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Westside Steve

Another actual question.

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Good morning gentlemen. In this case I don't think it really matters if you align yourselves with any particular party or for or against any candidate.

There appear to be two schools of thought any upcoming impeachment trial in the Senate. since Party Line votes seem to be the standard here there will be a choice.

Option one with 51 or 50 and the vice president boats the Senate could just throw out the articles of impeachment.

 Option number two would be to go ahead with the trial and call most of the opposition party members as witnesses presumably to unearth some embarrassing answers relevant to the case at hand or not.

What say you members of the panel?

WSS

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If Trump had actually committed any high crimes or misdemeanors they would not have party line voting. This is all about trying to hurt Trump in November as well as republican senators up for re-election this year. 

What Nancy and the dems have given us is a political impeachment which is something the founders of our country never wanted to see happen.

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when you say option 2 are you including the witnesses that the POTUS can call too?

because either way the articles of impeachment from the house on its face doesnt have any weight - like OBF said political theater all because they dont like Trump...

and dragging this out will work both ways in keeping the status (voters) the  same - love him or hate him 

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13 minutes ago, tiamat63 said:

Emilia-Clarke-Eye-Roll-Before-Bursting-In-Laughter.gif.c0ebc9d29f5be904a4674067a3cea106.gif

This is the kind of response when you have nothing of substance...what are the high crimes and misdemeanors? I saw the impeachment hearings and the dems only had one fact witness testify (the rest were all opinion and hearsay witnesses) ...the one fact witness testified that Trump specifically told him there was NO quid pro quo... the dems have wanted to impeach Trump from his first day in office and after the 3 year Russian witch hunt failed they went to plan  b...Ukraine 

Just because Joe Biden is running for president does not mean he should get a pass from any investigation about his son getting on the Burisma board making over 50 grand a month with no experience. Then we have the obvious quid pro quo from Joe Biden who threatened Ukraine that unless the prosecutor investigating Burisma is fired Ukraine will not get billions of dollars in aid. Trump was right in holding up aid to Ukraine until it could be confirmed the new president was cleaning up the rampant corruption in Ukraine. In fact Trump would have be derelict in his duty as president not to and Burisma and Hunter Biden are fair game in looking into corruption as Burisma obviously was at least attempting to buy influence influence with Hunter Biden. An investigation is needed to find out if they actually did get any influential treatment (besides Joe Biden having the prosecutor investigating Burisma fired).

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56 minutes ago, FairHooker11 said:

when you say option 2 are you including the witnesses that the POTUS can call too?

yes. Pelosi Schiff Schumer and the Biden boys could be grilled.

because either way the articles of impeachment from the house on its face doesnt have any weight - like OBF said political theater all because they dont like Trump...

and dragging this out will work both ways in keeping the status (voters) the  same - love him or hate him 

 that's true. But think how much fun it would be listening to Chuck Schumer change his position from if you want to testify you must be guilty when it's time for him to take the stand.

 And make no mistake I don't expect the gotcha aspect will be any more substantial than Clinton lying about the blow job.

WSS

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2 hours ago, OldBrownsFan said:

This is the kind of response when you have nothing of substance...what are the high crimes and misdemeanors? I saw the impeachment hearings and the dems only had one fact witness testify (the rest were all opinion and hearsay witnesses) ...the one fact witness testified that Trump specifically told him there was NO quid pro quo... the dems have wanted to impeach Trump from his first day in office and after the 3 year Russian witch hunt failed they went to plan  b...Ukraine 

Just because Joe Biden is running for president does not mean he should get a pass from any investigation about his son getting on the Burisma board making over 50 grand a month with no experience. Then we have the obvious quid pro quo from Joe Biden who threatened Ukraine that unless the prosecutor investigating Burisma is fired Ukraine will not get billions of dollars in aid. Trump was right in holding up aid to Ukraine until it could be confirmed the new president was cleaning up the rampant corruption in Ukraine. In fact Trump would have be derelict in his duty as president not to and Burisma and Hunter Biden are fair game in looking into corruption as Burisma obviously was at least attempting to buy influence influence with Hunter Biden. An investigation is needed to find out if they actually did get any influential treatment (besides Joe Biden having the prosecutor investigating Burisma fired).

  95% of the content on this side of the board possess the same substance of what I posted.   You have people on here so desperate to troll that they keep posting despite their intended targets having vacated the board some time ago.  Those responses, all of them, every bit as shallow or unimaginative.    You won't say much about those, I'm sure.

We now live in a time when anyone who holds high office has their actions, words and the legality of such judged not on the content and context, but with that little D or R next to their title.  A time of non-stop political trolling and negative individual governance.  Most people held their noses when they voted for Trump or Hillary.    The rest of the lot needs a serious psych eval.   That's not good democracy.  That's not what you want when we've reached the point that we vote for whom we hate less and to be afraid of exploring any other possible candidates for the sake of missing on a political "win".

Any belief or attempt to reason the opposite is willful ignorance if not outright stupidity.   

The two party system serves it's own interests and little else.    Cast your lot with trash simpy,  be pandered to because we'll endorse anyone who promises to make things how you want them.  Then 4 to 8 years later swing the pendulum back the other way. That is what this process is now. Nobody considers the merits of logic, reason, temperance, integrity and longevity.  

The good fight, if there ever was one, is over.  Idiots, loudmouths, fake tough guys, the brash, fearful and misguided are drive the voting bus now.

Response? Sure.... Fuck Darth Trump, his oldest sons, Ivanka, the GOP,  the corporate centrist dems, the AOC dems, basically that whole party too, fuck 80% of the voters in this country, Fox News, CNN, political mouth-pieces whose primary interest is money and selling ad space, fuck Hillary, Bill for riding the economic wave he had little to do with, Fuck dubya jr, fuck libertarians at this point, fuck the "oathkeepers", antifa, Rachel Ray and you, for that matter.

Only way to fix this bitch is meteor the damn thing and start over.   Trump wins 2020 as the United States continues to grow dumber yet more financially and morally bankrupt.          I'll pass.

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35 minutes ago, tiamat63 said:

  95% of the content on this side of the board possess the same substance of what I posted.   You have people on here so desperate to troll that they keep posting despite their intended targets having vacated the board some time ago.  Those responses, all of them, every bit as shallow or unimaginative.    You won't say much about those, I'm sure.

We now live in a time when anyone who holds high office has their actions, words and the legality of such judged not on the content and context, but with that little D or R next to their title.  A time of non-stop political trolling and negative individual governance.  Most people held their noses when they voted for Trump or Hillary.    The rest of the lot needs a serious psych eval.   That's not good democracy.  That's not what you want when we've reached the point that we vote for whom we hate less and to be afraid of exploring any other possible candidates for the sake of missing on a political "win".

Any belief or attempt to reason the opposite is willful ignorance if not outright stupidity.   

The two party system serves it's own interests and little else.    Cast your lot with trash simpy,  be pandered to because we'll endorse anyone who promises to make things how you want them.  Then 4 to 8 years later swing the pendulum back the other way. That is what this process is now. Nobody considers the merits of logic, reason, temperance, integrity and longevity.  

The good fight, if there ever was one, is over.  Idiots, loudmouths, fake tough guys, the brash, fearful and misguided are drive the voting bus now.

Response? Sure.... Fuck Darth Trump, his oldest sons, Ivanka, the GOP,  the corporate centrist dems, the AOC dems, basically that whole party too, fuck 80% of the voters in this country, Fox News, CNN, political mouth-pieces whose primary interest is money and selling ad space, fuck Hillary, Bill for riding the economic wave he had little to do with, Fuck dubya jr, fuck libertarians at this point, fuck the "oathkeepers", antifa, Rachel Ray and you, for that matter.

Only way to fix this bitch is meteor the damn thing and start over.   Trump wins 2020 as the United States continues to grow dumber yet more financially and morally bankrupt.          I'll pass.

One of the most important issues to me as an individual voter is pro life. On that issue alone Trump has been the most pro life president we have had since Roe. I would vote for him again for that alone but he has done a great job as well with the economy, rebuilding our military, securing the southern border (as much as one president alone can possibly do), made things better for veterans, got us out of terrible trade deals and is renegotiating  better deals, he has done well with religious liberty issues, got us out of the terrible Paris climate accord, made our country energy independent, tore up the terrible Obama Iran peace treaty,  made other countries in NATO start paying their fair share, etc...so he has been a great president in my book, you may disagree but this is America and you have every right to...

We probably would be better off having 3 or 4 viable political parties as competition always makes things better but since we don't then  voting for the lesser of the two evils makes sense to me (to a point, there may come a time where the differences are so minimal I wouldn't vote for either party). I don't have any faith in the republican party and consider myself a conservative and not a republican. I vote republican because generally speaking they support the issues I support but that is not to say they don't let me down at times such as funding Planned Parenthood when they controlled all 3 branches of government. Obviously the dems were willing to fight harder to keep funding PP than the republicans were to de-fund PP. So do I throw the baby out with the bathwater and stop voting republican? No because the dem alternative is much worse.

 

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9 minutes ago, OldBrownsFan said:

One of the most important issues to me as an individual voter is pro life. On that issue alone Trump has been the most pro life president we have had since Roe. I would vote for him again for that alone but he has done a great job as well with the economy, rebuilding our military, securing the southern border (as much as one president alone can possibly do), made things better for veterans, got us out of terrible trade deals and is renegotiating  better deals, he has done well with religious liberty issues, got us out of the terrible Paris climate accord, made our country energy independent, tore up the terrible Obama Iran peace treaty,  made other countries in NATO start paying their fair share, etc...so he has been a great president in my book, you may disagree but this is America and you have every right to...

We probably would be better off having 3 or 4 viable political parties as competition always makes things better but since we don't then  voting for the lesser of the two evils makes sense to me (to a point, there may come a time where the differences are so minimal I wouldn't vote for either party). I don't have any faith in the republican party and consider myself a conservative and not a republican. I vote republican because generally speaking they support the issues I support but that is not to say they don't let me down at times such as funding Planned Parenthood when they controlled all 3 branches of government. Obviously the dems were willing to fight harder to keep funding PP than the republicans were to de-fund PP. So do I throw the baby out with the bathwater and stop voting republican? No because the dem alternative is much worse.

 

   I'm all for a third party to give the other two competition and keep them honest. Right now, though, it's like we are on a giant Good Ship America. do we turn left ? or right? or keep going straight ahead?

  It's just tantrum-throwing to say start all over again with new water and a new ship. It is impossible to happen. I'm tired of those on this board whose egos drive their spews against Pres Trump. They won't admit our economy is running far greater, won't admit Pres Trump is keeping his promises. they are just like the leftwing/democrat/liars/sombeitches ... who openly have adopted hateful nonsense as some kind of fake reality - thinking that they can undo the last presidential election, because they are po'd that they lost the opportunity of a lifetime - they nearly turned the tables on America and owned it via corruption, padding our electoral system with millions of illegals, padding states' voter registrations with the deceased, the relocated out of state, etc etc etc, and inviting as many illegals to get drivers licenses, to help them vote. and staffing our legal system with leftwing anti-Constitution hacks, including our Supreme Court they nearly owned.

For example - all this fake indignation over Pres Trump and our military taking out a top world's most terrible terrorist.

from the same party that applauds rampant no-excuse abortion on demand, no matter when. Even after they are born.

More than a few times, there are those who want to control the narrative on this board - as in, prevent the political side they don't like...from speaking. And when they can't, they complain to the extreme, and personally attack primary posters who oppose them.

and then leave the forum. Too bad - but like the Senate - we should not go with the dishonesty from the other side.  The obamao clinton mafia/deep state has a dangerously tenacious grip on our country.

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5 minutes ago, calfoxwc said:

   I'm all for a third party to give the other two competition and keep them honest. Right now, though, it's like we are on a giant Good Ship America. do we turn left ? or right? or keep going straight ahead?

  It's just tantrum-throwing to say start all over again with new water and a new ship. It is impossible to happen. I'm tired of those on this board whose egos drive their spews against Pres Trump. They won't admit our economy is running far greater, won't admit Pres Trump is keeping his promises. they are just like the leftwing/democrat/liars/sombeitches ... who openly have adopted hateful nonsense as some kind of fake reality - thinking that they can undo the last presidential election, because they are po'd that they lost the opportunity of a lifetime - they nearly turned the tables on America and owned it via corruption, padding our electoral system with millions of illegals, padding states' voter registrations with the deceased, the relocated out of state, etc etc etc, and inviting as many illegals to get drivers licenses, to help them vote. and staffing our legal system with leftwing anti-Constitution hacks, including our Supreme Court they nearly owned.

For example - all this fake indignation over Pres Trump and our military taking out a top world's most terrible terrorist.

from the same party that applauds rampant no-excuse abortion on demand, no matter when. Even after they are born.

More than a few times, there are those who want to control the narrative on this board - as in, prevent the political side they don't like...from speaking. And when they can't, they complain to the extreme, and personally attack primary posters who oppose them.

and then leave the forum. Too bad - but like the Senate - we should not go with the dishonesty from the other side.  The obamao clinton mafia/deep state has a dangerously tenacious grip on our country.

I didn't support Trump in 2016. I wanted to see Cruz win. I knew Cruz to be a solid conservative with his history. I wasn't sure about Trump. He was pro choice before he was pro life. He was for the Clinton assault rifle ban before he was against it. He seemed to be chummy with liberal democrats and at one time switched to the democrat party. His children were all registered democrats. 

He has by far exceeded my expectations as president. He has withstood the worst attacks of any president in my lifetime and never stops fighting. He has a whole list of accomplishments as president yet our biased MSM has consistently given him over 90 percent negative media coverage. At this point he is right up there with Reagan with me as the best president in my lifetime.

 

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1 hour ago, OldBrownsFan said:

I didn't support Trump in 2016. I wanted to see Cruz win. I knew Cruz to be a solid conservative with his history. I wasn't sure about Trump. He was pro choice before he was pro life. He was for the Clinton assault rifle ban before he was against it. He seemed to be chummy with liberal democrats and at one time switched to the democrat party. His children were all registered democrats. 

He has by far exceeded my expectations as president. He has withstood the worst attacks of any president in my lifetime and never stops fighting. He has a whole list of accomplishments as president yet our biased MSM has consistently given him over 90 percent negative media coverage. At this point he is right up there with Reagan with me as the best president in my lifetime.

 

I was on the Cruz train too. It wasn't til Pres Trump started taking the lead that I really started to listen. Then, after he was the nominee, I listened very closely. and I came to realize quickly that he was very serious. And he was sincere - he's been keeping his promises.

     The left is more and more sounding like the Manson family - they hate and are all in for sick reasons. Reality doesn't matter, and the truth is their enemy. A cult. It doesn't have to make any kind of sense at all. They are emotionally happy to be "all in"

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Tia, sure, we get it. Everybody sucks no doubt. Guess what? So do Libertarians green party Tea Party socialist whigs bullmoose whoever the fuck you got. My question really didn't have anything to do with any of them just a strategy question if you were at the helm.

WSS

 

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So back to the question I'm not one hundred percent one way or the other but I would lead toward just having the majority throw the case out. If that's not possible I would Grill every opposition candidate and member of The Witch Hunt the way I'm sure they will grill every human being who's ever parked in the same lot as a member of the administration.

I'd like to see Trey Gowdy take them on he seems pretty Sharp. but again to be completely honest I assume those charges are going to rise above Clinton's blowjob and I really don't give a fuk.

WSS

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10 hours ago, Westside Steve said:

Good morning gentlemen. In this case I don't think it really matters if you align yourselves with any particular party or for or against any candidate.

There appear to be two schools of thought any upcoming impeachment trial in the Senate. since Party Line votes seem to be the standard here there will be a choice.

Option one with 51 or 50 and the vice president boats the Senate could just throw out the articles of impeachment.

 Option number two would be to go ahead with the trial and call most of the opposition party members as witnesses presumably to unearth some embarrassing answers relevant to the case at hand or not.

What say you members of the panel?

WSS

What are the scenarios that can happen?

If they decide to take the route to call witnesses, I would love to see Hunter Biden and the whistleblower take the stand.

BTW, Joe Biden said if he’s indicted...he won’t testify.

I don’t know how he thinks he can get away with not testifying, he really can’t claim executive privilege because he’s an ordinary citizen.

But I digress.

If the Senate decides to take up a vote to see if they want to dismiss the whole thing, I would be good with that as well.

It would be like giving the House a big “F¥ck You”! 🖕🏻

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The "everybody sucks" by the left is quite convenient - we never heard that during the eight years we put up with

THEIR president, who was completely corrupt, and lied/deliberately broke promises he made to the American people, and ran us

down all around the world - most notably, to European and Arabic countries.

He was a dirtbag.

But now, "everybody is just as bad".

I call bs. bigtime.

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15 minutes ago, LogicIsForSquares said:

Not all of us but I prefer small government.

So you don't want the master you pick to force the Second Amendment on the rest of the population? Come now.

WSS

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1 hour ago, Westside Steve said:

So you don't want the master you pick to force the Second Amendment on the rest of the population? Come now.

WSS

No one is forcing a gun in anyone’s hands. That is the difference. The ability to choose how you want to live is much different than making everyone else adhere to your personal convictions. If every possible weapon on Earth was available to the public, you could still choose to live without any as a personal preference. 

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4 minutes ago, LogicIsForSquares said:

No one is forcing a gun in anyone’s hands. That is the difference. The ability to choose how you want to live is much different than making everyone else adhere to your personal convictions. If every possible weapon on Earth was available to the public, you could still choose to live without any as a personal preference. 

I'm completely aware of that my friend. But there are people think it's their Duty to put that right to an end. Along with plenty of other rights which you may or may not care to keep. And frankly I want my elected Masters to protect the ones that I do care about it. Even if I'm in the minority.

WSS

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10 hours ago, Westside Steve said:

So back to the question I'm not one hundred percent one way or the other but I would lead toward just having the majority throw the case out. If that's not possible I would Grill every opposition candidate and member of The Witch Hunt the way I'm sure they will grill every human being who's ever parked in the same lot as a member of the administration.

I'd like to see Trey Gowdy take them on he seems pretty Sharp. but again to be completely honest I assume those charges are going to rise above Clinton's blowjob and I really don't give a fuk.

WSS

the charges ( Durham investigations) that are hiding behind what the left is doing to deflect with the "impeachment"  are criminal in my opinion 

yes, much bigger than clintons blow job and certainly WAY bigger than watergate

 

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1 hour ago, FairHooker11 said:

the charges ( Durham investigations) that are hiding behind what the left is doing to deflect with the "impeachment"  are criminal in my opinion 

yes, much bigger than clintons blow job and certainly WAY bigger than watergate

 

IMO Watergate head white water or bullshit. I'd be surprised if Nixon actually masterminded the break-in but I wouldn't be surprised if he knew about it. And Bill Clinton is no fool I can't imagine he didn't smell a rat when he got involved with the minor-league land swindle.

But lying about fucking around on your wife? If that's the new standard for criminal activity we better start building some more prisons.

😏

WSS

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Plus if anybody wants to be honest I can't imagine that the Ukraine oh, who had a very close and financially rewarding relationship with the Democrats in office, would have hired some random stranger for the position they gave Hunter Biden who had equal experience and expertise. And there might certainly be nothing actually illegal there but the wink and the nod are pretty evident.

WSS

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Bring on all the witnesses under oath that each side wants and get all documents wanted out by each side as well. The American people deserve to hear it all regardless of party. But that won't happen because obstruction of Congress has not allowed anything and Moscow Mitch is part of it now that he has openly stated he does not want any witnesses and he is in concert with the WH.. And truthfully the Dems should have pursued it all up through the Supreme Court. Whether anyone likes it or not there are some real Constitutional issues involved in the whole mess.  And if you catch any witness lying under oath, then prosecute for perjury.

It should be up to the American people to hear it all and make their own decision in Nov. 

But he will not be found guilty and this will be a sham of a "trial". Documents and witnesses will be blocked and our right wing banana Republic is intact and getting Russian help again to keep in power. Maduro = Trump. The other side of the same coin.

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46 minutes ago, TexasAg1969 said:

Bring on all the witnesses under oath that each side wants and get all documents wanted out by each side as well. The American people deserve to hear it all regardless of party. But that won't happen because obstruction of Congress has not allowed anything and Moscow Mitch is part of it now that he has openly stated he does not want any witnesses and he is in concert with the WH.. And truthfully the Dems should have pursued it all up through the Supreme Court. Whether anyone likes it or not there are some real Constitutional issues involved in the whole mess.  And if you catch any witness lying under oath, then prosecute for perjury.

It should be up to the American people to hear it all and make their own decision in Nov. 

But he will not be found guilty and this will be a sham of a "trial". Documents and witnesses will be blocked and our right wing banana Republic is intact and getting Russian help again to keep in power. Maduro = Trump. The other side of the same coin.

"Moscow Mitch" lol...now all republicans are working hand in hand with Putin. McConnell made a mistake when he said the truth that he was not an impartial juror but he was partisan. Schumer may say he is impartial or any number of other democrats may claim to be impartial but if you actually believe that I have some bridges to sell to you. In fact most of the democrats running for president have already called for Trump's impeachment even without any evidence.

The real sham was in the House where Pelosi and Schiff made up their own unfair rules. They voted to impeach Trump saying they had overwhelming evidence but now they want the Senate to go fishing to try and find more.  I thought they already had overwhelming evidence?  It is not the Senate's job to finish the House's investigation. I say send it back to the House and tell them to come back to the Senate when they have a case they actually believe they have evidence to impeach. Also Pelosi and the dems said they had to rush their impeachment in the House because it was so "urgent" and then Pelosi instead of sending her "urgent" impeachment to the Senate sat on the impeachment for a month before finally sending the articles of impeachment to the Senate. Yeah...it was really urgent.

Trump is guilty of the crime of beating Hillary Clinton in 2016 and for all the preaching from the democrats in 2016 that we had to accept the 2016 election results (when they thought Hillary Clinton had the election in the bag) when Trump pulled off the upset they are the hypocrites who never accepted the election results and now they are dragging the country through a political impeachment when we have a presidential election later this year....... but they don't want the voters to decide...)

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