Bigalow80 Posted March 28, 2018 Report Share Posted March 28, 2018 8 minutes ago, domcucch1994 said: DIdn't we trade down and pass on Carson Wentz? The difference is the Browns are not bypassing their qb this time around. They still get the qb they want. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
domcucch1994 Posted March 28, 2018 Report Share Posted March 28, 2018 1 minute ago, Bigalow80 said: The difference is the Browns are not bypassing their qb this time around. They still get the qb they want. Nonsense.. Stay at 1 and TAKE THE GUY! Don't wait and hope some team drafts a different QB. Darnold is the guy, take him #1. It's not that hard of a concept.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mjp28 Posted March 28, 2018 Report Share Posted March 28, 2018 2 hours ago, Bigalow80 said: The difference is the Browns are not bypassing their qb this time around. They still get the qb they want. And they want quality they already have quantity and were the youngest team in the NFL. Trade down is just a dumb idea. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jiggins7919 Posted March 28, 2018 Report Share Posted March 28, 2018 3 hours ago, Bigalow80 said: Good point to the "distance" of trading down. However, there is a caveat to trading down. The question is, "what are you trading down for?" The reason I think this is important is because of how the browns board maybe stacked and trading down does not always just mean draft picks. Fans don't want the browns to acquire more draft picks, they want tangible ready to compete players. This is the adversity to trading down. Analyzing who is on the board when you pick is most important and this is what makes a great GM. Chubb is far and away the best DE in this draft. Fitzpatrick is very good and multi-dimensional but the next few CB's are not nearly as far back as the other DE's in the draft compared to Chubb. The same goes for Barkley. This is why "what" you are trading down for becomes the most important. Let's take the Bills scenario. I have said this in a few boards but if the bills offered #12, 22, 53, 56 and Tre'Davious White for #4, I jump on that in a second if I'm the browns. Why? 1.) The bills are going up for a qb, meaning that at least 4 out of the first 5 picks are going to be qb's pushing very good talent down the board. 2.) Adding White gives the browns a proven, elite player and perhaps one of the best up and coming secondary's in the nfl with all kinds of flexibility 3.) The browns now have 5 second round picks which is important for the next point 4.) They now have even more ammo to move up from #12 or #22 to get the guys they want. With all of the qb's going early, Barkley, Chubb, Nelson, etc are going to be sliding down the board. I bet if Cleveland called the Colts and said we will give you 2 more second round picks for #6, they still get Chubb. Now they have added another first round pick, White, and got the player they were probably targeting at #4. Once again, there are a lot of "If this happens then..." in this scenario and a lot of things need to go correctly for this work. But it is very plausible. In addition, IF the browns Love them some Allen and the jets really really want Darnold, I think it would be wise for the Browns to trade #1 for #3 and Leonard Williams. No draft picks involved. The browns could then take Allen at #3 and Chubb at #4 or even make the trade above. They have created one of the best DL in the NFL. Now, this does not have to happen right as the first pick comes out either. If both teams want to make sure they get "their guy" the Browns can wait until the Jets are on the clock to ensure they get Allen and then make the deal (see Eli Manning deal). If Allen goes 2, then they hold onto Darnold and they have a very good qb whom they feel is just as good. (Yes, I understand there is a sense that the browns would be "settling" but if the reports of them being basically equal in their eyes, this theory works). Trading down is not wrong. It's how you manipulate the draft from there. The browns need proven players which is what they are doing in FA, but they also have some big holes that need to be filled such as LT. Targeting specific players is the reason you acquire tons of draft and salary cap capital. It's to manipulate FA and the draft how you see it. You make an excellent point. I'd be far more pleased if a trade down involved a legitimate stud coming to our team, and not just more picks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tour2ma Posted March 28, 2018 Report Share Posted March 28, 2018 Yeah... we have a QB preference. We aren't trading the #1. So on the #4, or trade downs in general... It still comes down to your valuation of the player at the top of the board vs those players you believe that you can land with the picks that are offered. IMO every player at #4 has a potentially fatal flaw with the exception of Nelson... and if we have a position of minimal need, it's OG. If I am stuck at #4, then I will take one of them. However, if there's a trade offer, any reasonable trade offer, then I am outta there. The player(s) ultimately taken with the pick(s) I trade away do not have to fail, but the one(s) taken with picks I receive need to succeed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Westside Steve Posted March 28, 2018 Author Report Share Posted March 28, 2018 22 minutes ago, Tour2ma said: Yeah... we have a QB preference. We aren't trading the #1. So on the #4, or trade downs in general... It still comes down to your valuation of the player at the top of the board vs those players you believe that you can land with the picks that are offered. IMO every player at #4 has a potentially fatal flaw with the exception of Nelson... and if we have a position of minimal need, it's OG. If I am stuck at #4, then I will take one of them. However, if there's a trade offer, any reasonable trade offer, then I am outta there. The player(s) ultimately taken with the pick(s) I trade away do not have to fail, but the one(s) taken with picks I receive need to succeed. But you know the drill every pick we trade away that turns out to be a star will be repeated here ad infinitum. WSS Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tour2ma Posted March 28, 2018 Report Share Posted March 28, 2018 22 minutes ago, Westside Steve said: But you know the drill every pick we trade away that turns out to be a star will be repeated here ad infinitum. Absolutely... but had we hit on the picks we received, the critics would have been muted somewhat. But as long as the one "we gave away" was a QB they will never be silent... until we land our QB. Might be this year... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JimboJones Posted March 30, 2018 Report Share Posted March 30, 2018 To get #18 the Browns would likely have to give up #33+#64. Unless a guy like Tremaine Edmunds, Derwin James, Davenport, Vea, Ward, Minkah ect fall to #18, I don't want. Hoping for #4 to the QB needy Bills for #12+#22+#56. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dutch Oven Posted March 30, 2018 Report Share Posted March 30, 2018 On 3/28/2018 at 2:48 PM, Tour2ma said: IMO every player at #4 has a potentially fatal flaw with the exception of Nelson... Just curious, but what is Minkah Fitzpatrick's potential fatal flaw Tour? IMO Fitpatrick might be about as "safe" pick there is in this draft. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gumby73 Posted March 30, 2018 Report Share Posted March 30, 2018 4 hours ago, JimboJones said: To get #18 the Browns would likely have to give up #33+#64. Unless a guy like Tremaine Edmunds, Derwin James, Davenport, Vea, Ward, Minkah ect fall to #18, I don't want. Hoping for #4 to the QB needy Bills for #12+#22+#56. I've heard this rumor for weeks now also..Chad Forbes throws Smoke with 2 lines..1)Rumors this time of why are everywhere.2)hearing this one since before combine. It's simple Chad,Pete Carrol wants Shaq Griffin back playing with his brother in Seattle..Sherman is gone & Kam Chancellor maybe gone also.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gunz41 Posted March 31, 2018 Report Share Posted March 31, 2018 I understand people not wanting to trade down, but people act like trading down is a TERRIBLE thing or never works. The pick that everyone is saying get this or that elite player at #4 (Barkley, Chubb, Fitzpatrick, Nelson, etc) is the result of... YEP A TRADE DOWN. This is what drives me crazy. Everyone will complain when the trade happens, but it worked out GREAT last year. Exactly what elite player were the Browns getting at #12 Last year besides Watson (Who got hurt). And they also got Njoku or Peppers from it. So while I would be 99.9% positive the Browns aren't getting 12,22,53,56 and White, just say they do get AT LEAST 12 and 22, that means they got 12, 22, and 27 for the 12th pick. And if they dont make a trade, then they got #4 for #12. Seems pretty good to me Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
runyon27 Posted March 31, 2018 Report Share Posted March 31, 2018 The trade down also cost them Wentz too. At some point you need to pick players and at #4 we will at a minimum have out pick of the #2 non-QB player in this draft, possibly #1. If we trade back we lose out on that. We need to start putting some blue chip players on this team. And if we do trade back there is no reason for us to drop back 8 plus spots. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Orion Posted March 31, 2018 Report Share Posted March 31, 2018 Pick #1 - Your favorite QB (from the beginning I've wanted the QB with the best mechanics) Pick #4 - I think they only trade out if Chubb and Barkley are gone....but maybe they like Fitzpatrick. (although I prefer offense...Cubb with Garrett and Ogbah might be able to seriously inhibit our opponents passing attack) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tour2ma Posted March 31, 2018 Report Share Posted March 31, 2018 21 hours ago, JimboJones said: To get #18 the Browns would likely have to give up #33+#64. Unless a guy like Tremaine Edmunds, Derwin James, Davenport, Vea, Ward, Minkah ect fall to #18, I don't want. I think it would cost more than two seconds to get back up to 18. 17 hours ago, Dutch Oven said: Just curious, but what is Minkah Fitzpatrick's potential fatal flaw Tour? IMO Fitpatrick might be about as "safe" pick there is in this draft. First... fatal in terms of not being elite... in terms of not being worth a high first. In Minkah's case it is insufficient burst... I think it shows in his first steps and, maybe more importantly as indicated by is sub-average 33" vertical, his ability to compete for the high pass. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tour2ma Posted March 31, 2018 Report Share Posted March 31, 2018 13 hours ago, runyon27 said: The trade down also cost them Wentz too. At some point you need to pick players and at #4 we will at a minimum have out pick of the #2 non-QB player in this draft, possibly #1. Pretty sure that point is our first pick this year. I love it when folks haul out Wentz as if he was a sure thing. This just in... he's still not a sure thing. As for the top or second non-QB... are you sure either unnamed player's value is greater than the sum of the #12, #22, and #53? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.