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***Browns Vs. Titans Game Day Thread***

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Did the refs suck? Yes

Did Baker suck? Yes

Did the D suck? Yes

Is this still our team? Do we still have talent? Can we overcome? 

Does anyone here really believe this game is who we are?

I believe this game was our players believing the hype. Now it's down to business. Earn it, work for it, prevail.

 

Our season has just begun...TBD

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My fears for this team heading into this season... 

- Interior Oline.  Who looked OK today for the most part.

- Commitment to the running game.   Which Freddie and Monken did a masterful job of shoving their heads up their own asses after the first drive.

- Having a coaching staff obsessed with their shiny toys. I.E. Baker, ODB, Landry, etc etc.     

- Forgetting that this team and young QB (emphasis on young) is still at its best when they run the ball, setup playaction, the bootlegs, etc etc... then attack the short to intermediate field.

- A defense that was left on the field far too long

- A QB that, once you frustrate him, gets too far in his own head and starts throwing the ball pissed off.  Leading to wild pitches that end up high and into DB's hands.

 

Some of these are scheme, others are mentality that aren't easily broken, if at all broken.   Baker throwing that pick to Logan Ryan is InFuckingExcusable.   Part of the Farve mentality I've mentioned on here a few times.   Sure, you may get a big time throw here and there. But there will come a game when it fucks your WHOLE team over because you just haven't met a single throw you didn't like.  

This team needs a serious Come-To-Jesus moment early.   Style and Flash will never beat passion and substance.   The Jets play quality defense and if this coaching staff doesn't respect the Williams Duo and tries to make Baker do it all, they will turn the ball over and they WILL lose.

 

Tennessee flat beat you at your own game today.    They rode the hot hand of their bruising RB, forced the defense to consistently stop them.  They setup their QB for success with play action, some high percentage throws and sprinkled in some creative screen looks.       Thank Christ I took Henry in the 3rd round.  Vrabel has a real weapon on his hands there.     It was nothing short of a fucking clinic as to how the Browns SHOULD have played today. 

 

Get this fixed early because this season is very dependent on getting off to a quality start.  The back half of this schedule was pretty unforgiving and so far the 2 other AFCN teams looked pretty damn respectable.  

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It was a real kick in the teeth getting blown out in our home opener against a team we were favored to beat. Did the Browns make a mistake selecting Kitchens over Williams as HC? The jury is still out but after the first game the Browns showed a serious lack of discipline something that Williams brought to the table. 

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Disgusted? Yes I am.

I never coached FB, so here is my ignorant POV (and I won't even mention officiating as the entire league has to tolerate & overcome that)

1- Seems like we read our press clippings rather than taking this game seriously.

2- 18 penalties? ATROCIOUS, & it wasn't all the refs.

3- Damn near 70% of our plays were pass plays. We won't win in this league with that kind of imbalance.

4- From Freddie on down, they should ALL bend over, take a good swift kick in the ass, LEARN from this fiasco, blame ONLY themselves & come back with renewed focus, discipline, & determination. No finger pointing...OWN THIS BEATING!

Browns......It's time to MAN UP!

Mike

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29 minutes ago, OldBrownsFan said:

It was a real kick in the teeth getting blown out in our home opener against a team we were favored to beat. Did the Browns make a mistake selecting Kitchens over Williams as HC? The jury is still out but after the first game the Browns showed a serious lack of discipline something that Williams brought to the table. 

You are right about the lack of discipline. This reflects poorly on the coaching staff. 18 penalties for 182 yards, the most since 1951?? WTH?  I thought they were going to live up to the hype after the successful first series but thereafter it was a backwards slide to a dumpster fire. Baker was running for his life much like Tim Couch was, the last time there was such preseason hype about the Browns.  It was a very disheartening day for this 70 year old Brown’s fan. 

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As far tempering my expectations (something I am told to do in this thread), I didn't expect to win (hoped but did not expect), but I also did not expect this embarrassing shitshow. No excuse for how the Browns showed up today. None.

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2 hours ago, Babernakle said:

Plan and simple after the first score the refs stepped in and turned that game the calls where tic tac at beast why the nfl is targeting the Browns is beyond me 

eh,,,,,,,,no.they are not.....

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24 minutes ago, Frank Ryan’s Ghost said:

You are right about the lack of discipline. This reflects poorly on the coaching staff. 18 penalties for 182 yards, the most since 1951?? WTH?  I thought they were going to live up to the hype after the successful first series but thereafter it was a backwards slide to a dumpster fire. Baker was running for his life much like Tim Couch was, the last time there was such preseason hype about the Browns.  It was a very disheartening day for this 70 year old Brown’s fan. 

so far....same shit.....for 20 years now....piss poor undisipline play....i'm watching the pats pummel the squeelers....you want to talk about a disipline machine...man...it makes me sick that we can never play the way the pats do....looks like next monday is a must win already because we ain't beating the rams the following week...they better turn this crap around immediately...

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The main issue was lack of discipline (penalties) and it created 2 and 3rd and Longs most of the game which made the Browns one dimensional when the run game was doing pretty well.  

Defensively, the Titans were severely limited by their Oline reshuffling and Tenn game planned perfectly to address it.  The Browns took away most of the run game gave up chunk yards in spots when they were gassed but had no answer for play action...and many times the titans used the Browns pressure against them- screens. The Henry 75 yard TE pass was aided by block back hold whatever.  I thought Tenn O vs Browns D.  Advantage Tenn O coaching staff with their plan and out lack of adjustment

But I’m Not getting the Oline hate on here...The oline held up well Hubbard had his problems at times.  Kush Tretter Botonio weren’t negatively mentioned...and all this after being placed in 2 and 3rd and Longs with the defense ears pinned back.  TE play was awful- drops... holds. Collectively the TE group they all need to go this offseason.

 

i watched 4 other games this week and the Browns game was officiated tight Ticky tack as heck compared to the others. Anyway lesson learned hopefully send that official crew a gift basket they have their eye on us.

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37 minutes ago, Canton Mike said:

Disgusted? Yes I am.

I never coached FB, so here is my ignorant POV (and I won't even mention officiating as the entire league has to tolerate & overcome that)

1- Seems like we read our press clippings rather than taking this game seriously.

2- 18 penalties? ATROCIOUS, & it wasn't all the refs.

3- Damn near 70% of our plays were pass plays. We won't win in this league with that kind of imbalance.

4- From Freddie on down, they should ALL bend over, take a good swift kick in the ass, LEARN from this fiasco, blame ONLY themselves & come back with renewed focus, discipline, & determination. No finger pointing...OWN THIS BEATING!

Browns......It's time to MAN UP!

Mike

i just don't think kitchens is going to be around very long...browns spent alot of moola to see this fail because of poor coaching....guys like landry and becham ain't going to put up with this shit very long...they will get their money, start bitching because of the losing and then get out of dodge....probably to new england.....heh heh

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Well, here's my take on it -

the Browns were taken out of their game by the oline, who got run over all too often, and other times lost their composure. Our LT gets shoved well after the play..no call. He puts his foot upside the guys head when the guy seems to be going for another cheap shot at him... he gets called, ejected.

Lamm goes in, and Hubbard moves from RT to LT. Hubbard had a bad game. OBJ gets held on a route, held and held, no call, then OBJ shoves him off him...and HE gets called for offensive interference.

One play, the Tenn olineman actually TACKLES a Browns rusher, no call.

etc etc, and stupid penalties that were all on a few players of the Browns.

to sum it up = the Browns offensive line was not ready for real NFL game time - the offense takes longer

to click.

The defense looks like one of the top defenses in the NFL, but a few players in the secondary got some signals crossed.

Adversity builds character - but the tackles have to play better. Draft new offensive tackles next draft. Baker got frustrated, beat up, had no time.

 

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My take. We had gotten back in this game until Henry's 75 yd. one play drive and then the panic button got pushed. Once you panic then you just mistake your way into a rout. Browns did exactly that.

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You'd figure we could win an opening game by accident at least.

They really should give the Skins a call about Williams, but the Texans probably have made it too expensive of an option.  

If they lose next week, it's going to be a long season.

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Good night everyone it's been quite a day......at least the steelrz got clobbered too.  :)

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This was only the second Browns opening day game that I have missed......... the other was the the 51-0 rectal rape of the Stoolerz in '89.

Glad I missed today's embarrassment. 

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6 hours ago, Babernakle said:

Plan and simple after the first score the refs stepped in and turned that game the calls where tic tac at beast why the nfl is targeting the Browns is beyond me 

Make that 1-5 when the Browns draw this reffing crew.  

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8 hours ago, TexasAg1969 said:

My take. We had gotten back in this game until Henry's 75 yd. one play drive and then the panic button got pushed. Once you panic then you just mistake your way into a rout. Browns did exactly that.

Exactly. Problem is, our defense picked the exact wrong time to be out of position and take atrocious angles in pursuit. I mean, REALLY guys? We scratch and claw our way back into the ugliest game ever and you shit the sheets IMMEDIATELY after we get within 2 on a play they tried to run 3-4 times already?! Ughhhhhhh. 

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8 minutes ago, jiggins7919 said:

Exactly. Problem is, our defense picked the exact wrong time to be out of position and take atrocious angles in pursuit. I mean, REALLY guys? We scratch and claw our way back into the ugliest game ever and you shit the sheets IMMEDIATELY after we get within 2 on a play they tried to run 3-4 times already?! Ughhhhhhh. 

As I pointed out way back when I wanted us to take Henry, he has those long strides that fool you into thinking he is slow, but like Eric Dickerson's similar running gait, that just isn't the case. He's very fast when into 6th gear. He fools you into taking wrong angles and that's what we did. Up until that play I was fine with how we had contained him compared to the potential. But he is very dangerous in the second half when you get a little sloppy when tired. Vrabel knows exactly what he has in Henry. His previous HC never understood it.

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I'm hoping that this was the hard smack in the mouth we needed to bring everyone back down to earth. Despite the shit show with penalties we were still right in it at 13-15, then panic set in. Spent the summer doing a lot of talking, well let's start seeing the walking.

Lot of pressure now on the jets game.

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2 hours ago, TexasAg1969 said:

As I pointed out way back when I wanted us to take Henry, he has those long strides that fool you into thinking he is slow, but like Eric Dickerson's similar running gait, that just isn't the case. He's very fast when into 6th gear. He fools you into taking wrong angles and that's what we did. Up until that play I was fine with how we had contained him compared to the potential. But he is very dangerous in the second half when you get a little sloppy when tired. Vrabel knows exactly what he has in Henry. His previous HC never understood it.

We didn't take any wrong angles on that play.  No one had an angle to get to him because outside of the linebacker who got put on the ground Greedy was the only player on that half of the field and he was blocked. Henry is a solid back, but your infatuation with him is something else lol. I'll take chubb 10 times out of 10. We just need to not get behind the sticks because of penalties and give him the ball some more. 

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I find all the ref bitchin' to be hilareous...

16 hours ago, Tour2ma said:

More later... including "the good" I saw... which may mean it's a very short post.

The Good:

  • Higgins... I was half joking a week or so ago when I said he could have the best season in our WR room.
  • Flashes of Baker... the back shoulder to Landry... the fast ball to Njoku for the TD... so the Baker we love is in there.
  • Chubb... showed the zone-read vision we saw last year.
  • OBJ... saw the Giant the league feared.

So skill-position-wise... we have what we need.

I said it'd be a short post, but there's more bad...

Game plan discipline...

I really want to see (or do) a formation count. Specifically how much Baker was under Center. I know he was on play #1 and the Hilliyard TD run, but having a hard time remembering other instances. It's where Baker needs to live on 1st and 2nd downs. He is a clever ball faker and starting by turning his back to the D seems to speed his decision process... plus of course the hesitation it creates in the DL gives our OL that little bit of pressure relief that they need.

This worked early, but my impression is that we went away from it much earlier than the score demanded us to, i.e., the 4th quarter.

15 hours ago, Dutch Oven said:

Every Browns fan's mock draft next offseason is going to be OLine OT heavy. 

FIFY... and can you blame them?

Right now we look like the 2017 NYGs... spent on D... had great skill players... OL s-s-s-s-s-s-s-s-sucked... especially the OTs.

And who saved then inside??? An over-the-hill cast off named John Greco...

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13 hours ago, tiamat63 said:

Part of the Farve mentality I've mentioned on here a few times. 

So you're the other one... ;) ... Just one line from a great post.

Serious question, tia... did you see any "quit" today?

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Credit to Coach Vrabel and staff for having their team ready.

A lot of what they did to protect their tackle situation and shaky QB play were things I expected to see from our own staff.

Tennessee might have a hell of a coach who is a QB away from bringing them some playoff wins.

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28 minutes ago, Tour2ma said:

So you're the other one... ;) ... Just one line from a great post.

Serious question, tia... did you see any "quit" today?

Not quit per-se.    But I did see a "fuck it, let's see what happens" from Baker a time or two. 

And towards the end, saw a few of the boys on defense protecting themselves and perhaps not giving -100%.    Couldn't blame them either.

But I'm combing through memories while the beer started flowing. Hoping to get a more clear 2nd look sometime in the middle of the week.

The lack of work from under center on the early downs as the game went on was something I mentioned to a friend.  Glad you brought that up as well.

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sorry, I'll just repost my post from the "panic mode" thread.

***********************************************

sorry, I see that as wrong.Kitchens is the PERFECT coach to be Coach of the Browns. The players fought for a half, it was close - but game time is different - timing is different - and the Teets played like they were po'd at the attention and hype the Browns have been getting. and their defense

  As far as "over-hyped"...sure...that is what the media does. But the changes to the Browns and their success the last third of last season does deserve some serious attention.

    The Kardiac Kids, 1980, lost the first two games of their season. They ended up 11-6. Even week 12, they got hammered by the bungles.

    The Browns lost their composure - the defense was being held like crazy, and the offense was being overrun. And don't anybody tell me there weren't non-calls and calls that benefitted the teets. The OPI on OBJ was a huge example. Their oline got away with a lot of crap that should have been called. Not so much on the Browns offensive line. I'm just sayin what I'm seein. Our LT Robinson got shoved down well after the play was over, NO CALL. The teet that shoved him seemed to be going after him again, and Robinson got po'd and put his foot up to his head to stop him, still on the ground, immediate call of UC and ejection of Robinson.

    There are different examples the Browns suffer this crap. I believe some other teams see it, and bait the Browns, some of the Browns don't handle it well.

   That will change.

Anyways...in 1980, the Browns went 11-6, but lost their first two games. And their first game they got hammered by the Patriots.

It's a long season. We'll see how it goes, but judging by the first game is just not valid. I'm concerned about the oline, but still, the Browns didn't have one of the best olines back then either. They will adapt.

1 September 7, 1980 at New England Patriots L 34–17
49,222
0–1
2 September 15, 1980 Houston Oilers L 16–7
80,243
0–2
3 September 21, 1980 Kansas City Chiefs W 20–13
63,614
1–2
4 September 28, 1980 at Tampa Bay Buccaneers W 34–27
65,540
2–2
5 October 5, 1980 Denver Broncos L 19–16
81,065
2–3
6 October 12, 1980 at Seattle Seahawks W 27–3
61,366
3–3
7 October 19, 1980 Green Bay Packers W 26–21
75,548
4–3
8 October 26, 1980 Pittsburgh Steelers W 27–26
79,095
5–3
9 November 3, 1980 Chicago Bears W 27–21
84,225
6–3
10 November 9, 1980 at Baltimore Colts W 28–27
45,369
7–3
11 November 16, 1980 at Pittsburgh Steelers L 16–13
54,563
7–4
12 November 23, 1980 Cincinnati Bengals W 31–7
79,253
8–4
13 November 30, 1980 at Houston Oilers W 17–14
51,514
9–4
14 December 7, 1980 New York Jets W 17–14
78,454
10–4
15 December 14, 1980 at Minnesota Vikings L 28–23
42,202
10–5
16 December 21, 1980 at Cincinnati Bengals W 27–24
50,058
11–5
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I get as upset as anyone at the bad officiating in the NFL and the Browns seem to get more than their share of bad calls but it is something all the NFL teams have to deal with and I won't use it as an excuse for losing. The good teams learn to deal with it and overcome it and that is what we must do and not lose our composure when it happens but to stay disciplined and focused. 

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3 hours ago, bjh2130 said:

Henry is a solid back, but your infatuation with him is something else lol.

What infatuation? You mean the one that says we took Coleman and Ogbah while leaving him there for the Titans to use to tromp all over us? 😱🐘That one?😂

EDIT: The one that called this happening all summer?😜

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