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jcam222

Hogans Heroes

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Straight and to the point I think PoeticG has this one right. Hogan is light years ahead of Kizer. I've resisted it,  argued against it and made excuses. The fact is though the second he takes the field it's like an entirely different offense. He gets the ball out fast, throws a beautiful accurate catchable ball AND is a dual threat. There is no reason at all to start Kizer next week. PoG has fallen in love with some losers more than once but I have think he has this right. 

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I don’t think he has it right in terms of Hogan being a franchise guy but he’s certainly shown that he knows this offense enough to move the chains.

Its no different than starting a guy like McCown. 

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and he was just a rookie last year....technically, Kizer has more game experience than Hogan now....or very close to it...and we can see how good Kessler and Hogan looked as rookies, compared to Kizer as a rookie....they were both MUCH better....much much better...

 

much.....(lots).....notably better....notable.....offense moving...points.....etc

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5 minutes ago, Tim Couch Pulls Out said:

I don’t think he has it right in terms of Hogan being a franchise guy but he’s certainly shown that he knows this offense enough to move the chains.

Its no different than starting a guy like McCown. 

Fair assessment. What I wonder though is what Hogan looks like a few weeks out with all the starter reps. I honestly have a gut feel we haven't seen his ceiling. Then again that feeling in my gut could be the bad nachos I had at the game lol. The speed difference between him and Kizer for processing what they see is astounding. 

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I'll give PoG credit for calling out Hogan as the best QB on the roster, and giving us the best chance to win this season..... however, I do not think for a second that Hogan is our 16yr franchise QB, but maybe I'm wrong again and would sure love to be.

but I'm not...... ;)

 

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9 minutes ago, jcam222 said:

Fair assessment. What I wonder though is what Hogan looks like a few weeks out with all the starter reps. I honestly have a gut feel we haven't seen his ceiling. Then again that feeling in my gut could be the bad nachos I had at the game lol. The speed difference between him and Kizer for processing what they see is astounding. 

That’s true, there’s no way of truly knowing. I would love for him to be the QBOTF, I really enjoyed him in college.

 

Kizer is struggling hardcore.

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I don't have any doubt that Hogan gives the Browns a better shot at winning right now.

But let's not forget that Hogan has self-destructed two times in a row after setting the world on fire in his initial drives. Both interceptions he threw were godawful and pretty much negated his touchdowns.

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14 minutes ago, Tim Couch Pulls Out said:

 

 

Kizer is struggling hardcore.

he needs a break....if he was just a tad off, then.......but he's way off...in several areas......

If ever a QB needed to sit and learn, this is the one.......

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He's having the struggles a rookie QB, with no vet presence, is going to have. As long as we don't "break" him, we should continue to get him experience. We  aren't playing for anything this year anyway. Unless they truly believe Hogan is the future, Kizer should continue to start.

 

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Hogan seems to move them better however i think neither him or kizer are close to a long term answer. We need throw a boat load of money at free agent qbs next year!!!!!

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1 hour ago, MLD Woody said:

He's having the struggles a rookie QB, with no vet presence, is going to have. As long as we don't "break" him, we should continue to get him experience. We  aren't playing for anything this year anyway. Unless they truly believe Hogan is the future, Kizer should continue to start.

I'm beginning to have serious doubts about Kizer being our QBOTF,  he sure as hell isn't the QB of the present. My anti Notre Dame bias aside, I'm seeing the same crap out of Deshone I saw in college. 

Sorry Woody- you going to sacrifice any shred of hope winning a game just to develop one player? I don't care what Sashi says- Hue's playing for his job at this point. 1-20, and counting. FYI, at this rate, we can pass the '70s Tampa Bay Yuckaneers record of futility over two seasons. Historically awful. MHO is Jackson's coaching career is as sunk as the Titanic if he keeps playing Deshone. 

You'd have to be blind to not see Hogan has clearly outplayed Kizer to this point. 

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Kizer is a reactionary passer.

Kizer waits for his WRs to break open and then throws the ball. By then its usually too late because the DBs are so fast and react to the ball in the air. Thats why he is sacked and throwing INTs like I change socks.

Kizer is playing sand lot ball like back in college where you just make stuff happen on the fly. He is more comfortable off script.

 

Hogan is an anticipatory passer.

Hogan has the ball away before the WR completes his route. Timing plays that avoid sacks. Hogan would rather stay on script.

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9 hours ago, MLD Woody said:

He's having the struggles a rookie QB, with no vet presence, is going to have. As long as we don't "break" him, we should continue to get him experience. We  aren't playing for anything this year anyway. Unless they truly believe Hogan is the future, Kizer should continue to start.

 

They should bench Kizer and Peppers.  Lets cut our losses and go with the best players.

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Can someone please explain to me this ceiling that only Kizer has? Why are lots so certain he is our future? I just don't see it. Why can't Hogan be the future?

Both times we hit the red zone early with Kizer I just expected something to go wrong. As soon as I saw Hogan get in the game I expected to march down the field and score. I was right. Am I the only one that gets these feelings? ;)

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11 hours ago, Tim Couch Pulls Out said:

I don’t think he has it right in terms of Hogan being a franchise guy but he’s certainly shown that he knows this offense enough to move the chains.

Its no different than starting a guy like McCown. 

Yeah what a stupid idea to want a better quarterback under center.  Even if you are committed to Kizer in the long run wouldn't it be a better idea to have a serviceable quarterback who has a good grasp of this  questionable offense ,have a better team, and have someone with the attitude conducive to teaching a young player the ropes?  

Unless your main goal is getting that first pic in 2018?

WSS

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11 hours ago, Tim Couch Pulls Out said:

I don’t think he has it right in terms of Hogan being a franchise guy but he’s certainly shown that he knows this offense enough to move the chains.

Its no different than starting a guy like McCown. 

I agree he's better for us than Kizer.  i wouldn't compare him to McCown.  McCown gets the ball down field much faster than any of our QBs, the only question is his mobility.  I heard yesterday during the game that Hue wanted McCown to hang around and coach Kizer.  I think that would've made him much more appealing to the fans.  But putting him in raw, just not working.  

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Honestly, Im not sure why so many people are certain that Hogan isnt the answer.....

I hear he's not mobile....yet seems to run better than most other QB's.....heck, he ran for 100 yards in a game last season...remember?

He's got decent size at 6'-3" 220#.......

He clearly has moved the team better than Kizer and Kessler.....

And he's only played in about 4 games his entire career.....

How can you write off a guy who's performed every time he's played, yet hasnt even been given a single start in his career?

Yesterday, Hue called him a back up and made the excuse that Kizer is just a rookie....well. Id tell you that Hogan is just as "rookie" as kIzer is......and has had less reps and game opportunities than Kizer....yet, has FAR AND AWAY outplayed him.....

What is it about Hogan that says he cant be a better QB than Kizer??.....the arm?.....cause we all know strong arms do not a QB make....

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They say that Hogan is dink and dunk passer and Kizer has that long ball strong arm thing going on......BUT....

The numbers say that Kizer averages 5.4 yds per pass play and Hogan averages 9.9 yds per pass play....(which is #2 in the league, btw)(and almost double Kizers avg)

The numbers give Kizer a 49 rating and Hogan a 104 rating.....(yesterday he ranked #4 in the league....with the worst OC and WR's money can buy)....(was sitting right there with Aaron Rodgers).....

Is this the twilight zone?.....play the man and see if he falls to earth.....or excels.....it's happened before, but you have to give him a chance to see......

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Kizers development is in a consistent downslide.....

Game 1 = 85 rating - 66% comp

game 3 = 50 rating - 47% comp

game 5 = 38 rating - 47% comp

 

Hogans development is in a consistent UPswing.....

Game 1 = 58 rating - 45% comp

game 2 = 88 rating - 62% comp

game 3 = 122 rating - 84% comp

 

Same players....same coaches.....same competition....ONE guy is clearly "developing" and one guy is clearly "sucking"....

Can you guess which is which???

 

 

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I haven't seen a Browns QB actually throw with anticipation for years.  We've seen so many hold on to the ball too long (Kizer, Kessler, McCown, RG3, Manziel, Weeden and whoever else in between).  They all held on to the ball too long and took too many sacks.  Hogan's throws have been pretty accurate too. Maybe teams will adjust to him and he won't play as well if they prepare for him but hell, give him a shot.

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14 minutes ago, Clevfan4life said:

Im not adverse to giving hogan a shotbut can we please not act as if he's some hidden gem?

This. 

If Hue starts Hogan it's because he is worried about his job.

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In terms of processing, Kizer is just taking way to long. Almost like he wants the guy to be open to make a pass, so indecisive 

Hogan, just the opposite, throws the ball before the break, puts the ball where he expects the receiver to be. 

Hue, worried about a chip shot on that field goal? Christ, he makes it and just maybe it boosts his confidence  smh

 

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2 minutes ago, blitzz2 said:

Hue, worried about a chip shot on that field goal? Christ, he makes it and just maybe it boosts his confidence  smh

I was yelling the whole time he called the TO to kick the f'n FG to tie the game and show your kicker you think he is up to it. And the whole time they go out with the starting O I'm yelling even more, "You dumb SOB have you not seen how bad they have played so far down there? Kick the f'n FG you TO wasting idiot!"

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