfield, needs a great deal of work. But his hands and strength to make contested catches is below average, along with an 11.3% drop rate. He's a good athlete with good wheels, but the things that make a good athlete into a good, well rounded NFL receiver, are in need of serious coaching and conditioning. He'll need to add strength and technique if he wants to carve out a role beyond special teams and the occasional gadget snaps. The rest of the lineup is a 'who'? Of who's. Michael Woods James Proche Jalen Camp Matt Landers Practice squad, camp and pre-season bodies. The majority of NFL teams carry 6 receivers on the active roster. The last 4 names will fight for practice squad and auditioning for other teams. It's a bit of an enigma. This group, with the health of Watson, could the the strongest unit on the team apart from the Dline. Or they could be a complete paper tiger where Cooper half hearts his game saving his body for another payday elsewhere, Tillman fails to progress, Moore piles up more injuries and Jeudy never finds chemistry in the passing game. You'd hope more of the former then the latter, so fingers crossed for good health. Here are my questions to you. - Do you think Amari will be given a contract extension with the Browns? - Which WR will lead the Browns in targets? - Which WR will lead the Browns in catches? - Which WR will lead the Browns in receiving yards? - Which WR will lead the Browns in TD receptions? Great write-up on the WRs - thanks T! Yes Amari Cooper will get a contract extension. Answers to your questions are as follows: Amari Cooper will lead the Browns WRs in targets, catches, receiving and TD receptions. I'll give you the specifics after the season ends. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
calfoxwc Posted June 19 Report Share Posted June 19 Amari Cooper is the star of the wr group. They need to pay him what he's worth. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dutch Oven Posted June 20 Report Share Posted June 20 16 hours ago, Flugel said: Great write-up on the WRs - thanks T! Yes Amari Cooper will get a contract extension. Answers to your questions are as follows: Amari Cooper will lead the Browns WRs in targets, catches, receiving and TD receptions. I'll give you the specifics after the season ends. You really have to think this will get done, but.... When has this current regime drug their feet when it comes to a contract extension? Hell, they've given extensions to guys I figured were going to have to be salary cap victims without hesitation. But we all saw Amari Cooper going into this season on his last year of the deal, but as we are hurtling towards training camp, still no deal. I hope they can extend him, obviously, but as the 90s musical super power C.C. Music Factory once said: This is a thing that makes you go hmmm.... 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AP1 Posted June 20 Report Share Posted June 20 Great analysis and input. In a similar vein to Dutch's thoughts on the pendulum swinging from Strong to Mildly Disappointing, I think this group has the most pressure and, probably, the most to prove. Amari Cooper is coming off the best back to back years in his career. Can he maintain his production? He also wants paid, my guess is that will land in the $23M-$25M/year range. I believe they will lock him up. I'm not ready for the Browns to need to find another WR1, especially given that LT1 has some uncertainty. Jerry Jeudy's contract is also one based upon expectation that he will continue averaging 15 yards a catch. I'm also ready for Cedric Tillman and David Bell to show the league why they were drafted. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ibleedbrown Posted June 20 Report Share Posted June 20 59 minutes ago, Dutch Oven said: But we all saw Amari Cooper going into this season on his last year of the deal, but as we are hurtling towards training camp, still no deal. I hope they can extend him, obviously, but as the 90s musical super power C.C. Music Factory once said: This is a thing that makes you go hmmm.... The longer the standoff lasts, the more it’s gonna make you sweat… Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dutch Oven Posted June 20 Report Share Posted June 20 9 hours ago, Ibleedbrown said: The longer the standoff lasts, the more it’s gonna make you sweat… But if an extension can be brokered between the two camps, we could officially say: "Everybody dance now!" And with that, we have exhausted all C&C Music Factory references. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flugel Posted June 20 Report Share Posted June 20 I try not to make too much out of what happens at OTAs. Having said that, the repetition of it all is much needed for the younger guys in particular. Anyway, here's an article I thought I'd share about 3 guys that impressed some people at the OTAs before it all goes live pads a month from now. Since one of them is a WR Tia wrote about - why not? https://www.clevelandbrowns.com/news/3-standouts-from-browns-minicamp-x5596 3 standouts from Browns minicamp The Browns wrapped up three days of minicamp to finish out the offseason program Jun 14, 2024 at 03:33 PM Kelsey Russo Staff Writer The Browns officially wrapped up their offseason program as minicamp ended on Thursday. The next time they will all be at CrossCountry Mortgage Campus will be in July for the start of training camp. So, the Browns used the last three days to their advantage, with an energetic and competitive atmosphere on the practice fields each day. They saw the return of QB Deshaun Watson to throwing in 7-on-7 drills, and the defense brought a high level of spirit to the red zone drills. And while it was a productive few days for the Browns as an entire team, a few players stood out over the course of the three days of minicamp – which consisted of mostly low-tempo practices with the only true full-speed work in the 7-on-7 drills. Cedric Tillman Tillman stood out among the receiving corps as he took a number of reps throughout drills and caught passes from QB Deshaun Watson, QB Jameis Winston during offensive drills and 7-on-7 periods. He caught an intermediate pass during 7-on-7 from Watson and another in a red zone drill with CB Martin Emerson Jr. closely defending him in the end zone. Wide receivers coach Chad O'Shea was impressed by Tillman throughout camp. O'Shea said Tillman was constantly in the building working out and didn't miss a day of preparation during OTAs and heading into minicamp. Tillman finished his rookie season with 21 receptions for 224 receiving yards, as well as one carry for eight yards. With the work Tillman has put in, O'Shea sees that improvement in year two. "He has taken every rep and used that as an opportunity to become better," O'Shea said. "Can't say enough about how well he's done on the field for us as far as his work ethic and making plays. I think he's more confident in year two, which you would hope is the case with a young player. But Cedric, I just spoke to him and spoke to the group about how impressed we've been with him and how much he's improved, and to see his development has been really great as a coach to see." Martin Emerson Jr. Emerson had some standout moments over the course of minicamp that showcased his ability to defend and break up passes. On the final day of minicamp, Emerson broke up a pass intended for TE David Njoku during a 7-on-7 red zone drill. He also tightly defended a reception by Tillman in the end zone. Emerson is entering his third season with the Browns after a successful sophomore season where he led the team with four interceptions for 24 yards and tied for the team lead with 14 passes defended. He also ended the 2023 season with 59 tackles and one tackle for loss. Cornerbacks coach Brandon Lynch highlighted Emerson's consistency over the course of camp, especially in the 7-on-7 drills. "I know that we talk a lot about versatility, but really consistency and being available," Lynch said. "He's an extremely tough young guy who's accountable. He's resilient to the details, and he shows it on display." Mike Hall Jr. The rookie defensive tackle fit in well with the defensive line during minicamp. He appeared strong in all the drills as he showcased his speed, athleticism and his ability to rush the passer. Defensive line coach Jacques Cesaire saw up close what Hall could bring to the defensive line and was impressed with Hall throughout OTAs and into minicamp. "Mike's been great," Cesaire said. "He's been really serious and just all about ball. He's explosive. He knows how to rush already. We're tweaking some things right now with him, but he's physical, he's fast. I love the way he's cornering right now, and he's just scratching the surface of what he can do for us in this defense." 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flugel Posted June 20 Report Share Posted June 20 12 hours ago, AP1 said: Great analysis and input. In a similar vein to Dutch's thoughts on the pendulum swinging from Strong to Mildly Disappointing, I think this group has the most pressure and, probably, the most to prove. Amari Cooper is coming off the best back to back years in his career. Can he maintain his production? He also wants paid, my guess is that will land in the $23M-$25M/year range. I believe they will lock him up. I'm not ready for the Browns to need to find another WR1, especially given that LT1 has some uncertainty. Jerry Jeudy's contract is also one based upon expectation that he will continue averaging 15 yards a catch. I'm also ready for Cedric Tillman and David Bell to show the league why they were drafted. Thanks AP1! In a game that's all about the matchups today, the Browns WR Corps would like a JV roster without Cooper going up against the teams in the AFC North. His dynamic commanding the most attention - helps our other Receivers and even our Pro Bowl TE with their matchups. I'm confident they'll sign him when they need to. Cooper isn't a guy that blows off his conditioning. Dawand Jones, on the other hand, showed up so out of shape last year - and he later went on even if it's just coincidentally. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ibleedbrown Posted June 20 Report Share Posted June 20 I’ll play a little devil’s advocate with Amari Cooper. With the Browns going full on Oprah with extensions the last few years and doing interesting accounting things to kick cans down roads to make it work within the cap, l don’t think they had any intention of paying Coop any real money outside of the 5 year deal he signed with Dallas (which we picked up the tab for the final 3 years of it). He’s a fantastic receiver, but this is also his age 30 season, and l don’t know where $20 mil fits in the highest paid receiver list these days, but l’m pretty sure it’s a respectable amount. I’m not sure l’d be inclined to extend him. I think their thought process was for Jeudy to eventually be the number 1 dude and this is the transition year for that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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