calfoxwc Posted July 16, 2009 Report Share Posted July 16, 2009 Congress will be EXEMPT from the provisions in their Dem health care bill. Fleming KNOWS what he is talking about - great youtube on the subject. And, Dems will NOT sign on to his presented bill. Not one. But some of them won't read a word of the health care bill, they will just sign it because they're a Democrat and it's a Dem bill. I say, if they vote for the mess, they should abide by it, and be affected by it. )(&)(*&^(*&%^)(*&P !!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
calfoxwc Posted July 16, 2009 Author Report Share Posted July 16, 2009 Oh, btw, STEVE - We were shopping at Rural King (farm store), and walking past the checkout... was... FROSTTOP root beer. I swear they are the same that used to be "Frostie" root beer. Oh, happy day ! Why, last night, I left my iced mug of root beer on the counter, and went outside to turn the sprinker off (watering pepper plants)... came back in, and it was half full. So, I had to walk into the tv room, and yep. My wonderful cute Wife grinned at me, with half a mug of iced root beer. She generally always only drinks diet pop. Oh yeah. HAPPY DAY ! "happy sigh" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pumpkin Eater Posted July 16, 2009 Report Share Posted July 16, 2009 I do think it's tragic to see children without health covereage. However, when the gov't steps into anything, it become inefficient and wasteful. I dont know what the answer is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
choco Posted July 16, 2009 Report Share Posted July 16, 2009 you really dont pay any attention to the news, do ya cal? http://www.cnn.com/2009/POLITICS/07/10/hou...care/index.html seriously, use a variety of sources....not just shit from the rights political propaganda complex. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
calfoxwc Posted July 16, 2009 Author Report Share Posted July 16, 2009 Well, I hadn't seen that. But your own posted article says all Dems want a gov health care package. Fleming says not one Dem will give up HIS OWN HEALTH INSURANCE, they are EXEMPT for at least 5 years without having to comply, themselves. You are referring to the fact that they had a letter saying the current bill is unacceptable. Well, that should tell you something, btw. Fleming's bill that no Dems will sign onto, is another matter. Watch the youtube video entirely. Unless I missed something. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
choco Posted July 16, 2009 Report Share Posted July 16, 2009 You are referring to the fact that they had a letter saying the current bill is unacceptable. yes i am, contrary to your statement.. But some of them won't read a word of the health care bill, they will just sign it because they're a Democrat and it's a Dem bill. how very wrong you were.... Well, that should tell you something, btw. it does....it tells me that you dont follow current events, tells me you dont do your homework, and also tells me you only get 'fair and balanced' news. flemings bill is a sham.....i dont expect the elite to accept public health care....the fact you do is very telling. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
calfoxwc Posted July 16, 2009 Author Report Share Posted July 16, 2009 They will still sign it. They may want to tweak it to prevent a major backlash back home... I don't sit around and major in the news from many media outlets... true. I'm busy with livin. But you are avoiding the issue. The Dems are seeing to it, that they are exempt from the health bill, and will refuse to sign onto it themselves. That, and how to pay for a major health bill, is the outrage. They will go after business, big and small. And unemployment will hit, oh, maybe 15%, is my guess at some point not very far away. Then you can blame that on Bush too. And Cheney, and Karl Rove. But eventually, you will learn to stop drinking the liberal kool-aid. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest mz. Posted July 16, 2009 Report Share Posted July 16, 2009 I don't sit around and major in the news from many media outlets... true. I'm busy with livin. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ballpeen Posted July 17, 2009 Report Share Posted July 17, 2009 Why do you quote people and then not say anything? I have noticed you do that before. Try adding some substance to the conversation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest mz. Posted July 17, 2009 Report Share Posted July 17, 2009 Why do you quote people and then not say anything? I have noticed you do that before. Why must I formulate a "counterargument" when one is so simply stated for me? For example, let's look at the above instance. Cal claimed the media is biased towards the left, then turned around and admitted he doesn't even follow any of "it." Do I even need to explain in length how hypocritical that is, or can I just point it out by proving said hypocrisy in said hypocrite's own words? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
calfoxwc Posted July 17, 2009 Author Report Share Posted July 17, 2009 Why must I formulate a "counterargument" when one is so simply stated for me? mz the pussy *************************** No, is isn't stated, you take the op to warp and distort. *************************** For example, let's look at the above instance. Cal claimed the media is biased towards the left, then turned around and admitted he doesn't even follow any of "it." mz the pussy ************************** Well, you just did it again - look, here is what I said: **** "I don't sit around and major in the news from many media outlets... true. I'm busy with livin." ****** I'm SAYING, that I don't just sit around all day, and watch MANY media news outlets in college, we are very busy and having a LOT of fun living life on the farm this summer ! I watch the different local news stations, a lot of different stuff, different places on the net, I read two different newspapers, I listen to 640 AM, 1100 AM locally, (and 94.6 Country Music a lot) msnbc (bleck), Fox, and Cspan every so often. And other political shows, other channels. But I don't "MAJOR", as in study and spend ALL my time like a college student, on MANY of them, like I avoid the bigoted Communist News Network, and whatever news outlet on satellite that is Islamic anti-West, etc. How the hell is that saying what mz the pussy says I said? He says I said I don't watch ANY. I said I don't watch MANY. I think it's just trying to start trouble with someone, when you flagrantly mischaracterize most all of what people say. I do give mz the pussy the credit to be able to STOP it. But, he doesn't, and has been called a "dipshit" on this political forum, and the Browns forum as well, because of it. ****************************************** Do I even need to explain in length how hypocritical that is, or can I just point it out by proving said hypocrisy in said hypocrite's own words? ****************************************** I call great big giant cornfields of bullsheet. It's a liberal thing, change the subject by putting words in conservatives' posts, then mock the words they never said, to put them on the defensive. Seems to be a psychological defense mechanism. Lord knows Heck does it a lot, too. And, yet, when someone whines about wanting "serious conversation on issues", then do this, you have to wonder why they don't see the hypocrisy right there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
calfoxwc Posted July 17, 2009 Author Report Share Posted July 17, 2009 It is actually kinda funny and amusing, but in a stupidly and immaturely dishonest kind of way... **** "I don't sit around and major in the news from many media outlets... true. I'm busy with livin." ****** ***** Here is what mz the pussy said: "For example, let's look at the above instance. Cal claimed the media is biased towards the left, then turned around and admitted he doesn't even follow any of "it." ************************** Now, mz the pussy, where the hell did I say I never watched ANY of "it" ??? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. T Posted July 17, 2009 Report Share Posted July 17, 2009 If this healthcare plan was so great, then will all of these senators who want to pass national Healthcare Ins. go out and place their families under this same program? I believe we all know the answer to that one. Lets see their hypocrisy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Westside Steve Posted July 17, 2009 Report Share Posted July 17, 2009 If this healthcare plan was so great, then will all of these senators who want to pass national Healthcare Ins. go out and place their families under this same program? I believe we all know the answer to that one. Lets see their hypocrisy. I think the idea to put congress on the "public option" was shot down quickly. Here's my take. The "45 million uninsured" is the mantra. So if the public option doesn't come to pass (and that's how it looks) and neither does a public mandate or taxation of benefits what WILL happen is adding the next tier of "poor" people to medicare. That way the private insurance will need to go sky high just to stay alive. Without platitudes or Michael Moore quotes can any of the supporters give me a few positives in this process being rushed to the floor? WSS Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ballpeen Posted July 17, 2009 Report Share Posted July 17, 2009 I added this here though it could probably stand alone... So much for private insurance. http://www.ibdeditorials.com/IBDArticles.a...332548165656854 It's Not An Option By INVESTOR'S BUSINESS DAILY | Posted Wednesday, July 15, 2009 4:20 PM PT Congress: It didn't take long to run into an "uh-oh" moment when reading the House's "health care for all Americans" bill. Right there on Page 16 is a provision making individual private medical insurance illegal. When we first saw the paragraph Tuesday, just after the 1,018-page document was released, we thought we surely must be misreading it. So we sought help from the House Ways and Means Committee. It turns out we were right: The provision would indeed outlaw individual private coverage. Under the Orwellian header of "Protecting The Choice To Keep Current Coverage," the "Limitation On New Enrollment" section of the bill clearly states: "Except as provided in this paragraph, the individual health insurance issuer offering such coverage does not enroll any individual in such coverage if the first effective date of coverage is on or after the first day" of the year the legislation becomes law. So we can all keep our coverage, just as promised — with, of course, exceptions: Those who currently have private individual coverage won't be able to change it. Nor will those who leave a company to work for themselves be free to buy individual plans from private carriers. From the beginning, opponents of the public option plan have warned that if the government gets into the business of offering subsidized health insurance coverage, the private insurance market will wither. Drawn by a public option that will be 30% to 40% cheaper than their current premiums because taxpayers will be funding it, employers will gladly scrap their private plans and go with Washington's coverage. The nonpartisan Lewin Group estimated in April that 120 million or more Americans could lose their group coverage at work and end up in such a program. That would leave private carriers with 50 million or fewer customers. This could cause the market to, as Lewin Vice President John Sheils put it, "fizzle out altogether." What wasn't known until now is that the bill itself will kill the market for private individual coverage by not letting any new policies be written after the public option becomes law. The legislation is also likely to finish off health savings accounts, a goal that Democrats have had for years. They want to crush that alternative because nothing gives individuals more control over their medical care, and the government less, than HSAs. With HSAs out of the way, a key obstacle to the left's expansion of the welfare state will be removed. The public option won't be an option for many, but rather a mandate for buying government care. A free people should be outraged at this advance of soft tyranny. Washington does not have the constitutional or moral authority to outlaw private markets in which parties voluntarily participate. It shouldn't be killing business opportunities, or limiting choices, or legislating major changes in Americans' lives. It took just 16 pages of reading to find this naked attempt by the political powers to increase their reach. It's scary to think how many more breaches of liberty we'll come across in the final 1,002. ................................... Sorry guys...this administration and what they seek to do to our freedoms is a bunch of crap. You won't be able to purchase private insurance if this gets passed...all you can do is keep amy current coverage. Change jobs, you have to take the government coverage no matter how inferior it may be. You and the indigent can line up at the county hospital. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ballpeen Posted July 18, 2009 Report Share Posted July 18, 2009 I will bump this as long as it takes to get some serious replies Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
calfoxwc Posted July 18, 2009 Author Report Share Posted July 18, 2009 Me too. btw - + + Congress Racing to Get “ObamaCare” Done! Despite the fact that most Americans have serious reservations about “ObamaCare,” Congress is charging ahead at lightning speed to pass their government-run health care scheme before the August recess! It's obvious that they don't want us to understand the impact this so-called “reform” will have on every America's access to quality health care. A recently released CNN/USA Today poll confirmed that the vast majority of Americans have real concerns about current efforts to overhaul our health care system... 81 % believe health care overhaul will reduce their quality of care 79% believe “ObamaCare” will limit their choices of doctors or treatments 82% think their health insurance coverage will be reduced 84 % believe “ObamaCare” will increase their health care costs 84% say a government-run system will sharply increase the federal deficit And why are our lawmakers ignoring the very people who put them in office? Health care “reform” is a Trojan Horse—an opportunity for the government to take more control over our lives, and they are counting on the media to pave the way! This poll, and other important news stories that dare to tell the truth about “ObamaCare” are either ignored or underreported. The vast majority of media outlets are in the tank with liberal lawmakers and the President, refusing to look at the facts and instead choosing to do whatever it takes to rush this 1,000+ page bill through Congress! (most of the media haven’t even read the proposals – click here for more on this) That’s why we created ObamaCareTruth.org. It’s the one site where concerned citizens can get the truth about Obama’s socialist health care plans. Updated continuously with the latest news and commentary, ObamaCareTruth.org boldly exposes the truth about the proposed government takeover of your personal health care decisions that the liberal media simply aren’t interested in reporting! As the health care crisis intensifies, we are urging members of our team to visit the site everyday, and to encourage friends and family to do the same. This is far too important an issue, and one that left ignored and unchallenged could radically change our lives forever! Thank you for standing with the MRC to fight for Free Speech and to get the truth out on ObamaCare! [/font] David Martin P.S: Please be watching your email for a VERY special message next week on how you can personally impact “ObamaCare” and the media’s role in selling it to America. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. T Posted July 18, 2009 Report Share Posted July 18, 2009 Me too. btw - + + Congress Racing to Get “ObamaCare” Done! Despite the fact that most Americans have serious reservations about “ObamaCare,” Congress is charging ahead at lightning speed to pass their government-run health care scheme before the August recess! It's obvious that they don't want us to understand the impact this so-called “reform” will have on every America's access to quality health care. A recently released CNN/USA Today poll confirmed that the vast majority of Americans have real concerns about current efforts to overhaul our health care system... 81 % believe health care overhaul will reduce their quality of care 79% believe “ObamaCare” will limit their choices of doctors or treatments 82% think their health insurance coverage will be reduced 84 % believe “ObamaCare” will increase their health care costs 84% say a government-run system will sharply increase the federal deficit And why are our lawmakers ignoring the very people who put them in office? Health care “reform” is a Trojan Horse—an opportunity for the government to take more control over our lives, and they are counting on the media to pave the way! This poll, and other important news stories that dare to tell the truth about “ObamaCare” are either ignored or underreported. The vast majority of media outlets are in the tank with liberal lawmakers and the President, refusing to look at the facts and instead choosing to do whatever it takes to rush this 1,000+ page bill through Congress! (most of the media haven’t even read the proposals – click here for more on this) That’s why we created ObamaCareTruth.org. It’s the one site where concerned citizens can get the truth about Obama’s socialist health care plans. Updated continuously with the latest news and commentary, ObamaCareTruth.org boldly exposes the truth about the proposed government takeover of your personal health care decisions that the liberal media simply aren’t interested in reporting! As the health care crisis intensifies, we are urging members of our team to visit the site everyday, and to encourage friends and family to do the same. This is far too important an issue, and one that left ignored and unchallenged could radically change our lives forever! Thank you for standing with the MRC to fight for Free Speech and to get the truth out on ObamaCare! [/font] David Martin P.S: Please be watching your email for a VERY special message next week on how you can personally impact “ObamaCare” and the media’s role in selling it to America. Good Stuff, Bump! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
calfoxwc Posted July 18, 2009 Author Report Share Posted July 18, 2009 PEEN deserves some serious replies on this: (bump) He posted: *************** I added this here though it could probably stand alone... So much for private insurance. http://www.ibdeditorials.com/IBDArticles.a...332548165656854 It's Not An Option By INVESTOR'S BUSINESS DAILY | Posted Wednesday, July 15, 2009 4:20 PM PT Congress: It didn't take long to run into an "uh-oh" moment when reading the House's "health care for all Americans" bill. Right there on Page 16 is a provision making individual private medical insurance illegal. When we first saw the paragraph Tuesday, just after the 1,018-page document was released, we thought we surely must be misreading it. So we sought help from the House Ways and Means Committee. It turns out we were right: The provision would indeed outlaw individual private coverage. Under the Orwellian header of "Protecting The Choice To Keep Current Coverage," the "Limitation On New Enrollment" section of the bill clearly states: "Except as provided in this paragraph, the individual health insurance issuer offering such coverage does not enroll any individual in such coverage if the first effective date of coverage is on or after the first day" of the year the legislation becomes law. So we can all keep our coverage, just as promised — with, of course, exceptions: Those who currently have private individual coverage won't be able to change it. Nor will those who leave a company to work for themselves be free to buy individual plans from private carriers. From the beginning, opponents of the public option plan have warned that if the government gets into the business of offering subsidized health insurance coverage, the private insurance market will wither. Drawn by a public option that will be 30% to 40% cheaper than their current premiums because taxpayers will be funding it, employers will gladly scrap their private plans and go with Washington's coverage. The nonpartisan Lewin Group estimated in April that 120 million or more Americans could lose their group coverage at work and end up in such a program. That would leave private carriers with 50 million or fewer customers. This could cause the market to, as Lewin Vice President John Sheils put it, "fizzle out altogether." What wasn't known until now is that the bill itself will kill the market for private individual coverage by not letting any new policies be written after the public option becomes law. The legislation is also likely to finish off health savings accounts, a goal that Democrats have had for years. They want to crush that alternative because nothing gives individuals more control over their medical care, and the government less, than HSAs. With HSAs out of the way, a key obstacle to the left's expansion of the welfare state will be removed. The public option won't be an option for many, but rather a mandate for buying government care. A free people should be outraged at this advance of soft tyranny. Washington does not have the constitutional or moral authority to outlaw private markets in which parties voluntarily participate. It shouldn't be killing business opportunities, or limiting choices, or legislating major changes in Americans' lives. It took just 16 pages of reading to find this naked attempt by the political powers to increase their reach. It's scary to think how many more breaches of liberty we'll come across in the final 1,002. ................................... Sorry guys...this administration and what they seek to do to our freedoms is a bunch of crap. You won't be able to purchase private insurance if this gets passed...all you can do is keep amy current coverage. Change jobs, you have to take the government coverage no matter how inferior it may be. You and the indigent can line up at the county hospital. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Westside Steve Posted July 18, 2009 Report Share Posted July 18, 2009 I'll bump it again. You get the feeling that this one's DOA when even the lefties can't muster an apology for the "plan." Either the left knew it wasn't going to happen but wanted the issue or foolishly thought it would. I'm not sure which is worse for the future and the other save the world schemes. WSS Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smalls1129 Posted July 18, 2009 Report Share Posted July 18, 2009 There is almost no way this thing gets past with that provision in there. Although if there continues to be only 42 "blue dogs" willing to go against it then we might be screwed. And the President made it clear that this must get passed so the next month should be interesting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
calfoxwc Posted July 18, 2009 Author Report Share Posted July 18, 2009 WE're lucky if there IS that many Blue Dog Dems.. You'd think more of them would be jumping off the uglier by the day Obama admin tree that is floating down the river, toward a waterfall. This health care plan is the waterfall. Kinda like Obama's Waterloo. But, still, we're waiting for at least one lib to have some legit substantive input on his post: PEEN deserves some serious replies on this: (bump) He posted: *************** I added this here though it could probably stand alone... So much for private insurance. http://www.ibdeditorials.com/IBDArticles.a...332548165656854 It's Not An Option By INVESTOR'S BUSINESS DAILY | Posted Wednesday, July 15, 2009 4:20 PM PT Congress: It didn't take long to run into an "uh-oh" moment when reading the House's "health care for all Americans" bill. Right there on Page 16 is a provision making individual private medical insurance illegal. When we first saw the paragraph Tuesday, just after the 1,018-page document was released, we thought we surely must be misreading it. So we sought help from the House Ways and Means Committee. It turns out we were right: The provision would indeed outlaw individual private coverage. Under the Orwellian header of "Protecting The Choice To Keep Current Coverage," the "Limitation On New Enrollment" section of the bill clearly states: "Except as provided in this paragraph, the individual health insurance issuer offering such coverage does not enroll any individual in such coverage if the first effective date of coverage is on or after the first day" of the year the legislation becomes law. So we can all keep our coverage, just as promised — with, of course, exceptions: Those who currently have private individual coverage won't be able to change it. Nor will those who leave a company to work for themselves be free to buy individual plans from private carriers. From the beginning, opponents of the public option plan have warned that if the government gets into the business of offering subsidized health insurance coverage, the private insurance market will wither. Drawn by a public option that will be 30% to 40% cheaper than their current premiums because taxpayers will be funding it, employers will gladly scrap their private plans and go with Washington's coverage. The nonpartisan Lewin Group estimated in April that 120 million or more Americans could lose their group coverage at work and end up in such a program. That would leave private carriers with 50 million or fewer customers. This could cause the market to, as Lewin Vice President John Sheils put it, "fizzle out altogether." What wasn't known until now is that the bill itself will kill the market for private individual coverage by not letting any new policies be written after the public option becomes law. The legislation is also likely to finish off health savings accounts, a goal that Democrats have had for years. They want to crush that alternative because nothing gives individuals more control over their medical care, and the government less, than HSAs. With HSAs out of the way, a key obstacle to the left's expansion of the welfare state will be removed. The public option won't be an option for many, but rather a mandate for buying government care. A free people should be outraged at this advance of soft tyranny. Washington does not have the constitutional or moral authority to outlaw private markets in which parties voluntarily participate. It shouldn't be killing business opportunities, or limiting choices, or legislating major changes in Americans' lives. It took just 16 pages of reading to find this naked attempt by the political powers to increase their reach. It's scary to think how many more breaches of liberty we'll come across in the final 1,002. ................................... Sorry guys...this administration and what they seek to do to our freedoms is a bunch of crap. You won't be able to purchase private insurance if this gets passed...all you can do is keep amy current coverage. Change jobs, you have to take the government coverage no matter how inferior it may be. You and the indigent can line up at the county hospital. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ballpeen Posted July 18, 2009 Report Share Posted July 18, 2009 Don't worry about it guys...no reply is actually the loudest reply they can give. Possibly it means they are thinking about this?? Better late then never as the saying goes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Aloysius Posted July 19, 2009 Report Share Posted July 19, 2009 Here: Well, It Is Sort Of An Option Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ballpeen Posted July 19, 2009 Report Share Posted July 19, 2009 Here: Well, It Is Sort Of An Option In the bit, I keep seeing comments such as these... I think the IDB misfired here, but they still have 1,000 pages to go If the person can't get the name of the publication with whom they dissent correct, how can I assume what else they think is accurate?? OK..I am not going to cop out like that... Not going back to pull the exact quote, but it got in to "approved" plans....approved by who...the government?? If that is the means they wish to drive insurance companies out of business, why not just mandate at this point that all carriers cannot turn down anyone for any reason and set caps on how much can be charged in the way of premiums?? The next step in all of this is they will begin telling doctors how much they can charge. I understand some of that already happens between the health networks and doctors with the managed care programs, but I am against the government having any say in the matter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
calfoxwc Posted July 19, 2009 Author Report Share Posted July 19, 2009 Right there on Page 16 is a provision making individual private medical insurance illegal. ****************** I don't know how so many comments after the article, can be so conflicting. Why can't they just FIX current problems instead of ramping up to provide eventual dominating gov control of all health care? I really don't get it. Surely they can believe what they say their intentions are. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
choco Posted July 20, 2009 Report Share Posted July 20, 2009 i have nothing to add.....only that sebilious was talking to stewart, and nothing like this was mentioned. i'll see if i can find the provision, and post back once im done. my stance is pretty well known anyway, so where's the proponents?.... edit: yup, this is pretty underhanded.....tell us one thing, do another. bad obama! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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