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The Gipper

A Cautionary Note

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I reproduce this from the College Football Forum:

Some of the best pro QBs ever were not necessarily the cream of the crop when it came to their college careers.  Brady....had to fight for a starting job his whole time at Mich.  Brees...went to Purdue....where they likely won nothing.  Ben R.  Good in college, likely underrecruited. 

Favre, Marino, the Mannings....Rivers, etc.   Not great success per se in College.

And, FYI,  here is the list of QBs who have won the national championships since 2000:

Josh Heupel   Okla

Ken Dorsey  Miami

Craig Krenzel  Ohio St.

Matt Mauck  LSU

Matt Leinert  USC

Vince Young  Texas

Chris Leak  Florida

Matt Flynn  LSU

Tim Tebow Florida

Greg McElroy  Alabama

Cam Newton   Auburn

AJ McCarron  Alabama

Jameis Winston  FSU

Cardale Jones OSU

Jake Coker  Ala.

DeShaun Watson   Clemson

Jalen Hurt  Ala.

Only  one single proven quality NFL starter there.  Newton.  Others, like Winston and Watson still have the book out on them.  A couple were thought to be strong pro QB candidates, but flamed out:  Young, Leinert.  One became a decent backup QB at best:  Flynn.  

So, I think I can say this with some confidence:  total success in the college game does not really translate into success in the NFL.   And vice versa....QBs have to be good....but their NFL prowess may have little with how they ...or their team, did in college.

So...what does this mean for us Browns fans?   College success does by no means assure Pro success....and vice versa.  A good pro QB may not have played on the great college teams...they rarely have.

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An Alabama QB just needs to know not to put his jock strap on backwards because the team is so good. Saban is god.

Tebow was on a pretty good team with a good HC.

USC Carroll was a good HC.

Seems to me that in college a great HC is more important than a great QB.

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13 minutes ago, boo fagley said:

An Alabama QB just needs to know not to put his jock strap on backwards because the team is so good. Saban is god.

Tebow was on a pretty good team with a good HC.

USC Carroll was a good HC.

Seems to me that in college a great HC is more important than a great QB.

A very fair statement.  The stars of these teams are the coaches.   Saban, Carroll, Urban Meyer,   Tressel, Stoops,  Les Miles,  etc.

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A Heisman Trophy losing QB in Ncaa title games is 10 years overdue to winning in NFL? Before the BCS in 2014.(which M.Mariota nor D.Watson won Heisman) .1)FSU-Chris Weinke lost title game in 2000. 2)USC-Matt Leinart won but title was vacated from 04. 3)OSU-Troy Smith lost in 06. 5)Oka.-Sam Bradford lost in 08. 6)Aub.-Cam Newton won in 2010. 7)FSU-Jameis Winston won in 2013..B.Mayfield follows his last Oklahoma Title losing QB from 10 years ago...Cautionary Note Gip,I got no idea what any of this means :)..(can we get at least Bradford QB play in Da Land?)

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Big difference between having great stats and winning a championship. 

Mayfield is another example. 

 

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1 hour ago, boo fagley said:

 

USC Carroll was a good HC.

 

He's a total scumbag, but yeah he could coach. 

While I've never cared for USC, when he bailed to Seattle is one of the most slimiest things in sports history.

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1 hour ago, gumby73 said:

A Heisman Trophy losing QB in Ncaa title games is 10 years overdue to winning in NFL? Before the BCS in 2014.(which M.Mariota nor D.Watson won Heisman) .1)FSU-Chris Weinke lost title game in 2000. 2)USC-Matt Leinart won but title was vacated from 04. 3)OSU-Troy Smith lost in 06. 5)Oka.-Sam Bradford lost in 08. 6)Aub.-Cam Newton won in 2010. 7)FSU-Jameis Winston won in 2013..B.Mayfield follows his last Oklahoma Title losing QB from 10 years ago...Cautionary Note Gip,I got no idea what any of this means :)..(can we get at least Bradford QB play in Da Land?)

It simply meant that  NCAA Championship QBs often do not perform well in the Pros.    (Heisman winner was not a factor above)

I guess I would have to go back and look at the QBs on the losing side of the College Football Championship game...be that BCS or CFP...to see how those QBs did.   Though you covered some of it there. 

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2 hours ago, The Gipper said:

A very fair statement.  The stars of these teams are the coaches.   Saban, Carroll, Urban Meyer,   Tressel, Stoops,  Les Miles,  etc.

Don't forget Dabo Swinney of Clemson.

Mike 

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Just FYI.....generally...the losing QBs of the BCS and  National Championship games since 2000....have been no great shakes when it comes to the pro ranks either.   Here is that list:

1998  FSU  Chris Weinke

1999 Va. Tech Michael Vick

2000 FSU  Weinke

2001  Nebraska  Eric Crouch

2002 Miami Fla.   Ken Dorsey

2003 Oklahoma Jason White

2004 Oklahoma  Jason White

2005 USC  Matt Leinert

2006 Ohio State  Troy Smith

2007 Ohio State  Todd Boeckman

2008  Oklahoma  Sam Bradford

2009 Texas  Colt McCoy

2010 Oregon  Darren Thomas

2011 LSU  Jordan Jefferson

2012 Notre Dame  Tommy Rees

2013 Auburn  Nick Marshall

2014  Oregon Marcus Mariota

2015 Clemson DeShaun Watson

2016  Alabama  Jalen Hurts

2017 Georgia   Jake Fromm

Very few of these had stellar Pro careers.   Vick being the best probably.  Mariota doing pretty good. Bradford...spotty.  McCoy....career backup really.  Watson may be good.

Not sure if this group is any better or not than the QBs who won the title.

Newton the class of them all.

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2 minutes ago, Canton Mike said:

Don't forget Dabo Swinney of Clemson.

Mike 

Yes, Check.

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3 hours ago, Bob806 said:

He's a total scumbag, but yeah he could coach. 

While I've never cared for USC, when he bailed to Seattle is one of the most slimiest things in sports history.

Saban left LSU for the Dolphins and then Alabama.

Meyer is always looking for his next job. If the Devil could win a National Championship he would have his choice of jobs.

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Agree to a point, but remember Carroll left because of the sanctions imposed by the NCAA.

Meyer will retire a Buckeye. 

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13 hours ago, boo fagley said:

Saban left LSU for the Dolphins and then Alabama.

Meyer is always looking for his next job. If the Devil could win a National Championship he would have his choice of jobs.

Meyer was always looking for only one job:   the one he has now.

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4 minutes ago, The Gipper said:

Meyer was always looking for only one job:   the one he has now.

If the NFL came calling with the right team and money he would be gone.

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12 hours ago, Bob806 said:

Agree to a point, but remember Carroll left because of the sanctions imposed by the NCAA.

Meyer will retire a Buckeye. 

A very successful winning coach and wealthy BUCKEYE.  :D

Big time NCAA football....hey it's a money game.

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23 minutes ago, boo fagley said:

If the NFL came calling with the right team and money he would be gone.

I don't know about that.   The major colleges, I believe, actually pay their coaches more than the NFL does.  So...it would not be about the money.  It would be more about the challenge.   I think he feels he still has challenges ahead of him at OSU/college.  Unlike Saban. 

This is the thing about Saban......he must either be so totally content at Alabama....or convinced that he is either too old.....or convinced that he would suffer defeat and humiliation at the NFL level....again...that he does not want to take another NFL job.    He certainly has nothing else whatsoever to prove at the college level.  He proved that with good coaching and the right mix of HGH that you can dominate the college game. Maybe it is that latter factor that keeps him where he is.

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The major schools and their assistant coaches are well paid now.

http://sports.usatoday.com/ncaa/salaries/

 

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1 hour ago, The Gipper said:

I don't know about that.   The major colleges, I believe, actually pay their coaches more than the NFL does.  So...it would not be about the money.  It would be more about the challenge.   I think he feels he still has challenges ahead of him at OSU/college.  Unlike Saban. 

This is the thing about Saban......he must either be so totally content at Alabama....or convinced that he is either too old.....or convinced that he would suffer defeat and humiliation at the NFL level....again...that he does not want to take another NFL job.    He certainly has nothing else whatsoever to prove at the college level.  He proved that with good coaching and the right mix of HGH that you can dominate the college game. Maybe it is that latter factor that keeps him where he is.

It also helps that 5***** players are tripping over one another just to start on his teams. They usually spend most of their first two years getting to Saban's standards. It's a reload every year. Always a top 5 class or better yearly.

EDIT: QB was recently an exception to that when he switched to dual threat QBs after JM gave him so much trouble the two years he played them. Saban quit bitching about it and adapted it for his own use.

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