Rumor Hunt was in a bar fight....

[The Gipper]

2 hours ago, hoorta said:

Haven't  read much of it huh? Not the forum for a religious arguement. 

I know but I do think I’m right about hell not been mentioned. That actual word did come from the Norse. 

[Dutch Oven]

7 hours ago, hoorta said:

Yes, but  too much  booze can put your  religion on the  back burner.

A gentle breeze puts most people's religious beliefs on the back burner. 

[bjh2130]

5 hours ago, The Gipper said:

I know but I do think I’m right about hell not been mentioned. That actual word did come from the Norse. 

In the King James Bible, Sheol (old testament) is translated to Hell 31 times, "the grave" 31 times, and "the pit" 3 times. In new testament "Tartarus" (deepest pit of divine torture below hades) and "Gehenna" (a place where both soul and body could be destroyed in "unquenchable fire") are typically translated as either "Hell" or "Hell fire" in many English versions.

Edited July 4, 2019 by bjh2130
Sorry horta you're right not the place

[TexasAg1969]

12 minutes ago, bjh2130 said:

In the King James Bible, Sheol (old testament) is translated to Hell 31 times, "the grave" 31 times, and "the pit" 3 times. In new testament "Tartarus" (deepest pit of divine torture below hades) and "Gehenna" (a place where both soul and body could be destroyed in "unquenchable fire") are typically translated as either "Hell" or "Hell fire" in many English versions.

You hear about the Aggie who found out he was going to hell when he died according to his preacher? So he decided he'd be cremated so it wouldn't hurt so much.😁

[Dutch Oven]

1 hour ago, bjh2130 said:

In the King James Bible, Sheol (old testament) is translated to Hell 31 times, "the grave" 31 times, and "the pit" 3 times. In new testament "Tartarus" (deepest pit of divine torture below hades) and "Gehenna" (a place where both soul and body could be destroyed in "unquenchable fire") are typically translated as either "Hell" or "Hell fire" in many English versions.

While we are talking about fiction books, how many times is hell mentioned in the Lord of the Rings, The Godfather and The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy? 😝

[jcam222]

On 7/2/2019 at 7:39 PM, nickers said:

So I guess people should clam up and not live life.. I mean your all "Oh so perfect, Law abiding Christians, Aren't you?"

Pretty big fucking stretch from what I actually said. Spin what I say anyway you want but people with self admitted alcohol issues don’t belong in bars. 

[nickers]

24 minutes ago, jcam222 said:

Pretty big fucking stretch from what I actually said. Spin what I say anyway you want but people with self admitted alcohol issues don’t belong in bars. 

Don't even try to school me on Alcoholism.... I watched My father drink himself to death... Have a nice day...

[hoorta]

3 hours ago, bjh2130 said:

In the King James Bible, Sheol (old testament) is translated to Hell 31 times, "the grave" 31 times, and "the pit" 3 times. In new testament "Tartarus" (deepest pit of divine torture below hades) and "Gehenna" (a place where both soul and body could be destroyed in "unquenchable fire") are typically translated as either "Hell" or "Hell fire" in many English versions.

thanks for saving me the trouble of looking that up.....  Jesus specifically mentioned Ghenna at least once.    And it was a place, so misbehave, and you're going to get thrown into a continually burning garbage pit. 

2 hours ago, Dutch Oven said:

While we are talking about fiction books, how many times is hell mentioned in the Lord of the Rings, The Godfather and The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy? 😝

You're talking to a Lord of the Rings geek. I did recently find out Tolkien was a Catholic. Hell is never mentioned in LOTR- though you sure can take Sauron as being "the devil".  Go back even farther in Tolkien's mythology to the Silmarillion, it's obvious Sauron's boss- Morgoth = Lucifer.  

[Flugel]

On 7/2/2019 at 1:21 PM, Clevfan4life said:

i understand duke wanting to go where he's not the "contingency plan". Hard to.understand why browns fans are salty at him. I mean if kareem fucks up we're expecting duke to come bounding in one week all tits up after getting "quality" reps in with the berea landscapers and cleaning crew?

And exactly where is that place after Duke was shopped at the combines, NFL meetings as well as before and all throughout the draft? The entire RB market replied with - we don't think Duke is worthy of trading an active roster guy or draft picks for at the salary Cleveland overpaid him to be anything less than #1. 

IMO, Duke is confusing the love he needs with the love he wants.  The love he needs is in the place that made him the 9th highest paid RB (in 2018) of 32 teams that employ at least 3 RBs apiece.  When you think about it - did anyone challenge Duke's comfortable niche of change of pace and situational reps as well as first dibs on injury fill-in reps all throughout 1-31 football?  No; and we never got better for it.  In 2018, the sum of Hyde and Chubb temporarily reduced Duke's reps prior to the mid-season trade of Hyde to Jax. That said, all 3 RBs had reps reduced prior to the trade and restoration of Duke's very comfortable niche.  

Now that we're seeing way more depth and talent at the RB and WR positions around the most promising QB we've had since Kosar, you better believe fans are going to be disappointed in Duke for the route he continues to choose in a year this franchise has high expectations. Bigger picture shows Duke has his comfortable niche uncontested again for at least the first 8 regular season games of 2019.  Duke's level of protest should be red-flagging an already disinterested market - that this is how the guy responds to the first big challenges a better football team demands of him after they gave him a huge raise.  He's being asked to compete for playing time just like the rest of his teammates.  How is his employer getting this wrong?

[The Gipper]

12 hours ago, bjh2130 said:

In the King James Bible, Sheol (old testament) is translated to Hell 31 times, "the grave" 31 times, and "the pit" 3 times. In new testament "Tartarus" (deepest pit of divine torture below hades) and "Gehenna" (a place where both soul and body could be destroyed in "unquenchable fire") are typically translated as either "Hell" or "Hell fire" in many English versions.

Well....a few things:   A. You are still saying that "Hell" is never  mentioned.   B. I am not saying the concept of some underworld is not in the Bible, just that "Hell" is not what that place is called.  C. You must know that the Jews do NOT believe in the concept of Hell. D. The King James Bible was printed/translated...whatever, long after the Danes and Norse had invaded England in the late 800s....and brought the concept of hell with them.

And OK, sorry about this being here..

 

[bjh2130]

1 hour ago, The Gipper said:

Well....a few things:   A. You are still saying that "Hell" is never  mentioned.   B. I am not saying the concept of some underworld is not in the Bible, just that "Hell" is not what that place is called.  C. You must know that the Jews do NOT believe in the concept of Hell. D. The King James Bible was printed/translated...whatever, long after the Danes and Norse had invaded England in the late 800s....and brought the concept of hell with them.

And OK, sorry about this being here..

 

If you said you would never find the exact word "hell" in the old testament or new testament then you'd have been correct. You stated you wouldn't find the concept (abstract idea or general notion). Pretty clearly gehenna, a place where both soul and body could be destroyed in "unquenchable fire", is a concept of hell found in the new testament.

[hoorta]

1 hour ago, bjh2130 said:

If you said you would never find the exact word "hell" in the old testament or new testament then you'd have been correct. You stated you wouldn't find the concept (abstract idea or general notion). Pretty clearly gehenna, a place where both soul and body could be destroyed in "unquenchable fire", is a concept of hell found in the new testament.

Spinning on technicalities, as he usually does when he's wrong. He needs to look  up Luke 16:19 and the verses that follow. If that isn't hell, I don't  know what  is. 

[The Gipper]

1 hour ago, hoorta said:

Spinning on technicalities, as he usually does when he's wrong. He needs to look  up Luke 16:19 and the verses that follow. If that isn't hell, I don't  know what  is. 

So maybe I was wrong is that make you happy now. Hell was still an Old Norse concept.   And Answer me this why I knew the Jews not believe in hell

[hoorta]

5 minutes ago, The Gipper said:

So maybe I was wrong is that make you happy now. Hell was still an Old Norse concept.   And Answer me this why I knew the Jews not believe in hell

I won't disagree that hell could be a a Norse concept- I'm not great on Norse mythology, other than knowing a lot of their names. Odin, Thor et al.  and some of our days of the week come from them- Wednesday (Woden), Friday (Friga).  

Our Jewish friends don't believe in hell as we understand it, more like our Purgatory.   Some of Jesus' contemporaries (The Sadducees)  didn't even believe in an afterlife. Our atheist pals over on the political forum had better hope they were right.  

[Dutch Oven]

1 hour ago, hoorta said:

Our atheist pals over on the political forum had better hope they were right.  

This atheist who avoids the wasteland of the political forum like the plague is smart enough not to extorted into believing in the imaginary mob boss in the sky. I'm Italian, I'm versed in the whole "protection" racket already. 

And I don't believe there's any mention of Purgatory in the Old or New Testament. I always was under the impression that Purgatory was a Catholic invention to try and squeeze more money out of their flock by hinting that giving more money to them might persuade Jesus's dad into moving them from Purgatory to Heaven. 

This is a strangely interesting conversation, by the way. Not Browns-related at all, but still interesting. Nothing wrong with that. 

[The Gipper]

1 hour ago, hoorta said:

I won't disagree that hell could be a a Norse concept- I'm not great on Norse mythology, other than knowing a lot of their names. Odin, Thor et al.  and some of our days of the week come from them- Wednesday (Woden), Friday (Friga).  

Our Jewish friends don't believe in hell as we understand it, more like our Purgatory.   Some of Jesus' contemporaries (The Sadducees)  didn't even believe in an afterlife. Our atheist pals over on the political forum had better hope they were right.  

In Norse mythology, Hel, the location, shares a name with Hel, a being who rules over the location. In late Icelandic sources, varying descriptions of Hel are given and various figures are described as being buried with items that will facilitate their journey to Hel after their death. In the Poetic Edda, Brynhildr's trip to Hel after her death is described and Odin, while alive, also visits Hel upon his horse Sleipnir. In Snorri Sturluson's Prose Edda, Baldr goes to Hel on his death and subsequently Hermóðr uses Sleipnir to attempt to retrieve him.

The Old Norse feminine proper noun Hel is identical to the name of the entity that presides over the realm, Old Norse Hel. The word has cognates in all branches of the Germanic languages, including Old English hell (and thus Modern English hell), Old Frisian helle, Old Saxon hellia, Old High German hella, and Gothic halja. All forms ultimately derive from the reconstructed Proto-Germanic feminine noun *xaljō ('concealed place, the underworld'). In turn, the Proto-Germanic form derives from the o-grade form of the Proto-Indo-European root *kel-, *kol-: 'to cover, conceal, save'.^[1]

[The Gipper]

13 minutes ago, Dutch Oven said:

This atheist who avoids the wasteland of the political forum like the plague is smart enough not to extorted into believing in the imaginary mob boss in the sky. I'm Italian, I'm versed in the whole "protection" racket already. 

And I don't believe there's any mention of Purgatory in the Old or New Testament. I always was under the impression that Purgatory was a Catholic invention to try and squeeze more money out of their flock by hinting that giving more money to them might persuade Jesus's dad into moving them from Purgatory to Heaven. 

This is a strangely interesting conversation, by the way. Not Browns-related at all, but still interesting. Nothing wrong with that. 

Well....we Browns fans have been in Hel/Hell for the last 20 years.   Or has that been purgatory? Perhaps we are now working our way out of Purgatory and into the Heaven of some winning/playoff seasons.

So, there...I have connected it to the Browns.  How did that work?

[Kvoethe]

Well...i didnt see that coming??🤯

[jcam222]

18 hours ago, nickers said:

Don't even try to school me on Alcoholism.... I watched My father drink himself to death... Have a nice day...

First sorry he drank himself to death. Secondly I’ve been sober now 30 years. One thing I know is that a bar at 3am is no place for me or people like me. 

[Dutch Oven]

1 hour ago, jcam222 said:

First sorry he drank himself to death. Secondly I’ve been sober now 30 years. One thing I know is that a bar at 3am is no place for me or people like me. 

The funny thing about nickers is how testy he is about this situation (YOU DON'T KNOW THE ENTIRE STORY!) while you know if there's even a hint that OBJ is late returning a library book he'll be all over his ass... 😝

[hoorta]

9 hours ago, Dutch Oven said:

This atheist who avoids the wasteland of the political forum like the plague is smart enough not to extorted into believing in the imaginary mob boss in the sky. I'm Italian, I'm versed in the whole "protection" racket already. 

And I don't believe there's any mention of Purgatory in the Old or New Testament. I always was under the impression that Purgatory was a Catholic invention to try and squeeze more money out of their flock by hinting that giving more money to them might persuade Jesus's dad into moving them from Purgatory to Heaven. 

This is a strangely interesting conversation, by the way. Not Browns-related at all, but still interesting. Nothing wrong with that. 

Fer sure, there's lots of things not biblical that some "Catholics" hold by tradition. As one of those- I have a hard time with this specific teaching- among others. Fish on Friday is OK during Lent- but cow\pig isn't. Fish\ lobster\shrimp\octopus\squid is every bit as much protein as land animals. Was that a dispensation for Italian fishermen to make a killing 40 days out of the year?   

PS- that whole concept of Purgatory has to do with things called "private revelations" that you can believe- or not, if you want to. Some of them are pretty convincing if you're a believer of those special mystics. The "official" church has never AFAIK taken a stand if it really exists- or not.  

I'm sure not going to draw a line with "official" Church teaching- and what that Holy Spirit- tells me as right- I suppose some hard cores would brand me as a heretic. There's still some "traditionalists"who think Vatican II  (which gave the green light to say the Mass in languages other than Latin) believe it's the sign of the end times. Never mind this little historical tidbit- way, way back- the Apostles didn't know much Latin- and the initial celebrations were in Aramaic or Greek, not Latin.    

 

[Flugel]

4 hours ago, hoorta said:

Fer sure, there's lots of things not biblical that some "Catholics" hold by tradition. As one of those- I have a hard time with this specific teaching- among others. Fish on Friday is OK during Lent- but cow\pig isn't. Fish\ lobster\shrimp\octopus\squid is every bit as much protein as land animals. Was that a dispensation for Italian fishermen to make a killing 40 days out of the year?   

PS- that whole concept of Purgatory has to do with things called "private revelations" that you can believe- or not, if you want to. Some of them are pretty convincing if you're a believer of those special mystics. The "official" church has never AFAIK taken a stand if it really exists- or not.  

I'm sure not going to draw a line with "official" Church teaching- and what that Holy Spirit- tells me as right- I suppose some hard cores would brand me as a heretic. There's still some "traditionalists"who think Vatican II  (which gave the green light to say the Mass in languages other than Latin) believe it's the sign of the end times. Never mind this little historical tidbit- way, way back- the Apostles didn't know much Latin- and the initial celebrations were in Aramaic or Greek, not Latin.    

 

I showed up to a thread about Hunt and landed in a debate about Hell. 

Here's my beef with the Catholic Church and their religious instructions I wasted way too many years participating in. What part of excommunicating a divorced couple and their young children from the church exemplifies  "don't judge others" and "forgiveness of sins"?    So, if a spouse is repeatedly unfaithful - the whole family pretty much gets thrown out of the church, judged and unforgiven.    That said, an allegedly celibate Priest going Sandusky on little boys hasn't been kicked out of the Catholic Church.   He just gets sent to another Catholic Church where he can rinse and repeat the unthinkable (quite often under the same roof where most of the sacraments take place). 

[Dutch Oven]

1 hour ago, Flugel said:

I showed up to a thread about Hunt and landed in a debate about Hell. 

Here's my beef with the Catholic Church and their religious instructions I wasted way too many years participating in. What part of excommunicating a divorced couple and their young children from the church exemplifies  "don't judge others" and "forgiveness of sins"?    So, if a spouse is repeatedly unfaithful - the whole family pretty much gets thrown out of the church, judged and unforgiven.    That said, an allegedly celibate Priest going Sandusky on little boys hasn't been kicked out of the Catholic Church.   He just gets sent to another Catholic Church where he can rinse and repeat the unthinkable (quite often under the same roof where most of the sacraments take place). 

Did you ever see the film 'Spotlight' with Michael Keaton? 

Fascinating movie on the Catholic Church in Boston and their coverup of pedophiles in their midst. 

[Nero]

I'm thinking about joining the conversation... But I'm tired and I think it will request a lot of energy. Keep it guys, I'll have some popcorn.

The Catholic Spaniard

 

 

[The Gipper]

4 hours ago, Flugel said:

I showed up to a thread about Hunt and landed in a debate about Hell. 

Here's my beef with the Catholic Church and their religious instructions I wasted way too many years participating in. What part of excommunicating a divorced couple and their young children from the church exemplifies  "don't judge others" and "forgiveness of sins"?    So, if a spouse is repeatedly unfaithful - the whole family pretty much gets thrown out of the church, judged and unforgiven.    That said, an allegedly celibate Priest going Sandusky on little boys hasn't been kicked out of the Catholic Church.   He just gets sent to another Catholic Church where he can rinse and repeat the unthinkable (quite often under the same roof where most of the sacraments take place). 

I don't think the Catholic Church should come in for any worse criticism than any other Christian denomination.  They all have their idiotic traditions and rules and history.

[Clevfan4life]

what the fuvk is going on in here? i had to backpage just to.verify which forum i was in. Umm, this was about kareem hunt right?

[hoorta]

1 hour ago, Clevfan4life said:

what the fuvk is going on in here? i had to backpage just to.verify which forum i was in. Umm, this was about kareem hunt right?

Sorry we got way off topic Clevefan.  But not much is happening on the football front till the end of the month.  

7 hours ago, Flugel said:

I showed up to a thread about Hunt and landed in a debate about Hell. 

Here's my beef with the Catholic Church and their religious instructions I wasted way too many years participating in. What part of excommunicating a divorced couple and their young children from the church exemplifies  "don't judge others" and "forgiveness of sins"?    So, if a spouse is repeatedly unfaithful - the whole family pretty much gets thrown out of the church, judged and unforgiven.    That said, an allegedly celibate Priest going Sandusky on little boys hasn't been kicked out of the Catholic Church.   He just gets sent to another Catholic Church where he can rinse and repeat the unthinkable (quite often under the same roof where most of the sacraments take place). 

Since I\we are getting comments to keep religion out of it, I'll just sign off that I understand where you're coming from. I'll send you a PM.  

[The Gipper]

1 hour ago, Clevfan4life said:

what the fuvk is going on in here? i had to backpage just to.verify which forum i was in. Umm, this was about kareem hunt right?

Since you think it is torture, that confirms that you are a sinner...and that you have landed in the right place!

[The Gipper]

On 7/2/2019 at 5:16 PM, nickers said:

Of course everyone get the pitchforks.. because all of the evidence has not been accrued so to speak.. But I guess you all deem him guilty and want to run him out of town..  Lets gather the facts before we sentence him Kay?

See.....Nickers started it all with this reference to pitchforks!!!

[Clevfan4life]

1 hour ago, The Gipper said:

Since you think it is torture, that confirms that you are a sinner...and that you have landed in the right place!