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htownbrown

I'm sorry NATO I didn't hear you...

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why is the russian pipeline a thing? so russia sells some natural gas to europe. if they charge too much they buy from america or from wherever else. germany and europe in general is just diversifying their supply. russia has no control over anybody, like i said europe can buy energy from multiple sources. all it dies is make american gas exporters have more competitive pricing. 

its called "CAPITALISM" in case some of u were mystified as to why someone would want to look at multiple stores before they bought something.

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but im glad trump is saying no you need spend ur agreed upon % of gdp on nato defense NOW, not in 10 years. we've been asking them for years so nobody is being blindsided by sht

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They can have the pipeline from Russia if they so choose, but they can't leave us financially responsible for protecting them from the very same Russia.  Capitalism and competition has nothing to do with it.  Where that came from, I have no idea.

These countries barely act as our allies these days.  Yet everyday you and I wake up, put our pants on, and go to work to help fund the protection of these countries from their own business partners?  

Furthermore, I wonder if Putin is shaking in his boots when he gets economic sanctions handed down, while he pumps oil across Europe?  I'll have to think real hard about that one.

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1) I agree that they have to pay their share, but yes it is capitalism that they're trading with Russia...which they did during the height of the cold war as well...there's nothing new here. I listened to Trump explicity state he was salty that they were bringing in Russian gas instead of American..which has to be shipped across the atlantic. 

2) there's nothing they're doing that isn't "ally like"...they're just looking out for their own economic interests and the trade imbalances were the result of decades of concessions so the American dollar keeps being the worlds reserve. The current American "way of life" is a direct result of being positioned closest to the worlds credit spigot. Of course it was a short term short sighted deal that made people a few decades ago "very very very wealthy" and they gave no fuks about what happened when they're dead or too old to give a sht. Not many people have read about this concept so I don't blame you for not understanding this, but please understand that the peril the U.S is in now economically and monetarily...was predicted decades ago BY REPUBLICANS!!!

3) I had to chuckle a bit at your naivete that any meaningful sanctions are going to get thrown at the Russians by our current admin. Not with peepee tape out there. I don't know if you caught it or not, but in that thread I made about the titty milk....the u.s delegation backed the fuk down from the Russians. They handed a global fastball down the middle of the plate to the Russians while we looked like sht knuckle asshats trying to strong arm the likes of fukking Ecuador. 

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Trump is absolutely correct. Russia uses economics, particularly gas/oil...as a weapon. It's what marxists do.

and Germany goes for it hook line and sinker?

https://www.independent.co.uk › News › World › Europe

 
Feb 27, 2015 - Russia has threatened to turn off the gas supply to Ukraine “by the end of the week”, sparking fears of a potential fuel shortage across the whole ...
 

Russia Cuts Gas, and Europe Shivers - The New York Times

Jan 6, 2009 - Russia's gas price dispute with Ukraine escalated, disrupting deliveries to ... the risk of shortages of heating fuel, Gazprom threatened additional cuts. ... Oil and gas exports provide about 60 percent of the Russian budget; oil ...
 

Oil, carrots, and sticks: Russia's energy resources as a foreign policy ...

by R Newnham - ‎2011 - ‎Cited by 63 - ‎Related articles
A key component of this power is Russia's ability to use its oil and gas reserves as ..... Today, while the recession has cut into Russia's financial reserves, it remains far ... oil or gas shipments through its pipelines, Russia can shrug off the threat.
 
The Russia–Ukraine gas disputes refer to a number of disputes between Ukrainian oil and gas ..... On 2 October 2007, Gazprom threatened to cut off gas supplies to Ukraine because of unpaid debt of $1.3 billion. This dispute appeared to be ...
 
Mar 15, 2018 - VLADIMIR Putin could cut off Britain's gas supplies and send the ... World War 3: Theresa May sends WARSHIPS to combat 'Russia THREAT'.
 
Jun 20, 2017 - As the world's second-largest producer of natural gas, Russia actually has leverage over its European customers by threatening to cut off gas ...
 
Mar 3, 2018 - Russia's Energy Ministry said on Saturday that gas giant Gazprom's ... “Minister Novak assured that the gas transit from Russia to Europe is under no threat. ... gas from Europe to try to cut its energy dependence on Moscow.
Missing: oil ‎| ‎Must include: ‎oil
 
Mar 3, 2014 - Russia presses Ukraine on natural gas debt and threatens price hike. ... Twice in the past decade, Russia cut off vital fuel supplies to Ukraine, .... (See related, "Pictures: At Five Years Old, BTC Pipeline Moves Oil, Culture.").
Jan 1, 2018 - Despite years of effort from the EU, Russia's grip over natural gas ... At a minimum, the availability of LNG weakens the threat of a cutoff of ...
 

Moscow threatened to cut gas supplies to Ukraine (for the third time since 2006) ... to lose in Russia (which has some of the world's biggest untapped oil and gas ...

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Poland, the Baltics, and some other European countries agree with President Trump.

https://www.politico.eu/article/germany-russia-gas-nord-stream-2-foreign-policy/

" Germany’s support for Nord Stream 2 has been Gazprom’s biggest asset in pushing forward with its plans in the face of resistance from the European Commission and many other EU countries. "

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However, if tensions between Russia and the EU continue to rise, so will the political pressure on Germany and other EU countries to do something about Nord Stream 2, Giuli said.

Denmark, Sweden and Finland have yet to issue their own construction permits for the pipeline.

“A downward spiral in West-Russia relations might increase the political risk associated to the investment,” Giuli said. “At some point the double approach may not be tenable anymore and require Germany to make a choice between aligning to the Western camp, or protecting its business community’s interests.”

Kalina Oroschakoff and Matthew Karnitschnig contributed reporting.

 

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2 hours ago, Clevfan4life said:

1) I agree that they have to pay their share, but yes it is capitalism that they're trading with Russia...which they did during the height of the cold war as well...there's nothing new here. I listened to Trump explicity state he was salty that they were bringing in Russian gas instead of American..which has to be shipped across the atlantic. 

2) there's nothing they're doing that isn't "ally like"...they're just looking out for their own economic interests and the trade imbalances were the result of decades of concessions so the American dollar keeps being the worlds reserve. The current American "way of life" is a direct result of being positioned closest to the worlds credit spigot. Of course it was a short term short sighted deal that made people a few decades ago "very very very wealthy" and they gave no fuks about what happened when they're dead or too old to give a sht. Not many people have read about this concept so I don't blame you for not understanding this, but please understand that the peril the U.S is in now economically and monetarily...was predicted decades ago BY REPUBLICANS!!!

3) I had to chuckle a bit at your naivete that any meaningful sanctions are going to get thrown at the Russians by our current admin. Not with peepee tape out there. I don't know if you caught it or not, but in that thread I made about the titty milk....the u.s delegation backed the fuk down from the Russians. They handed a global fastball down the middle of the plate to the Russians while we looked like sht knuckle asshats trying to strong arm the likes of fukking Ecuador. 

1.  I never mentioned capitalism or competition.  I'm not sure why you keep bringing it up or insinuating I need it explained to me.  Again, they can dig up Hitler's corpse and buy lamp shades from him if they want, but requiring us to pay for military protection from him is both hypocritical and shady.  But just to get past this, yes buying things from Russia is a form of capitalism.  We good here?  Trump may be salty about that, but I'm salty about the tax revenue lost to people that clearly don't need it, while our social programs require more money to stay afloat.  I know where we can get some of that money, do you see it too?

2. I wasn't speaking of this particular story when I said Europe is not acting like our allies.  But why not, since we're here.  Say we went to war with Russia for legitimate reasons, being that a pipeline pumps Europe's lifeblood in everyday, do you think its in their best interest to back us?  Consider the investment to this project.  I say let them buy their protection with all that money they're going to save now.  Bet you they won't call us allies if the bucks stop rolling in.  Trading oil has a different implication than trading potato chips.  You do realize that?

3.  Sure ok.  Pretend the great Obama gets a second run like FDR and sanctions the sh!t out of Russia.  How effective are they?  

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10 hours ago, Clevfan4life said:

why is the russian pipeline a thing? so russia sells some natural gas to europe. if they charge too much they buy from america or from wherever else. germany and europe in general is just diversifying their supply. russia has no control over anybody, like i said europe can buy energy from multiple sources. all it dies is make american gas exporters have more competitive pricing. 

its called "CAPITALISM" in case some of u were mystified as to why someone would want to look at multiple stores before they bought something.

Yes. By the way why is Russia a thing at all?

WSS

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Of the links I posted above, take special notice of this one:

***********

Oil, carrots, and sticks: Russia's energy resources as a foreign policy ...

Oil, carrots, and sticks: Russia’s energy resources as a foreign policy tool

Author links open overlay panelRandallNewnham
Open Access funded by Hanyang University
Under a Creative Commons license

Abstract

This paper will explore the growth of Russia’s energy leverage in recent years, a source of power which Russia has used both to reward its friends and punish its enemies. It will briefly trace the origins of this power in the integrated energy networks of the former USSR and Warsaw Pact. It will then examine recent cases of the use of ‘oil power.’ Both positive and negative linkage will be considered. Some states-such as Armenia, Belarus and the Ukraine under President Kuchma-have been favored with heavily subsidized energy. Others-such as Georgia, Moldova, the Baltic States and the Ukraine under President Yushchenko-have been targeted by supply disruptions and punitive price increases. Russia’s new ‘petro-power’ is of great importance today, and not just for its immediate neighbors: like other ‘petro-states,’ Russia is likely to gain ever more power as oil and gas become scarcer in the future.

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Not to mention that if the whole idea of us footing the bill for NATO is to keep these pussies safe from the russkies... You probably understand.

WSS

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34 minutes ago, jbluhm86 said:

Well, that escalated quickly:

Trump threatens to pull out of NATO

Screenshot_20180712-114915.thumb.png.f301fb006b53c742a292529e83e42824.png

So it's pretty obvious by the bombastic writing here that Politico, a dingleberry on the butt of the Washington Post, is looking to make the story more important than it is. You understand how that works JB I'm sure. Another point the use of the word demand instead of asked suggested or requested is telling since it's not a direct quote. Again like I said if NATO is necessary to protect Europe from the russkies and they are happy to do business with the ruskies then what may be the problem? Does someone think that Putin is a relevant threat to Western Europe? Let me guess no. You can correct me if you think I'm wrong.

Another point is that was Star Wars we fighting the Russians into spending more than they could afford on defense and helped broker a deal. Why then should we be paying more than our share of the defense of the NATO countries and allowing them, especially the ones in the EU, to compete with us?

Is it possible that you don't believe NATO allies should at least pay a reasonable amount for their own defense? And if not why shouldn't we treat them as mere territories?

WSS

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LOL.

that was great. LOL

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cal, if russia was germanys only source of gas u might have a point....but they're not, nor ever will be unless germany opts out of nato themselves and allies with russia.

im not buying ur stupid act on this one, i know ur smart enough to understand that the pipeline is just competition and not the eu's only source. 

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Mar 16, 2018 - The UK is firing back at Russia in retaliation for a nerve agent attack on a former ... “I'd say the bulk of Russian wealth goes through London in one way or ... The British oil giant BP has a roughly 20 percent stake in Russia's ...
 

The UK response to the Russian spy attack. Why Theresa May can't ...

money.cnn.com/2018/03/14/news/russia-uk-economy-sanctions/index.html
 
 

Mar 14, 2018 - With just a year to go before Brexit, the British economy is struggling with weak growth. ... British oil giant BP (BP) also has major ties to Russia.

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Why Britain Has to Be Really Nice to Norway and Russia - Bloomberg

Jun 20, 2017 - Rough gas site shutdown means reliance on LNG, Russian fuel. U.K. has been net importer of natural gas since 2004. SHARE THIS ARTICLE ... Qatar Petroleum said it's business as usual. If all imports were to suddenly stop, ...
 

Mar 3, 2018 - BRITAIN has had to beg Russia to bring a tanker of gas to help out after ... Britain will receive gas from Russia's oil reserves in the wake of the ...

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https://uk.reuters.com/article/uk-centrica-gas-deals/uk-gas-import-dependence-grows-with-centricas-russia-norway-deals-idUKKBN0NY1FH20150513

"Gazprom, Russia’s top natural gas producer, meets a third of EU gas needs."
 

"Gas production in Britain, which was self-sufficient at the turn of this century, has fallen nearly 70 percent since a peak in 2000. Dependence on imports leave it heavily exposed to production risks that are beyond its control. "

"The Gazprom deal give Britain a much higher exposure to Russian-sourced gas and comes despite European Union pressure to reduce the region’s dependence on Russian gas due to frosty relations with President Vladimir Putin over the conflict in Ukraine."

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Putin's gas threat: What happens if Russia cuts the gas to Europe ...

https://www.independent.co.uk › News › World › Europe
 
Feb 27, 2015 - How much do the UK and Europe rely on Russia for energy? Russia ... What proportion of Russian gas goes through Ukraine? Between 40 and ...

Mar 14, 2018 - A crackdown on Russia's UK business ties would come up against a complex ... how will BP manage an asset that provides a third of its global oil ... If the way to hurt Putin is to hurt his friends, how far is the UK prepared to go?

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1 hour ago, Clevfan4life said:

so whats stopping them from buying american gas if russia were to.decide not to sell to.them?

Besides gas Russia doesn't have all that much to offer. You can only drink so much Stolichnaya.

WSS

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28 minutes ago, Westside Steve said:

Besides gas Russia doesn't have all that much to offer. You can only drink so much Stolichnaya.

WSS

im not disagreeing. im just not getting how the nordstream pipeline gives russia some ultra control over europe. it seems to me trumps sour grapes are sour grapes delivered vicariously through him by the energy sector that thought THEY would be the ones controlling the EU energy market. The EU simply has "choices" now which. and i could be wrong here but i dont think i am, choices/options are the cornerstone of capitalism.....

 

whoa whoa whoa pump those brakes clevfan right? i mean talk about a bomb going off right? we're bringing core concepts of capitalism into this discussion now grtfo with that sht clevfan these are heavy concepts requiring weeks of deliberation!!!

 

 

🙄

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1 hour ago, Westside Steve said:

Besides gas Russia doesn't have all that much to offer. You can only drink so much Stolichnaya.

WSS

Image result for Russian drinking vodka gif

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Fox News on Trump is starting to finally "get it". When will Trumpettes finally "get it"?

 

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And another Fox News Commentary on this Fool & NATO. It's about time the real Republican conservatives have come to the front and declare this guy a traitor. Fool is really too kind a word.

 

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shep smith wants to go to cnn so he can be gay, and wear some pink clothes.

He's your hero?

blech.

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