Baker Mayfield

[The Gipper]

7 hours ago, Icecube said:

I really hate to have to explain this to you, higher is actually lower in this case. You see, being the 25th QB compared to the 1st is lower. Why am I bothering. 

Taking your team to the playoffs, which is all that matters, puts your team in the Top 14 teams...which is all that matters. 

You can be ranked the best QB in the league, but if your team is not in the playoffs, who gives a fuck about you.  See Archie Manning.   You can be the #32 ranked QB in the league, but if your team makes the playoffs, that is all that counts.   See:  Mark Rypien, Trent Dilfer, Brad Johnson.   Average at best QBs....but you know what else they are:  Super Bowl Champions. 

[Unsympathetic]

On 11/5/2020 at 4:04 PM, Icecube said:

By definition, to be average Baker would

Nobody agreed with your proposed definition.  Get over it, loser.

 

Before attempting to "rank" quarterbacks, first you have to get everyone to agree on the methodology you want to use to rank them.  Good luck.

[Icecube]

37 minutes ago, Unsympathetic said:

Nobody agreed with your proposed definition.  Get over it, loser.

 

Before attempting to "rank" quarterbacks, first you have to get everyone to agree on the methodology you want to use to rank them.  Good luck.

Pathetic (your given name here), I don't have to have ANYone agree on shit. And I certainly don't have to rely on you coherently detailing any thoughts or we'd all be waiting for months. 

[Dutch Oven]

1 hour ago, Icecube said:

 I don't have to have ANYone agree on shit.

That's good news, because we'd all be waiting for months waiting for someone to agree with whatever nonsense you posted last. 

You should really give up while you are way behind. I know you have a desperate need to be right on something, anything, but it just doesn't seem to ever work out your way, buddy. It still burns your backside something fierce about the way the board universally laughed at you on your original OBJ threads, so months and months later we are still subjected to your OBJ obsession. 

At least you have solace that you were able to bench 400lbs, back in the day.  

 

[browns52]

On 11/7/2020 at 3:04 PM, nickers said:

I think to best sum this all up is to say...... We all know the short comings of our beloved Cleveland Browns , at this time , during their development... Yes... the LBer's are whoafully slow.. Banged up and outside of Garrett and his efforts... The defense isn't getting much up on anyone... We're 5-3... Lets revel in that for a change.. Yeah... we have holes... as does every team... Rome wasn't built in week let alone a day... Give Baker the remainder of the season... If he stumbles... So be it... But I'm rooting for the kid... It's apparent we're getting nothing for Njoku.. I guess they'll just let him "walk"... No takers... Hopefully Bryant learned from his mistakes and can transition smoothly...

yipper....based on what i saw and heard from the gm on espn...ole baker better have an incredible 2nd half.....gm is more important than herd or bradshaw....it appears berry does not want anything to do with the what, 1 yr left on his contract after this yr unless baker improves dramatically.....also the new coachie coach inherited this team....and aside from barry switzer when he won a sb with dallas, which was jimmy johnson's team, usually every coaching change comes change in alot of the inherited team....i can't see our coach being too happy with what transpired with statefarm baker and yodell.....that project is kaput....

[Icecube]

7 hours ago, Dutch Oven said:

That's good news, because we'd all be waiting for months waiting for someone to agree with whatever nonsense you posted last. 

You should really give up while you are way behind. I know you have a desperate need to be right on something, anything, but it just doesn't seem to ever work out your way, buddy. It still burns your backside something fierce about the way the board universally laughed at you on your original OBJ threads, so months and months later we are still subjected to your OBJ obsession. 

At least you have solace that you were able to bench 400lbs, back in the day.  

 

Oh look, it's the guy who said months ago, "I won't respond to any of your posts, don't respond to any of mine." Gee whiz, you have zero credibility. ZERO. And I'm sure you probably never even benched an Olympic bar with any weights on it. You Canal Fulton hillbillies don't see the insides of gyms.

 

And, by the way, my OBJ takes are still in play. They will dump him before the 2021 season. Watch and learn, little one. 

[Icecube]

10 hours ago, The Gipper said:

Taking your team to the playoffs, which is all that matters, puts your team in the Top 14 teams...which is all that matters. 

You can be ranked the best QB in the league, but if your team is not in the playoffs, who gives a fuck about you.  See Archie Manning.   You can be the #32 ranked QB in the league, but if your team makes the playoffs, that is all that counts.   See:  Mark Rypien, Trent Dilfer, Brad Johnson.   Average at best QBs....but you know what else they are:  Super Bowl Champions. 

So is Big Ben. 

[Dutch Oven]

52 minutes ago, Icecube said:

Oh look, it's the guy who said months ago, "I won't respond to any of your posts, don't respond to any of mine." Gee whiz, you have zero credibility. ZERO. And I'm sure you probably never even benched an Olympic bar with any weights on it. You Canal Fulton hillbillies don't see the insides of gyms.

 

And, by the way, my OBJ takes are still in play. They will dump him before the 2021 season. Watch and learn, little one. 

The only thing any of us learn from your posts is that your parents must be incredibly embarrassed to have to claim you. 😂

With the exception of the time you benched 400lbs, of course. 

[The Gipper]

2 hours ago, Icecube said:

So is Big Ben. 

Are you saying that you think he has been an average at best QB? 

[Icecube]

1 hour ago, Dutch Oven said:

The only thing any of us learn from your posts is that your parents must be incredibly embarrassed to have to claim you. 😂

With the exception of the time you benched 400lbs, of course. 

[Icecube]

43 minutes ago, The Gipper said:

Are you saying that you think he has been an average at best QB? 

Who? Ben? 

[The Gipper]

12 hours ago, Icecube said:

Who? Ben? 

Yes, that is who you mentioned. 

[Icecube]

3 hours ago, The Gipper said:

Yes, that is who you mentioned. 

We all know Ben is far above average; Hall of Fame QBs all are. He' a beast. 

[Vambo]

[The Gipper]

1 hour ago, Icecube said:

We all know Ben is far above average; Hall of Fame QBs all are. He' a beast. 

Well, yea, that is why I questioned you after this:

Average at best QBs....but you know what else they are:  Super Bowl Champions. 

So is Big Ben. 

[hx214]

2 hours ago, Icecube said:

We all know Ben is far above average; Hall of Fame QBs all are. He' a beast. 

You misspelled rapist. 

[Dutch Oven]

The morning show on 92.3 was talking about Baker this morning, and some interesting points were made.

It will be interesting to see just how much the Browns would be willing to pay Baker if they want to keep him past his rookie deal. I just can't see the Browns giving him HUGE money, maybe good money, but not a monster deal.

Especially considering two QBs who had a lot of success in this type of system were mid-round draft picks who fit the system well in Matt Schaub (3rd rounder) and Kirk Cousins (4th).  

[Tour2ma]

5 hours ago, Dutch Oven said:

The morning show on 92.3 was talking about Baker this morning, and some interesting points were made.

It will be interesting to see just how much the Browns would be willing to pay Baker if they want to keep him past his rookie deal. I just can't see the Browns giving him HUGE money, maybe good money, but not a monster deal.

Especially considering two QBs who had a lot of success in this type of system were mid-round draft picks who fit the system well in Matt Schaub (3rd rounder) and Kirk Cousins (4th).  

Because you get a discount for a franchise level 4th-rounder?

[Icecube]

54 minutes ago, Tour2ma said:

Because you get a discount for a franchise level 4th-rounder?

Cousins played he system masterfully. You got to hand it to him. 

[Vambo]

How did Baker Mayfield grade out for his first eight games of the 2020 season? Ellis Williams’ take

Updated Nov 09, 2020; Posted Nov 09, 2020

https://www.cleveland.com/browns/2020/11/how-did-baker-mayfield-grade-out-for-his-first-eight-games-of-the-2020-season-ellis-williams-take.html

 

Accuracy: C

 

Coming out of college, accuracy was considered one of Mayfield’s best attributes. That hasn’t been the case as a pro, and things haven’t improved much this season either. His 61.4 completion percentage ranks 28th, and the eye test tells me he still sails some passes that should be easy completions.

 

Big Moments: C-

 

The biggest moment Mayfield faced was in Week 6 versus the Steelers. He had an opportunity to create a legendary moment by challenging an AFC North rival and possibly beating them on their turf. Instead, he threw a pick-six on his first throw and the game was over before it started. He deserves credit for bouncing back with 22 straight completions against the Bengals but please remember, it’s the Bengals.

 

Face of the Franchise: B+

 

At times, Mayfield looks and sounds the part. His strongest leadership moment came last year following Myles Garrett’s incident with Steelers quarterback Mason Rudolph. Without much time to think he delivered a “Face of the Franchise” style message to Fox’s Erin Andrews. However, there are other times when he has become the talk of Twitter for poor reasons, and if he doesn’t start winning big games his Progressive commercials aren’t going to age well.

 

Leadership/Intangibles: A-

 

It seems like the Browns locker room really believes in Mayfield. His authentic style makes him likable, and transparency is king within NFL locker rooms. Winning cures everything, and if he keeps doing that then his teammates will respect him. No one has questioned his work ethic, nor should they.

 

Making all the Throws: A

 

What makes Mayfield so difficult to evaluate is those moments when he makes big-time NFL throws that remind the world that he has No. 1 overall pick arm talent. It’s not consistent, but when he is on, Mayfield’s ability to make all the throws ranks in the top half of the league.

 

Reading Defenses: B-

 

It still seems at times that Mayfield gets flustered in the pocket when defenses change on him or his first read is taken away. I’m confident he knows or can recognize a defense on most dropbacks. It’s an issue when his misreads turn into interceptions, which has happened on at least three of his seven interceptions this season.

 

Overall Grade: C

[Dutch Oven]

17 hours ago, Tour2ma said:

Because you get a discount for a franchise level 4th-rounder?

No, I was pointing out that QBs who can fit this system can be found later on in the draft, instead of being dependent on tanking and getting the highest pick possible for a "franchise/HOF" QB. 

If the Browns find Mayfield's second contract demands to be too high, they might just say "We can find a 3rd/4th rounder who can put up the same numbers as Baker". 

[Tour2ma]

5 hours ago, Vambo said:

Overall Grade: C

IIRC...

"C" is:

1. "average"...
2. not at a 50% level.

[Tour2ma]

1 hour ago, Dutch Oven said:

No, I was pointing out that QBs who can fit this system can be found later on in the draft. It is dependent on tanking and getting the highest pick possible for a "franchise/HOF" QB. 

If the Browns find Mayfield's second contract demands to be too high, they might just say "We can find a 3rd/4th rounder who can put up the same numbers as Baker".  

Well.... need to signal those turns in the future...

I doubt you roll the dice on an "either/or" scenario... stakes are too high and those mid-round QBs are far from plentiful.

And that bring me back to the 5th year option... Even with the increased cost of it beginning with Baker's and Ward's draft class, it's still a relatively cheap way to buy decision time.

 

[The Gipper]

48 minutes ago, Tour2ma said:

IIRC...

"C" is:

1. "average"...
2. not at a 50% level.

The overall "C" that this writer gives to Baker is contradicted by what he does just above.  Ignoring pluses and minuses,  taking the grade he gives in each category....he would have had to conclude that Baker was a B.    How so?  Simple math.  If, instead of an alphabetical grade you did a numerical grade,  5 for A, 4 for B,  3=C,  2=D, 1=F.     In 6 categories, he gave  Baker  24 pts.    24 divided by 6 =  4.    4= B.    B should have been the overall grade. 

[Unsympathetic]

The writer's post is as accurate as the grade he gave to Baker?

[The Gipper]

4 minutes ago, Unsympathetic said:

The writer's post is as accurate as the grade he gave to Baker?

Not sure I understand the question.   What I am saying is that the Final Grade he gave to Baker does not comport with the average that he would have come up with by adding all the scores in each category he listed.

[The Gipper]

19 minutes ago, Unsympathetic said:

The writer's post is as accurate as the grade he gave to Baker?

If you prefer to look at it, taking into account using  pluses and minuses, you would come up with a 15 point scale:

15 points for an  A+......14 for  A,  13 for A-,  12 for B+ , 11 for B,  10 for B -.....etc. down to  1 point for an F-  (yes, sure, can have that)

Baker, in each category got:

C=8 pts

C- = 7 

B+  = 12

A- = 13

A = 14

B- =  10

Total those up  equals  64 pts.    64 divided by  6 categories =  10.66 pts.  10.66 points puts him .66  above a B- .  Rounding up gives Baker a B.  

I am going strictly by the author above's  grades that he gave. 

I guess you could submit your own grades to each of those categories, if you choose. 

[Unsympathetic]

Twas a joke.. he gave Baker a C for accuracy and then didn't accurately describe the weighting system he used to compute Baker's final grade.

It's possible to assign different weights to the categories, doesn't have to be the same for each. So 20% of the total could be the grade for accuracy, 5% for "moments", 10% for leadership etc.. adding up to 100% of course. So [weight%*grade] summed over all the grades - 0.2*8+0.05*7 - would give us the final "grade."

I don't think "big moments" [this is the old "clutch" measurement] is really a thing.. for example Tebow's playoff win was the one accurate throw to Thomas in OT but the rest of the game he was not-a-professional-QB level of terrible, and thus the game wouldn't have been close leading to the "clutch" throw if he had been even an average QB all 4 quarters.  The studies of Brees/Brady/Favre etc [guys with a big enough sample to be useful] certainly suggest their performance in "definable clutch" is not measurably different from the rest.

[The Gipper]

Well,  I was giving equal weight to each category, as it was not explained that he did anything but that. 

I also think that some of his commentary was way off base.    I mean, he was saying that the Steelers game was a "big moment"  It just can't be that when your defense is getting hammered for 38 points. I don't see where a blowout game can constitute a big moment really. 

Now, a big moment was at the end of the Bengals game, putting together a game winning drive, a game winning TD pass. 

[Dutch Oven]

Speaking of QBs, thought I'd share this remarkable stat...