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BrownsfaninPa

The Missed Call in NFC Champ. Game

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13 hours ago, Dutch Oven said:

Are you seriously comparing a non-TD in a Browns game that meant nothing to the Saints missing out on a Super Bowl trip?

And the fact that the one in the Browns game was one that in real time, 99% of the referees would've called it exactly the same way as it was called in the game.    The call in the Saints game was one that everyone watching on tv and in the stadium in real time could see that in was interference without question. 

The call against the Browns on the goal line went exactly the same way the very next weekend and was called against the Ravens and if the review had come back that it was a fumble, it would've cost them a TD as well.  

To me....the call against the Browns in that game was not all that bad of a call.   It was unfortunate that it happened but in real time it sure looked like a TD.   The replay had to be slowed down and paused to tell the ball didn't make it to the goal line.  When it takes that kind of scrutiny to determine what happened, its hard to expect an official to see it on the field in real time.

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9 minutes ago, Mark O said:

And the fact that the one in the Browns game was one that in real time, 99% of the referees would've called it exactly the same way as it was called in the game.    The call in the Saints game was one that everyone watching on tv and in the stadium in real time could see that in was interference without question. 

The call against the Browns on the goal line went exactly the same way the very next weekend and was called against the Ravens and if the review had come back that it was a fumble, it would've cost them a TD as well.  

To me....the call against the Browns in that game was not all that bad of a call.   It was unfortunate that it happened but in real time it sure looked like a TD.   The replay had to be slowed down and paused to tell the ball didn't make it to the goal line.  When it takes that kind of scrutiny to determine what happened, its hard to expect an official to see it on the field in real time.

But ...of course....unlike that kind of play.....there is no opportunity to correct the call via instant replay on an interference call.

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1 minute ago, The Gipper said:

But ...of course....unlike that kind of play.....there is no opportunity to correct the call via instant replay on an interference call.

Hopefully that will change.  I think it should be reviewable as should all roughing the passer and also the helmet to helmet hits.   Give the coaches one extra challenge and let them review all those things.  Won't slow the game down any and they can get the calls right. 

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Just now, Mark O said:

Hopefully that will change.  I think it should be reviewable as should all roughing the passer and also the helmet to helmet hits.   Give the coaches one extra challenge and let them review all those things.  Won't slow the game down any and they can get the calls right. 

Not sure why the NFL should give a rat's ass about "slowing the game down".   The game is slowed down tremendously with all their TV timeouts....this would absolutely add little to the length of a game comparatively.

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59 minutes ago, Mark O said:

And the fact that the one in the Browns game was one that in real time, 99% of the referees would've called it exactly the same way as it was called in the game.    The call in the Saints game was one that everyone watching on tv and in the stadium in real time could see that in was interference without question. 

The call against the Browns on the goal line went exactly the same way the very next weekend and was called against the Ravens and if the review had come back that it was a fumble, it would've cost them a TD as well.  

To me....the call against the Browns in that game was not all that bad of a call.   It was unfortunate that it happened but in real time it sure looked like a TD.   The replay had to be slowed down and paused to tell the ball didn't make it to the goal line.  When it takes that kind of scrutiny to determine what happened, its hard to expect an official to see it on the field in real time.

so, it wasn't a TD, wouldn't a ref think it may have been, but rule it a fumble, let the play continue, then on replay, overrule it?

ruling it a TD when it was that close, and NOT a TD, was a travesty. I don't see how it's legit to give the refs a pass on a questionable call. Let the play continue, replay will show the truth of the TD or not. I still call BS on the play.

 

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4 minutes ago, calfoxwc said:

so, it wasn't a TD, wouldn't a ref think it may have been, but rule it a fumble, let the play continue, then on replay, overrule it?

ruling it a TD when it was that close, and NOT a TD, was a travesty. I don't see how it's legit to give the refs a pass on a questionable call. Let the play continue, replay will show the truth of the TD or not. I still call BS on the play.

 

That play gets called that way in every game of every single Sunday.  It wasn't some great conspiracy against the Browns.   In fact as I pointed out..it was called the same way against the Ravens the very next Sunday.

 

 

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not when it's a fumble before you can call it. It was a very early whistle.

 

Officials costs Browns a TD with early whistle against Ravens

"Officials correctly ruled that Browns defensive lineman Larry Ogunjobi forced a fumble and that Peppers recovered it at the 7-yard line, wiping the Ravens touchdown off the board."

So, all I'm saying is, how the heyl can they have correctly ruled it a fumble and recovery by the Browns, then blow the whistle ? If they blew the whistle before the fumble, the play is dead. But...

yeah. I don't know - the NFL said it was a blown call, right on time vs the Browns.

 

 

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The Rams defender who hit the receiver has been fined $27,000 for the helmet to helmet hit ....rubs salt in Saints wounds

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46 minutes ago, calfoxwc said:

not when it's a fumble before you can call it. It was a very early whistle.

 

Officials costs Browns a TD with early whistle against Ravens

"Officials correctly ruled that Browns defensive lineman Larry Ogunjobi forced a fumble and that Peppers recovered it at the 7-yard line, wiping the Ravens touchdown off the board."

So, all I'm saying is, how the heyl can they have correctly ruled it a fumble and recovery by the Browns, then blow the whistle ? If they blew the whistle before the fumble, the play is dead. But...

yeah. I don't know - the NFL said it was a blown call, right on time vs the Browns.

 

 

How could they blow the whistle before the fumble, when he fumbled during the act of extending the ball towards the goaline?  The play was blown dead because they ruled it a TD, then overturned the call on review.

 

ETA: as Mark said, very next week the same thing happened. I don't mind the call against the browns, as that's how those plays are consistently called. So yeah, it was a mistake...but it's an easy one to make and was only able to be assertained a wrong call by frame by frame analysis.

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16 minutes ago, choco said:

How could they blow the whistle before the fumble, when he fumbled during the act of extending the ball towards the goaline?  The play was blown dead because they ruled it a TD, then overturned the call on review.

 

ETA: as Mark said, very next week the same thing happened. I don't mind the call against the browns, as that's how those plays are consistently called. So yeah, it was a mistake...but it's an easy one to make and was only able to be assertained a wrong call by frame by frame analysis.

Well, are we saying then, that they whistled the play dead only after the fumble, and they THOUGHT it was a TD? what if they were wrong and it wasn't a TD? After the fumble, I'd think it doesn't get whistled til the end of the play, then the truth sorts out on replay, one way or another. It's probably just me, but.... btw, if the exact same play happens in another ratbird game, didn't they learn anything from the first debacle?

    My dumb opinion, lol, is that if it was the steelers instead of the Browns playing that game, it would have been a fumble and a TD the other direction. LOL.

dammit. whatever. I have the last four games recorded and I don't think I want to rewatch that game.

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17 minutes ago, calfoxwc said:

Well, are we saying then, that they whistled the play dead only after the fumble, and they THOUGHT it was a TD?

yes, thought they scored, so no reason to allow the play to continue.

18 minutes ago, calfoxwc said:

what if they were wrong and it wasn't a TD?

that was pretty much the case, no?

19 minutes ago, calfoxwc said:

After the fumble, I'd think it doesn't get whistled til the end of the play, then the truth sorts out on replay, one way or another. It's probably just me,

ideally, they'd just let it play out, but they just dont seem to want to anymore.  no harm in letting him run to the endzone and sort it out later, as all scoring drives and turnovers are reviewed.  that, is my issue with this particular call.  but that they are at least consistent about how its called is rather important, at least imo.

23 minutes ago, calfoxwc said:

if it was the steelers instead of the Browns playing that game, it would have been a fumble and a TD the other direction. LOL.

im not so sure tbh...haden was flagged for a phantom PI call against the saints that extended a saints drive and allowed them to score (basically knocking the stools out of the playoffs).  i actually dont think its a team specific problem.

 

considering the average age of the refs, the fact the rules change every single year for the past 10 years, coupled with advances in HD TV and camera angles, i think refs jobs are tougher now than ever.  this is particularly demonstrated by the inconsistencies of many calls from crew to crew, as the rules are so fuzzy now that most things are judgement calls, which vary from person to person.  so i dont think theres a nefarious plot to screw certain teams, i just think the NFL has made too many mistakes trying to legislate the game, and thus set up their officials to fail.  throw in no accountability, as well as this being a side gig for most officials...frankly, this was bound to happen.  

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On 1/24/2019 at 3:23 AM, Nero said:

 

And I repeat, I don't believe in conspiracy theories.

I never really did either, until I witnessed a FG go wide left that was called good in our own stadium. Overshadowed by "The Drive," and a legendary QB. Horse crap is what it was and still is.

I also saw Clay Matthews pick up a backwards pass by Warren Moon in a playoff game at our own stadium, but Jerry Markbreit "blew the play dead," and we lost. Guess who got promoted to the head of officials years later? Yep, Jerry Markbreit. He also was lead official in the "Holy Roller" game.

Pittsburgh & Denver have gotten some serious playoff gifts, more than the other 30 teams combined I bet. Patriots have had a few breaks as you know. 

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1 hour ago, calfoxwc said:

. if the exact same play happens in another ratbird game, didn't they learn anything from the first debacle?

    My dumb opinion, lol, is that if it was the steelers instead of the Browns playing that game, it would have been a fumble and a TD the other direction. LOL.

 

The exact same thing did happen the next weekend.  Ravens and Chargers in the playoffs.  Chargers running back is lunging for the goal line and loses the ball, the Ravens player picks it up and does in fact run it all the way back for a TD.  Crowd going nuts.    Officials believed that it was a TD and were blowing the whistles to end the play but no one heard it that way on the field, after review it was ruled that he was down short of the goal line and it wasn't a fumble but they did the exact same thing and blew the whistles and ended the play.

There isn't a conspiracy against the Browns.   Bad calls happen in every game all season.  Watch other games and not just the Browns and you'd see that. 

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4 hours ago, darren15 said:

The Rams defender who hit the receiver has been fined $27,000 for the helmet to helmet hit ....rubs salt in Saints wounds

Just goes to prove the ref missed 2 calls on the same play.

Thats just another level of suckage by the NFL officials.

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On 1/23/2019 at 11:25 AM, Orion said:

What they should do...is to put it in the hands of the coaches, under the coaches challenge rules

...an issue with that thought is: Coach A throws the flag for pass interference....then Coach B throws his flag figuring that you could call a holding penalty Somewhere on any play.

I know, We'll build a large wooden badger.... :)

https://getyarn.io/yarn-clip/1099b959-8343-4c97-b708-b5bac2cde6b5

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On 1/25/2019 at 12:58 PM, darren15 said:

The Rams defender who hit the receiver has been fined $27,000 for the helmet to helmet hit ....rubs salt in Saints wounds

Hardly makes the Superbowl worth watching when you know one team does not belong there. It's the Shambowl.

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5 hours ago, TexasAg1969 said:

Hardly makes the Superbowl worth watching when you know one team does not belong there. It's the Shambowl.

Which is exactly why I'll be tying flies for fishing instead of watching it.

Mike

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On 1/25/2019 at 11:16 AM, The Gipper said:

Not sure why the NFL should give a rat's ass about "slowing the game down".   The game is slowed down tremendously with all their TV timeouts....this would absolutely add little to the length of a game comparatively.

Want better refs? Better training and pay would help a lot. No fix can be perfect. The refs would get better if shown how. Maybe add one as well. Expand replay and take it out of team hands. They shouldn’t get punished for a questionable call. 

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On 1/23/2019 at 9:09 AM, BrownsfaninPa said:

This was a disgrace to all NFL fans. These ref's throw flags on some of the most non-contact plays and this play proves that not one , but two ref's were in view of this penalty. It does no good for the NFL office to say that WE MISSED THAT CALL' Really, what makes you think that. hell millions of fans seen it, the fans in the stadium seen it, the players and coaches seen it, but the two closest ref's went blind all of a sudden. This stuff makes me so mad about ref;s controlling the game. When calls like this occur, I feel the coach has the right to throw a red challenge flag to prove that the ref's were at fault, and let the video speak for its self. Like they say, ref's are human , and make mistakes. So if that's the case, then let the video prove them wrong.

Love the fire in you.  Just my opinion, but I think it's way deeper than the instant replay so hear me out on this long winded rant that won't please any of our fans living in CA.

I stopped watching the NBA years ago when the officials had more say in the outcomes than the players in order to KEEP the CA markets in the finals.  I can't tell you how many times I saw the Utah Jazz not getting to the free throw line for obvious fouls committed while the Lakers went to the line for every every ticky tacky foul possibly invented.  Whenever they could get a Boston-LA matchup for the higher market TV ratings spike - those calling the game were often more influential to the outcome than the players.

I was hoping this wouldn't bleed over into the NFL but Roger Goodfella got his dream of 2 Teams in LA. Guess who both made the playoffs?  And guess who just made the SB on one of the shadiest/most controversial non-calls?   The Saints just got Utah Jazzed by that same LA market agenda from the top to bring this sport a, drum roll please..... Boston-LA matchup.  Officiating had everything to do with 1 of those teams getting there. Some have even suggested that Dee Ford penalty has often been a warning to the player by the line judge before a flag is thrown especially if officials don't allegedly want to impact the final score.   If he was playing for the right market against the Saints, that's a non-call all the way as we all witnessed in the 2 penalties 1 officiating crew purposely selected not to call at the most crucial point in the game.

BTW, this parity they want us to think is so special has us watching everybody but NE, Pittsburgh and Ratville,MD changing coaches every other year or so in the AFC. In the NFC that only applies to Seattle, New Orleans, Carolina and Dallas.  The NBA used to have the same kind of parity when they perpetuated all the same teams competing to win it all while the small markets elsewhere never really got relevant. 

There's still people under the assumption that NFL owners get most of their profit from home attendance.  Not any more man.  Roger Goodfella became a hero to ALL the owners when he helped get them the gigantic TV contracts giving all 32 owners a shared revenue that blows away what each team brings in from stadium attendances.  The worst thing that could happen right now is for all the people in that LA market to get just as bored with their NFL teams as they once did with the Rams franchise that frequented post seasons.  Not to worry - we just watched how Roger prevented that.  When you really think about it - there was quite a trend of NFL line judges and linesmen missing blatant false starts on the LA Chargers' LT and sometimes more than once a game.  Now all that alleged need to challenge pass interference calls is just a nice detour from a really stinky scent; and Roger adores it.

I used to get pissed off when people would say - that game was fixed, not to be confused with someone getting hosed on a bad call.  Today?  Roger is more interested in new TV markets out of this country than he is about ever caring what happens to traditional/storied franchises buried in his agenda. That said, now that ATT has taken over DirecTV and their monopoly - their current level of customer service needs chemotherapy before it metastasizes beyond all repair.  If you're going to charge long time customers an arm and a leg - shouldn't you at least hire someone that knows how to bill customers correctly? 

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4 hours ago, Flugel said:

The worst thing that could happen right now is for all the people in that LA market to get just as bored with their NFL teams as they once did with the Rams franchise that frequented post seasons.t.

 

People in LA don't care about the Rams or the Chargers, case in point the ratings were higher for the Patriots/Chiefs game than for the Rams/Saints game last weekend in LA.    Chargers are playing in a 27,000 seat stadium and every game has more fans of the visiting team than the Chargers.    I live out here and you'd think there would be all sorts of Super Bowl talk and buzz with the Rams in the game and its just not like that.  No one cares.

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1 hour ago, Mark O said:

People in LA don't care about the Rams or the Chargers, case in point the ratings were higher for the Patriots/Chiefs game than for the Rams/Saints game last weekend in LA.    Chargers are playing in a 27,000 seat stadium and every game has more fans of the visiting team than the Chargers.    I live out here and you'd think there would be all sorts of Super Bowl talk and buzz with the Rams in the game and its just not like that.  No one cares.

Wow! Thanks Mark!  That's what is so batshitt nuts about this Commish cramming LA market size down the esophagi.  Roger needs 2 teams because of market size when that same market size didn't give the first shitt about the last Rams team that frequented post seasons let alone 2 different NFL teams?  Needs assessment anyone? 

Roger has HIS 2 playoff teams in LA today and one of them needs to frequent SBs or he's going to be dangerously close to sending one of them back to St Louis and the other one elsewhere.  The Chargers deserve something better than half a seating capacity of 27,000 fans interested in them. That's been too good of franchise with Dan Fouts, Stan Humphries, Drew Brees, and Phillip Rivers to warrant that lack of interest.  Here's a concept, how about finding out why a team that frequents NFL post seasons can't keep locals interested in viewing or attending games.  When I had season tickets to Vandy games before Franklin showed up and gave them back to back 9 wins seasons - I thought it was pathetic an SEC Team with a seating capacity of 35,000 couldn't muster up at least 17,000 home fans.  Ready for this?  Season tickets only cost $192 for me and my wife.  The Chargers aren't even beating that right now; but Roger got the big TV contracts so there's an inevitable blind eye or 32 to the situation...

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Population New Orleans metro area:  1,262,888

Population Los Angeles metro area:  13,131,431

If YOU were the NFL brass faced  with sagging ratings, purely from a business standpoint, who would YOU want in the Super Bowl, New Orleans or the L.A. Rams?  

 

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28 minutes ago, onkyoreceiver said:

Population New Orleans metro area:  1,262,888

Population Los Angeles metro area:  13,131,431

If YOU were the NFL brass faced  with sagging ratings, purely from a business standpoint, who would YOU want in the Super Bowl, New Orleans or the L.A. Rams?  

 

The ratings aren't sagging. Quite the contrary they went up like 6 to 7% this year. Which is like the second highest they've been overall. Everyone wants to point out the ratings drop of last year but it isn't that people aren't watching football they aren't watching TV at least legally. A lot of streaming goes on which doesn't go into ratings. I should say illegal streaming. Even though ratings were down last year 27 of the top 50 watched television shows or programs, whatever you want to call them, were NFL football games. Which is right on par with every other year just over 50% of the most watched shows are football games every year. So though they dip last year so did the rest of television and they stayed right on par with where they've always been.

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On 1/26/2019 at 5:49 PM, TexasAg1969 said:

Hardly makes the Superbowl worth watching when you know one team does not belong there. It's the Shambowl.

I'm still trying to figure out what the Rams did to deserve the hate from people.

A defender realized that a receiver was totally uncovered, so he ran over there to try and stop a sure TD.  He got there too early.  He knows he did.  Was he supposed to put up his hand and call a foul on himself?  

Before the game was played, I felt either team deserved to go to the Super Bowl.  During the play of the game, it looked like either team deserved to go.  And now, after the game, I can still say that either team deserved to go to the SB.  The two teams played hard and well.  It's just that the ref's phucked one team out of a much better chance to have won the game.    Sucks for the Saints and their fans.  But it's not the Rams fault.

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for me - it's that they moved. twice. and that non call ranks way high on the NFL "there is no freaking way they didn't see that. they just refused to call it to make the commish happy" kind of a play, imho.

Seriously - does ANYBODY think that if it were the squealers driving to win the game, and they hit antonio brown that freaking early and flagrantly, that it would be a no call?

 

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5 hours ago, Flugel said:

Wow! Thanks Mark!  That's what is so batshitt nuts about this Commish cramming LA market size down the esophagi.  Roger needs 2 teams because of market size when that same market size didn't give the first shitt about the last Rams team that frequented post seasons let alone 2 different NFL teams?  Needs assessment anyone? 

Roger has HIS 2 playoff teams in LA today and one of them needs to frequent SBs or he's going to be dangerously close to sending one of them back to St Louis and the other one elsewhere.  The Chargers deserve something better than half a seating capacity of 27,000 fans interested in them. That's been too good of franchise with Dan Fouts, Stan Humphries, Drew Brees, and Phillip Rivers to warrant that lack of interest.  Here's a concept, how about finding out why a team that frequents NFL post seasons can't keep locals interested in viewing or attending games.  When I had season tickets to Vandy games before Franklin showed up and gave them back to back 9 wins seasons - I thought it was pathetic an SEC Team with a seating capacity of 35,000 couldn't muster up at least 17,000 home fans.  Ready for this?  Season tickets only cost $192 for me and my wife.  The Chargers aren't even beating that right now; but Roger got the big TV contracts so there's an inevitable blind eye or 32 to the situation...

You blame it on Roger Goodelle but I don’t think this is Roger is doing   this has Jerry Jones fingerprints all over it. Jones is the greedy bastard not Roger 

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I’m still mad about that call.... I wasted 4 hours of my life watching that game for it to end like that. 

Ref said, “I thought ball was tipped” ya ok..... every other PI that gets called with a questionable tip gets the flag thrown, refs huddle up and the one closest to the line says the ball was tipped and they pick the flag up....

Honestly if that would have happened to the Browns I’m not sure I could ever watch another NFL game. 

Keep reading all these articles about how happy bookies are that an LA team made the super bowl because betting on the game has tripled because of it....

The biggest farce of the whole thing is the NFL fined the CB for the illegal hit and took his money.....what a freaking joke.

I can’t believe I’m hoping the Pats waste the Rams and it’s an awful blowout game. I seriously have to root for the Pats? Screw you NFL.

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2 hours ago, Orion said:

I'm still trying to figure out what the Rams did to deserve the hate from people.

A defender realized that a receiver was totally uncovered, so he ran over there to try and stop a sure TD.  He got there too early.  He knows he did.  Was he supposed to put up his hand and call a foul on himself?  

Before the game was played, I felt either team deserved to go to the Super Bowl.  During the play of the game, it looked like either team deserved to go.  And now, after the game, I can still say that either team deserved to go to the SB.  The two teams played hard and well.  It's just that the ref's phucked one team out of a much better chance to have won the game.    Sucks for the Saints and their fans.  But it's not the Rams fault.

I don't blame the Rams at all. But I also know they do not belong there because that one playcall changed the obvious win into a loss. The wrong team is in the Superbowl. But even so I am tired of NE winning so I hope it goes the Rams way. It just is not one I look forward to seeing, but probably will anyway.

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20 minutes ago, TexasAg1969 said:

that one playcall changed the obvious win into a loss.

But we don't know that with 100% certainty.  -  They next might have called a bubble screen left for a loss of 7 yards.  :)

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