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Jonathan Paul Manziel

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5 hours ago, The Gipper said:

And at whatever mimimalist salary they would give him.

Not really so minimalist, well for us working stiffs, JM had two years in so I believe it's a somewhat livable payday for him.

Each year the NFL minimum salaries increase by $15,000, up to $465,000 for a rookie in 2017. A player’s minimum salary is determined by his years of experience (YOE), ranging from 0 to 10 or more. The chart below shows the minimum (P5) salaries a team can contract a player to based on Years of Experience (credited seasons).

 

Yrs. 2017 2018 2019
0 $465,000 $480,000 $495,000
1 $540,000 $555,000 $570,000
2 $615,000 $630,000 $645,000
3 $690,000 $705,000 $720,000
4-6 $775,000 $790,000 $805,000
7-9 $900,000 $915,000 $930,000
10+ $1,000,000 $1,015,000 $1,030,000

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1 hour ago, The Cysko Kid said:

He'll be the face of the XFL in 2020 

You may well be right!

Mike

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4 hours ago, jrb12711 said:

Yes, there are corrupt doctors. But you know what? There's corrupt everyone, everywhere. By the logic you're using we should never trust anyone, anytime who can be influenced at face value. Also, did you not watch the Manziel trainwreck? Is it really that hard to believe he had a diagnosed mental illness based on the dozens of examples on and off the field?

So every drunk Shmucked up rich brat must have a mental illness?

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8 hours ago, LogicIsForSquares said:

So every drunk Shmucked up rich brat must have a mental illness?

Of course.

Remember the kid that got off because he had a case of "affluenza"? Basically the argument was made that he was brought up too rich, too spoiled to know wrong from right?

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That S.OB. again? I still hope he chokes to death on a tequila worm for what he INTENTIONALLY did to my football team. Screw that punk!

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9 hours ago, LogicIsForSquares said:

So every drunk Shmucked up rich brat must have a mental illness?

Nope-but these are honest words of painful insight,  "and you wake up the next day and that's all gone and that liquid courage or that liquid like sense of euphoria that's over you is all gone, and you're left staring at the ceiling by yourself, and you're back in that depression and back in that hole, that dark hole of sitting in a room by yourself being super-depressed, thinking about all the mistakes you've made in your life, what did that get me? Where did that get me except out of the NFL? Where did that get me? Disgraced?"

As a former counselor those thoughts are music to the ears because it often takes years for some people to say something like that. It's a great starting place for real permanent change.

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I always think I'm bipolar too. 

Every fall I get massively depressed.... but it really only happens on Sundays. Doctors are baffled. 

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9 hours ago, LogicIsForSquares said:

So every drunk Shmucked up rich brat must have a mental illness?

No, but maybe a dude using a terrible disguise to gamble/drink despite his whole career being on the line has some more issues than on the surface?

We get it, you don't like rich people and Manziel was a douche, I'm not arguing with you. But come on man, the say flatly that someone who is struggling with mental illness is simply getting a "luxury diagnosis" is absurd. Manziel will never set foot in the NFL again, so what is there to gain? To share the intimate details of his life on national television in order to maybe play in the CFL? Get over yourself.

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5 hours ago, hx214 said:

I always think I'm bipolar too. 

Every fall I get massively depressed.... but it really only happens on Sundays. Doctors are baffled. 

Try lithium carbonate. If that doesn't work try my elixir of 1 part N of the equator (Venezuela) Diplomatico Reserva Exclusiva 12 y.o. and 1 part S of the equator (Peru) Ron Cartavio XO 18 y.o.. At the end of the day you will be happy no matter what happens on Sunday.:P

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14 hours ago, jrb12711 said:

Yes, there are corrupt doctors. But you know what? There's corrupt everyone, everywhere. By the logic you're using we should never trust anyone, anytime who can be influenced at face value. Also, did you not watch the Manziel trainwreck? Is it really that hard to believe he had a diagnosed mental illness based on the dozens of examples on and off the field?

While watching the Manziel trainwreck, I found it really easy to believe that I was looking at a spoiled rich kid who was never held accountable for his behavior. Because he was really good at sports. I find it easy to lump his sudden "I'm getting help and I'm bipolar" announcement with countless celebrities who fuk up and announce they're checking into rehab or people who find themselves in jail and announce they've found Jesus.

Sorry, but the Manziel trainwreck showed me that J was really, really, really good at looking people in the eye with an earnest, sincere expression on his face, and telling them what they wanted to hear: "I've really changed this time; I'm going to act mature now. It's all going to be different." Watched that shite for two years.

Hey, maybe he really has changed. I'll believe it when I see it. 

Thus concludes today's episode of 'Cynicism Today'. 

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29 minutes ago, jrb12711 said:

 

We get it, you don't like rich people and Manziel was a douche, I'm not arguing with you. But come on man, the say flatly that someone who is struggling with mental illness is simply getting a "luxury diagnosis" is absurd. Manziel will never set foot in the NFL again, so what is there to gain? To share the intimate details of his life on national television in order to maybe play in the CFL? Get over yourself.

Yes because one dude acted like a brat, I must dislike all rich people? Haha Starting to think this must have really hit close to home.

Getting right with the public seems to be important to Manziel so don’t think for a second that this guy is out preaching the gospel on mental illness. If he plays his cards right, Manziel will get a try out with some teams. Pulling out the excuses for his behavior is a good start.

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1 hour ago, Dutch Oven said:

Of course.

Remember the kid that got off because he had a case of "affluenza"? Basically the argument was made that he was brought up too rich, too spoiled to know wrong from right?

Yeah I remember that. Johnny was the master of making excuses and lying directly to people. But somehow everyone is supposed to believe this horse sh-it.

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The best thing Johnny can do is hit the road telling his story so others dont follow in his footsteps. 

 

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13 hours ago, jcam222 said:

I think you are likely right it tends to be over diagonosed. Having said that for those where the diagnosis is valid it's a crippling disease. I've seen it literally suck the life out of two different beautiful vibrant human beings. Both self medicated like crazy and neither have stayed on their meds long term. The manic phase of the disease itself can be quite addictive. So much so they give up the meds and take the lows just to get the manic phase as well. 

I know what you mean, and I too have seen the awful effects of mental illness and addiction. As many of you know, I actually work in the that industry as the Assistant Director of a non-profit who assists homeless military veterans in getting homes, benefits, and things like jobs and training. It's incredible work but I see the ugliness of addiction and mental illness every day. Men that were strong and skilled at one time, reduced to shadows of their glory. 

In obviously very sympathetic to people struggling with these issues, and it's the reason why I've always been so supportive of Josh Gordon. I think we always knew something was very wrong with Johnny, and this revelation shocks nobody. His condition is extremely treatable, and you just would've liked it diagnosed earlier so the downward spiral wouldn't have taken so much from him. 

Does he still have a chance to play? Actually, yes he does. The reason he does is because there's a REASON he acted the way he did. If it was a situation where he was just a complete jerk for the sake of being an arrogant jerk, that's one thing. But if seeing a therapist, taking medication, and living a clean life can mitigate his negative symptoms, he may find a sympathetic team willing to give him a workout. Obviously the odds are stacked against him, but I'm still rooting for him because I've seen enough devastation caused by mental illness, and I believe Johnny could go from a complete bust to possibly a positive influence for the millions of people fighting their own private wars. 

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49 minutes ago, LogicIsForSquares said:

Yes because one dude acted like a brat, I must dislike all rich people? Haha Starting to think this must have really hit close to home.

Getting right with the public seems to be important to Manziel so don’t think for a second that this guy is out preaching the gospel on mental illness. If he plays his cards right, Manziel will get a try out with some teams. Pulling out the excuses for his behavior is a good start.

It's not hitting a nerve, just stop. The "nerve" it's hitting is that dismissing mental illness out of hand because of someone's past experience is an a-hole move by you. The way you're acting is the reason millions of people in the country are afraid to seek help in the first place.  

I'd bet you 100 dollars Manziel never sees even a preseason snap in the NFL. He knows that, and if you had common sense you would too.

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Do you think the heisman voters are being more careful with their votes?

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13 hours ago, jcam222 said:

I respect your opinion but you and I are polar opposites regarding rehab. Rehab and 12 step based follow up was very effective for me. It saved my life no question. I've been sober for 28 years and counting God willing. I do agree with your father in that no one "quits" if they aren't ready. 

Congrats!  And being a browns fan and the ability to stay sober shows incredible intestinal fortitude!

I myself am not a drinker at all,  but the browns make me want to start.

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14 hours ago, mjp28 said:

Not really so minimalist, well for us working stiffs, JM had two years in so I believe it's a somewhat livable payday for him.

Each year the NFL minimum salaries increase by $15,000, up to $465,000 for a rookie in 2017. A player’s minimum salary is determined by his years of experience (YOE), ranging from 0 to 10 or more. The chart below shows the minimum (P5) salaries a team can contract a player to based on Years of Experience (credited seasons).

 

Yrs. 2017 2018 2019
0 $465,000 $480,000 $495,000
1 $540,000 $555,000 $570,000
2 $615,000 $630,000 $645,000
3 $690,000 $705,000 $720,000
4-6 $775,000 $790,000 $805,000
7-9 $900,000 $915,000 $930,000
10+ $1,000,000 $1,015,000 $1,030,000

Uhnn......I am talking about the minimal salary he would be playing in the CFL.    That is what he needs to take.  He ain't coming close to getting any kind of a gig in the NFL  with the money that comes with it until he proves 2 things:

A. He has his personal Sheet together......and any NFL team will want him to have had that Sheet together for a couple of years:

B. That he can actually play football a bit.    And Canada ....or I guess maybe the Arena League...for now (yes...until XFL comes around) is the only place he can prove that.  

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2 hours ago, Kvoethe said:

Do you think the heisman voters are being more careful with their votes?

No, why?

Johnny deserved the Heisman.

Zombo

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2 hours ago, The Gipper said:

Uhnn......I am talking about the minimal salary he would be playing in the CFL.    That is what he needs to take.  He ain't coming close to getting any kind of a gig in the NFL  with the money that comes with it until he proves 2 things:

A. He has his personal Sheet together......and any NFL team will want him to have had that Sheet together for a couple of years:

B. That he can actually play football a bit.    And Canada ....or I guess maybe the Arena League...for now (yes...until XFL comes around) is the only place he can prove that.  

Oh I wasn't sure what they you meant....CFL is real minor league compared to the GREAT AMERICAN GAME! (I still think NFL QBs are way overpriced.)

Like everyone else they all want to be "Coming to America" to make the real money. 

....OH I JUST ACCIDENTALLY RAN INTO THIS, just FYI......

The Australian Football League has implemented a salary cap on its clubs since 1987, when Brisbane and West Coast were admitted, as part of its equalization policy designed to neutralize the ability of the richest and most successful clubs, Carlton, Collingwood, Essendon and Hawthorn, to perennially dominate the competition......

........The AFL Players Association negotiates for players with the AFL on the topic of average salary. In June 2017, the AFL and AFL Players Association agreed to a new CBA deal which resulted in a 20% increase in players salary. The six-year deal, which begins in 2017 and ends in 2022 means that the average player wage rises from $309,000 to $371,000 and the player salary cap from $10.37m to $12.45m. In 2022, the final year of the agreement, the average player wage will be $389,000 with a salary cap of $13.54m.......... :o

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Arena football salaries and life, GOOD READ.......

https://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2014/jul/22/arena-football-league-dreams-following-jay-grudens/

.....Before the league was reset in 2010, salaries were competitive. The league minimum for players was $31,000, though six-figure contracts weren’t uncommon, pushing the average salary near $80,000.

Now, under a single-entity model where players sign contracts with the league, they make $830 a game — $775 for rookies, with quarterbacks earning an extra $250 per start. To offset the meager salaries, players are given three meals a day and have the option of renting an apartment provided by the team, and often arranged by the coach, for $600 per month.

About half of the players on the Soul supplement their income with a second job, while all but two or three have assistance with housing. Around the league, players have been known to work as bouncers at nightclubs or personal trainers at local

gyms.......CONTINUED IN LINK. .........

“I really think it kind of weeds out who’s serious and who’s not,” said Siaha Burley, the offensive coordinator of the Orlando Predators and a former player from 2001 through 2010. “I think if you look at the people who have been around Arena Football for a while, they’ve made some major, major sacrifices to align their lifestyle to be able to handle its ups and downs.

“When you have a family or a wife or what have you, usually, you’re calling for some sort of stability. That’s kind of the American dream. Those who stick around here … they’ve really bought into the game and their job of coaching, and they’re willing to take that chance and whatever opportunities come from it.”..........CONTINUED IN LINK.......

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1 hour ago, mjp28 said:

Oh I wasn't sure what they you meant....CFL is real minor league compared to the GREAT AMERICAN GAME! (I still think NFL QBs are way overpriced.)

Like everyone else they all want to be "Coming to America" to make the real money. 

....OH I JUST ACCIDENTALLY RAN INTO THIS, just FYI......

The Australian Football League has implemented a salary cap on its clubs since 1987, when Brisbane and West Coast were admitted, as part of its equalization policy designed to neutralize the ability of the richest and most successful clubs, Carlton, Collingwood, Essendon and Hawthorn, to perennially dominate the competition......

........The AFL Players Association negotiates for players with the AFL on the topic of average salary. In June 2017, the AFL and AFL Players Association agreed to a new CBA deal which resulted in a 20% increase in players salary. The six-year deal, which begins in 2017 and ends in 2022 means that the average player wage rises from $309,000 to $371,000 and the player salary cap from $10.37m to $12.45m. In 2022, the final year of the agreement, the average player wage will be $389,000 with a salary cap of $13.54m.......... :o

I don't think they have Quarterbacks in Australian Rules football, do they?    It is more akin to Rugby.

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19 hours ago, mjp28 said:

Not really so minimalist, well for us working stiffs, JM had two years in so I believe it's a somewhat livable payday for him.

Each year the NFL minimum salaries increase by $15,000, up to $465,000 for a rookie in 2017. A player’s minimum salary is determined by his years of experience (YOE), ranging from 0 to 10 or more. The chart below shows the minimum (P5) salaries a team can contract a player to based on Years of Experience (credited seasons).

 

Yrs. 2017 2018 2019
0 $465,000 $480,000 $495,000
1 $540,000 $555,000 $570,000
2 $615,000 $630,000 $645,000
3 $690,000 $705,000 $720,000
4-6 $775,000 $790,000 $805,000
7-9 $900,000 $915,000 $930,000
10+ $1,000,000 $1,015,000 $1,030,000

Though Gip hit on this- Current salaries are nice- it's probable Manziel already blew through most- if not all of the money he made with the Browns living high off the hog...  Though looking at his contract, I don't think most of us peons could have blown through his rookie $6.7 million guaranteed in a couple of years.... 

Should Johnny even sniff a tryout with an NFL team, you can bet none of that money is going to be guaranteed, and contingent on making the roster. If he got offered $500k to play in the CFL that's not that far off $700k in the NFL. 

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7 hours ago, LogicIsForSquares said:

Yeah I remember that. Johnny was the master of making excuses and lying directly to people. But somehow everyone is supposed to believe this horse sh-it.

Addicts are really great at lying and making excuses for their behavior... you should know that.  

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2 minutes ago, hoorta said:

Though Gip hit on this- Current salaries are nice- it's probable Manziel already blew through most- if not all of the money he made with the Browns living high off the hog...  Though looking at his contract, I don't think most of us peons could have blown through his rookie $6.7 million guaranteed in a couple of years.... 

Should Johnny even sniff a tryout with an NFL team, you can bet none of that money is going to be guaranteed, and contingent on making the roster. If he got offered $500k to play in the CFL that's not that far off $700k in the NFL. 

He never got close to being offered that kind of money...but that is what his agent said he wanted.

The entire team has about a 5.2 mill salary cap:

The last round of CBA negotiations concluded in June of 2014, a deal that included a bump in the salary cap from $4.4-million to $5-million. The cap has gone up $50,000 in each subsequent year, peaking at $5.2-millon next season.

The Minimum salary is:

The league’s minimum salary was raised from $45,000 to just $50,000 in 2014 with a further increase of $1,000 in each subsequent year, reaching $54,000 next season.

If you are a proven elite QB....you may get something close to what JMZ wants:

The going rate for a starting-calibre CFL quarterback is $400,000, with some players — Hamilton’s Zach Collaros and Edmonton’s Mike Reilly, for instance — surpassing the $500,000 mark. Elite Canadians also tend to make north of $200,000, including Hamilton’s Ted Laurent and Toronto’s Chris Van Zeyl.

But, obviously JMZ is by no means proven to be elite.    Maybe he can get approaching the 200K he wants....but not the 500K.

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17 minutes ago, hoorta said:

Addicts are really great at lying and making excuses for their behavior... you should know that.  

No doubt the kid was a drunk. That doesn’t mean he had some mental illness excuse.

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10 minutes ago, The Gipper said:

He never got close to being offered that kind of money...but that is what his agent said he wanted.

The entire team has about a 5.2 mill salary cap:

The last round of CBA negotiations concluded in June of 2014, a deal that included a bump in the salary cap from $4.4-million to $5-million. The cap has gone up $50,000 in each subsequent year, peaking at $5.2-millon next season.

The Minimum salary is:

The league’s minimum salary was raised from $45,000 to just $50,000 in 2014 with a further increase of $1,000 in each subsequent year, reaching $54,000 next season.

If you are a proven elite QB....you may get something close to what JMZ wants:

The going rate for a starting-calibre CFL quarterback is $400,000, with some players — Hamilton’s Zach Collaros and Edmonton’s Mike Reilly, for instance — surpassing the $500,000 mark. Elite Canadians also tend to make north of $200,000, including Hamilton’s Ted Laurent and Toronto’s Chris Van Zeyl.

But, obviously JMZ is by no means proven to be elite.    Maybe he can get approaching the 200K he wants....but not the 500K.

:) thanks, was wondering. Johnny's agent apparently wanted top CFL qb money right out of the gate... But mucking (Googling) around, seems that salary cap is sort of flexible...  maybe that's not the case anymore. The Argonauts paid Rajib Ismail $4 million in 2006. 

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hated the pick when the Browns drafted him and felt bad for Pettine and Hoyer who got saddled with him. However, I do hope that Johnny makes a turnaround and is able to play football again.  I'm more angry at the Browns FO for drafting him with his known problems than angry at JFF for being JFF and don't hold a grudge against him, would be nice if he got his life back on track.  Can't say the same for Ray Farmer, huge grudge there for setting the Browns back another few rebuilding years.

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