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Always find Pluto reads to be among the best...

This point jumped out at me. I've read so much here and other places about how inferior the talent around Allen was... how his completion percentage suffered due to drops, etc. Turns out not-so-much...

" 10. Profootballfocus reported Allen had only 12 passes dropped at Wyoming last season. By contrast, UCLA's Josh Rosen had 34 passes dropped, Mayfield had 28 and Darnold had 18. So Allen's low completion percentage was not due to guys dropping balls."

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I guess you could make the argument his WRs couldn't get as open, causing him to force throws in tighter windows, hurting his completion percentage

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2 minutes ago, Tour2ma said:

So Allen's low completion percentage was not due to guys dropping balls."

It was due to the broad side of the barn being missed.

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6 hours ago, Tour2ma said:

Always find Pluto reads to be among the best...

This point jumped out at me. I've read so much here and other places about how inferior the talent around Allen was... how his completion percentage suffered due to drops, etc. Turns out not-so-much...

" 10. Profootballfocus reported Allen had only 12 passes dropped at Wyoming last season. By contrast, UCLA's Josh Rosen had 34 passes dropped, Mayfield had 28 and Darnold had 18. So Allen's low completion percentage was not due to guys dropping balls."

How many times do we have to go over this?

Allen attempted 270 @ 56% completions

Rosen attempted 452 @ 62% completions.

Allen needs to complete 6 more passes per 100 to be equal with Rosen. Ridiculous.

Allens O line sucked. He was under constant pressure. You guys act like Allen is a pitcher up on the mound with a lousy era.

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6 minutes ago, boo fagley said:

How many times do we have to go over this?

Allen attempted 270 @ 56% completions

Rosen attempted 452 @ 62% completions.

Allen needs to complete 6 more passes per 100 to be equal with Rosen. Ridiculous.

Allens O line sucked. He was under constant pressure. You guys act like Allen is a pitcher up on the mound with a lousy era.

To Summarize... 

Allen = Kizer

 

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34 minutes ago, boo fagley said:

How many times do we have to go over this?

Allen attempted 270 @ 56% completions

Rosen attempted 452 @ 62% completions.

Allen needs to complete 6 more passes per 100 to be equal with Rosen. Ridiculous.

Allens O line sucked. He was under constant pressure. You guys act like Allen is a pitcher up on the mound with a lousy era.

Six more passes per 100?!? Are you sure? I’m not convinced that’s how percentages work. Well, Sheet, Kizer only needed to complete seven more passes per 100 to be equal with Carson Wentz.

 

67CAE491-AA25-4997-A4C6-0E3A4EA55D32.gif

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1 hour ago, Mark O said:

To Summarize... 

Allen = Kizer

 

Quinn = Rosen.

Brady Quinn a 62% rate.

Johnny Football had a 70% completion rate.

 

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1 minute ago, boo fagley said:

Quinn = Rosen.

Brady Quinn a 62% rate.

Johnny Football had a 70% completion rate.

 

No one ever said that completion percentage guaranteed success.  But an inaccurate college QB is only going to get more inaccurate in the NFL.

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43 minutes ago, broganreynik said:

Six more passes per 100?!? Are you sure? I’m not convinced that’s how percentages work. Well, Sheet, Kizer only needed to complete seven more passes per 100 to be equal with Carson Wentz.

 

67CAE491-AA25-4997-A4C6-0E3A4EA55D32.gif

  

 100 passes completed out of 100 attempts is a 100% rate. Allen completed 56 out of 100 for 56% rate.

 

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11 minutes ago, Mark O said:

No one ever said that completion percentage guaranteed success.  But an inaccurate college QB is only going to get more inaccurate in the NFL.

Really.

Brady got better. Brees got better. I could go on all night with examples to the contrary. Its called development. 

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Just now, boo fagley said:

Really.

Brady got better. Brees got better. I could go on all night with examples to the contrary. Its called development. 

Yeah..Brady and Brees were still at 60% completion percentage in college or above.  Allen is completing  55% in the shitty mountain west conference.  

But sure..lets draft Kizer part 2 in round 1 first overall because he's got a big arm and is a good athlete.  Wait..that sounds a lot like Kizer.   He's a good athlete and has a great arm but he is inaccurate as well. 

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50 minutes ago, boo fagley said:

  

 100 passes completed out of 100 attempts is a 100% rate. Allen completed 56 out of 100 for 56% rate.

 

Notice I used your logic to compare Kizer to Wentz?

EC4EBD05-AF42-4031-AEF7-297FA7DEB21C.gif

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4 hours ago, boo fagley said:

How many times do we have to go over this?

Allen attempted 270 @ 56% completions

Rosen attempted 452 @ 62% completions.

Allen needs to complete 6 more passes per 100 to be equal with Rosen. Ridiculous.

Allens O line sucked. He was under constant pressure. You guys act like Allen is a pitcher up on the mound with a lousy era.

If only... well he didn't. Go watch an entire game of his Boo, and get back to me...  Lousy ERA? More like a flame throwing pitcher who can't find the strike zone on a regular basis. 

We've been through all the outliers who significantly improved their completion % in the pros. The odds are against Allen doing so. Our wildly inconsistent Deshone Kizer actually had a better completion percentage than Allen in college- and now some guys want to draft his clone? No thanks. 

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16 hours ago, Tour2ma said:

Always find Pluto reads to be among the best...

This point jumped out at me. I've read so much here and other places about how inferior the talent around Allen was... how his completion percentage suffered due to drops, etc. Turns out not-so-much...

" 10. Profootballfocus reported Allen had only 12 passes dropped at Wyoming last season. By contrast, UCLA's Josh Rosen had 34 passes dropped, Mayfield had 28 and Darnold had 18. So Allen's low completion percentage was not due to guys dropping balls."

Pluto is great.. I miss Hal Lebovits.. He was a thousand times better.....

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9 hours ago, boo fagley said:

Really.

Brady got better. Brees got better. I could go on all night with examples to the contrary. Its called development. 

Compare Kesslers better numbers than Darnold at USC & get back with us. meanwhile the buckeyes put Darnold over the Kessler mark of plus 30 sacks per season. USC QB's fumbling balls must cum with Trojan protection<_<   

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8 hours ago, broganreynik said:

Notice I used your logic to compare Kizer to Wentz?

EC4EBD05-AF42-4031-AEF7-297FA7DEB21C.gif

I noticed that you were  puzzled of my numbers. Take half the money out of your piggy bank and give it to me. I have 50% and you have 50%. See how that works??

Hilarious, you are arguing over 6 more completions per 100 attempts. Thats 24 more completions @ 400 attempts divide by 16 games = 1.5 additional completions per game to reach 62%. Brady completes so many short 5 yard passes its  impossible for him to not be in the 66% range which is 2 completions out 3 attempts and the winning formula. Brady, Rogers, Ryan, Brees even Alex Smith are all 66% passers. Allen needs 10 more completions per 100 to reach the 66% plateau. 2.5 completions per 16 games with better coaching, better OL, better WRs, better RBs.

Allen needs coaching up. Brady needed coaching up. Its foolish to believe that these QBs come from winning college programs and start winning in the NFL the same way. Brady is constantly working on his throwing motion and footwork. 

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7 hours ago, hoorta said:

If only... well he didn't. Go watch an entire game of his Boo, and get back to me...  Lousy ERA? More like a flame throwing pitcher who can't find the strike zone on a regular basis. 

We've been through all the outliers who significantly improved their completion % in the pros. The odds are against Allen doing so. Our wildly inconsistent Deshone Kizer actually had a better completion percentage than Allen in college- and now some guys want to draft his clone? No thanks. 

No, Allen did not get better behind that colander of an offensive line.

You guys act like the other 10 guys around the QB are of no factor whatsoever. Rosen has bust written all over him.

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10 hours ago, Mark O said:

Yeah..Brady and Brees were still at 60% completion percentage in college or above.  Allen is completing  55% in the shitty mountain west conference.  

But sure..lets draft Kizer part 2 in round 1 first overall because he's got a big arm and is a good athlete.  Wait..that sounds a lot like Kizer.   He's a good athlete and has a great arm but he is inaccurate as well. 

Lamar Jackson is a better version of Kizer. 

Compare Allen to Kizer all you want but it isn't true. 

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38 minutes ago, boo fagley said:

I noticed that you were  puzzled of my numbers. Take half the money out of your piggy bank and give it to me. I have 50% and you have 50%. See how that works??

Hilarious, you are arguing over 6 more completions per 100 attempts. Thats 24 more completions @ 400 attempts divide by 16 games = 1.5 additional completions per game to reach 62%. Brady completes so many short 5 yard passes its  impossible for him to not be in the 66% range which is 2 completions out 3 attempts and the winning formula. Brady, Rogers, Ryan, Brees even Alex Smith are all 66% passers. Allen needs 10 more completions per 100 to reach the 66% plateau. 2.5 completions per 16 games with better coaching, better OL, better WRs, better RBs.

Allen needs coaching up. Brady needed coaching up. Its foolish to believe that these QBs come from winning college programs and start winning in the NFL the same way. Brady is constantly working on his throwing motion and footwork. 

It is ridiculous that we have to debate taking a QB at #1 or #4 overall who even his backers say is a multi-year project.

Let someone else use their high first rounder on such a project. Someone on here (cal?) made the point that Denver wants him? Let them have him.

Their "coaching up" of Tebow and Paxton Lynch should be done any moment now.

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1 hour ago, boo fagley said:

Rosen has bust written all over him.

Unless he ends up being drafted by a dome team, like Indy. The guy needs some coddling.

There's reports Indy is going to hire McDaniels as HC. Maybe they want Rosen so bad we can dupe them in a draft deal trade and still get Allen, Barkley, Fitzpatrick, or Chubb. 

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On 1/28/2018 at 6:59 AM, nickers said:

Pluto is great.. I miss Hal Lebovits.. He was a thousand times better.....

Hal LowBlow  as Pete Franklin used to call him.

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11 minutes ago, The Gipper said:

How low blow onHow low blow on

Habla Esp on HOLIO?

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4 hours ago, gumby73 said:

Compare Kesslers better numbers than Darnold at USC & get back with us. meanwhile the buckeyes put Darnold over the Kessler mark of plus 30 sacks per season. USC QB's fumbling balls must cum with Trojan protection<_<   

USC is always good.  Usually top ten,  minimum,  top 20.they always have good WR and usually good RB. Makes it much easier to put big numbers up and win lots of games when you have guys like woods and juju that catch anything thrown their way. 

Their QB's don't set the NFL on fire though.  Most are backups.  Palmer being the one exception. 

 

 

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2 hours ago, Bob806 said:

Unless he ends up being drafted by a dome team, like Indy. The guy needs some coddling.

Just curious Bob, but why do you feel Rosen needs to play in a dome?

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21 hours ago, Tour2ma said:

" 10. Profootballfocus reported Allen had only 12 passes dropped at Wyoming last season. By contrast, UCLA's Josh Rosen had 34 passes dropped, Mayfield had 28 and Darnold had 18. So Allen's low completion percentage was not due to guys dropping balls."

15 hours ago, boo fagley said:

How many times do we have to go over this?

Allen attempted 270 @ 56% completions

Rosen attempted 452 @ 62% completions.

Allen needs to complete 6 more passes per 100 to be equal with Rosen. Ridiculous.

Allens O line sucked. He was under constant pressure. You guys act like Allen is a pitcher up on the mound with a lousy era.

Until you understand it?

First... love you picking 270, his 2017 attempt total when he threw 373 times in 2016 with the same completion percentage... 56%. #Samplesizematters...

Only 6 per 100...  lol... Makes it sound so easy doesn't it? Just magically turn 16 incompletions in to completions. Doesn't work that way...

How easy does a string of 40 for 40 sound? That is what Allen would have to add to 152 completions in 270 attempts to come out on the other side with a 62% completion rate.

It's called Algebra...

 

But if you want to wish away incompletions then let's start with all the drops... for every QB.

That's adds 4 points plus change to Allen's completion percentage.

How much would it add to Rosen's?

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5 hours ago, nickers said:

Pluto is great.. I miss Hal Lebovits.. He was a thousand times better.....

Damn... had not thought of Hal in forever. Yes... used to love his reads.

Then there was Dan "The Sock" Coughlin... the 60's/70's version of Tony Grossi.

40 minutes ago, Dutch Oven said:

Just curious Bob, but why do you feel Rosen needs to play in a dome?

Imma guess "hot tub"... Let me know if I win.

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19 hours ago, Mark O said:

No one ever said that completion percentage guaranteed success.  But an inaccurate college QB is only going to get more inaccurate in the NFL.

Not true Mathew Stafford was a big arm inaccurate qb coming out of college. Similar to Allen. Stafford had accuracy problems his first 6 years he didn't complete 60%. The last 3 years he's been around 66% a year. A QB can be coached to be more accurate. They're very similar players except Allen is more mobile and Staffords arm is a little stronger.

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17 hours ago, hoorta said:

If only... well he didn't. Go watch an entire game of his Boo, and get back to me...  Lousy ERA? More like a flame throwing pitcher who can't find the strike zone on a regular basis. 

We've been through all the outliers who significantly improved their completion % in the pros. The odds are against Allen doing so. Our wildly inconsistent Deshone Kizer actually had a better completion percentage than Allen in college- and now some guys want to draft his clone? No thanks. 

Kizer had one of the best OL in college history. He had a lot more talent around him. His college coach even said he wasn't NFL ready. The schemes are completely different also. Do some research on Kelly's scheme vs Brett Vigens. Kelly runs more of a West Coast Offense. Shorter passes with less risk. Wyoming also runs a variant of the WCO, but they stretch the field Air Coryell style. They also rolled Allen out a lot because the OL was bad. 

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7 hours ago, Dutch Oven said:

Just curious Bob, but why do you feel Rosen needs to play in a dome?

The kid shoots his mouth off too much. He longs for the NY Giants...no way he survives NYC or the NFC East weather.  

Indy sits 3rd, with a "hot candidate" coach in McDaniels. He'll supposedly get a great offensive system and play indoors 8 games a season. 

He reminds me of John Elway, Eli Manning. Trying to dictate his future. He's fragile, put him in a dome, and see if he lives up to the lofty expectations. He doesn't want Cleveland, so heck with him.

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