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KITCHENS NEW HEAD COACH

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I was shocked he got the job. I thought for sure McCarthy would get the job. I wonder if it was Dorsey or Haslem who forced HC candidates to commit to Kitchens as OC. Sounds like a Haslem thing.

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It's funny to think back to when Hue got canned, and what we were all speculating who would get hired, who would be the main candidates. 

Ends up being a guy who before Hue and Haley were fired most of us couldn't have picked out of a police line-up. 

Kitchens wouldn't admit it publicly, but he has to be secretly shocked at how his career has turned in the last few months. 

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5 hours ago, Realplayer said:

I was shocked he got the job. I thought for sure McCarthy would get the job. I wonder if it was Dorsey or Haslem who forced HC candidates to commit to Kitchens as OC. Sounds like a Haslam thing.

Other way around.. Wolf and Dorsey already knew all they needed to know about McCarthy from their Green Bay Days.  They weren't all that interested...   Apparently no other teams are\were either...  McCarthy has been passed over at least six times already, and apparently the only teams left minus a head coach, the Dolphins and Bengals aren't interviewing him.   

EDIT:  & now McCarthy is out out of the mix totally. Will go the Mike Pettine route, and take at least 2019 off.  He won't need Food Stamps....  

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1 hour ago, Dutch Oven said:

Kitchens wouldn't admit it publicly, but he has to be secretly shocked at how his career has turned in the last few months.

It IS a little scary...the whole 'rags to riches' thing here.  As well as the fact that Freddie is known as such a 'nice guy'.  I don't know if you can BE that nice and be the HC of an NFL football team.  We're going to find out if Freddie can LEAD the millionaires into battle with their full support and respect.  But not for nothin'.....it's nice to see The Good Guy win once in a while! 

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1 hour ago, Orion said:

It IS a little scary...the whole 'rags to riches' thing here.  As well as the fact that Freddie is known as such a 'nice guy'.  I don't know if you can BE that nice and be the HC of an NFL football team.  We're going to find out if Freddie can LEAD the millionaires into battle with their full support and respect.  But not for nothin'.....it's nice to see The Good Guy win once in a while! 

Good guy or not.. this is a results oriented business..I wonder if Jim Schwartz is still.. with Philly I think?... Someone may or may not know.. however.. Back to more ominous thinking...

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I'm not seeing any official announcing of Kitchens from ClevelandBrowns.com?

 

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36 minutes ago, PoeticG said:

I'm not seeing any official announcing of Kitchens from ClevelandBrowns.com?

 

Love ya, Po, and you're right.  It's the most "official"  unofficial announcement ever..  clevelandbrowns.com is notoriously bad about updating the website.  LOL, you think Cleveland.com, ESPN, NFL.com, & Sports Illustrated are all in on a big joke from Dorsey?  :) 

 

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2 hours ago, hoorta said:

Love ya, Po, and you're right.  It's the most "official"  unofficial announcement ever..  clevelandbrowns.com is notoriously bad about updating the website.  LOL, you think Cleveland.com, ESPN, NFL.com, & Sports Illustrated are all in on a big joke from Dorsey?  :) 

 

Presser is today and gonna be Dorsey and Kitchens up there. All the other assistants are gone. 

And in line with some wild speculation Bumblebee will be in charge of linebackers because the haslams like him

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7 hours ago, hoorta said:

Other way around.. Wolf and Dorsey already knew all they needed to know about McCarthy from their Green Bay Days.  They weren't all that interested...   Apparently no other teams are\were either...  McCarthy has been passed over at least six times already, and apparently the only teams left minus a head coach, the Dolphins and Bengals aren't interviewing him.   

EDIT:  & now McCarthy is out out of the mix totally. Will go the Mike Pettine route, and take at least 2019 off.  He won't need Food Stamps....  

I'll bet all those teams trampled all over each other to get Huey as HC.

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I am nervous and incredibly happy all at the same time. This was my pick yet again. Like the Baker Mayfield pick, I just got a great feeling that he was going to be the right fit here in Cleveland. After watching that video posted above about Kitchens in Arizona, i am even more convinced he is the right pick.

 

BUT..... I can completely understand Cowherd's(and frankly probably a lot of other more serious people) head scratching on our pick for head coach.  The dude was a Running back coach just months ago. Now he is an elite level NFL Coach, who is going to have to steer the ship and do thousand other things all while trying to maintain this relationship with his franchise QB and other top players.. It's going to be a tough row to hoe.... So I don't think anything that Cowherd said was out of bounds or even dickish.. And I think he is spot on, concerning how arrogant Browns fans are getting coming out of this season... We finished THIRD in the division. We didn't get a winning season even.... So let's check our arrogance at the door and get back to the work that got us from the bottom of the basement to the middle of the league in just a single year.. Playoffs and even an AFC North championship are now well within our grasp......

 

So I don't end up with a wall of words I'm going to end here.. And I am going to post why I think Freddie is a harbinger of things to come not only in the NFL but across the management world. It is a movement that is LONG overdue..

BobPound!

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I don't think Browns fans are arogant at all.  I'd say excited to have some victories after 2 horrible seasons.  There is optimism.

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Freddie Kitchens/John Dorsey to me personifies a quiet movement that is taking place in the world.... For literally thousands of years the management style of the western world(going back to Rome) has been that of top down, hierarchical structures that emphasizes the need of a strong man at the top of the heap. The strong man maintains his leadership by bringing in underlings who share his values and his management style. And before long(depending on the size of the structure) you have an entire organization that mimics the style and personality of its anointed strong man leader. 

At times this can be a great way to build an organization, because if the strong man at the top has a good moral compass and makes good choices in his underlings, the structure under him becomes stronger as it goes down to the bottom of the pyramid... But the opposite can (and more times than not) also be true.. A weak leader at the top can result in an exponentially weaker bottom, as the weakness grows the further down the structure it goes.. Hue was a perfect example in year 2. He had replaced most of the people with people he wanted. He led with a "MY WAY or NO WAY" mentality that was on display constantly in that HBO show. He was the quintessential Strong Man leader... It isn't obviously just the NFL that does this. Organization such as Wells Fargo take on the personality and traits of its strong man/woman leaders.. Wells Fargo was led by a man named Strumpf. His style was to push the legal boundaries in pursuit of higher share holder value... It took a few years, but eventually that mindset permeated all the way down to the lowest levels of the organization. And in 2018 we finally saw what that looked like as the FCC showed how corrupt even the lowest level loan officers were screwing people over for a buck.

So back to the Browns.   Our owner is the personification of the Strong Man leader type. He is the CEO of the Pilot Flying J Corporation and likely leads that corporation in the same way that he has tried to run the Browns since he bought it. That's why Hue was the way he was likely. He was brought in to mimic Haslan's management style and "enforce" some discipline on this team. But as is usually the case with top down thinking. The person he chose, fooled him into thinking he was a strong leader. He wasn't and the rest is history.

What Dorsey is doing to me transcends the NFL.. He has interjected himself between Haslam and the team and is incorporating a new structure that starts with him... And instead of him being the strong man at the top, he is setting about hiring people up and down the structure that are people capable of leading not because the man above them TOLD THEM he was in charge, but rather because the people below them WANT TO FOLLOW THEM. Baker personifies this. He leads by example, not because he tells everyone around him he is in charge(Hue).. Kitchens appears to be cut from the same cloth. People want to follow him, they want to do good work for him.. And as this structure grows, it will start to take on the attributes and personality of Dorsey.

Watching him on that HBO show was crazy and I didn't realize what I was watching at the time. Dorsey walks to his own drum. He is nice to people, he doesn't talk down to them.. I mean what the fuck kind of GM acts like that? In normal hierarchical structures a man like him is supposed to be untouchable by the commoners...

Imagine a man like Dorsey in charge of a  company? Not leading because he tells you he is in charge, but because you want to work for him. I have a very strong feeling that every pick this team makes going forward is going to be in the mold of Dorsey. Not men/women in charge, but true leader of men. Up and down the chain, from the towel boy to our next DC..

 

BobPound!

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5 hours ago, flyingfooldoug said:

Presser is today and gonna be Dorsey and Kitchens up there. All the other assistants are gone. 

And in line with some wild speculation Bumblebee will be in charge of linebackers because the haslams like him

What time is the presser ?

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22 hours ago, lodilobo said:

Thank God....maybe that info about the power struggle was crap...

I think it really is, and I believe we're going to learn from past mistakes.  It's already been reported that Kitchens will report directly to Dorsey, so that's a positive first step.  The next biggest issue is to locate a badass defensive coordinator.  I was also pretty shocked to see us let Bob Wylie go from his offensive line coaching position.  Our OL was pretty amazing in the second half of the year, and we also developed Greg Robinson nicely.  Additionally, our RT (Hubbard) was at first getting booed out the door, then got his act together along with Greg, so I'm pretty shocked to see Bob go.  

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7 minutes ago, jiggins7919 said:

I think it really is, and I believe we're going to learn from past mistakes.  It's already been reported that Kitchens will report directly to Dorsey, so that's a positive first step.  The next biggest issue is to locate a badass defensive coordinator.  I was also pretty shocked to see us let Bob Wylie go from his offensive line coaching position.  Our OL was pretty amazing in the second half of the year, and we also developed Greg Robinson nicely.  Additionally, our RT (Hubbard) was at first getting booed out the door, then got his act together along with Greg, so I'm pretty shocked to see Bob go.  

Im not surprised to see Wylie go... He might not have made it through another training camp unless he went on Jenny Craig..
 

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2 hours ago, BobPOUND! said:

Freddie Kitchens/John Dorsey to me personifies a quiet movement that is taking place in the world.... For literally thousands of years the management style of the western world(going back to Rome) has been that of top down, hierarchical structures that emphasizes the need of a strong man at the top of the heap. The strong man maintains his leadership by bringing in underlings who share his values and his management style. And before long(depending on the size of the structure) you have an entire organization that mimics the style and personality of its anointed strong man leader. 

At times this can be a great way to build an organization, because if the strong man at the top has a good moral compass and makes good choices in his underlings, the structure under him becomes stronger as it goes down to the bottom of the pyramid... But the opposite can (and more times than not) also be true.. A weak leader at the top can result in an exponentially weaker bottom, as the weakness grows the further down the structure it goes.. Hue was a perfect example in year 2. He had replaced most of the people with people he wanted. He led with a "MY WAY or NO WAY" mentality that was on display constantly in that HBO show. He was the quintessential Strong Man leader... It isn't obviously just the NFL that does this. Organization such as Wells Fargo take on the personality and traits of its strong man/woman leaders.. Wells Fargo was led by a man named Strumpf. His style was to push the legal boundaries in pursuit of higher share holder value... It took a few years, but eventually that mindset permeated all the way down to the lowest levels of the organization. And in 2018 we finally saw what that looked like as the FCC showed how corrupt even the lowest level loan officers were screwing people over for a buck.

So back to the Browns.   Our owner is the personification of the Strong Man leader type. He is the CEO of the Pilot Flying J Corporation and likely leads that corporation in the same way that he has tried to run the Browns since he bought it. That's why Hue was the way he was likely. He was brought in to mimic Haslan's management style and "enforce" some discipline on this team. But as is usually the case with top down thinking. The person he chose, fooled him into thinking he was a strong leader. He wasn't and the rest is history.

What Dorsey is doing to me transcends the NFL.. He has interjected himself between Haslam and the team and is incorporating a new structure that starts with him... And instead of him being the strong man at the top, he is setting about hiring people up and down the structure that are people capable of leading not because the man above them TOLD THEM he was in charge, but rather because the people below them WANT TO FOLLOW THEM. Baker personifies this. He leads by example, not because he tells everyone around him he is in charge(Hue).. Kitchens appears to be cut from the same cloth. People want to follow him, they want to do good work for him.. And as this structure grows, it will start to take on the attributes and personality of Dorsey.

Watching him on that HBO show was crazy and I didn't realize what I was watching at the time. Dorsey walks to his own drum. He is nice to people, he doesn't talk down to them.. I mean what the fuck kind of GM acts like that? In normal hierarchical structures a man like him is supposed to be untouchable by the commoners...

Imagine a man like Dorsey in charge of a  company? Not leading because he tells you he is in charge, but because you want to work for him. I have a very strong feeling that every pick this team makes going forward is going to be in the mold of Dorsey. Not men/women in charge, but true leader of men. Up and down the chain, from the towel boy to our next DC..

 

BobPound!

That’s deep Bob, and good analogies. I would disagree on a thing. Dorsey does his fair share of talking down to people, but l think it’s more a product of circumstance. There’s only so much time to convey messages, and there’s lots of messages to convey.

The thing that is apparent to me re: Dorsey is he’s a meticulous mofo, and seems to be involved in damn near every aspect of the organization. I’m used to seeing a GM in some some office or on a phone or something, but time and again we saw him on the field during practices, participating in drills even. The guy is all up in the nuts and bolts of what goes on, snd that’s refreshing to see.

I feel like l’ve read a crap ton on both Kitchens and Williams the last few weeks. Williams described as a self-promotor and Kitchens a more humble dude. It stands to reason that with Kitchens’ experience (he’s been around the league a while), had he been more of a self-promotor, he would’ve ascended some time ago. 

Kitchens has also been described as a “no nonsense” guy, and a straight shooter. My guess is that with the amount of time Dorsey spends around these guys, he liked what he saw from Kitchens, and whatever perceived holes he saw in Kitchens like inexperience and such were shored up in the interview process. 

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I've said multiple times before that I hoped the Browns would hire the right guy, and simply not the most well known guy...... Well, part 2 done  < I see you there McCarthy and Arians >  and now it's up to Freddie to prove he is part 1.

I can't wait to see the coaches he surrounds himself with. 

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17 hours ago, gumby73 said:

Good! Have your guy forward that info to MKC & tell her she's wrong again & to find another job :D..thanks & hail the queen(s) 

MKC is still masturbating to pictures of Jimmy Garoppolo.

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Skip and Bayless giving Kitchens shit..

Fucking ignorant..

 

The guy has coaching experience, he can lead, he has passion for the game and has learned from the best.

I think he will do great,

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12 minutes ago, domcucch1994 said:

Skip and Bayless giving Kitchens shit..

Fucking ignorant..

 

The guy has coaching experience, he can lead, he has passion for the game and has learned from the best.

I think he will do great,

I don't understand why any of you watch these shows when all they do is piss you all off because of their "opinions".    I mean Skip Blowhard is making millions to shit on Lebron every chance he gets and people still listen to his opinion.  

No one had ever heard of Sean McVey before the Rams hired him as HC.  Do you think they want to go back and do it all over again?    Id like to see Kitchens get a DC and work like the Rams do...he is the HC and calls the plays and leaves the defense to an experienced defensive coach.

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14 minutes ago, domcucch1994 said:

Skip and Bayless giving Kitchens shit..

Fucking ignorant..

 

The guy has coaching experience, he can lead, he has passion for the game and has learned from the best.

I think he will do great,

CAn Kitchens situation be any different really than Jason Garrett's was when he was hired?

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1 minute ago, Mark O said:

I don't understand why any of you watch these shows when all they do is piss you all off because of their "opinions".    I mean Skip Blowhard is making millions to shit on Lebron every chance he gets and people still listen to his opinion.  

No one had ever heard of Sean McVey before the Rams hired him as HC.  Do you think they want to go back and do it all over again?    Id like to see Kitchens get a DC and work like the Rams do...he is the HC and calls the plays and leaves the defense to an experienced defensive coach.

I watch it just to pass the time at my boring desk job. And I like to hear their opinions cause they are right on certain issues, but they put little to no faith in Cleveland's new HC which I don't agree with..

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3 minutes ago, domcucch1994 said:

I watch it just to pass the time at my boring desk job. And I like to hear their opinions cause they are right on certain issues, but they put little to no faith in Cleveland's new HC which I don't agree with..

That is ONLY because he is not a "Name" that they can identify with. 

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24 minutes ago, Mark O said:

I don't understand why any of you watch these shows when all they do is piss you all off because of their "opinions".    I mean Skip Blowhard is making millions to shit on Lebron every chance he gets and people still listen to his opinion.  

No one had ever heard of Sean McVey before the Rams hired him as HC.  Do you think they want to go back and do it all over again?    Id like to see Kitchens get a DC and work like the Rams do...he is the HC and calls the plays and leaves the defense to an experienced defensive coach.

Exactly! Why torture yourself? just don't watch those stupid blowhards. Im telling you I stopped watching those idiots along with mainstream media, and my attitude and blood pressure has improved immensely. 

 

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11 hours ago, flyingfooldoug said:

Presser is today and gonna be Dorsey and Kitchens up there. All the other assistants are gone. 

And in line with some wild speculation Bumblebee will be in charge of linebackers because the haslams like him

Well, it's really getting weird not seeing anything about Kitchens as HC on the Browns website, not a word of a press conference, and they're in the process of interviewing coordinators? 

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26 minutes ago, hoorta said:

Well, it's really getting weird not seeing anything about Kitchens as HC on the Browns website, not a word of a press conference, and they're in the process of interviewing coordinators? 

Loose lips sink ships? Local media said there will be a presser today. As far as hiring Freddy? He is the one that oversaw the O and that showed the biggest difference. Play calling and practice. But nothing from Berea. 

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1 hour ago, hoorta said:

Well, it's really getting weird not seeing anything about Kitchens as HC on the Browns website, not a word of a press conference, and they're in the process of interviewing coordinators? 

Closest I’ve seen is WKYC with GWs goodbye to the fans note. 

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4 hours ago, 5150k9 said:

Exactly! Why torture yourself? just don't watch those stupid blowhards. Im telling you I stopped watching those idiots along with mainstream media, and my attitude and blood pressure has improved immensely. 

 

Hey, I really like your Avatar, and welcome.  And I get the 5150 reference...  You do have a point, and I should know better that the main reason Cow-pie is on the air is (short of a few weird guys like Baking up Turnovers) to get the majority of  listeners so pissed off they can't help themselves to see what sort of crap he's going to come up with next. 

Shame the guy is so small he can't come out and admit more often that he's dead wrong...  

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So now it's disagree politely and get a week off? Jesus...

12 hours ago, BobPOUND! said:

I am nervous and incredibly happy all at the same time.

Ditto-ish...

I'm happy for Kitch and think he has promise based upon his seeking input from the entire Offense when he took over as OC, but...

... there are a lot of questions to be answered about his ability to run an org.

That said.... His comment on being ready to be HC is a promising one. Equal parts humility and self-awareness...

 

First test will be the quality of the staff he can attract and assemble and what his playcalling approach will be on Sundays. Word is that Jim Bob Cooter may be the new OC and that says he is willing to hand the duty over to the right OC.

Another positive...

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