Rashard Higgins drama confirms Cleveland Browns locker room problems

[Vambo]

https://dawgpounddaily.com/2019/11/08/rashard-higgins-drama-confirms-cleveland-browns-locker-room-problems/

wns locker room problems

by Dan Justik 2 hours ago

 

On Friday, Jason Lloyd of The Athletic reported Higgins did not play against the Seahawks because he refused to play when asked to enter the game (subscription required). Higgins said after the game he did not know why he was not put into the game.

The Browns coaching staff clearly was expecting Higgins to be on the field against the Seahawks. Otherwise, they would not have activated him for the game and instead would have let him miss another game.

This drama with Higgins is just another arrow pointing at the direction of the Browns having issues in the locker room. There does not appear to be much leadership from both the coaching staff and the players themselves because situations like this do not normally happen.

The concern with Kitchens would be if he would demand the respect from his players as the head coach. But as the season drags on and the Browns still resemble an undisciplined team who can not execute, it is clear Kitchens is not doing enough to get what he wants out of the players.

Higgins telling his own head coach that he will not enter a game despite being dressed and apparently part of the game plan is mind-numbing. A coach clearly is not showing enough leadership if his own players are saying they won’t enter games when called upon.

But the issue does not just fall onto Kitchens. It is now a broader issue because there does not seem to be too much leadership in the locker room itself. With the Browns struggling, the players should be demanding the most out of each other. But what they are getting is players who don’t want to play in games despite being ready to play.

[ATOM]

players ?  who else have refused to play when called upon ?

[Orion]

Was he still hurt?

[CLEVELANDwantsPLAYOFFS]

Seems like some kind of depth chart drama..

[jcam222]

I’m not sure I believe he refused. I think the rest of the WR and Baker would be all over his ass.  

[hx214]

I never could figure out why he was active anyway. Dude had a knee injury for 4 weeks and they active him for the game before the bye week. Why? Let him sit that game, and the bye week game and come back 100%
 

Not to mention he is 3rd maybe 4th on the depth chart anyway.

[Dutch Oven]

I do recall Freddie saying something in the press conference the following week along the lines of "Ask Rashard why he didn't go in to the game"....

[Orion]

1 hour ago, Dutch Oven said:

I do recall Freddie saying something in the press conference the following week along the lines of "Ask Rashard why he didn't go in to the game"....

I think it was more like "Go ask Rashard about the Seattle game".  And then when asked, Rashard plead the 5th.  It's beginning to get weird like the Payton Hillis implosion....

[jiggins7919]

19 minutes ago, Orion said:

I think it was more like "Go ask Rashard about the Seattle game".  And then when asked, Rashard plead the 5th.  It's beginning to get weird like the Payton Hillis implosion....

I noticed that too. This is what happens when the wheels fall off. 

Time to make sure they stay on. 

[gumby73]

I too, expected to see Higgy get some snaps during the Seattle game..Heck, I drafted higgy in league 4's fantasy league, than just dumped him after the hawks game post game interviews.. I'd file this one under "butt hurt with bad timing for a injury while Cab was suspended".Hig's went out after week 1*. Baker got here, throwing the ball to Higgy as a back-up growing some solid chemistry with Higgins.. Man, has the chemistry & the roster changed since than..If Freddie was Baker's guy as his HC? This can't be sitting well with Bake & Higgy's past friendship..

Flustrating Freddie was waiting on *adversity*..Were getting beyond here!!   

[Flugel]

On 11/8/2019 at 11:17 PM, jiggins7919 said:

I noticed that too. This is what happens when the wheels fall off. 

Time to make sure they stay on. 

With all the money dished out to gotta-have players - there's no the behind closed doors (players only) meeting that took place or is set to take place? 

Here's an appropriate line from a player in a football movie about bringing players and coaches from different neighborhoods and backgrounds together: "Attitude reflect leadership"

I was wondering WTF is up with a guy like Higgins that helped Baker out in clutch situations when called upon in 2018.  But apparently guys like Higgins and Zampese aren't worth the continuity to the #1 overall investment at QB.  Yeah, just yank out the rug/foundation and start all over again.  And look at all the wonderful alternatives to Higgins while OBJ draws the #1 corner with Safety help.   If some of this is Dorsey's ego in the from of "I didn't draft Higgins"  kind of thing: then Higgins' reaction to it on the sideline isn't the problem - it's a symptom. We're about 1-2 more disappointing game days from veteran players and their agents wanting out of here asap all over again.  Then we get treated to all kinds of mysterious injuries sidelining veterans that were allegedly going to change everything.   This puts us right back in the same boat, which is a safety canoe off the ship that just sunk.

With the investments made at DE, they sure have a knack of losing contain and not getting to the depth of the QB dropback before clamping down and in.  If they don't get to that depth and they take an inside angle instead - this allows running games to get outside easily rather than funneling everything back inside toward pursuit.  When our DEs do get that depth and maintain outside leverage throughout the clampd0wn, now the ball carriers have to belly backward around our DE depth.   This gives the pursuit much more time to get there for speedsters like Breida and more recently the Denver RBs that got outside early on.  It's especially critical when the defensive scheme only fields 2 LBers much of the time.   YES, Garrett gets his sacks and 1-2 pressures a game - but I'm not seeing a guy ready to be the reason we're winning (except for the Jets who everyone else beats).  He's a #1 overall pick; but I'm not seeing a guy that dominates or takes over a game like a Reggie White or Bruce Smith (who rarely ever had to complain about being held). Garrett seems like a good kid. But all this hoopla about his fitness routines - aren't showing me the full game motor at all.

All we heard all training camp and throughout the preseason was how GREAT and underrated this defense is.  They're pretty amazing when there's no tackling. Having said that, when there is tackling - check out the missing fundamentals and/or how often guys aren't in position to make a tackle.  The frequency of missing fundamentals and guys not doing their jobs enough to be in the right place to be helpful is why the volume of penalties persist here. Shortcuts get flagged.   And, isn't it fun watching us burn a timeout because someone doesn't know how/where to line up? And how about when we don't have 11 guys on the field?  Penalties are just a symptom of the bigger problem at hand - a complete lack of leadership on the field and the sidelines.  That's very disappointing. NFL body by Anita Beer...

 

[Flugel]

Look Ice!  Every time the Browns have a problem - Colin Cowerd gets another under wear change!   You see, he really has a Wonderful Life...

[jiggins7919]

11 minutes ago, Flugel said:

He's a #1 overall pick; but I'm not seeing a guy that dominates or takes over a game like a Reggie White or Bruce Smith (who rarely ever had to complain about being held). Garrett seems like a good kid. But all this hoopla about his fitness routines - aren't showing me the full game motor at all.

I've been saying this for a while and we keep hearing about how Myles terrorizes everyone in camp and looks absolutely unblockable, and how he totally wrecked practice and blah, blah, blah. 

I don't see THAT level of player in our games. Listen, I LOVE Myles Garrett and he's probably my favorite player on the team. He's a very good player, a terrific teammate, and a better human being. But he doesn't win games. He doesn't get game-altering plays (rarely). He's just a really good player and that's about it. 

I 100% agree with virtually EVERYTHING you said, and I'm very worried about the "random injuries" popping up and players sitting out. I also agree with you about the defense sucking and I can't understand WHY we're this bad. Like so many people have said in some way other posts, our offense and defense can be summed up with this statement:  "Nobody makes a big play when we need it." 

For example, several weeks ago the Ravens played the Seahawks. With the game on the line, the Ravens had a 4th and 2 near the goal line. Now, what do you think happened? Better yet, what would OUR team do? Would we rise up and make a game-winning play? No...no we wouldn't. What did Baltimore do? Well, Lamar Jackson obviously scored. Duh. But that's not all! The Seahawks had plenty of time to score a touchdown and retake the lead. Sound familiar?

Do you think Baltimore's defense choked and let them go all the way down the field to score? Why no...no they didn't. In FACT, Baltimore's defense took the ball away and scored a TD to seal it. Something our defense has never done. (to be fair, the Seattle player literally fumbled the ball to them without being touched, but whatever. We'll never, ever get that break, so we'll have to deal) 

I guess my point is that NFL games typically come down to a handful of plays every week. It's UNCANNY how on both offense and defense we routinely fail to MAKE these plays. This game tomorrow is probably going to be very similar to the Broncos game. If we don't make adjustments, the result will be similar too. Oddly enough, I'm betting on the Browns to win. I think we rise up for the home crowd, and I DON'T think Buffalo is a 7-2 team. They're just not. 

 

 

[calfoxwc]

I believe it all comes down to this - the defense was keeping us in games just fine, and the offense was pitiful.

Totally out of kilter. I figure, the defense is getting back to a point where it is hopeless because the offense doesn't work.

I think offensive skill players are figuring, the offensive line is hopeless.

   Before, the interior of the oline was priceless, best in the NFL maybe? Now, weak at ROG, and our center might try to help him, Bitonio tries to help Robinson... kinda like pinball....

and, Kitchens is a rookie Head Coach who calls his own plays. So there ya go.

   I just haven't had my coffee yet.

[Ibleedbrown]

I subscribe to the Athletic and read the article. It was like an odd cat and mouse game where the interviewer suspected there was something unsaid about the reason he didn’t play but he didn’t fess up. I guess silver lining, at least it’s not def con 5 where players and coaches are bad mouthing each other to the media, but we might be a step away from that. Either way, not a good look for Kitchens deferring the question to the player because at the very least it makes it harder for Kitchens to control the narrative, and for better or worse he badly needs to be on top of the narrative.

[TexasAg1969]

On Myles-if the rest of his teammates were playing up to his league tying sacks and hurries, we'd all be bragging about him leading this great defense. But they have collectively sucked in support. Change that and suddenly he's a great player again. They are so bad that we have to move him around the line to different positions to try to hide him. That is ridiculous.

[CLEVELANDwantsPLAYOFFS]

Myles isn’t making as much plays because we are consistently playing from behind.. It’s tough to get strip sacks against the run, PAs(with wide open targets), and screens while the offense isn’t scoring touchdowns..

[LBC mike]

I had high hopes for b the front seven this year 🙄

[nickers]

Does anyone get the sense that Higgy  is trying to pull a Josh Gordon and make his way to NE?

[Bob806]

4 hours ago, TexasAg1969 said:

On Myles-if the rest of his teammates were playing up to his league tying sacks and hurries, we'd all be bragging about him leading this great defense. But they have collectively sucked in support. Change that and suddenly he's a great player again. They are so bad that we have to move him around the line to different positions to try to hide him. That is ridiculous.

Yes, you'd think if Myles is getting double-teamed someone else would step up.Then again, in the Wilks 4-2-5 there really isn't a blitzing LB. It's kind of a bend-don't break defense IMHO. 

[gumby73]

 

I'd like to see more of Myles stunting to the inside lanes to avoid the doubles 🤔 

1 hour ago, nickers said:

Does anyone get the sense that Higgy  is trying to pull a Josh Gordon and make his way to NE?

signed a 2M tender for just 1 year..Why take the 2M cap hit just to cut him? if report holds true? if a lockerroom cancer, I'd get? heck, the former Ram WR Khadarel Hodge saw reps before Higgy last week. I think their plan sucks btw, but the trade deadline is gone & why not then? Hawks game was 10-13///deadline was 10-29.. 

[stillmotion]

1 hour ago, nickers said:

Does anyone get the sense that Higgy  is trying to pull a Josh Gordon and make his way to NE?

I think Higgins feels undervalued. ODB and Landry and then Callaway screws off and as soon as he gets back he's ahead of Higgy in the depth chart. That would make me feel weird as well.

Hue loved Higgins and I think Freddie likes Callaway better. Heck, Dorsey might too.

[browns52]

10 hours ago, jiggins7919 said:

I've been saying this for a while and we keep hearing about how Myles terrorizes everyone in camp and looks absolutely unblockable, and how he totally wrecked practice and blah, blah, blah. 

I don't see THAT level of player in our games. Listen, I LOVE Myles Garrett and he's probably my favorite player on the team. He's a very good player, a terrific teammate, and a better human being. But he doesn't win games. He doesn't get game-altering plays (rarely). He's just a really good player and that's about it. 

I 100% agree with virtually EVERYTHING you said, and I'm very worried about the "random injuries" popping up and players sitting out. I also agree with you about the defense sucking and I can't understand WHY we're this bad. Like so many people have said in some way other posts, our offense and defense can be summed up with this statement:  "Nobody makes a big play when we need it." 

For example, several weeks ago the Ravens played the Seahawks. With the game on the line, the Ravens had a 4th and 2 near the goal line. Now, what do you think happened? Better yet, what would OUR team do? Would we rise up and make a game-winning play? No...no we wouldn't. What did Baltimore do? Well, Lamar Jackson obviously scored. Duh. But that's not all! The Seahawks had plenty of time to score a touchdown and retake the lead. Sound familiar?

Do you think Baltimore's defense choked and let them go all the way down the field to score? Why no...no they didn't. In FACT, Baltimore's defense took the ball away and scored a TD to seal it. Something our defense has never done. (to be fair, the Seattle player literally fumbled the ball to them without being touched, but whatever. We'll never, ever get that break, so we'll have to deal) 

I guess my point is that NFL games typically come down to a handful of plays every week. It's UNCANNY how on both offense and defense we routinely fail to MAKE these plays. This game tomorrow is probably going to be very similar to the Broncos game. If we don't make adjustments, the result will be similar too. Oddly enough, I'm betting on the Browns to win. I think we rise up for the home crowd, and I DON'T think Buffalo is a 7-2 team. They're just not. 

 

 

he needs help....he's probably getting doubled alot...who else is picking up the slack....no one....if someone else starts showing up, i think you would see garrett at his best....you are right rig....but i don't think it is totally on him....our dl overall really stinks the lbs are a little below mediocre...maybe even worse...they have no lateral pursuit and are mostly slow...there is absolutely no pressure at all on the qb ....i can't put that on garrett alonw...

[Ibleedbrown]

13 hours ago, nickers said:

Does anyone get the sense that Higgy  is trying to pull a Josh Gordon and make his way to NE?

A couple weeks ago l thought it was the other way around where the team was sort of trying to manipulate the situation to lessen Higgins’ field time, which means he won’t have much compelling evidence on tape come free agent time and the Browns could resign him on the cheap. I’m not really sure that’s the case though. 

[Flugel]

20 hours ago, calfoxwc said:

I believe it all comes down to this - the defense was keeping us in games just fine, and the offense was pitiful.

Totally out of kilter. I figure, the defense is getting back to a point where it is hopeless because the offense doesn't work.

I think offensive skill players are figuring, the offensive line is hopeless.

   Before, the interior of the oline was priceless, best in the NFL maybe? Now, weak at ROG, and our center might try to help him, Bitonio tries to help Robinson... kinda like pinball....

and, Kitchens is a rookie Head Coach who calls his own plays. So there ya go.

   I just haven't had my coffee yet.

This feels like 1 of those Kit Kat commercials.  I have a HUGE problem with that very last comment above.  Go get an acre of coffee bean in you.  FWIW, Robinson played a pretty good game last week with the exception of a sack that Baker had more than enough time to get rid of the ball on. 

While it looks like the offensive line is the biggest problem - keep in mind how much credit the OL was given last year when Baker got rid of the ball far more quickly, accurately and decisively.   Baker hasn't been that guy at all so far this season (although there's 8 weeks to change that sooner than later).  I wish the FO would have left the Offensive Staff in tact so we don't do what TN did to Mariota and given him a bunch of new systems he may not be compatible with all the while he has to de-program many of the concepts his previous coaches asked him to master.  As we've seen in the NFL, there's a very short window in whether a QB emerges or fails out. 

Also, while we know Nick Chubb is #2 in yards after contact, you still gotta get a little momentum behind you to break all those tackles. I don't think we're that bad with run blocking and neither is Robin's son.  I have had a cup of coffee or 2 or 3 so make sure you do the same before responding.  Comprendsies?

[Flugel]

22 hours ago, jiggins7919 said:

I 100% agree with virtually EVERYTHING you said, and I'm very worried about the "random injuries" popping up and players sitting out. I also agree with you about the defense sucking and I can't understand WHY we're this bad. Like so many people have said in some way other posts, our offense and defense can be summed up with this statement:  "Nobody makes a big play when we need it." 

For example, several weeks ago the Ravens played the Seahawks. With the game on the line, the Ravens had a 4th and 2 near the goal line. Now, what do you think happened? Better yet, what would OUR team do? Would we rise up and make a game-winning play? No...

Do you think Baltimore's defense choked and let them go all the way down the field to score? Why no...no they didn't. In FACT, Baltimore's defense took the ball away and scored a TD to seal it. Something our defense has never done. (to be fair, the Seattle player literally fumbled the ball to them without being touched, but whatever. We'll never, ever get that break, so we'll have to deal) 

I guess my point is that NFL games typically come down to a handful of plays every week. It's UNCANNY how on both offense and defense we routinely fail to MAKE these plays. This game tomorrow is probably going to be very similar to the Broncos game. If we don't make adjustments, the result will be similar too. Oddly enough, I'm betting on the Browns to win. I think we rise up for the home crowd, and I DON'T think Buffalo is a 7-2 team. They're just not.

Last year's Baker would have had the confidence to exploit the WR breaking free Harris on the perimeter for the game winning points. This year's Baker threw a bad pass to a double covered Jarvis Landry.  Game over!

In high school back in 1980 and 1981, the team I played on in Western NY (Fairport High School) made it to the sectional finals in both seasons I played Varsity.  We did this with a HC that said you WIN and LOSE games during the practices before the games. If we fail to prepare we should prepare to fail.  AND, we're always only as good as our last guy (which is the guy flagged for not doing his job).  The teams that are fundamentally sound and know their assignments to DO THEIR JOBS - tend to get penalized less,commit less turnovers while being opportunistic with miscues and bad tackling from their opponents. They tackle, stay with their blocks and protect/secure the ball (and keep it in their arm closest to the sideline).  FWIW, all throughout NE going 8-0 - Tom Brady hasn't exactly been on a record setting path for TD passes (but he does maintain a good TD to INT ratio).  And, it's not like they haven't had multiple injuries to their OL and WR Corps.  The 1 week NE got sloppy/forgetful of their winning formula - they got Rathoused in Ratville.  As a result, they were the team turning the ball over.

A 60 minute game always looks like it's the team that makes the BIG plays that wins the game.  No argument with that; but when you don't turn the ball over or serial kill drives with penalties - all those little things GIVE you more opportunities to make the BIG plays.  The biggest reason winning teams don't have to repeat ad nauseum "We have to stop shooting ourselves in the foot" is because they take care of that during the week of preparation.  We had 2 weeks to prepare for NE on their short week.  Which team repeatedly shot themselves in the foot and which one did not?  The commentator said NE even practiced with soaking wet footballs, which tells me they were prepared for the weather and their ill-prepared opponent.  Denver out-prepared us too (and they haven't even been a team that prepared well) until they faced a team even less prepared.  

As for your concern about players checking out early, has there been a players only meeting with this collection of players yet?  They had one last year after the coaching change during the season which improved the leadership within and it helped the leadership on the sidelines as well. End result?  We had a fun season that set our expectations higher than we usually set them for the next year. Let's hope our gut feeling is wrong here; and we get an 8 week rally this fan base totally deserves...

[Tour2ma]

It appears Higgy was ready to play today...

[TexasAg1969]

1 hour ago, Tour2ma said:

It appears Higgy was ready to play today...

And so was Myles.😁

[Vambo]

 

[The Gipper]

Well...he isn't the only one.  Again, can this be a case of  Ferd just not having a clue how to use his talent....or is there something more?  Some discipline thing...which we have not heard of..

....because this is fucking ridiculous.  Baker clearly has a connection with Higgins.....why not fucking exploit it instead of subjecting we...the people that pay for you....to your personal fucking prejudices.