Dutch Oven Posted January 29, 2018 Report Share Posted January 29, 2018 56 minutes ago, Bob806 said: The kid shoots his mouth off too much. He longs for the NY Giants...no way he survives NYC or the NFC East weather. Indy sits 3rd, with a "hot candidate" coach in McDaniels. He'll supposedly get a great offensive system and play indoors 8 games a season. He reminds me of John Elway, Eli Manning. Trying to dictate his future. He's fragile, put him in a dome, and see if he lives up to the lofty expectations. He doesn't want Cleveland, so heck with him. So basically you have no reason... got it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob806 Posted January 29, 2018 Report Share Posted January 29, 2018 10 minutes ago, Dutch Oven said: So basically you have no reason... got it. Wow. Look, I know we're all a bit fiesty waiting for our team to turn around, but it's just my opinion he will not last in a northern/northeast climate. I said he's fragile. A dome may help the kid, plain and simple. I take it you want him in Cleveland. I wouldn't take somebody who has reservations about the Browns. A leader looks to lead, establish greatness and embrace a challenge. This is why I shy away from our forum's draft threads. Should have never commented. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dutch Oven Posted January 29, 2018 Report Share Posted January 29, 2018 2 minutes ago, Bob806 said: Wow. Look, I know we're all a bit fiesty waiting for our team to turn around, but it's just my opinion he will not last in a northern/northeast climate. I said he's fragile. A dome may help the kid, plain and simple. I take it you want him in Cleveland. I wouldn't take somebody who has reservations about the Browns. A leader looks to lead, establish greatness and embrace a challenge. This is why I shy away from our forum's draft threads. Should have never commented. I was kind of expecting a more concrete reason why you thought he needed to play in a dome, such as you think he has a mediocre arm, or that he has small hands (which would hinder a QB in poor weather, and to be able to get enough zip on the ball to throw spirals in wet or windy weather). Instead, your response was a bit vague... just seemed like "I don't like him so he must be a pussy who can't play in bad weather" type of answer. The list of QBs who come from warm weather areas who thrived in the NFL in cold weather cities is an impressively long one. I also don't think he's the most "sturdy" of QBs, but I don't think weather has anything to do with it. His injury history/body build is the reason I still haven't gone all-in on him, even if I do think he's the best QB in this class, especially from Day 1. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
calfoxwc Posted January 29, 2018 Report Share Posted January 29, 2018 12 minutes ago, Bob806 said: Wow. Look, I know we're all a bit fiesty waiting for our team to turn around, but it's just my opinion he will not last in a northern/northeast climate. I said he's fragile. A dome may help the kid, plain and simple. I take it you want him in Cleveland. I wouldn't take somebody who has reservations about the Browns. A leader looks to lead, establish greatness and embrace a challenge. This is why I shy away from our forum's draft threads. Should have never commented. Hang in there, Bob. That is the old "Lord of the Flies" syndrome that peaks around this forum once in a while. If certain hostile wannabe alpha males can intimidate and squelch differing opinions, they relish the chance. The rest of us just love talking football. I have some dumb opinions, if I can't back em up, I try to change em. I'm happy with any qb in the draft the Browns take - and they won't take Rosen the reason you mentioned being a primary reason. Rudolph, Mayfield, Allen, Tour's guy Benkirt, sp?, Mike White, etc etc, have the kind of tough mental makeup to play in the snow. A fighter, a guy his teammates rally around. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dutch Oven Posted January 29, 2018 Report Share Posted January 29, 2018 11 minutes ago, calfoxwc said: Hang in there, Bob. That is the old "Lord of the Flies" syndrome that peaks around this forum once in a while. If certain hostile wannabe alpha males can intimidate and squelch differing opinions, they relish the chance. The rest of us just love talking football. Settle down, Princess. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
calfoxwc Posted January 29, 2018 Report Share Posted January 29, 2018 1 minute ago, Dutch Oven said: Settle down, Princess. yes you want attention more than some others. have a nice day, and if you can't back your opinions up, then perhaps you should stop and think about that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TexasAg1969 Posted January 29, 2018 Report Share Posted January 29, 2018 10 hours ago, Dutch Oven said: The list of QBs who come from warm weather areas who thrived in the NFL in cold weather cities is an impressively long one. I also don't think he's the most "sturdy" of QBs, but I don't think weather has anything to do with it. His injury history/body build is the reason I still haven't gone all-in on him, even if I do think he's the best QB in this class, especially from Day 1. All you need to succeed as a QB in cold weather. https://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_nkw=joe+namath+fur+coat Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boo fagley Posted January 29, 2018 Report Share Posted January 29, 2018 18 hours ago, Tour2ma said: Until you understand it? First... love you picking 270, his 2017 attempt total when he threw 373 times in 2016 with the same completion percentage... 56%. #Samplesizematters... Only 6 per 100... lol... Makes it sound so easy doesn't it? Just magically turn 16 incompletions in to completions. Doesn't work that way... How easy does a string of 40 for 40 sound? That is what Allen would have to add to 152 completions in 270 attempts to come out on the other side with a 62% completion rate. It's called Algebra... But if you want to wish away incompletions then let's start with all the drops... for every QB. That's adds 4 points plus change to Allen's completion percentage. How much would it add to Rosen's? You love splitting peas. Some team will be wise and draft Allen and develop him into a stud. Probably the Steelers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boo fagley Posted January 29, 2018 Report Share Posted January 29, 2018 11 hours ago, Bob806 said: Wow. Look, I know we're all a bit fiesty waiting for our team to turn around, but it's just my opinion he will not last in a northern/northeast climate. I said he's fragile. A dome may help the kid, plain and simple. I take it you want him in Cleveland. I wouldn't take somebody who has reservations about the Browns. A leader looks to lead, establish greatness and embrace a challenge. This is why I shy away from our forum's draft threads. Should have never commented. Well stated. Rosen is a nobody who thinks that he walks on water. Fans waiting in line for hours to perform fellatio like Tour. Rosen will be another no balls excuse maker like Andy Luck just watch. Always needing that next piece of the puzzle to deliver. A Bust. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TexasAg1969 Posted January 29, 2018 Report Share Posted January 29, 2018 24 minutes ago, boo fagley said: Some team will be wise and draft Allen and let him linger on the bench before finally cutting. Hopefully the Steelers. FIFY Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ibleedbrown Posted January 29, 2018 Report Share Posted January 29, 2018 On 1/27/2018 at 1:22 PM, Westside Steve said: http://www.cleveland.com/pluto/index.ssf/2018/01/cleveland_browns_terrys_talkin_2.html WSS I think the one thing that popped out to me in the article was... "Dorsey is not a big fan of analytics." So how well is this guy going to work with the DePodesta's of the world? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Westside Steve Posted January 29, 2018 Author Report Share Posted January 29, 2018 1 minute ago, Ibleedbrown said: I think the one thing that popped out to me in the article was... "Dorsey is not a big fan of analytics." So how well is this guy going to work with the DePodesta's of the world? It depends. He will have to be very clear as to how much cream and or sugar he wants in his coffee when instructing mr. Depodesta. WSS Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Gipper Posted January 29, 2018 Report Share Posted January 29, 2018 14 hours ago, Dutch Oven said: I was kind of expecting a more concrete reason why you thought he needed to play in a dome, such as you think he has a mediocre arm, or that he has small hands (which would hinder a QB in poor weather, and to be able to get enough zip on the ball to throw spirals in wet or windy weather). Instead, your response was a bit vague... just seemed like "I don't like him so he must be a pussy who can't play in bad weather" type of answer. The list of QBs who come from warm weather areas who thrived in the NFL in cold weather cities is an impressively long one. I also don't think he's the most "sturdy" of QBs, but I don't think weather has anything to do with it. His injury history/body build is the reason I still haven't gone all-in on him, even if I do think he's the best QB in this class, especially from Day 1. List of warm weather QBs that went north and did well: Tom Brady...from San Mateo Cal....to Michigan and New England Brett Favre...from Southern Mississippi....to Green Bay Peyton Manning...from New Orleans/Tenn...to Indy (though, yes, that was a dome) Bart Starr...from Alabama to Green Bay Eli Manning...from New Orleans/Ole Miss to New York Carson Palmer...from So Cal to Cincinnati Fran Tarkenton...from Georgia to Minnesota...before they had a dome! Aaron Rodgers....from San Francisco Bay to Green Bay Jim Kelly....sort of.....while from Western Pa....went to school in Miami.....then played in Houston...to Buffalo Y.A. Tittle...from LSU to New York Brian Sipe....from San Diego to Cleveland. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tour2ma Posted January 29, 2018 Report Share Posted January 29, 2018 19 hours ago, Ghoolie#1fan said: Not true Mathew Stafford was a big arm inaccurate qb coming out of college. Similar to Allen. Stafford had accuracy problems his first 6 years he didn't complete 60%. The last 3 years he's been around 66% a year. A QB can be coached to be more accurate. They're very similar players except Allen is more mobile and Staffords arm is a little stronger. True as far as your analysis goes, but one thing Stafford did do in college that Allen did not was show progress. Allen's successive two years as starter were 56.0 and 56.3% completion. Stafford's were 52.7, 55.7 and 61.4%. Stafford demonstrated the capacity to improve... geometrically. Not sure about your mobility comparison. I don't remember what Matt was like at UGA, but he's been pretty nifty in Detroit. His Combine 40 was close to Allen's currently listed times. Matt's 3-cone time was a very respectable 7.06. As far as I know Josh hasn't run one, but will I presume in a few weeks. 5 hours ago, boo fagley said: you love spliting peas. I'll take that as a concession for my math over whatever you were doing. That said... I do make a mean split pea soup. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tour2ma Posted January 29, 2018 Report Share Posted January 29, 2018 5 hours ago, boo fagley said: Rosen is a nobody who thinks that he walks on water. Fans waiting in line for hours to perform fellatio like Tour. So.... your bag is officially empty? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boo fagley Posted January 29, 2018 Report Share Posted January 29, 2018 3 hours ago, Tour2ma said: So.... your bag is officially empty? Nope, calling out man - boy love. Rosen will be a bust. Just watch. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hoorta Posted January 30, 2018 Report Share Posted January 30, 2018 On 1/28/2018 at 6:11 PM, Ghoolie#1fan said: Not true Mathew Stafford was a big arm inaccurate qb coming out of college. Similar to Allen. Stafford had accuracy problems his first 6 years he didn't complete 60%. The last 3 years he's been around 66% a year. A QB can be coached to be more accurate. They're very similar players except Allen is more mobile and Staffords arm is a little stronger. Note Ghoolie thumper. We're not gonna wait 6 years for improvement out of our QBOTF. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tiamat63 Posted January 30, 2018 Report Share Posted January 30, 2018 8 hours ago, boo fagley said: Nope, calling out man - boy love. Rosen will be a bust. Just watch. Willing to stake a wager vs... say, Allen? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SD_Tom Posted January 30, 2018 Report Share Posted January 30, 2018 Isn't Rosen about the same size as Tom Brady? 18 hours ago, boo fagley said: Well stated. Rosen is a nobody who thinks that he walks on water. Fans waiting in line for hours to perform fellatio like Tour. Rosen will be another no balls excuse maker like Andy Luck just watch. Always needing that next piece of the puzzle to deliver. A Bust. You don't become the first true frosh to start at UCLA by being a "nobody". I think he set the school record for most passes in a row without an INT. The A&M game was a great example of starting off horribly, and then they pulled off an amazing comeback. I remember that one, cuz I flipped off the game and had to turn back on when I saw the ticker. You don't pull off a comeback like that without having some toughness.... and getting your team to believe you can win. Rosen looked more poised in his college debut than most QB's look after 3 seasons. he's a legit QB. LOL and it's fitting for that team, his very 1st pass was a perfect ball, deep throw for a sure TD even while the WR was covered, right in WR's hands....and dropped. That kinda summed up most of his career there. Lots of drops in all the game film. At least he's used to it! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nickers Posted January 30, 2018 Report Share Posted January 30, 2018 On 1/28/2018 at 12:51 PM, Tour2ma said: Damn... had not thought of Hal in forever. Yes... used to love his reads. Then there was Dan "The Sock" Coughlin... the 60's/70's version of Tony Grossi. Imma guess "hot tub"... Let me know if I win. Your talking about the same portly man who was on TV8 Sports , correct?. That Dan Coughlin? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tour2ma Posted January 30, 2018 Report Share Posted January 30, 2018 No idea, nickers.... hadn't seen him in decades, but he wrote a column for The PD back when I was in HS... so he my well be dead now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Gipper Posted January 30, 2018 Report Share Posted January 30, 2018 4 hours ago, nickers said: Your talking about the same portly man who was on TV8 Sports , correct?. That Dan Coughlin? Coughlin is still around. I just saw him in a feature a couple of weeks ago. I never thought he was much good....and based on recent viewing...that has not changed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Orion Posted January 31, 2018 Report Share Posted January 31, 2018 Sam Darnold - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q7TRrfWO3uU - Good size. Has kind of a long, looping throwing motion....but he does it really fast so it's not as big of a deal as it could be (unless you're a DE with a nice long wing-span). I'm not thinking that QB Mechanics School would have much of an effect on his motion. He's done growed up with it and it'll be there when the bullets start flying. Josh Rosen - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_9xDIb1N2LI - Tall but skinny. Has a nice tight throwing motion. Gets it out quickly. Has had a couple of concussions. Looks like he could be easily broken if dropped. He would probably prefer we don't draft him. (get in the lengthy line pal) Josh Allen - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sQezAEfWQCk - Pretty good size. Pretty good throwing motion. Not as fast getting the ball out as Rosen but ok. Didn't really have to fight the heavy-weight contenders to get to the title fight. Completion percentage follows him like a dark cloud. Baker Mayfield - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZprJbOgROps - The runt of the litter. Reminds me of Manziel (but doesn't live to run as much). Makes off balance throws (sometimes when he doesn't have to). Knows how to avoid the rush and get out where LB'ers feel like they're in nowhere land. (at what maturity level is his head at though?) - I have to say here that there was one game that Manziel played for us where I actually enjoyed watching the Browns offense. Although Pettine wanted him to stay in the pocket and get killed, he used his internal clock properly and got out of the crumbling pocket and into open space where you could just 'feel' the defense $hittin' their pants. - Then again, I enjoyed watching Kosar too. Obviously, the fate of these guys depend on what happens in free agency. (perhaps a couple of 'em will be sending a letter to Cousins telling him how nice the colors orange & brown look together) IMO, they all throw the ball well enough to play NFL football. But it might be a difficult decision deciding who will deliver the MOST value in terms of talent, longevity, leadership and professionalism. I'd support any choice with the warning that Mayfield's maturity level will have to be researched THOROUGHLY...because we ARE the team that suffered the Manziel thing. (Billy) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SD_Tom Posted January 31, 2018 Report Share Posted January 31, 2018 Darnold and Rosen have played head to head. Rosen was obviously and clearly better as a QB. He sits in the pocket better, he's more accurate, and is more polished. I highly suggest watching that game film and make your own decision. Dorsey seemed to choose very well last year with Mahomes and Hunt, so that's a good sign for the Browns. I don't even care who they get #1, as long as he turns out to be THE GUY. It's been too damn long, and we're all sick of trading down, or drafting QB's at #22, or whatever. Get the best guy and take a shot for once. Side note- didn't Kerry Collins have a similar throwing motion to Darnold? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Orion Posted January 31, 2018 Report Share Posted January 31, 2018 33 minutes ago, SD_Tom said: It's been too damn long, and we're all sick of trading down Absolutely. A couple of years ago I was almost giddy because I knew that we would get one of the two best QB's in the draft and FINALLY man the position. Well, we didn't. So even though there are 4 to choose from...and THIS time we're under new management...I'm still once shot and twice shy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hoorta Posted January 31, 2018 Report Share Posted January 31, 2018 1 hour ago, Orion said: Absolutely. A couple of years ago I was almost giddy because I knew that we would get one of the two best QB's in the draft and FINALLY man the position. Well, we didn't. So even though there are 4 to choose from...and THIS time we're under new management...I'm still once shot and twice shy. Don't worry. If Smith vetoed a trade to the Browns, you really think Cousins is coming here, regardless of how much loot we throw at him? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
syd Posted January 31, 2018 Report Share Posted January 31, 2018 2 hours ago, SD_Tom said: Darnold and Rosen have played head to head. Rosen was obviously and clearly better as a QB. He sits in the pocket better, he's more accurate, and is more polished. I highly suggest watching that game film and make your own decision. Dorsey seemed to choose very well last year with Mahomes and Hunt, so that's a good sign for the Browns. I don't even care who they get #1, as long as he turns out to be THE GUY. It's been too damn long, and we're all sick of trading down, or drafting QB's at #22, or whatever. Get the best guy and take a shot for once. Side note- didn't Kerry Collins have a similar throwing motion to Darnold? wtf are your passive aggressive remarks about Donald all about on the Alex Smith thread you said that Donald did not want to be here(which was a Shmucking lie) and now comparing him to Collins ? where do you pull this Sheet from ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SD_Tom Posted January 31, 2018 Report Share Posted January 31, 2018 20 minutes ago, syd said: wtf are your passive aggressive remarks about Donald all about on the Alex Smith thread you said that Donald did not want to be here(which was a Shmucking lie) and now comparing him to Collins ? where do you pull this Sheet from ? I asked if his long throwing motion (which is supposedly a con on his scouting report... just like leadership/attitude is con on Rosen's report) was similar to Kerry Collins. Only reason I remember Collins, is I remember a buddy of mine hated him with a passion for that exact reason. He's PSU fan, and me being a Buckeyes fan, we sued to talk Sheet about each school's draft picks. Not once did I compare him to Collins as a player, so don't put words in my mouth. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SD_Tom Posted January 31, 2018 Report Share Posted January 31, 2018 Good listen. https://soundcloud.com/user-465540614 Joe Marino likes Rosen the best, Mayfield second best. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TexasAg1969 Posted January 31, 2018 Report Share Posted January 31, 2018 3 hours ago, SD_Tom said: Good listen. https://soundcloud.com/user-465540614 Joe Marino likes Rosen the best, Mayfield second best. Never mind I found it. Also a good talk on who to take @ #4. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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