MLD Woody Posted February 4, 2014 Report Share Posted February 4, 2014 Oh my bad, I didn't realize I said those things Steve. Please feel free to point out where I made any of those statements.... I'll wait. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Westside Steve Posted February 4, 2014 Report Share Posted February 4, 2014 Oh my bad, I didn't realize I said those things Steve. Please feel free to point out where I made any of those statements.... I'll wait. Actually you were the one who said that it's perfectly okay to fly the Muslim flag and not worry about offending victims families and friends from 9 11. I believe your reasoning with something like this not all Muslims are terrorists or extremists. So since only a fraction, a small fraction, of southerners were slave owners and most were just defending their homes which were being destroyed by berserkers from the north I figured you might give them a pass too. I guess not. WSS Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gftChris Posted February 4, 2014 Report Share Posted February 4, 2014 The logic goes that the confederate states were trying to defect (or whatever) in order to retain their rights to slavery, so the flag that applies to that group represents those values. The terrorists responsible for 9/11 have been condemned by the muslim community and so the muslim crescent does not represent the ideal that western infidels should be blown up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MLD Woody Posted February 4, 2014 Report Share Posted February 4, 2014 ^ good way to word it The confederate flag doesnt just represent slave owners. It is the belief that blacks were inferior to whites and nothing but property. That wasnt an idea held by JUST slave owners. It was a much more widespread belief in the south than the percentage of muslims that are terrorists.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Westside Steve Posted February 4, 2014 Report Share Posted February 4, 2014 so you say the great majority of southerners felt that way right? and that fair treatment of black people was the only reason for the war. good to hear. WSS Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MLD Woody Posted February 4, 2014 Report Share Posted February 4, 2014 Never said GREAT majority Never said ONLY reason man... it must be a lot easier thinking you are right when you invent my side of the argument yourself... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
calfoxwc Posted February 4, 2014 Report Share Posted February 4, 2014 Less than ten percent of southerners, eight percent, owned slaves. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Westside Steve Posted February 4, 2014 Report Share Posted February 4, 2014 Chris would you suppose the Irish have any honest grudge against the crown? Should they enjoy the protected status as well? WSS Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Westside Steve Posted February 4, 2014 Report Share Posted February 4, 2014 Never said GREAT majority Never said ONLY reason man... it must be a lot easier thinking you are right when you invent my side of the argument yourself... Nah and to be honest it's not even challenging debating you. I mean honestly you have one set of rules for people you don't like and another set for groups you think you should like better. So in your opinion should all three versions of that flag be banned from public display? Or only 2? WSS Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Westside Steve Posted February 4, 2014 Report Share Posted February 4, 2014 ^ good way to word it The confederate flag doesnt just represent slave owners. It is the belief that blacks were inferior to whites and nothing but property. That wasnt an idea held by JUST slave owners. It was a much more widespread belief in the south than the percentage of muslims that are terrorists.... Now we are making progress. What percentage would that be exactly and what percentage is the cutoff point? WSS Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MLD Woody Posted February 4, 2014 Report Share Posted February 4, 2014 Nah and to be honest it's not even challenging debating you. WSS Well no shit, you are debating points i never made.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Westside Steve Posted February 5, 2014 Report Share Posted February 5, 2014 Well no shit, you are debating points i never made....Well that's not true. Plus I always give you the opportunity to clarify your statements. You just bitch or belittle someone else or make points that you have no intention of adhering to yourself. For instance you say we can't paint all Muslims with the same brush because some of them didn't support the 911 attack. Fair enough. But then you go on to say we should ban the historical southern Confederate flag because even though only a few Southerners own slaves you said, and I'm paraphrasing, that the idea that blacks were inferior was prevalent in the south. Because of that reason they don't deserve the protected status of Muslims. You also grips if I guess a number, (like 95 percent), and demand an accurate accounting. Again fair enough. Since that attitude that bothers you so is prevalent in the south, or was during the Civil War, I allowed you to backup your claim with hard numbers. Instead you blustery and grumble. And of course I'm being facetious if I suggest that I, as someone who has Irish ancestors, should be just as offended by the British flag. But if someone said that he was I don't think you could separate the two in any moral sense. It's just that one particular group of people has been put on a pedestal and singled out for special treatment and protection from whatever outrage they claim. Personally I think we have done a disservice to an entire race by writing that second set of rules based on an historical injustice. WSS Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MLD Woody Posted February 5, 2014 Report Share Posted February 5, 2014 Well that's not true. Plus I always give you the opportunity to clarify your statements. You just bitch or belittle someone else or make points that you have no intention of adhering to yourself. WSS Oh you give me the opportunity to clarify statements I never made? How kind of you. You try to be clever, and draw comparisons from a point I made on one topic and use it to disprove I a point I made (or you made up) on another topic. Yes, yes, such master debater. Very impressed. Except every example isn't a one to one comparison. Two different topics do not exist in a vacuum with just one similar trait. I will insult someone else or their idea if I think they deserve it. I am no where near alone in that on this board (though hypocrites are alive and well). But if you think that is all I do then you don't read anything I post. Then again, you must not judging by your posts of what point you think I make... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Westside Steve Posted February 5, 2014 Report Share Posted February 5, 2014 Oh you give me the opportunity to clarify statements I never made? How kind of you. You try to be clever, and draw comparisons from a point I made on one topic and use it to disprove I a point I made (or you made up) on another topic. Yes, yes, such master debater. Very impressed. Except every example isn't a one to one comparison. Two different topics do not exist in a vacuum with just one similar trait. I will insult someone else or their idea if I think they deserve it. I am no where near alone in that on this board (though hypocrites are alive and well). But if you think that is all I do then you don't read anything I post. Then again, you must not judging by your posts of what point you think I make... Well feel free to go over that post that you truncated and tell me what I have wrong. WSS Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MLD Woody Posted February 5, 2014 Report Share Posted February 5, 2014 For instance you say we can't paint all Muslims with the same brush because some of them didn't support the 911 attack. Fair enough. But then you go on to say we should ban the historical southern Confederate flag because even though only a few Southerners own slaves you said, and I'm paraphrasing, that the idea that blacks were inferior was prevalent in the south. Because of that reason they don't deserve the protected status of Muslims. You also grips if I guess a number, (like 95 percent), and demand an accurate accounting. Again fair enough. Since that attitude that bothers you so is prevalent in the south, or was during the Civil War, I allowed you to backup your claim with hard numbers. Instead you blustery and grumble. And of course I'm being facetious if I suggest that I, as someone who has Irish ancestors, should be just as offended by the British flag. But if someone said that he was I don't think you could separate the two in any moral sense. It's just that one particular group of people has been put on a pedestal and singled out for special treatment and protection from whatever outrage they claim. Personally I think we have done a disservice to an entire race by writing that second set of rules based on an historical injustice. WSS I'm going to guess the vast majority of muslins didn't support the 911 attacks, not "some" Banning it is not my decision, I'm not from the state. I don't think they should fly it probably for any reason. Of course it should still exist for historical reasons though. The flag represents a period of bigotry and racism in our past, a dark period. Why anyone would proudly display it is beyond me. And yes, I believe a good majority of the southern population at that time held racist beliefs. I do not know an exact number. Judging by the fact slavery of another racist was a major part of life at the time, to segregation, Jim crow, etc afterwards I would say it is a pretty safe assumption. Muslims do not have a protected status. Not acting like the only distinguishing characteristic of the terrorists was that they were Muslim is not protected status. When you throw out a specific number as high as 95% to make a point I would expect something to back it up. The only numbers point here is that the percentage in the south that held races believes in the Civil War south is much greater than the percentage of Muslims that are terrorists... that seems obvious. Completely obvious. The point is terrorists are not a representation of Muslims, but racist ideals were a representation of the south at that time (which is represented by the flag). I don't know the exact percentage but the cutoff from something being offensive lies between them, IMO. I don't think it us consider some special blacks only privilege if we don't proudly display the Confederate flag. It just seems like common decency/ sense to not probably display something related to slavery, racism, etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MLD Woody Posted February 5, 2014 Report Share Posted February 5, 2014 Well feel free to go over that post that you truncated and tell me what I have wrong. WSS I was in class and on my phone, cool your jets Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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