MDDawg Posted October 9, 2019 Report Share Posted October 9, 2019 Bob Wiley gave an explosive interview during the preseason and made several claims: https://www.cleveland.com/browns/2019/08/ex-browns-ol-coach-bob-wylie-rips-freddie-kitchens-saying-qb-coach-ken-zampese-did-all-the-coaching.html 1. The post Hue success was due to Gregg Williams. 2. Dorsey didn't hire Williams because he didn't want to deal with a strong willed coach which may also explain why a different veteran coach wasn't hired. 3. Offensive success was mainly due to Zampese the QB coach. Indisputable that Mayfield has regressed under the new QB coach and this offense. Also in my opinion the OL has regressed under the new Oline coach. Tackles Robinson and Hubbard graded mediocre last season but they're awful this year. Dorsey won't admit it publicly but by trading for Beckham he was aiming for at minimum a playoff spot. Even though the second half of the schedule is easier, these inconsistent performances and lack of discipline will result in us losing winnable games and possibly missing the playoffs. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
calfoxwc Posted October 9, 2019 Report Share Posted October 9, 2019 too much surmising, too soon. The Chiefs just laid an egg vs the Colts. It happens. We knew the offensive line was going with a LT that would struggle, a RT that would struggle, and would miss Zietler at ROG. That isn't on Kitchens. The Browns coaches had a game plan that backfired. They will learn from that. You can't build a winner by constantly attacking the building blocks all the time, imho. You adjust, grow, and remember how you got there. We didn't know the oline would struggle THIS much. It is what it is. Maybe they beat Seattle and the Patriots. I mean.... dammit. LOL LOL who knows. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jiggins7919 Posted October 9, 2019 Report Share Posted October 9, 2019 The problem is that Dorsey WILL make a change if this continues. I'm not sure what that looks like, but if we get embarrassed again, something will happen. The problem with Baker is when teams can pressure with just 4, he doesn't know where to go with the ball. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MDDawg Posted October 9, 2019 Author Report Share Posted October 9, 2019 13 minutes ago, jiggins7919 said: The problem is that Dorsey WILL make a change if this continues. I'm not sure what that looks like, but if we get embarrassed again, something will happen. The problem with Baker is when teams can pressure with just 4, he doesn't know where to go with the ball. The change in question would be pressuring Kitchens to give up playcalling and without playcalling duties he's essentially deadman walking. Will Dorsey be able to admit he was wrong in hiring Kitchens? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stillmotion Posted October 9, 2019 Report Share Posted October 9, 2019 Kitchens is good at what he does, but is he a strong leader? that's yet to be seen. The talent is unquestionable. Gregg might've been an asshole, but he was a proven leader. Love him or hate him, he wouldn't put up with undisciplined play or bullshit. We should've kept Gregg and let Freddie run the offense. Dorsey got too smart. Let me tell you, going to the game with my friend and seeing him drop $3000 on tickets to watch what happened in San Francisco was abysmal. I had to sit for 4 quarters and watch 49ers fans talk shit the whole time. I watched Baker play like a deer in headlights. I watched our run defense roll over and make Matt Brieda look like Walter Payton. Get a leader to run the team Freddie, or demote yourself if you can't be the leader. Sometimes leaders need to get mad. If Freddie wasn't furious after that game, then he doesn't deserve to be head coach. Think of the thousands of Browns fans that traveled there and paid hard earned money to see that. Even if the Hue days, how often did we get blown out that abysmally. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jiggins7919 Posted October 9, 2019 Report Share Posted October 9, 2019 1 hour ago, MDDawg said: The change in question would be pressuring Kitchens to give up playcalling and without playcalling duties he's essentially deadman walking. Will Dorsey be able to admit he was wrong in hiring Kitchens? I know...ugh. I'm praying to God that it's just growing pains of some sorts. The LAST thing I want is more coaching crap drama. I just have no idea why it's so difficult to get OBJ the ball in space, and why we can't take advantage of the opposite side of the field if he's being double-teamed. I read that we didn't attempt one pass to the left side of the field Monday. How is that possible? Baker threw it all over the yard last year, and I he doesn't even look like the same guy. I didn't think for a second that we'd be a 13-3 team or anything like that, but I did expect 10 wins. Technically, we can still reach 10 wins, but the way we look right now, I wouldn't bet a dented nickel on it. I hope to high heck that we figure it out. I didn't see this type of play coming...I really didn't. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mjp28 Posted October 9, 2019 Report Share Posted October 9, 2019 1 minute ago, jiggins7919 said: .....I hope to high heck that we figure it out. I didn't see this type of play coming...I really didn't. Does anyone remember the very first appearance of Baker and the boys in preseason I believe against the Redskins when they blew down the field with almost if not ALL first downs on the drive? Remember too he was passing long, checking down to Chubb and anybody else who was open. They looked like the greatest show on grass and we're going to be unstoppable. Remember too after the drive they checked out and it was "see you in WEEK 1" adios! And we all including me sure that they were going to bury Tennessee and roll to 10+ wins, the playoffs and beyond. What happened? They stunk it up in week 1, barely beat the miserable Jets and here we are going into week 6 at 2-3 and not sure of anything. OK fix this. Now beating Seattle would let us all breathe and be 3-3 ready to start over. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jiggins7919 Posted October 9, 2019 Report Share Posted October 9, 2019 21 minutes ago, mjp28 said: Does anyone remember the very first appearance of Baker and the boys in preseason I believe against the Redskins when they blew down the field with almost if not ALL first downs on the drive? Remember too he was passing long, checking down to Chubb and anybody else who was open. They looked like the greatest show on grass and we're going to be unstoppable. Remember too after the drive they checked out and it was "see you in WEEK 1" adios! And we all including me sure that they were going to bury Tennessee and roll to 10+ wins, the playoffs and beyond. What happened? They stunk it up in week 1, barely beat the miserable Jets and here we are going into week 6 at 2-3 and not sure of anything. OK fix this. Now beating Seattle would let us all breathe and be 3-3 ready to start over. Winning cures all, and a win vs Seattle would be GIGANTIC. Problem is, Seattle is a very physical team, and we DO NOT play well against physical teams. I also hate mentioning that Russell Wilson is playing like the love child of Tom Brady and Randal Cunningham, and I believe he has 12 tds vs zero INT's. Yo. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MDDawg Posted October 9, 2019 Author Report Share Posted October 9, 2019 24 minutes ago, mjp28 said: Does anyone remember the very first appearance of Baker and the boys in preseason I believe against the Redskins when they blew down the field with almost if not ALL first downs on the drive? Remember too he was passing long, checking down to Chubb and anybody else who was open. They looked like the greatest show on grass and we're going to be unstoppable. Remember too after the drive they checked out and it was "see you in WEEK 1" adios! And we all including me sure that they were going to bury Tennessee and roll to 10+ wins, the playoffs and beyond. What happened? They stunk it up in week 1, barely beat the miserable Jets and here we are going into week 6 at 2-3 and not sure of anything. OK fix this. Now beating Seattle would let us all breathe and be 3-3 ready to start over. Yes I do but week 3 against Tampa was disconcerting, Baker was missing wide open guys something he never did in the second half of last season. I just put it down to " well it's the preseason, OBJ, Landry and Njoku sat out" but it appears that it was more foretelling than we all thought. For the first time I drafted not one but two Browns in my first 4 rounds and now paying the price (-2 fantasy points for Baker last game). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MDDawg Posted October 9, 2019 Author Report Share Posted October 9, 2019 7 minutes ago, jiggins7919 said: Winning cures all, and a win vs Seattle would be GIGANTIC. Problem is, Seattle is a very physical team, and we DO NOT play well against physical teams. I also hate mentioning that Russell Wilson is playing like the love child of Tom Brady and Randal Cunningham, and I believe he has 12 tds vs zero INT's. Yo. That would be great but I'm yet to be convinced Freddie can gameplan to our strengths. Before the SF game, Tony Grossi mentioned that because of Shanahan's offense we'd have to play 3 linebackers more often to contain the run. What do we do in SF's opening possession? 2 LBs and we're taken to the woodshed. A true headcoach would tell Wilkes-" I know you like putting only two LBs back there but make sure we have 3 and stop the run no matter what". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Icecube Posted October 9, 2019 Report Share Posted October 9, 2019 2 hours ago, jiggins7919 said: The problem is that Dorsey WILL make a change if this continues. I'm not sure what that looks like, but if we get embarrassed again, something will happen. The problem with Baker is when teams can pressure with just 4, he doesn't know where to go with the ball. Baker himself is part of it, but I think it has more to do with him being under siege, way too often, almost instantly. NO QB can be successful under those conditions. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Icecube Posted October 9, 2019 Report Share Posted October 9, 2019 37 minutes ago, MDDawg said: Yes I do but week 3 against Tampa was disconcerting, Baker was missing wide open guys something he never did in the second half of last season. I just put it down to " well it's the preseason, OBJ, Landry and Njoku sat out" but it appears that it was more foretelling than we all thought. For the first time I drafted not one but two Browns in my first 4 rounds and now paying the price (-2 fantasy points for Baker last game). OUCHIE. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jcam222 Posted October 9, 2019 Report Share Posted October 9, 2019 5 hours ago, calfoxwc said: too much surmising, too soon. The Chiefs just laid an egg vs the Colts. It happens. We knew the offensive line was going with a LT that would struggle, a RT that would struggle, and would miss Zietler at ROG. That isn't on Kitchens. The Browns coaches had a game plan that backfired. They will learn from that. You can't build a winner by constantly attacking the building blocks all the time, imho. You adjust, grow, and remember how you got there. We didn't know the oline would struggle THIS much. It is what it is. Maybe they beat Seattle and the Patriots. I mean.... dammit. LOL LOL who knows. To be fair the Chiefs lost to the Colts unexpectedly but both looked like NFL teams. We looked like a high school team trying o compete Monday night and that’s being kind. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gumby73 Posted October 9, 2019 Report Share Posted October 9, 2019 1 hour ago, Icecube said: Baker himself is part of it, but I think it has more to do with him being under siege, way too often, almost instantly. NO QB can be successful under those conditions. So was Aaron Rodgers in GB...Have ya seen anybody in GB whining about losing James Campen as their OL coach? Who knew GB could run the football too? with only one change, coaching staff...this ain't all on Freddie & takes time...but his plates are filling up...After draft, i can't blame Dorsey on FA lineman..their was nothing to see, imho Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Orion Posted October 9, 2019 Report Share Posted October 9, 2019 Is it time to admit Bob Wiley was right? lol.........the man didn't even believe in stretching. MY DOG knows better than him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MDDawg Posted January 1, 2020 Author Report Share Posted January 1, 2020 Admin we can close this thread now, Wiley was proven right 😉. 1 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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