The Gipper Posted December 23, 2019 Report Share Posted December 23, 2019 Larry (Hoorta) and I have a bet going. A bottle of wine at stake. I said that the Bengals pick at #1 overall would be Chase Young DE OSU. He says it will be Joe Burrows QB LSU. Straight forward enought no? Well, not so fast my friend. He and I need to clarify our bet a bit, and here is why: There was speculation on some ESPN radio programs that the few teams behind Cinci in the draft order could conduct a bidding war with Cinci for them to move up to that #1 pick. Right now it could be that both the Giants, and Redskins, teams that chose their QBs of the future just last year, may want to get into a competition for the rights to Chase Young. Lets say arguendo that Hoorta is right.....the Bengals do want Burrows....BUT, that does NOT mean that they have to have him at the #1 spot. Let's suppose they are talking to both the Giants and Skins who both want Young (and the analysts involved in this conversation said they DO both want Young.) What would they give the Bengals for the #1 pick. The Giants who have #2 cannot just sit back and wait for the Bengals to take Burrows....as what if the Bengals say they are willing to trade the pick to the Skins? Then the Giants lose out. The Giants could/should turn around and say: "Cinci, we will give you our #2 pick, plus X additional compensation to switch spots with us". What should they ask for in addition? Or...let's say that the Bengals do a deal with the the Redskins, who have #3......getting that #3 plus more. They could then say to NYG...HA! We are letting your divisional rival Redskins have Young, and we still get Burrows. But...in that case.....NYG could say: "touche".....we trade #2 to Miami, or Jacksonville..or the like...and you, Bitchy Pussies, lose out on both Young AND Burrow because the (Fins..or Jags) are taking Burrow. A very interesting scenario. Fair to say. But, back to the bet. We both assumed that the bet involved whether Cinci would take Young or Burrow. We did not factor in if the pick would be traded to someone else? What say you Hoorta? I am willing to stick to the proposition: Chase Young, No Matter What! Be it the Bangles/Giants/Redskins etc....he is #1. I will take the pulse of the collective here: IF the Bengals move the pick to another team......should the bet be off? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Gipper Posted December 23, 2019 Author Report Share Posted December 23, 2019 I just realized another kicker that is an issue: In fact, the Giants have "fallen" into the #4 spot...behind the Skins at #2 and the Lions at 3. I am sure the Lions would certainly like to have Young....but...would they possibly want Burrows? Matt Stafford I would say has pretty much underperformed....from a won/loss standpoint, if not from a statistical standpoint his whole career. Would the Lions want to move on from Stafford? And would they be in the mix in this bidding war, if it were to take place? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dutch Oven Posted December 23, 2019 Report Share Posted December 23, 2019 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SdBacker80 Posted December 23, 2019 Report Share Posted December 23, 2019 If the Bengals like Burrow they will not make a trade. And if they see something they don’t like you turn the card in for Young. And If they got too greedy I would expect some QB starving team to jump ahead of them should they move out of the Top spot and try to take Burrow later. The only way the Bengals lose this draft is if they miss out on a chance for either Burrow or Young. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Gipper Posted December 23, 2019 Author Report Share Posted December 23, 2019 1 minute ago, SdBacker80 said: If the Bengals like Burrow they will not make a trade. And if they see something they don’t like you turn the card in for Young. And If they got too greedy I would expect some QB starving team to jump ahead of them should they move out of the Top spot and try to take Burrow later. The only way the Bengals lose this draft is if they miss out on a chance for either Burrow or Young. Well...they ARE the Bengals. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SdBacker80 Posted December 23, 2019 Report Share Posted December 23, 2019 35 minutes ago, The Gipper said: Well...they ARE the Bengals. True And we are the Browns. must be an Ohio thing. If you Recall the whole trade down and still get your QB a couple years ago. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Gipper Posted December 23, 2019 Author Report Share Posted December 23, 2019 11 hours ago, SdBacker80 said: True And we are the Browns. must be an Ohio thing. If you Recall the whole trade down and still get your QB a couple years ago. For the Browns? No, I don't recall that at all. We took Mayfield #1. Or are you talking about the year they took DeShone Kizer? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bjh2130 Posted December 23, 2019 Report Share Posted December 23, 2019 16 hours ago, The Gipper said: I said that the Bengals pick at #1 overall would be Chase Young DE OSU. He says it will be Joe Burrows QB LSU. Straight forward enought no? Yes its straight forward. You said it yourself the Bengals will draft Young at number 1. If your bet was chase young will be the number 1 pick and he said Burrow then trades don't matter. However you said Bengals at number 1. If the Bengals don't draft at 1 then the bet is void. What if they trade down and still get burrow then you were right that young went first but Larry was right that the Bengals took burrow. How could you expect to be paid on that bet when both were half right? 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Gipper Posted December 23, 2019 Author Report Share Posted December 23, 2019 20 minutes ago, bjh2130 said: Yes its straight forward. You said it yourself the Bengals will draft Young at number 1. If your bet was chase young will be the number 1 pick and he said Burrow then trades don't matter. However you said Bengals at number 1. If the Bengals don't draft at 1 then the bet is void. What if they trade down and still get burrow then you were right that young went first but Larry was right that the Bengals took burrow. How could you expect to be paid on that bet when both were half right? Well yeah that’s my question should the bet continue if the pick is traded. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bjh2130 Posted December 23, 2019 Report Share Posted December 23, 2019 1 hour ago, The Gipper said: Well yeah that’s my question should the bet continue if the pick is traded. No the bet should not continue. 18 hours ago, The Gipper said: I am willing to stick to the proposition: Chase Young, No Matter What! Be it the Bangles/Giants/Redskins etc....he is #1. The original proposition was the Bengals draft young at 1 vs the Bengals draft burrow at 1. Not young will be drafted at 1 vs Burrow will be drafted at 1. So you're statement above isn't sticking to the original proposition. Its changing the original proposition. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hoorta Posted December 23, 2019 Report Share Posted December 23, 2019 17 hours ago, The Gipper said: I just realized another kicker that is an issue: In fact, the Giants have "fallen" into the #4 spot...behind the Skins at #2 and the Lions at 3. I am sure the Lions would certainly like to have Young....but...would they possibly want Burrows? Matt Stafford I would say has pretty much underperformed....from a won/loss standpoint, if not from a statistical standpoint his whole career. Would the Lions want to move on from Stafford? And would they be in the mix in this bidding war, if it were to take place? You can just can the speculation on Stafford. (pun intended.) Matt is going nowhere in 2020- not with a $31 million cap hit albatross. Washington, Lions, and Giants will all be desirous of getting Young. MHO is trade speculation starts at the #2 pick. Oh, the Redskins will just sit at #2 and take Young- no one is jumping ahead of them to take Chase, that would only happen to take a QB- and I don't see any realistic trade that would have the Bengals trading down and missing out on the chance to get Joe 55 minutes ago, The Gipper said: Well yeah that’s my question should the bet continue if the pick is traded. I'll let you off if the Bengals decide to trade the pick, but it's a damn near certainty they won't. Not with Esiason giving Joe a Bengals helmet on the NFL Today pregame. And if you want any more proof you're gonna lose this bet, intrepid Cincinnati marketeers are already hawking unlicensed Burrow jerseys. https://bengalswire.usatoday.com/2019/12/23/joe-burrow-bengals-jersey-nfl-draft/ There'd be an uprising in Bungledom if the Bungles take anyone but Joe. I've seen some draft rags calling Burrow the best qb prospect since Andrew Luck. Walter is a little less effusive in his praise, but still considers him the lock #1 pick... "It's clear by now that Ryan Finley is not the long-term answer, so the Bengals will want to select a franchise quarterback with the top pick in the 2020 NFL Draft. Tua Tagovailoa is no longer the option because of his devastating injury, but it doesn't even matter anymore, based on what Joe Burrow has accomplished. Burrow has improved exponentially, and he's now the no-brainer No. 1 overall selection." The only way the Bengals don't take Joe is in the unfortunate event he suffers a catastrophic injury in the College Playoffs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nickers Posted December 23, 2019 Report Share Posted December 23, 2019 20 hours ago, Dutch Oven said: This cat(Bubbles) is a darn good guitar player.. I'd love to see a duel between him and Buckethead!!.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hoorta Posted December 23, 2019 Report Share Posted December 23, 2019 3 minutes ago, bjh2130 said: No the bet should not continue. The original proposition was the Bengals draft young at 1 vs the Bengals draft burrow at 1. Not young will be drafted at 1 vs Burrow will be drafted at 1. So you're statement above isn't sticking to the original proposition. Its changing the original proposition. Gipper likes to confuse the issues- especially because it looks like he's going to lose the bet. 1 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bjh2130 Posted December 23, 2019 Report Share Posted December 23, 2019 1 minute ago, hoorta said: Gipper likes to confuse the issues- especially because it looks like he's going to lose the bet. Yeah barring injury Burrow is going to be selected number 1. That hometown kid thing is really going to solidify it with the fanbase also. Which if the redskins select second and take young he'll be going back home also. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hoorta Posted December 23, 2019 Report Share Posted December 23, 2019 Just now, bjh2130 said: Yeah barring injury Burrow is going to be selected number 1. That hometown kid thing is really going to solidify it with the fanbase also. Which if the redskins select second and take young he'll be going back home also. Well, he's really not a hometown kid- not in the sense Trubisky would have been if the Browns had drafted him. Athens is over 100 miles from Cinci- but he is an OHIO kid, having played at Ohio State. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SdBacker80 Posted December 24, 2019 Report Share Posted December 24, 2019 On 12/23/2019 at 6:02 AM, The Gipper said: For the Browns? No, I don't recall that at all. We took Mayfield #1. Or are you talking about the year they took DeShone Kizer? Yeah because it didn’t happen although fans wanted us to trade down. if a team finds their guy at QB and the player is there ...we have a long history of teams not tempting fate and trading down they just take their guy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Gipper Posted December 24, 2019 Author Report Share Posted December 24, 2019 On 12/23/2019 at 2:11 PM, hoorta said: You can just can the speculation on Stafford. (pun intended.) Matt is going nowhere in 2020- not with a $31 million cap hit albatross. Washington, Lions, and Giants will all be desirous of getting Young. MHO is trade speculation starts at the #2 pick. Oh, the Redskins will just sit at #2 and take Young- no one is jumping ahead of them to take Chase, that would only happen to take a QB- and I don't see any realistic trade that would have the Bengals trading down and missing out on the chance to get Joe I'll let you off if the Bengals decide to trade the pick, but it's a damn near certainty they won't. Not with Esiason giving Joe a Bengals helmet on the NFL Today pregame. And if you want any more proof you're gonna lose this bet, intrepid Cincinnati marketeers are already hawking unlicensed Burrow jerseys. https://bengalswire.usatoday.com/2019/12/23/joe-burrow-bengals-jersey-nfl-draft/ There'd be an uprising in Bungledom if the Bungles take anyone but Joe. I've seen some draft rags calling Burrow the best qb prospect since Andrew Luck. Walter is a little less effusive in his praise, but still considers him the lock #1 pick... "It's clear by now that Ryan Finley is not the long-term answer, so the Bengals will want to select a franchise quarterback with the top pick in the 2020 NFL Draft. Tua Tagovailoa is no longer the option because of his devastating injury, but it doesn't even matter anymore, based on what Joe Burrow has accomplished. Burrow has improved exponentially, and he's now the no-brainer No. 1 overall selection." The only way the Bengals don't take Joe is in the unfortunate event he suffers a catastrophic injury in the College Playoffs. Actually, I would be the one letting YOU off....because I say "Young, no matter what" at #1, be it Bengals, Giants, Redskins whomever. Maybe we should wait and see if the Bitchy Pussies do the trade before determining if the bet is off...for, if they don't the suggestion of letting the bet go is superfluous. I only brought it up because it was brought up on the radio.....and it does provide a subject for some interesting speculation. Fair to say? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Gipper Posted December 24, 2019 Author Report Share Posted December 24, 2019 The original proposition was the Bengals draft young at 1 vs the Bengals draft burrow at 1. Not young will be drafted at 1 vs Burrow will be drafted at 1. So you're statement above isn't sticking to the original proposition. Its changing the original proposition. I agree that by the Bengals trading the #1 pick, the original proposition is changed. We/I never thought about the possibility of the Bengals trading down until I heard it stated on the radio. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Gipper Posted December 24, 2019 Author Report Share Posted December 24, 2019 On 12/23/2019 at 2:18 PM, hoorta said: Well, he's really not a hometown kid- not in the sense Trubisky would have been if the Browns had drafted him. Athens is over 100 miles from Cinci- but he is an OHIO kid, having played at Ohio State. Chase Young is a Hyattsville DeMatha Product....from Maryland. So maybe that would be an incentive for the Redskins to try to get him....he would be a home town product for them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mjp28 Posted December 24, 2019 Report Share Posted December 24, 2019 On 12/23/2019 at 2:18 PM, hoorta said: Well, he's really not a hometown kid- not in the sense Trubisky would have been if the Browns had drafted him. Athens is over 100 miles from Cinci- but he is an OHIO kid, having played at Ohio State. I think today's players are more concerned with going to a winner -or- maybe just the big numbers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Gipper Posted December 24, 2019 Author Report Share Posted December 24, 2019 Today's players, no more than yesterday's players, do not have a choice as to where they are drafted. The post you made is also irrelevent....because they basically have no choice on their compensation. On the other hand, once their initial contract ends, then they have choices. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hoorta Posted December 25, 2019 Report Share Posted December 25, 2019 9 hours ago, The Gipper said: Actually, I would be the one letting YOU off....because I say "Young, no matter what" at #1, be it Bengals, Giants, Redskins whomever. Maybe we should wait and see if the Bitchy Pussies do the trade before determining if the bet is off...for, if they don't the suggestion of letting the bet go is superfluous. I only brought it up because it was brought up on the radio.....and it does provide a subject for some interesting speculation. Fair to say? Bull, I said Burrow #1 to the Bengals, you're the one trying to muddy the waters. Now you're trying to throw some trade crap in there? I was PERFECTLY clear what I meant. And Young ISN'T going to the Bengals at #1 regardless. Care to double down? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Gipper Posted December 25, 2019 Author Report Share Posted December 25, 2019 5 hours ago, hoorta said: Bull, I said Burrow #1 to the Bengals, you're the one trying to muddy the waters. Now you're trying to throw some trade crap in there? I was PERFECTLY clear what I meant. And Young ISN'T going to the Bengals at #1 regardless. Care to double down? That’s right you said Burrow number one to the Bengals you didn’t say Burrow number two or number three or number four. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bjh2130 Posted December 25, 2019 Report Share Posted December 25, 2019 5 hours ago, The Gipper said: That’s right you said Burrow number one to the Bengals you didn’t say Burrow number two or number three or number four. Gipper you are definitely trying to muddy the waters in your original post in here you said that Larry said the BENGALS would take burrow at 1 and you said the BENGALS would take young at 1. Seems to be the bet was made based on who the BENGALS would pick at 1 not just who the pick at number 1 would be. If you made that exact bet in vegas and the Bengals traded out of the number 1 pick the bet would be void. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Gipper Posted December 25, 2019 Author Report Share Posted December 25, 2019 59 minutes ago, bjh2130 said: Gipper you are definitely trying to muddy the waters in your original post in here you said that Larry said the BENGALS would take burrow at 1 and you said the BENGALS would take young at 1. Seems to be the bet was made based on who the BENGALS would pick at 1 not just who the pick at number 1 would be. If you made that exact bet in vegas and the Bengals traded out of the number 1 pick the bet would be void. OK, fair enough. I guess. Like I said, my question was what should be the disposition of the bet if the Bengals traded the pick. I only "muddied it up" because some national radio/tv guys had a discussion about what would happen if the Bengals made a trade. So, nothing is muddied until and unless that happens. That is how I see it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jiggins7919 Posted December 26, 2019 Report Share Posted December 26, 2019 On 12/25/2019 at 2:46 AM, hoorta said: Bull, I said Burrow #1 to the Bengals, you're the one trying to muddy the waters. It's going to be Burrow unless they're fools. I REALLY like him, and I think he would have EASILY been the first pick in the 2018 draft. Limited time as a starter, but his pocket awareness translates so freaking well IMO. I'm officially terrified that Baker is ruined. You don't set rookie records and then all of the sudden start sucking. Something is going on and we all need to hope a new coaching staff can get him back on track. I wouldn't bet against Baker, but this entire season has been choppy as hell. Two steps forward, three backwards. He hasn't even feasted on the bad defenses, something he excelled at last year. I still believe in him, but let's be honest, next year will likely be the "put up or shut up" time of his young career. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dutch Oven Posted December 26, 2019 Report Share Posted December 26, 2019 If I was Zombo I would change Gipper's handle to: Muddy Waters 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Gipper Posted December 26, 2019 Author Report Share Posted December 26, 2019 1 hour ago, Dutch Oven said: If I was Zombo I would change Gipper's handle to: Muddy Waters Well, like I said, I brought it up only because national media types did, and because, again, like I said, I thought it could be an interesting subject for discussion : the possibility of the Bengals trading the pick. It could be that whether or not Hoorta and I had a bet going or not. It may be a bit premature now, but it was brought up elsewhere. Or, are you diametrically opposed to having any matter that can be an interesting subject for discussion brought up here? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hoorta Posted December 26, 2019 Report Share Posted December 26, 2019 52 minutes ago, The Gipper said: Well, like I said, I brought it up only because national media types did, and because, again, like I said, I thought it could be an interesting subject for discussion : the possibility of the Bengals trading the pick. It could be that whether or not Hoorta and I had a bet going or not. It may be a bit premature now, but it was brought up elsewhere. Or, are you diametrically opposed to having any matter that can be an interesting subject for discussion brought up here? Is it possible the Bengals would entertain trading the pick? Sure, anythings possible. But very, very unlikely they would do so. I've mentioned some draft rags are putting Joe on an Andrew Luck level of talent, and the Colts weren't trading out of #1 for Luck regardless of how silly the offers got. If Burrow shines in the playoffs, and brings the National championship to LSU, count on the Bengals asking price for the pick being prohibitive. It will be at least three first round picks & a lot more. & MHO that article suggesting a possible trade was just click bait, like Urban Meyer to the Browns level hot air. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Gipper Posted December 26, 2019 Author Report Share Posted December 26, 2019 15 minutes ago, hoorta said: Is it possible the Bengals would entertain trading the pick? Sure, anythings possible. But very, very unlikely they would do so. I've mentioned some draft rags are putting Joe on an Andrew Luck level of talent, and the Colts weren't trading out of #1 for Luck regardless of how silly the offers got. If Burrow shines in the playoffs, and brings the National championship to LSU, count on the Bengals asking price for the pick being prohibitive. It will be at least three first round picks & a lot more. OK, sure. Like I said, forget that we have a bet going.....As I said, this discussion on the radio involved a potential bidding war between the Redskins and Giants for the services of Young. IF the Bengals hold still, then the Redskins currently have the #2....and they would need to do nothing. But, as mentioned, what if the Giants were willing to give up a host in order to jump the Skins. The difference between this situation and the LUck situation would be that there, any team that was offering to trade with Indy was in order to get Luck. Here, the trade offers would not be to get the QB the Bengals may want, but another player. The issue could be: Can the Bengals eat their cake and have it too: Could they still get Burrows...AND get something very valuable in addition. If the Bengals were shrewd (something they have never been accused of)...they could even say: Washington, give us your number 2 pick plus X, in order that we do not trade down with NYG. They get Burrows and X...whatever that may be. Their 2d round or 3rd round pick...or a future pick. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.