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Supreme court sides with Colorado baker who refused to make wedding cake for same sex couple

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I never said every single belief needs to merge into one and everyone needs to agree. I'm talking about businesses refusing to provide a service, and actively discriminating against people because of their genetics. Are white people banned from African American groups if they believe in and want to support the message?

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11 hours ago, htownbrown said:

Do gay bars have the right to refuse you service if you're straight?  

 

 

no. but im not worried about alcohol dispensaries. some of u nonfunctional goofballs think this is going to begin and end with non essential services likes cakes, flowers and beer. u categorically do not undwrstand what happens with our economy in a full blown tit for tat culture war. thats why i want this sht to stop because i have a brain

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On principle, the bakery will sell most anything to gay people, gay couples.

They morally won't make a -gay- wedding cake.

The gov has no right to force services to be provided that violate their religious beliefs.

The argument that one could claim the same over color of skin is so bogus I'm

a bit surprised anyone could claim that seriously.

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Businesses should have the right to sink or swim by their own personal business practices. If people don’t like that they opted out of baking a cake for a gay couple, they can avoid that bakery and tell others to avoid giving them their cash. I bet the bakery across town who doesn’t give a crap about sexual orientation appreciated the extra business.

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2 minutes ago, LogicIsForSquares said:

Businesses should have the right to sink or swim by their own personal business practices. If people don’t like that they opted out of baking a cake for a gay couple, they can avoid that bakery and tell others to avoid giving them their cash. I bet the bakery across town who doesn’t give a crap about sexual orientation appreciated the extra business.

I bet most people don't care. And if a handful that do boycott the place or choose to vigorously supported it probably evens out. The homosexuals that Chick-fil-A lost they probably made it back up with churchgoers.

Starbucks? Well they probably have lots more people coming in and loitering so there's that...

😂

WSS

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2 minutes ago, Westside Steve said:

I bet most people don't care. And if a handful that do boycott the place or choose to vigorously supported it probably evens out. The homosexuals that Chick-fil-A lost they probably made it back up with churchgoers.

Starbucks? Well they probably have lots more people coming in and loitering so there's that...

😂

WSS

Honestly, I didn’t know a single gay person who quit eating Chic-fil-a. They weren’t as wound tight as the people who presumed they should be wound tight about the company’s position on gay marriage.

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4 minutes ago, LogicIsForSquares said:

Honestly, I didn’t know a single gay person who quit eating Chic-fil-a. They weren’t as wound tight as the people who presumed they should be wound tight about the company’s position on gay marriage.

Well that's probably true, I know a few and see them occasionally and can't remember ever bringing up the subject. Probably got more attention in the Press that it deserved.

WSS

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True - but that flips on the other side, for example, Chic-Fil-A...his business can/should thrive with all those who willgive him THEIR business, agreeing with his stance on his religious beliefs. And another baker who gets known for baking anything for anyone ,regardless, could lose the business of those who don't respect that.

The problem is the left. They force fake issues, they have liberal lawyer groups who love to make money, and the bakery in Oregon got hammered with a leftwing liberal judge polical fine.

http://www.foxnews.com/opinion/2015/04/26/bakers-face-135000-fine-for-refusing-to-make-cake-for-gay-wedding.html

yeah, make the bakery pay 135,000 bucks over a cake? When SCOTUS ruled IN FAVOR of the bakery in Colorado?

The judge in Oregon should be disbarred.

It's another way of winning the lottery, like flopping on the floor in the NBA to get a foul called.

Manipulating the system.

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1 hour ago, Clevfan4life said:

no. but im not worried about alcohol dispensaries. some of u nonfunctional goofballs think this is going to begin and end with non essential services likes cakes, flowers and beer. u categorically do not undwrstand what happens with our economy in a full blown tit for tat culture war. thats why i want this sht to stop because i have a brain

 

Nonfunctional goofballs.....that's great.  So what industry is suffering from "full blown culture war"?  How does simply choosing what you think is best for your small business, bad for the economy?  Franchises have their own established regulations that are predominately profit oriented and nondiscriminatory, so no need to include them.  I wouldn't have refused service to the gay couple, but I didn't invest in the business, you didn't invest in the business, and neither did the government.  So why does our opinion take precedent over the actual owners stupid decision?  They are the people who actually have something to lose.  Public utilities I would perfectly understand your point, but beyond that you don't have one.  If you had to guess, what percentage of the population do you think are racist homophobic?  And then what percent of that do you think are business owners?  If you think the only thing keeping businessmen from being discriminatory against all kinds is government, than I don't think you understand business to the capacity you claim.

 

Btw the doorman/bouncer gets paid to discriminate at almost every establishment the position is required.

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15 minutes ago, calfoxwc said:

True - but that flips on the other side, for example, Chic-Fil-A...his business can/should thrive with all those who willgive him THEIR business, agreeing with his stance on his religious beliefs. And another baker who gets known for baking anything for anyone ,regardless, could lose the business of those who don't respect that.

And that is the free market. It cuts both ways.

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1 hour ago, htownbrown said:

  If you think the only thing keeping businessmen from being discriminatory against all kinds is government, than I don't think you understand business to the capacity you claim.

 

 

somebody didn't pay enough attention in history class. We've been through all this before. Evidently the lessons never catch. 

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You do know businesses put pressure on the federal government to end segregation right?  You know, boycotts.

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2 hours ago, htownbrown said:

You do know businesses put pressure on the federal government to end segregation right?  You know, boycotts.

larger companies yes. they have far more to lose. local business's were essentially determining the local demographics and all the ills that entailed, old hat here. 

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They all were following the law of the land sent down by the government.  I'm as sure as you are there were some racist business owners in the 50's and 60's, but by and large you won't be in business long with that kind of model.  I can't see, in today's market, how you could get past social media operating like that.  It would literally kill you.

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2 hours ago, htownbrown said:

  I can't see, in today's market, how you could get past social media operating like that.  It would literally kill you.

in urban areas sure, 100% in agreement. 

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If a Christian baker could refuse to make something for a gay wedding, could a Christian also refuse service to Atheists, Muslims, etc?

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11 minutes ago, MLD Woody said:

If a Christian baker could refuse to make something for a gay wedding, could a Christian also refuse service to Atheists, Muslims, etc?

but of course. as long as it doesnt run the other way. the falafels will not be witheld

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On what grounds?  Set the parameters.  I doubt anyone would ask or care about your athiesm if you wanted to buy a birthday cake.  If you're asking them to do something offensive to their beliefs, I'm sure they'll refuse.  It's common sense.

I'm sure it would be no problem if a Jewish guy walked in, requested a kosher cake, and was told "No, we don't do that".  Happens everyday in this country I'm sure.  Are we going to force the baker to get halal certified now so Muslims don't have to be "treated" like the Jews? 

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6 hours ago, MLD Woody said:

If a Christian baker could refuse to make something for a gay wedding, could a Christian also refuse service to Atheists, Muslims, etc?

Could a Jewish or Muslim restaurant refuse to serve me bacon or ham?

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26 minutes ago, Canton Dawg said:

Could a Jewish or Muslim restaurant refuse to serve me bacon or ham?

I imagine they just wouldn't offer it. A Mexican restaurant would probably "refuse" to serve me a gryo too. 

But that didn't really answer my question. 

 

If you say that anyone can refuse to offer goods and services to anyone for any reason, then it's covered. Because you took it to an extreme.

If you are trying to play the freedom of religion card, you can skew that in a lot of ways. 

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5 hours ago, htownbrown said:

On what grounds?  Set the parameters.  I doubt anyone would ask or care about your athiesm if you wanted to buy a birthday cake.  If you're asking them to do something offensive to their beliefs, I'm sure they'll refuse.  It's common sense.

I'm sure it would be no problem if a Jewish guy walked in, requested a kosher cake, and was told "No, we don't do that".  Happens everyday in this country I'm sure.  Are we going to force the baker to get halal certified now so Muslims don't have to be "treated" like the Jews? 

Could Christian contractors refuse to work on the construction of a mosque? 

Could a Muslim in charge of a broadcast station refuse to show any media about Christianity?

 

I'm not talking hypotheticals where it's like "the Muslim wants a cake that says Shmuck jesus, can the Christian baker refuse?" Nothing that obviously hyperbolic. Or as obvious of a case where the baker can refuse to make the cake, regardless of this while conversation

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3 minutes ago, MLD Woody said:

Could Christian contractors refuse to work on the construction of a mosque? 

Could a Muslim in charge of a broadcast station refuse to show any media about Christianity?

 

I'm not talking hypotheticals where it's like "the Muslim wants a cake that says Shmuck jesus, can the Christian baker refuse?" Nothing that obviously hyperbolic. Or as obvious of a case where the baker can refuse to make the cake, regardless of this while conversation

Could a Mexican construction worker refuse to work on the border wall?

WSS

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Those two freaks wanted something disgusting put on the cake which he refused.  The Supreme Court agrees.  End of story.  MAGA.

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45 minutes ago, Westside Steve said:

Could a Mexican construction worker refuse to work on the border wall?

WSS

Can my questions get answered first? Good to see where others stand. 

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1 hour ago, MLD Woody said:

Could Christian contractors refuse to work on the construction of a mosque? 

Yes. Furthermore in Las Vegas where it's legal I'm assuming a Christian Construction firm could refused to build a house of ill repute.

Could a Muslim in charge of a broadcast station refuse to show any media about Christianity?

Yes if I'm not mistaken Al Jazeera is free to broadcast what they want. Also I seem to recall major networks refusing to are particular episodes of shows for some sort of moralistic reason oh, I just can't remember exactly what they were.

I'm not talking hypotheticals where it's like "the Muslim wants a cake that says Shmuck jesus, can the Christian baker refuse?" Nothing that obviously hyperbolic. Or as obvious of a case where the baker can refuse to make the cake, regardless of this while conversation

 so there are your answers. So how about the Ku Klux Klan or NAMBLA or the Nazi party, should people who are morally opposed to those organizations be forced to cater their affairs?

WSS

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So that's on the ownership level. What about a Muslim that works for the broadcasting station. Can they refuse to help produce Christian media but still keep their job?

 

For yours: No. And for the Mexican construction worker: He is in his right to refuse, but he has no protections if he is fired. 

Your examples are all ideologies. Opinions. I'm talking more about genetic traits you can't change. (And then also religion, because it's grouped in there)

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31 minutes ago, MLD Woody said:

So that's on the ownership level. What about a Muslim that works for the broadcasting station. Can they refuse to help produce Christian media but still keep their job?

 

For yours: No. And for the Mexican construction worker: He is in his right to refuse, but he has no protections if he is fired. 

Your examples are all ideologies. Opinions. I'm talking more about genetic traits you can't change. (And then also religion, because it's grouped in there)

No you are not you ask me about Muslims and Christians.

And of course we're talking about the ownership level. If an employee at the Christian Bakery refused to make the cake the owners can decide whether or not to fire the person. Same as the Muslim Network or the construction company. Problem is people care more about being assholes than anything else. Like that damn in Kentucky that wouldn't issue the marriage license. Everybody wanted to cause a stink rather than just say okay go to the other office and have the other chick do it. But I figure she can't do what you supposed to do they can fire her.

WSS

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3 hours ago, MLD Woody said:

If you are trying to play the freedom of religion card, you can skew that in a lot of ways. 

Freedom of religion isn't a "card", its a first Amendment right.

I think that's what you fail to grasp.

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54 minutes ago, Canton Dawg said:

Freedom of religion isn't a "card", its a first Amendment right.

I think that's what you fail to grasp.

No, I understand it completely. But I'll keep that line in mind when I hear someone mention the race card. 

I'm including religion with the genetic traits. I mean, it's got a generic basis to it too...so...

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