Wishbone formation

[Ibleedbrown]

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.cleveland.com/browns/2018/11/freddie-kitchens-brings-the-wishbone-to-life-in-cleveland-browns-win-over-the-atlanta-falcons.html%3foutputType=amp

I’ve also seen it referred to as the “triple shotgun” formation, and l thought it was one of the more intriguing settings Kitchen’s brought to the table (ba dum, chh).

Apparently it’s been around a loooong time but is seldom used these days outside of a few triple option college teams.

It seemed fairly effective until the errant pass from the rb. 

Normally when we change coordinators mid-season l just hope the wheels don’t fall off so bad that the team disengages and just starts going theough the motions, but we are definitely not seeing that with the plays Kitchens draws up. Kitchen’s ink, so to speak. Every play, all day, throwing the kitchen’s ink at ‘em.

I’m curious to see what he will pull out of the pantry after the bye.

[tiamat63]

Full house, diamond, inverted wishbone etc etc.  It has plenty of names. 

Forces defenses into a lot of 1on1 outside.  Which is why that slant-flat combo with Duke and Perrimen worked a few Times yesterday.

[Clevfan4life]

its prob sonething tgey want to put back on the shelf in 2 wweks, al9ng with the ole rb option to the qb. The next team will prob be sitting all over those plays. 

[Canton Dawg]

[ballpeen]

Very innovative install by Freddy.   I like it.  Inverted wishbone attack.

[Tour2ma]

8 hours ago, tiamat63 said:

Full house, diamond, inverted wishbone etc etc.  It has plenty of names. 

Forces defenses into a lot of 1on1 outside.  Which is why that slant-flat combo with Duke and Perrimen worked a few Times yesterday.

Flexbone is the one O eventually thought of (after referring to it as a "full house" in the gameday thread)... except we're running it out of the 'gun.

The HS in the city where I lived most of my working days in Texas ran a version of of the Flex... all the way to regionals in the old Astrodome one year.

 

Speaking of guns... I have never been a fan of the Pistol, but with Baker and Chubb, I think it's perfect for us.

[Dutch Oven]

The youth football program I coached at ran the Wing T. 

Can't pass out of it for a Sheet, but man, if you aren't used to seeing it, it is hard to defend. I remember watching it when I first came to help coach from the defensive side and literally having no idea who had the ball. 

[jiggins7919]

8 hours ago, tiamat63 said:

Full house, diamond, inverted wishbone etc etc.  It has plenty of names. 

Forces defenses into a lot of 1on1 outside.  Which is why that slant-flat combo with Duke and Perrimen worked a few Times yesterday.

Very good point Tiamat. Only issue is that WR has to win his route. I'm guessing there are "safety valves" in the flat because we have 8 RBs on the field, but the formation definitely gave Falcons problems....until the ill-timed RB pass that was picked off. Actually, the call timing was OK, but the execution was abysmal. Should've thrown it away. 

You know what play design I absolutely loved? The screen to Chubb. That was brilliant, and it was another "easy TD" for a team that doesn't get many. We had another one to Duke later, where Baker simply fired it to Duke out of the backfield, and he scooted into paydirt. 

[tiamat63]

33 minutes ago, Tour2ma said:

Flexbone is the one O eventually thought of (after referring to it as a "full house" in the gameday thread)... except we're running it out of the 'gun.

The HS in the city where I lived most of my working days in Texas ran a version of of the Flex... all the way to regionals in the old Astrodome one year.

 

Speaking of guns... I have never been a fan of the Pistol, but with Baker and Chubb, I think it's perfect for us.

 

That's saying a lot because I distinctly remember (and agreed) you're biggest gripe with the Shanny and Hoyer offense was the continued use of the singleback pistol.   IIRC the running game wasn't as effective when we moved away from center or a more traditional offset gun look.

[TexasAg1969]

1 hour ago, Dutch Oven said:

The youth football program I coached at ran the Wing T. 

Can't pass out of it for a Sheet, but man, if you aren't used to seeing it, it is hard to defend. I remember watching it when I first came to help coach from the defensive side and literally having no idea who had the ball. 

I always felt that the wishbone that UT played under Darrell Royal was greatly helped by the Burnt Orange jersey they had switched to from the old Orange that really was orange. The Burnt Orange was more the color of the footballs and made it far easier to camouflage who actually had it when the formation was run so well by the now deceased James Street.

[JohnnycakeRidge]

I'm kinda thinking I like the idea of the Wishbone being run by an Oklahoma quarterback.  Seems legit to me.

Baker seen on the sidelines in a fur coat next.

[calfoxwc]

1 hour ago, TexasAg1969 said:

I always felt that the wishbone that UT played under Darrell Royal was greatly helped by the Burnt Orange jersey they had switched to from the old Orange that really was orange. The Burnt Orange was more the color of the footballs and made it far easier to camouflage who actually had it when the formation was run so well by the now deceased James Street.

best I can remember, Texas used the wishbone offense. Nobody could stop it, back when I was a kid. If I remember correctly, Texas played in the Cotton Bowl, vs Notre Dame ? and ND, Ara Parseghian, hc,  used a defense that was actually created in some high school, where the defense lined up in the same formation, and ran the defense man-to-man. Something like that. I remember listening to it on the radio.

[The Gipper]

1 hour ago, JohnnycakeRidge said:

I'm kinda thinking I like the idea of the Wishbone being run by an Oklahoma quarterback.  Seems legit to me.

Baker seen on the sidelines in a fur coat next.

Are you thinking of the fur coat that Joe Namath war.? Joe Namath was an Alabama quarterback

[jiggins7919]

Speaking of offensive formations, I LOVED seeing us in the I-Formation. On our first 3rd and 1, we used the gimmicky direct snap that SHOULD'VE worked, but Chubb got drilled and Baker was called for penalty. I say should've worked because Chubb had a full head of steam, and he needs to either leap or fall forward for that yard. Additionally, our interior has to block better. Anyway, the next 3rd and 1 we had we went I-Formation, and got a run for about 10 yards through the interior. I don't know who we're using to lead block, but that man can BLOCK. He had several big time blocks to spring nice runs, and there's nothing wrong with old school football. Chubb also displays nice patience and vision following blocks, rare for someone so young. People may not remember, but Chubb was THE MAN in college, a huge prospect, and then suffered a catastrophic injury. I mean, it was awful. That opened the door for Sony Michell I believe, and Chubb came back a little less quick, but still effective. NOW, that top speed appears to be coming back. In spades. 

[TexasAg1969]

1 hour ago, jiggins7919 said:

Speaking of offensive formations, I LOVED seeing us in the I-Formation.

A&M and Miss were tied 14-14 at the half this past Sat. The second half they changed to the I-formation, inserted a true walk-on who had made the team as the designated student 12th man on the kickoff team (non-scholarship) in as the FB and just ran it down their throats so that they limited Miss to just around 10 min. TOP the second half. That kid was blasting LB's left and right like a demon possessed so the I-back could just keep making 1st downs. They won the second half 24-3 after you exclude the pick 6 from the Miss defense. It was great watching a throwback formation take over a game the old fashioned smash-mouth way, man on man, hat on hat..

[jiggins7919]

1 hour ago, TexasAg1969 said:

A&M and Miss were tied 14-14 at the half this past Sat. The second half they changed to the I-formation, inserted a true walk-on who had made the team as the designated student 12th man on the kickoff team (non-scholarship) in as the FB and just ran it down their throats so that they limited Miss to just around 10 min. TOP the second half. That kid was blasting LB's left and right like a demon possessed so the I-back could just keep making 1st downs. They won the second half 24-3 after you exclude the pick 6 from the Miss defense. It was great watching a throwback formation take over a game the old fashioned smash-mouth way, man on man, hat on hat..

Badazz!  That's my kind of football.  It's why I loved our Peyton Hillis season so much.  I forget our stats on 3rd and short, but when Hillis got the ball, we GOT the freaking first down.  Man, I loved that guy.  So sad to see what happened to him, although I guess it was his own doing.  Remember that Patriots victory we had?  So fun.  

Who was our blocking FB, Texas?  Orson Charles?  He had some big time blocks.  

[TexasAg1969]

9 hours ago, jiggins7919 said:

Badazz!  That's my kind of football.  It's why I loved our Peyton Hillis season so much.  I forget our stats on 3rd and short, but when Hillis got the ball, we GOT the freaking first down.  Man, I loved that guy.  So sad to see what happened to him, although I guess it was his own doing.  Remember that Patriots victory we had?  So fun.  

Who was our blocking FB, Texas?  Orson Charles?  He had some big time blocks.  

The really neat thing is that the FB retained his famous #12 that gets awarded to the top walk-on student qualifying to get down there and do a Kamikaze on opposing team blockers on kickoffs. You have to be a really fast and tough MFer to earn that right, so they first gave him some TE duties and then gave him those block FB duties in the I. Watch these two back to back plays early in the 2nd half. Old school stuff!! And even though we gave up the fumble for a TD (not a pick 6 like I said before), they kept at 'em throughout the rest of the game.

 

[Tour2ma]

The Aggie Forum is thataway --------------------=======================>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

22 hours ago, tiamat63 said:

That's saying a lot because I distinctly remember (and agreed) you're biggest gripe with the Shanny and Hoyer offense was the continued use of the singleback pistol.   IIRC the running game wasn't as effective when we moved away from center or a more traditional offset gun look.

You got it... Hoyer plus Crow was the combo. Hoyer's PAP skills were wasted when he wasn't under Center and we all know what Crow's vision was like. I can't recall a single jump-cut he made for us in 4 years.

Just a very different combo with Baker/Chubb... different skill sets with Baker's RPO (and less than stellar work under Center) and Chubb's eyes and feet. I think he had at least two jump-cuts Sunday.

13 hours ago, jiggins7919 said:

Speaking of offensive formations, I LOVED seeing us in the I-Formation. On our first 3rd and 1, we used the gimmicky direct snap that SHOULD'VE worked, but Chubb got drilled and Baker was called for penalty. I say should've worked because Chubb had a full head of steam, and he needs to either leap or fall forward for that yard. Additionally, our interior has to block better.

Woulda shoulda coulda...

The trick play had no chance. None... nada... zippo...

What I think you overlook is that in a direct snap from the snap there is no doubt in the D what the play is.

In the "I" there's always a PAP option to honor.

[SD_Tom]

On 11/13/2018 at 3:45 AM, jiggins7919 said:

Speaking of offensive formations, I LOVED seeing us in the I-Formation. On our first 3rd and 1, we used the gimmicky direct snap that SHOULD'VE worked, but Chubb got drilled and Baker was called for penalty. I say should've worked because Chubb had a full head of steam, and he needs to either leap or fall forward for that yard. Additionally, our interior has to block better. Anyway, the next 3rd and 1 we had we went I-Formation, and got a run for about 10 yards through the interior. I don't know who we're using to lead block, but that man can BLOCK. He had several big time blocks to spring nice runs, and there's nothing wrong with old school football. Chubb also displays nice patience and vision following blocks, rare for someone so young. People may not remember, but Chubb was THE MAN in college, a huge prospect, and then suffered a catastrophic injury. I mean, it was awful. That opened the door for Sony Michell I believe, and Chubb came back a little less quick, but still effective. NOW, that top speed appears to be coming back. In spades. 

I think a big reason they liked him so much is because he rehabbed from that injury and put up great numbers.  Loved his character and work ethic 

[tiamat63]

20 hours ago, Tour2ma said:

 

The trick play had no chance. None... nada... zippo...

What I think you overlook is that in a direct snap from the snap there is no doubt in the D what the play is.

In the "I" there's always a PAP option to honor.

I think if we're just going to try a direct snap, either sub out Mayfield for an extra blocker or let Duke take the snap and give him an option or lead with Chubb maybe even Charles. 

Just seems to make more sense on short yardage being that Mayfield is removing a +1 from blocking numbers at that point.