Cousins goes to.........

[hoorta]

13 hours ago, Ghoolie said:

Larry, you do this schidt all the time. He is not going to be the highest paid QB in the NFL. He will be for a short time, the new crop will raise that ante. All Cousins will be, is like one of the first downhill skiers down to course. In first......................temporarily.

You don't look at what the guy is getting paid now. You look in year 3, 4 or 5, then factoring the time value of money,  by year three a top QB will be signing for 50 million more than Cousins will. That's just how money works.

Not necessarily. The flaw in that logic is NFL revenue, and by extension the salary cap- is going to be ever expanding at a nice 10% compounded every year. My little calculator says in order to pay a quarterback $200 million three years down the road, that's what it's going to take. Viewership was down again, the league's real cash cow- TV revenue just may decrease proportionately when the contracts come up for renewal. 

Sure, you can give one guy that humongous contract- at the price of having a J-V supporting cast. The current examples in the Cousins bidding war are Denver will probably have to trade Aquib Talib, or (not gonna happen) Jerry and the Cowboys would have to dump Dez Bryant to fit Kirk under their cap. 

[wargograw]

Change the thread title already. 

[SkippinTurtles]

6 hours ago, mjp28 said:

C'mon?

SUPER BOWL WINNING QUARTERBACKS NOT FIRST ROUND PICKS 

Brady 6th, #199 overall
R. Wilson 3rd
Brees 2nd
B. Johnson 9th....#227, really?
Warner undrafted

Favre 2nd
Young supplimental
Rypien 6th
Hostetter 3rd
Joe Montana 3rd.... a couple of Joes, lol
Joe Theisman 4th
Staubach 10th
Stabler 2nd
Unitas 9th
Bart Starr 17th.....remember him? #200 overall, I guess the BROWNS  missed him too 

Cousins has never thrown for 30 TD's in a season or had a 10 win season.  Warren Moon and Drew Bledsoe threw for a lot of yards.  This seems like the world's most expensive band-aid for a hatchet wound.  At best he plays as well as Philip Rivers and the team wins nothing for 5 years. Rebuild, don't patch.

[mjp28]

2 hours ago, SkippinTurtles said:

Cousins has never thrown for 30 TD's in a season or had a 10 win season.  Warren Moon and Drew Bledsoe threw for a lot of yards.  This seems like the world's most expensive band-aid for a hatchet wound.  At best he plays as well as Philip Rivers and the team wins nothing for 5 years. Rebuild, don't patch.

It's starting to look like the BROWNS might not get any decent or any FA signings. The Cousins contract rumors look like an overpriced joke but we'll see what happens there. Cousins hasn't exactly been on any really good teams. And 29 TDs is pretty close to 30 TDs in anyone's book, about 3% away.

So the Cousins scorecard, not too bad all things considered :

Passing

Year	Age	Tm	Pos	No.	G	GS	QBrec	Cmp	Att	Cmp%	Yds	TD	TD%	Int	Int%	Lng	Y/A	AY/A	Y/C	Y/G	Rate	QBR	Sk	Yds	NY/A	ANY/A	Sk%	4QC	GWD	AV
Career					62	57	26-30-1	1372	2096	65.5	16206	99	4.7	55	2.6	81	7.7	7.5	11.8	261.4	93.7		106	847	6.98	6.75	4.8	8	12	43
2012	24	WAS	qb	12	3	1	1-0-0	33	48	68.8	466	4	8.3	3	6.3	77	9.7	8.6	14.1	155.3	101.6	79.0	3	27	8.61	7.53	5.9	1	1	2
2013	25	WAS	qb	12	5	3	0-3-0	81	155	52.3	854	4	2.6	7	4.5	62	5.5	4.0	10.5	170.8	58.4	38.8	5	32	5.14	3.67	3.1			-2
2014	26	WAS	qb	8	6	5	1-4-0	126	204	61.8	1710	10	4.9	9	4.4	81	8.4	7.4	13.6	285.0	86.4	55.8	8	70	7.74	6.77	3.8			4
2015	27	WAS	QB	8	16	16	9-7-0	379	543	69.8	4166	29	5.3	11	2.0	78	7.7	7.8	11.0	260.4	101.6	71.0	26	186	6.99	7.14	4.6	2	3	12
2016*	28	WAS	QB	8	16	16	8-7-1	406	606	67.0	4917	25	4.1	12	2.0	80	8.1	8.0	12.1	307.3	97.2	71.7	23	190	7.52	7.45	3.7	4	4	15
2017	29	WAS	QB	8	16	16	7-9-0	347	540	64.3	4093	27	5.0	13	2.4	74	7.6	7.5	11.8	255.8	93.9	50.5	41	342	6.46	6.38	7.1	1	4	12

2 playoff games - full playoff gamelogs

[nickers]

14 hours ago, boo fagley said:

The last 3 seasons Cousins has

19 - 300 yard games

81 passing TDs

36 INTs

13 rushing TDs

An approximate completion rate of 66%.

I have no doubts that Cousins could step in and help the Browns win games this season. He is exactly whats missing. Who knows, maybe even reaching the playoffs. Barkley, Cousins, Gordon, Devalve, Njoku, Duke?  Maybe Pryor is back. Thats a respectable lineup if you ask me.

 

                                                           

I need a QB who wins games.. Not pad stats...

[SkippinTurtles]

Does Cousins have ANY upside?  He is what he is.  A QB who piles up garbage time stats.  Stinks in the red-zone going to the worst team in football.  All he would provide is a quick-fix sense of legitimacy.  Rebuild, don't patch. 

[Canton Dawg]

8 minutes ago, SkippinTurtles said:

Does Cousins have ANY upside?  He is what he is.  A QB who piles up garbage time stats.  Stinks in the red-zone going to the worst team in football.  All he would provide is a quick-fix sense of legitimacy.  Rebuild, don't patch. 

Is that why he’s been franchise tagged the past 2 years?

Or is it because he’s set to become the highest paid FA?

[SkippinTurtles]

2 minutes ago, Canton Dawg said:

Is that why he’s been franchise tagged the past 2 years?

Or is it because he’s set to become the highest paid FA?

He's not embarrassing.  That's it.  No one tunes in to watch Kirk Cousins AND he doesn't win.  4000 passing yards in a season will get you tagged.  You better put the '85 Bears defense and the 90's Cowboys offensive line around him for him to even sniff a Super Bowl.  His dream is a Wild-Card win.

 

[Canton Mike]

31 minutes ago, SkippinTurtles said:

Does Cousins have ANY upside?  He is what he is.  A QB who piles up garbage time stats.  Stinks in the red-zone going to the worst team in football.  All he would provide is a quick-fix sense of legitimacy.  Rebuild, don't patch. 

BINGO!!!

We'll see what happens, but I agree. Cousins is a damned expensive bandaid.

Mike

[hoorta]

11 hours ago, Zombo said:

Are you familiar with the Redskins roster the last three years? Not much better than the Browns. Except QB.

Z

That's where I'm coming from Z- the other guys already said it- a real expensive band-aid that's going to get the Browns to (maybe) 8-8. At 30 years old, he is what he is. So Ghoolie can rag on his favorite whipping boy Coleman dropping Cousins' passes that hit him in the hands?

Why would Kirk even want to come to the Browns? Because we can throw more money at him than anyone else?  That's a piss poor reason for a qb that wants to win now, and by his own admission already has $40 million in the bank, and can be selective where he wants to wind up. If the Jets want to throw $60 million front loaded at him this year- let them. 

Honestly, I'm moderately certain McCarron can come within a win or two of what Cousins could post in Cleveland this year- at less than 1\2 the price. 

[mjp28]

Well the BROWNS after going 1-15 and 0-16 and nearly what could have been an unbelievable 0-32 two season record can't expect any magic from ANY quarterback FA or #1 pick.

Forget the band-aids, rookie saviors, bridge QB, best of what's left, whatever behind the center the BROWNS are in a total team reclamation project and the best -PLAN A- is to acquire as many quality players as they can get in a pretty good draft.

I think even the best gung-ho, rah-rah, diehard, brown and orange sunglass wearing fan (like many of us) down deep kind of have this wait and see uneasy feeling about.

HOWEVER this might be a cornerstone draft for the Cleveland Browns and their beleaguered fans for the near future. 

GO BROWNS,  May the force be with you.....or whatever! 

[Zombo]

11 hours ago, hoorta said:

That's where I'm coming from Z- the other guys already said it- a real expensive band-aid that's going to get the Browns to (maybe) 8-8. At 30 years old, he is what he is. So Ghoolie can rag on his favorite whipping boy Coleman dropping Cousins' passes that hit him in the hands?

Why would Kirk even want to come to the Browns? Because we can throw more money at him than anyone else?  That's a piss poor reason for a qb that wants to win now, and by his own admission already has $40 million in the bank, and can be selective where he wants to wind up. If the Jets want to throw $60 million front loaded at him this year- let them. 

Honestly, I'm moderately certain McCarron can come within a win or two of what Cousins could post in Cleveland this year- at less than 1\2 the price. 

You certainly have to assume Dorsey and these guys can turn all of these draft picks into a much better roster, and if you attract a good QB you will attract good playmakers. Don't see where he's a band aid, he's a solution. He solves starting QB for at least 3-5 years and resources are put into building the rest of the team so that we can WIN. SOON.

Zombo

[The Gipper]

21 minutes ago, Zombo said:

You certainly have to assume Dorsey and these guys can turn all of these draft picks into a much better roster, and if you attract a good QB you will attract good playmakers. Don't see where he's a band aid, he's a solution. He solves starting QB for at least 3-5 years and resources are put into building the rest of the team so that we can WIN. SOON.

Zombo

Its an argument in his behalf..to be sure.  And if it goes that way, we can only hope. 

[The Gipper]

It has been stated here that now that the Jags have signed Blake Bortles to an extension....that that take they out of the potential running to sigh Kirk Cousins.....HOWEVER:

I heard that while the extension to Bortles gives him more overall money than he was expecting in his current deal...and gives him some security....it actually may HELP the Jags if they want to go after Cousins...because:

the extension reduces Bortles Cap number from 19 million a year....to 10 million a year.  And 10 million per year is a palatable figure for a team for a BACKUP QB.  If they signed Cousins....he would be making Top Starter money, for certain.....but then Bortles would be making regular backup money.

So...apparently DO NOT strike the Jags off the "possible landing sites for Cousins" list.

If Cousins wants to win....as he claims....he can go to JAX, get big money AND have a ready made championship challenging team around him.  After all the Jags were just one big 2d half choke job from making the Super Bowl last year. 

[The Gipper]

THIS  has always been he biggest issue about Cousins:

(from ESPN Jets reporter):

A look at what's happening around the New York Jets:

1. Struggles against top competition: The Jets' anticipated pursuit of Kirk Cousins is a hot-button issue among fans in New York. Should they shell out $30 million a year for the prospective free agent or try to find their quarterback in the draft? Both sides can make compelling arguments, but here's a factoid that might provide some clarity for those on the fence:

During his time with the Washington Redskins, Cousins' starting record against winning teams is 4-19 (based on their opponents' final record).

Yes, 4-19.

[The Gipper]

Here is one of those reports that claims that the Jags are now out of the running for Cousins:

https://www.dawgsbynature.com/2018/2/25/17051408/blake-bortles-extension-has-cleveland-browns-implications

It claims that it takes away the Jags as a potential competitor for Cousins.

But...as noted in a couple of posts above.....others claim that that is by no means the case.

[Canton Dawg]

42 minutes ago, The Gipper said:

THIS  has always been he biggest issue about Cousins:

(from ESPN Jets reporter):

A look at what's happening around the New York Jets:

1. Struggles against top competition: The Jets' anticipated pursuit of Kirk Cousins is a hot-button issue among fans in New York. Should they shell out $30 million a year for the prospective free agent or try to find their quarterback in the draft? Both sides can make compelling arguments, but here's a factoid that might provide some clarity for those on the fence:

During his time with the Washington Redskins, Cousins' starting record against winning teams is 4-19 (based on their opponents' final record).

Yes, 4-19.

If Cousins had an O-Line, running game, and a couple of decent WR's...little wonder he did struggle against top competition.

Washington's offense (outside of the QB position) was worse than the Browns.

[The Gipper]

56 minutes ago, Canton Dawg said:

If Cousins had an O-Line, running game, and a couple of decent WR's...little wonder he did struggle against top competition.

Washington's offense (outside of the QB position) was worse than the Browns.

But, perhaps, what his record there tells us is that he is not capable of elevating that offense to a productive, winning level.  

I mean, fact it, what has Tom Brady had to work with over the years?  Journeyman RBs like Dion Lewis, James White?   Other than Randy Moss for a couple of years, no super WRs.  Gronk, yes....a great weapon for him.  I don't think his OL have been stellar at all times. 

Its an issue.  

In theory...he says he wants to go where he can win.  The likes of JAX or Denver have the defenses.   No one (except maybe some of us) expects that he can come to the Browns and win.   Or....even to the Jets?  Though they were competitive with Josh McCown. 

Sorry...but this just drags out too long.  Remember when they used to have the draft at the end of February?  Hell, the 1970 Draft was held at the end of January.  (but then the Super Bowl was held like the first week of January)

In fact...in checking....it all started in the mid 70ss.   Note:  1975 NFL draft held  Jan. 28/29th 1975.   What happened after 1975?  1976 NFL Draft held April 8-9 1976.  The 1977 draft held May 3-4 1977.  The answer may be that they had about that time passed the rule that the league will go to a 16 game schedule, from 14 games. That did not start until 1978..but they must have been getting ready for it. 

The main reason why there is such a gap between say the Super Bowl and the Combine is because the NFL collectively wants about a 3-4 week vacation so they can all go to the Caribbean or Hawaii to have time off.  I can understand that....but it just drags thing out for us fans.

[Dutch Oven]

6 hours ago, The Gipper said:

Sorry...but this just drags out too long.  Remember when they used to have the draft at the end of February?  Hell, the 1970 Draft was held at the end of January.  (but then the Super Bowl was held like the first week of January)

I honestly think teams would be better off if the process was shorter. The longer the process, the more apt teams are to make stupid decisions because they are so removed from the players they are drafting actually playing. 

If it was up to me, all American pro sports seasons would be shorter. The NFL would go back to 14 games, MLB would be around 140 games, the NBA and NHL would go to around 60 games. Quality over quantity, not so much overlapping of the sports seasons. 

[Mark O]

34 minutes ago, Dutch Oven said:

I honestly think teams would be better off if the process was shorter. The longer the process, the more apt teams are to make stupid decisions because they are so removed from the players they are drafting actually playing. 

If it was up to me, all American pro sports seasons would be shorter. The NFL would go back to 14 games, MLB would be around 140 games, the NBA and NHL would go to around 60 games. Quality over quantity, not so much overlapping of the sports seasons. 

It's not the season length that is a problem.   Its basically a 5 month football season.  Much less than every other sport, I'm not entirely convinced the NBA season ever ends.    The problem is the offseason is stretched out because the NFL wants to be in the news for 12 months.   So therefore...combine in March and free agency...Draft in April.  Minicamps in May and June..Traning camps open in July and preseason games in August.  Now the NFL is in the news for the entire year.

[Ghoolie]

On 2/25/2018 at 3:23 PM, SkippinTurtles said:

Cousins has never thrown for 30 TD's in a season or had a 10 win season.  Warren Moon and Drew Bledsoe threw for a lot of yards.  This seems like the world's most expensive band-aid for a hatchet wound.  At best he plays as well as Philip Rivers and the team wins nothing for 5 years. Rebuild, don't patch.

List the first rounders

 

[Ghoolie]

Here we go again................ Let's run like a muthafukka from the top playmakers............. RUN RUN RUN you stupid motherfukkaz................. draft more OL. zumba instructors and fumble fingered homosexual WRs. DOWN DOWN DOWN..................... TRade DOWN I TELL YA................... LE SOMEONE ELSE HAVE THE PLAYMAKERS...........WE DON'T NEED THEM............WE ARE AMASSING ASSETS AND DRAFT PICKS

[The Gipper]

14 hours ago, Mark O said:

It's not the season length that is a problem.   Its basically a 5 month football season.  Much less than every other sport, I'm not entirely convinced the NBA season ever ends.    The problem is the offseason is stretched out because the NFL wants to be in the news for 12 months.   So therefore...combine in March and free agency...Draft in April.  Minicamps in May and June..Traning camps open in July and preseason games in August.  Now the NFL is in the news for the entire year.

And, as you say....the NBA season now goes on forever.  Games begin in November and do not finish until June. 

That of course is all about the money with these stupid extended series that they play.   Sixteen teams make the playoffs?  Over half the league and several likely with losing records?   And every series is a 7 game series?   

The NBA used to have best 2 out of 3 in the first round....then best 3 out of 5. But now every freeking series is a 7 gamer? MLB only has 10 teams make the playoffs out of 30...and has a one game and done series and a best 3 out of 5.  Only the LCS and the World Series are 7 gamers.   NFL has only 12 out of 32 teams make post season.   But NHL is like NBA...16 teams...some losers.  Not sure if they have all 7 game series though. Probably. 

[The Gipper]

8 hours ago, Ghoolie said:

Here we go again................ Let's run like a muthafukka from the top playmakers............. RUN RUN RUN you stupid motherfukkaz................. draft more OL. zumba instructors and fumble fingered homosexual WRs. DOWN DOWN DOWN..................... TRade DOWN I TELL YA................... LE SOMEONE ELSE HAVE THE PLAYMAKERS...........WE DON'T NEED THEM............WE ARE AMASSING ASSETS AND DRAFT PICKS

Not sure what you are talking about.   Most of the conversation here has been all about the QBs and whether or not to take a RB. Plus the occasional talk about possibly a DB with the 4 pick. 

But, as I said, 98% of the conversation has been about QBs and RBs.  Are you of the opinion that QBs and RBs are not playmakers?  

[Mark O]

1 minute ago, The Gipper said:

.   But NHL is like NBA...16 teams...some losers.  Not sure if they have all 7 game series though. Probably. 

Yep...16 teams...all 7 game series but they go faster than the NBA because they play every other night until the series is over.   There's no waiting around 3 days in the middle of a series like the NBA does.  Once two teams advance to the next round, they start their series even if the entire first round isn't over yet.   Much better system and it goes faster but of course they don't have TV dictating when things need to be on tv. 

[LionOfBuddha]

Looks like the Vikings are going to let Keenum and Teddy walk.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.ganggreennation.com/platform/amp/2018/2/27/17057430/report-vikings-to-let-case-keenum-teddy-bridgewater-hit-free-agency-serious-bidders-kirk-cousins

My guess is they’re going to go all in on Cousins, and if they get him, release Bradford.

If they can’t land Cousins, they’ll probably keep Bradford as a bridge and draft a QB early on.

[The Gipper]

8 minutes ago, LionOfBuddha said:

Looks like the Vikings are going to let Keenum and Teddy walk.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.ganggreennation.com/platform/amp/2018/2/27/17057430/report-vikings-to-let-case-keenum-teddy-bridgewater-hit-free-agency-serious-bidders-kirk-cousins

My guess is they’re going to go all in on Cousins, and if they get him, release Bradford.

If they can’t land Cousins, they’ll probably keep Bradford as a bridge and draft a QB early on.

It can't be too early....they have what?  either pick #29 or 30.  

Even if they get Cousins...they would still need a backup...and who would that be? 

FYI....Bradford too is a FA...so there is no releasing him.  Even if they want him...he may not want them and he may move on.

And, you never know....that "moving on" could conceivably lead him to the Cleveland Browns. 

[Westside Steve]

https://deadspin.com/the-vikings-are-clearing-the-deck-of-quarterbacks-to-go-1823352889

[hoorta]

1 hour ago, The Gipper said:

Not sure what you are talking about.   Most of the conversation here has been all about the QBs and whether or not to take a RB. Plus the occasional talk about possibly a DB with the 4 pick. 

But, as I said, 98% of the conversation has been about QBs and RBs.  Are you of the opinion that QBs and RBs are not playmakers?  

More Ghoolie double talk. Last year year he wanted Trubisky #1. So this year when 99% of the board says QB or RB #1, he thinks somehow we're on the trade down wagon again. 

He's forgetting the QB we pick at #1 potentially could turn out better than Cousins, will be nine years younger, and will cost 1\10th short term than overpriced Kirk.

[LionOfBuddha]

38 minutes ago, The Gipper said:

It can't be too early....they have what?  either pick #29 or 30.  

Even if they get Cousins...they would still need a backup...and who would that be? 

FYI....Bradford too is a FA...so there is no releasing him.  Even if they want him...he may not want them and he may move on.

And, you never know....that "moving on" could conceivably lead him to the Cleveland Browns. 

Early as in rounds 1-2. They’ll be some QBs with potential there. They are pretty much set besides QB. Top 3 defense, Diggs and Thielen at WR, Kyle Rudolph at TE. Jerick McKinnon is their Duke Johnson. And remember Dalvin Cook? He was on par with Fournette before he went down. 

I think this means Cousins will sign there. But if not, it’s not like they have many needs besides QB, and they could definitely grab one in the first or second rd. Or even trade up.

You're right about Bradford, he is a FA. What I meant was that if they can’t get Cousins they may try to sign Bradford.