Hue Jackson clarifies comments he was paid to lose with Cleveland Browns

[Unsympathetic]

8 hours ago, Bob806 said:

So I'm not trying to be insulting here, but you grossly misinterpreted my statement.

A court ruling isn't going to magically make people accepting of race, religion, etc. That comes from within an individual. 

If someone takes me to court over my hatred of the Ratbirds & Steelers, I'm not going to magically turn and embrace them.....it's part of who I am, I just could never get on board with it.

I understand the cause- minority candidates are tired of being passed over. When Flores was fired I was shocked. I suppose this lawsuit could perhaps lead to some type of Affirmative Action situation where a judge rules an ___% of NFL Head Coaches must be minorities.....is that what we want? 

You'd be helped by reading the lawsuit -- your "statement" is addressed on the cover page before the claims are enumerated.

Morals cannot be legislated -- but behavior can be regulated.

I'm not trying to be insulting here, but it sure reads to me like you came to this thread with the intent to spread factual inaccuracies about the lawsuit.

 

This case is not about morality -- YOU are attempting to shift the discussion by inventing a completely fake version of both Flores' claim and his proposed remedy.. which is of course the classic dodge of someone who knows they're guilty but doesn't want to admit it.

Flores has facts, and has listed them as his claims.  If the jury buys his logic, he wins and the NFL loses.  And.. those claims are pretty numerous and well-sourced, and the NFL knows it. This entire thing will actually boil down to collection of yes-or-no questions: Was this law violated, yes or no? And repeat for each law.  Plenty of case history to go by to determine if the laws have been violated -- this isn't random.

 

If you either understood "the cause" or had read the actual lawsuit you would know that the list that is proposed to address the grievances is actually quite well thought-out and complete.  Listed at the end.  You may not agree with all, but it's definitely not "Just Affirmative Action" .. because just like Flores did when he coached, he thought this through much more than random white guys trying to insult him did.

 

As well, the laws cited that he's asserting have been violated are :

Section 1981 of the Civil Rights Act of 1866 (“Section 1981”), the New Jersey Law Against Discrimination, (“NJLAD”), the New York State Human Rights Law, N.Y. Exec. Law §§ 290 et seq. (“NYSHRL”) and the New York City Human Rights Law, N.Y.C. Admin. Code §§ 8-101 et seq. (“NYCHRL”).

 

The proposed list of redress of grievances :

1] Increase the influence of Black individuals in hiring and termination decisions for General Manager, Head Coach and Offensive and Defensive Coordinator positions;
a. Ensure diversity of ownership by creating and funding a committee dedicated to sourcing Black investors to take majority ownership stakes in NFL Teams;
b. Ensure diversity of decision-making by permitting select Black players and coaches to participate in the interviewing process for General Manager, Head Coach and Offensive and Defensive Coordinator positions;
2] Increase the objectivity of hiring and termination decisions for General Manager, Head Coach and Offensive and Defensive Coordinator positions;
a. Require NFL Teams to reduce to writing the rationale for hiring and termination decisions, including a full explanation of the basis for any subjective influences (e.g., trust, personality, interview performance, etc.);
b. Require NFL Teams to consider side-by-side comparisons of objective criteria, such as past performance, experience and objective qualifications;
3] Increase the number of Black Offensive and Defensive Coordinators;
a. Create and fund a training program for lower-level Black coaches who demonstrate an aptitude for coaching and an interest in advancing to a Coordinator position;
4] Incentivize the hiring and retention of Black General Managers, Head Coaches and Offensive and Defensive Coordinators through monetary, draft and/or other compensation such as additional salary cap space; and
5] Complete transparency with respect to pay for all General Managers, Head Coaches and Offensive and Defensive Coordinators.

[jrb12711]

I listened to Hue on Sportscenter this morning (from his interview last night). I think the reality of the situation is not that there was implicit bonuses tied with losing games intentionally.

More closely, the reality of the situation is Sashi Brown and his crew came in and loudly, proudly, and without remorse set the team up for tank mode. Hue was surprised (his words) at this and was perhaps understandably taken aback at this obvious plan to suck for draft capital. I can completely understand Hue being disgruntled about that in general, and feel like he was the 'fall guy' for a team that was NEVER going to win more than 3-4 games. 

This also brings up a fair conversation piece on if black coaches are more significantly set up for failure like the Browns were in 2016-2017. Culley, for example, this season was in a very similar boat and IMO exceeded reasonable expectations. It's definitely a very important conversation and may have merit in the lawsuit. 

With all that being said, that is much different than Haslam directly giving bonuses for throwing football games. Obviously, if there's proof of that let's burn it to the ground.

[Canton Dawg]

27 minutes ago, jrb12711 said:

I listened to Hue on Sportscenter this morning (from his interview last night). I think the reality of the situation is not that there was implicit bonuses tied with losing games intentionally.

More closely, the reality of the situation is Sashi Brown and his crew came in and loudly, proudly, and without remorse set the team up for tank mode. Hue was surprised (his words) at this and was perhaps understandably taken aback at this obvious plan to suck for draft capital. I can completely understand Hue being disgruntled about that in general, and feel like he was the 'fall guy' for a team that was NEVER going to win more than 3-4 games. 

This also brings up a fair conversation piece on if black coaches are more significantly set up for failure like the Browns were in 2016-2017. Culley, for example, this season was in a very similar boat and IMO exceeded reasonable expectations. It's definitely a very important conversation and may have merit in the lawsuit. 

With all that being said, that is much different than Haslam directly giving bonuses for throwing football games. Obviously, if there's proof of that let's burn it to the ground.

The only flaw I find in Hue’s statement that he was set up for failure, is the fact that Gregg Williams took over Hue’s team and went 5-3.

Either Williams didn’t get the memo that he was supposed to tank, or he didn’t need Haslam’s money.

[Marvin the Martian]

1 hour ago, Canton Dawg said:

The only flaw I find in Hue’s statement that he was set up for failure, is the fact that Gregg Williams took over Hue’s team and went 5-3.

Either Williams didn’t get the memo that he was supposed to tank, or he didn’t need Haslam’s money.

Or maybe Williams can coach well and intelligently.  That is why I find it hard to believe that you had to pay hue to lose.  just let him coach

[Canton Dawg]

6 minutes ago, Marvin the Martian said:

Or maybe Williams can coach well and intelligently.  That is why I find it hard to believe that you had to pay hue to lose.  just let him coach

Kind of my point, I just couldn’t put it as eloquently as you.

Also, if Hue was paid (aka bribed to lose) why didn’t he sing to the press about it sooner?

Its not like he was putting another potential head coaching position in jeopardy.

Lets face it…Hue has an axe to grind.

[DieHardBrownsFan]

8 hours ago, Unsympathetic said:

Culley's treatment is actually a part of this lawsuit as well -- Texans fired Culley after Culley had the temerity to get 4 wins this season starting a 4th rounder at QB and a roster of UDFA's and Money Mitch.. Because they wanted to replace him with Josh McCown.. he with no coaching experience at any level and many actual qualified coaches available.  But hey, he's white!

Oh stfu.

[nickers]

50 minutes ago, Canton Dawg said:

Kind of my point, I just couldn’t put it as eloquently as you.

Also, if Hue was paid (aka bribed to lose) why didn’t he sing to the press about it sooner?

Its not like he was putting another potential head coaching position in jeopardy.

Lets face it…Hue has an axe to grind.

Hes determined to grind it to the nub..

[jrb12711]

2 hours ago, Canton Dawg said:

The only flaw I find in Hue’s statement that he was set up for failure, is the fact that Gregg Williams took over Hue’s team and went 5-3.

Either Williams didn’t get the memo that he was supposed to tank, or he didn’t need Haslam’s money.

To be sure, my comment wasn’t to say I think Hue was a good coach. He absolutely was not and having a rancid roster only made his bad coaching worse. But, he’s not wrong in specifically pointing out how miserable the roster was in 2016 and 2017.

as a small devils advocate, the roster Williams had on the back half of 2018 was magnitudes or order better than two years. I highly doubt Hue goes 5-3 in that stretch, but comparing the 2018 roster to the 2016 roster specifically is marked. 

[Bob806]

3 hours ago, Unsympathetic said:

 

I'm not trying to be insulting here, but it sure reads to me like you came to this thread with the intent to spread factual inaccuracies about the lawsuit.

 

This case is not about morality -- YOU are attempting to shift the discussion by inventing a completely fake version of both Flores' claim and his proposed remedy.. which is of course the classic dodge of someone who knows they're guilty but doesn't want to admit it.

 

 

Lol, nope. You make quite the assumption.

I simply made a statement that somehow got you riled up..I stated "you cannot litigate humanity or kindness." 

I'm not spreading inaccuracies, I'm making an observation. Have a nice day.

 

[Unsympathetic]

1 hour ago, Bob806 said:

I stated "you cannot litigate humanity or kindness."

 

If you actually believed in not litigating humanity or kindness.. then you'd be either supporting this lawsuit because you were "shocked" or you wouldn't have a position - because the lawsuit from Flores explicitly does not do what you claimed.

But don't let facts stop you when you can entertain yourself and others with fun lies!

[Vambo]

[gumby73]

That ^ ^ #73

        

 

 

[hoorta]

5 hours ago, Unsympathetic said:

 

If you actually believed in not litigating humanity or kindness.. then you'd be either supporting this lawsuit because you were "shocked" or you wouldn't have a position - because the lawsuit from Flores explicitly does not do what you claimed.

But don't let facts stop you when you can entertain yourself and others with fun lies!

Calm down.. This will play out in court, in due time.  Flores has a Mount Everest to climb attempting to prove his claims....  Just "claiming" something doesn't make it so.  There's this thing called hard evidence... If you have it, then great- show it to the judges. He said, she said- will get you nowhere. And if I understand the latest fallout, he's up against three franchises, and the NFL....  Dear Mr. Flores.. the NFL has unlimited deep pockets to contest your claims....  Your NFL career is over, Grover. Ask Colin Kaepernick for a referral...  

https://www.nfl.com/news/giants-say-allegations-made-by-brian-flores-are-disturbing-and-simply-false

https://www.sportingnews.com/us/nfl/news/stephen-ross-dolphins-brian-flores-tanking/cvosu56cyghr1uwne0jhxrwgm

https://www.cbssports.com/nfl/news/broncos-john-elway-responds-to-lawsuit-issues-formal-statement-in-wake-of-brian-flores-allegations/

 

[Browns149]

In the interview on ESPN, he kept saying, “He didn’t understand the plan”

Well if he didn’t understand they were totally rebuilding the team from ground up, then he’s a BIGGER FOOL then we all thought

[Unsympathetic]

6 hours ago, hoorta said:

Your NFL career is over

His career was over before he filed it because he won too much.. that's why he did it.  Thinking his career is over only now is missing the reality.. 

6 hours ago, hoorta said:

Calm down

 

Everyone prefers a comfortable lie to a complicated and often discomforting truth.

[Canton Dawg]

2 hours ago, Unsympathetic said:

His career was over before he filed it because he won too much.. that's why he did it.  Thinking his career is over only now is missing the reality.. 

According to the talking heads on the NFL Network, he is still under consideration for the Texans & Saints HC positions.

[D Bone]

So now it's all Belichick's fault? Good luck with your lawsuit Flores. 

[Bob806]

14 hours ago, Unsympathetic said:

 

If you actually believed in not litigating humanity or kindness.. then you'd be either supporting this lawsuit because you were "shocked" or you wouldn't have a position - because the lawsuit from Flores explicitly does not do what you claimed.

But don't let facts stop you when you can entertain yourself and others with fun lies!

Jeez, so now I'm a liar. 

I really don't know what you're trying to prove here. I wrote nothing controversial whatsoever, and made no claims. 

[D Bone]

1 hour ago, Bob806 said:

Jeez, so now I'm a liar. 

I really don't know what you're trying to prove here. I wrote nothing controversial whatsoever, and made no claims. 

As someone who has already travelled down the road of frustration that you are currently on, I highly suggest you make a hard 90 degree turn and head away from it as fast as you can and never look back. 

[Bob806]

51 minutes ago, D Bone said:

As someone who has already travelled down the road of frustration that you are currently on, I highly suggest you make a hard 90 degree turn and head away from it as fast as you can and never look back. 

Thanks....yeah no sense getting frustrated here. The Browns are frustrating enough 😁

[hoorta]

2 hours ago, Bob806 said:

Jeez, so now I'm a liar. 

I really don't know what you're trying to prove here. I wrote nothing controversial whatsoever, and made no claims. 

Exactly..  I'm not taking sides either... But apparently a certain poster here definitely has.  Just filing a lawsuit and alleging something.... You're going to have to prove said allegations in court. I was just pointing out, the NFL and it's billionaire owners have unlimited resources and an army of lawyers to do their best to debunk your claims.  

[hoorta]

7 hours ago, Unsympathetic said:

His career was over before he filed it because he won too much.. that's why he did it.  Thinking his career is over only now is missing the reality.. 

Everyone prefers a comfortable lie to a complicated and often discomforting truth.

So, are you claiming NFL ownership is racist to the core? That black coaches only get fired because they're the wrong color?  

[D Bone]

16 minutes ago, hoorta said:

So, are you claiming NFL ownership is racist to the core? That black coaches only get fired because they're the wrong color?  

Good God, what have you done?? 

 

[Unsympathetic]

1 hour ago, hoorta said:

So, are you claiming NFL ownership is racist to the core? That black coaches only get fired because they're the wrong color?  

Only two logical fallacies in one post? You can cram more into your trolling than that - I believe in you!

For color, I suggest mimolette cheese. The color comes from the annato used during the aging process.

[hoorta]

10 hours ago, Unsympathetic said:

Only two logical fallacies in one post? You can cram more into your trolling than that - I believe in you!

For color, I suggest mimolette cheese. The color comes from the annato used during the aging process.

LOL, exactly who's doing the trolling? If you want to be the #1 Flores apologist, have at it.  You apparently can't even distinguish between simple questions.  A yes or no would have sufficed, not going off on a Cal tangent. Did Flores get a bum deal? Yup... However, I'm not the one who's all butthurt about a  guy who made more money in a few years than I did in a lifetime, like you apparently are....   

[BernieSuperBowl2]

Hue Jackson is like catching herpes. Once you get him, you have him for life. And he pops up every year or two to make your life a living hell for a little while. 

[TexasAg1969]

4 hours ago, BernieSuperBowl2 said:

Hue Jackson is like catching herpes. Once you get him, you have him for life. And he pops up every year or two to make your life a living hell for a little while. 

So you have a problem with using your first timeout before the first play of the game? No bonehead would ever do that!!🤗🍖

[Bob806]

Hue Jackson walks back Browns accusation: 'I was never offered money' to lose
https://www.thescore.com/nfl/news/2292271

 

Well well.....

[Canton Dawg]

3 minutes ago, Bob806 said:

Hue Jackson walks back Browns accusation: 'I was never offered money' to lose
https://www.thescore.com/nfl/news/2292271

 

Well well.....

I wonder if RGIII still supports Hue’s claim? 🤔

[Canton Dawg]