Westside Steve Posted December 17, 2013 Report Share Posted December 17, 2013 Said it before and I'll say it again, please please do not quote the daily mail on anything, it's a sensationalist, fascist rag of a newspaper and has been since it was set up by Lord Rothermere, friend and admirer of Hitler and noted fascist. Like Neville Chamberlain??? WSS Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gftChris Posted December 17, 2013 Report Share Posted December 17, 2013 Like Neville Chamberlain??? WSS Yes, just like Neville Chamberlain, the guy who went to war against Hitler... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Westside Steve Posted December 17, 2013 Report Share Posted December 17, 2013 http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Appeasement Not that I buy the Roosevelt as hero of the world gag either.... WSS Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gftChris Posted December 17, 2013 Report Share Posted December 17, 2013 Yeah, he signed the appeasement. That was designed to appease them. It didn't, so he declared war (once they invaded Poland). I'd hardly count that as being chummy, when a good part of the war strategy was 'how can we assassinate Hitler?' Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kosar_For_President Posted December 17, 2013 Report Share Posted December 17, 2013 Said it before and I'll say it again, please please do not quote the daily mail on anything, it's a sensationalist, fascist rag of a newspaper and has been since it was set up by Lord Rothermere, friend and admirer of Hitler and noted fascist. Ok read this 2,200 page document and tell me why a U.N. report on climate change struggles to explain why global warming appears to have slowed down in the past 15 years even as greenhouse gas emissions keep rising. http://www.ipcc.ch/report/ar5/wg1/#.UrCM7_RDsfE Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LogicIsForSquares Posted December 17, 2013 Report Share Posted December 17, 2013 Of course my reaction to these discussions has remained constant over the years. Let us say that Chicken Little is exactly right. What can, and what will we do to stop it? And I believe sincerely the answer is sweet fuck all. WSS I definitely believe in man made global warming. But I fall into this camp. The U.S. could stop all of its emissions today but it won't do jack shit. India and China are burning fossil fuels at absurd rates with very little in the way of regulation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gftChris Posted December 18, 2013 Report Share Posted December 18, 2013 Ok read this 2,200 page document and tell me why a U.N. report on climate change struggles to explain why global warming appears to have slowed down in the past 15 years even as greenhouse gas emissions keep rising. http://www.ipcc.ch/report/ar5/wg1/#.UrCM7_RDsfE Ah the old "well you didn't read this random 2000 word document I posted so you are obviously wrong" gambit. Haven't seen it in a while, it's always nice to see the oldies. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Westside Steve Posted December 18, 2013 Report Share Posted December 18, 2013 Ah the old "well you didn't read this random 2000 word document I posted so you are obviously wrong" gambit. Haven't seen it in a while, it's always nice to see the oldies.Reminds me of the football argument when two people were discussing a particular play and one of them says well I was at that game! (not really similar, just reminded me of it . ) WSS Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
koalabazooka Posted December 18, 2013 Report Share Posted December 18, 2013 Lol at the WWII tangent! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gftChris Posted December 18, 2013 Report Share Posted December 18, 2013 Reminds me of the football argument when two people were discussing a particular play and one of them says well I was at that game! (not really similar, just reminded me of it . ) WSS "Hey man, I was at that game, I saw it live!" "Yeah, ok, well I watched it on tv with the unlimited replays from as many different angles as there were..." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Westside Steve Posted December 18, 2013 Report Share Posted December 18, 2013 "Hey man, I was at that game, I saw it live!" "Yeah, ok, well I watched it on tv with the unlimited replays from as many different angles as there were..." Egg zackly. WSS Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Westside Steve Posted December 18, 2013 Report Share Posted December 18, 2013 I definitely believe in man made global warming. But I fall into this camp. The U.S. could stop all of its emissions today but it won't do jack shit. India and China are burning fossil fuels at absurd rates with very little in the way of regulation. I think that's most definitely the case. Not only that but every one of these emerging nations will want the same luxuries for their citizens as we have. And consider the environmental impact of eating and producing meet couple that with the ever-expanding population and I just don't see what we can do. Oh certainly technology will think of new and better ways to do things and those will probably be market driven. I don't believe it will make the impact needed if in fact the doomsayers are correct. WSS Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LogicIsForSquares Posted December 18, 2013 Report Share Posted December 18, 2013 I think that's most definitely the case. Not only that but every one of these emerging nations will want the same luxuries for their citizens as we have. And consider the environmental impact of eating and producing meet couple that with the ever-expanding population and I just don't see what we can do. Oh certainly technology will think of new and better ways to do things and those will probably be market driven. I don't believe it will make the impact needed if in fact the doomsayers are correct. WSS Population will see a decline soon. In the industrialized world, the decline has already started. China is about to face down a crisis of too few females (stupid domestic policy). India will follow soon due to an increase in GDP. The only continent where population continues to run wild is Africa. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gftChris Posted December 18, 2013 Report Share Posted December 18, 2013 Population will see a decline soon. In the industrialized world, the decline has already started. China is about to face down a crisis of too few females (stupid domestic policy). India will follow soon due to an increase in GDP. The only continent where population continues to run wild is Africa. I wonder if this is evolution. I'm not a biologist, but I believe that the general principle is that the more children you have, the higher chance of the species surviving. Now that children have an almost 100% chance of surviving to adulthood and having (the possibility of having) children of their own, perhaps we feel less need for produce as many offspring as possible. It's also possible, and probably more likely, that couples in 'developed' countries want fewer kids so that they can maintain a little of their previous lifestyle. A lot easier to find a babysitter for 2 kids than 8. Also, perhaps people are conscious that the population is growing unsustainably, and are doing their bit to reduce that trend. Probably it's all these reasons and more. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LogicIsForSquares Posted December 18, 2013 Report Share Posted December 18, 2013 It is a matter that having more kids has no benefit in the modern age. We don't need manual labor like we did in an agricultural society. Women are in the work place more than they had ever been. Now children are a resource/time burden. Professionals are choosing to forego children. The U.S. is right at replacement rate but Europe is well below it. Asian countries are starting to feel the pinch as well. Singapore is having to take extreme measures to try to boost their fertility rates. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gftChris Posted December 18, 2013 Report Share Posted December 18, 2013 It is a matter that having more kids has no benefit in the modern age. We don't need manual labor like we did in an agricultural society. Women are in the work place more than they had ever been. Now children are a resource/time burden. Professionals are choosing to forego children. The U.S. is right at replacement rate but Europe is well below it. Asian countries are starting to feel the pinch as well. Singapore is having to take extreme measures to try to boost their fertility rates. Singapore is actively trying to bring in people from other countries at all levels of employment. I don't know why, it's a massively overpopulated place as it is! Perhaps they're trying to make the whole island one big city. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LogicIsForSquares Posted December 18, 2013 Report Share Posted December 18, 2013 Singapore is actively trying to bring in people from other countries at all levels of employment. I don't know why, it's a massively overpopulated place as it is! Perhaps they're trying to make the whole island one big city. Because they know in one generation they are going to be dead in the water. The locals are not breeding. The EU's open door immigration policy is not a coincidence. Italy has been below replacement for 12+ years. They are not going to have enough working age people to support their social policies. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gftChris Posted December 18, 2013 Report Share Posted December 18, 2013 Well when you actually think about it any pension scheme is basically a ponzi scheme relying on having more people paying than people receiving it. If the amount of (money paid in by) working people stops exceeding the number of people receiving funds then the pension scheme fails. so yes, of course we're looking for more contributors. But, it's not a sustainable way of life. I'm certainly not expecting a penny from my pension, which is why I don't make any voluntary contributions. Instead that all goes in my own savings fund And above all else, this is probably a good thing, having less people in the world. The world is overpopulated for current production methods - of food, of energy etc. - and having less people around, while improving those methods will reduce the problem. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
koalabazooka Posted December 20, 2013 Report Share Posted December 20, 2013 Moral of the Story: pump your brakes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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