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boo fagley    137

Kizer - 20 of 30 (66.7%) for 222  passing yards and 1 TD.and 1 INT

Ben - 24 of 36 for (66.7%) for 263 passing yards and 2 TD and 1 INT

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Zombo    1,742

What the fuck do you guys want out of a 21 year old starting against a Final Four Steeler team in his first time out ... Seriously, wtf?

And yes, Westside Steve, I gave the same leniency to Brady Quinn and Johnny Manziel ... difference is ... I already knew they sucked. This kid is special.

 

Z

  • Upvote 1

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calfoxwc    1,175

well, after tonight, if I had played Kizer instead of Dak Prescott, I would have gotten

one and nearly a half more points. Not bad for Kizer's first regular season game.

Amazing poise, made a few mistakes...watch out the rest of the season. Kizer is really a gem of a

qb. He's the real deal.

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SD_Tom    7

Kid looks like the real deal.  Yes he made mistakes,  but you have to be a fool to think he won't improve.  It's his very first game people! 

I'll tell you what,  it never felt like we had no chance to make a first down.  Kizer can deliver the ball in spots other qbs can't.  He can get big yardage,  he can scramble and run to extend plays.  He's been a hair off on several big passes so far in ps and today., but Maybe if he had a wr like Brown who caught everything in his general vicinity,  instead of Britt,  he'd have won. 

Or any running game at all.  Most of his issues will be fixed with experience.  He seems like a real leader,  and the team responds well with him back there. 

 

 

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Ghoolie    384
3 hours ago, boo fagley said:

Despite getting sacked 7 times the Browns were in it the whole game. I wish that I could have seen your face when the Browns converted the 2 point conversion. The  Browns gift wrapped 7 points on the punt and Kizer threw a brutal INT to BJ Watt. A rookie QB gave the Steelers a scare.

Garret didnt even play.

I was at the Browns Backers get together with my friends. Ron Fittes, Ron Darling, Mike Fittes and a few other long timers. I told them I fully expected a successful 2 point conversion.................followed by Ben and company making plays to end the game. I boasted that the TD and conversion meant absolutely nothing. SO, the look on my face was calm. I expected it. What I would have liked to see, was the looks on your faces when Ben broke the Browns back with a really well thrown long ball.........

Ahhhhhh................not THOSE would have been some sour faces.

A scare? How was it a scare? he Steelers had the ball and the lead? What scare are you talking about? 

You know, this is the same shit with you guys every fucking year. And still, no matter how many times I tell you jackoffs ahead of time EXACLTY what you will say after the loss, you guys STILL say this stupid shit.............

If only we make that play......If the ref doesn't throw that flag, we win.......Take away that one play, and we win. Fuck dude, it doesn't work that way. From the Steeler side there are just as many IF only moments.............he Steelers basically gave the browns 75% of the yards on their last drive. IF THE STEELERS DON'T MAKE THOSE STUPID PENALTIES THEY WIN BY 18 POINTS.    IF BEN DOESN'T UNCHARACTERISTICALLY MISS TWO WIDE OPEN WRS ON LONG PASSES, THIS IS A BLOWOUT........

The Browns got beat. They got outplayed. When they needed plays, they had no playmakers. Big Bad Greg Williams sure didn't do anything but kiss Bens nutsack on the last Steeler drive, did he?

7 sacks. All I head for the last 17 years is how we need a great OL. So you got it. What difference did it make in this game? 7 fucking sacks. Why? NO PLAYMAKERS ON OFFENSE. The blocked punt meant nothing. We were punting deep and Ben would have had great field position. The would have driven for a TD in all likelyhood. Then the Browns last TD never would have happened, time woudl have expired.

Look dude, you can't rewrite the fucking game. The Browns got their ass handed to them at home. 0 -1 and the Ravens won't be any easier. Once again, the Browns players got laid out. Without all the bad ref calls, The Steelers win this by 18 points. None of that shit matters. They made plays, they wiped their ass with WIlliams pussy ass defense, and they sacked the living shit out of Black Tarkenton. Seriously, Kizer Blows.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

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boo fagley    137
6 hours ago, Ghoolie said:

I was at the Browns Backers get together with my friends. Ron Fittes, Ron Darling, Mike Fittes and a few other long timers. I told them I fully expected a successful 2 point conversion.................followed by Ben and company making plays to end the game. I boasted that the TD and conversion meant absolutely nothing. SO, the look on my face was calm. I expected it. What I would have liked to see, was the looks on your faces when Ben broke the Browns back with a really well thrown long ball.........

 Those guys must beg you for power ball numbers since you predicted 16 losses last season and were wrong only 1 time.

 You were lucky. That Brown catch in triple coverage was the ball breaker. Would have loved to see the Browns get the ball i more time.

Quote

 

Ahhhhhh................not THOSE would have been some sour faces.

A scare? How was it a scare? he Steelers had the ball and the lead? What scare are you talking about? 

 

Because 9 point favorite Pittsburgh was supposed to mop up the floor with Kizer behind center.

Nobody gave the Browns a real chance. If the Steelers are happy about this win then they are delusional. This wasnt Ben vs Brady.

Quote

You know, this is the same shit with you guys every fucking year. And still, no matter how many times I tell you jackoffs ahead of time EXACLTY what you will say after the loss, you guys STILL say this stupid shit.............

 Im new here.

 Ghoollie, you be in hiding if the Steelers had lost.

Quote

If only we make that play......If the ref doesn't throw that flag, we win.......Take away that one play, and we win. Fuck dude, it doesn't work that way. From the Steeler side there are just as many IF only moments.............he Steelers basically gave the browns 75% of the yards on their last drive. IF THE STEELERS DON'T MAKE THOSE STUPID PENALTIES THEY WIN BY 18 POINTS.    IF BEN DOESN'T UNCHARACTERISTICALLY MISS TWO WIDE OPEN WRS ON LONG PASSES, THIS IS A BLOWOUT........

 When good teams go at it, typically it boils down to a few plays to determine the winner and loser. The Browns are good team if they keep playing like this.

Quote

 The Browns got beat. They got outplayed. When they needed plays, they had no playmakers. Big Bad Greg Williams sure didn't do anything but kiss Bens nutsack on the last Steeler drive, did he?

Williams kept the Browns in the game. 

Best game that I watched all day. 

Quote

7 sacks. All I head for the last 17 years is how we need a great OL. So you got it. What difference did it make in this game? 7 fucking sacks. Why? NO PLAYMAKERS ON OFFENSE. The blocked punt meant nothing. We were punting deep and Ben would have had great field position. The would have driven for a TD in all likelyhood. Then the Browns last TD never would have happened, time woudl have expired.

Yeah, a rookie QB ate the ball 7 times. Sometimes you have to bite the bullet so there isnt a fumble. So, the Steelers would had good field position. The Browns defense was playing kick ass. Despite giving the better team 7 points, the Browns were in it the whole game. 

 

Quote

 

Look dude, you can't rewrite the fucking game. The Browns got their ass handed to them at home. 0 -1 and the Ravens won't be any easier. Once again, the Browns players got laid out. Without all the bad ref calls, The Steelers win this by 18 points. None of that shit matters. They made plays, they wiped their ass with WIlliams pussy ass defense, and they sacked the living shit out of Black Tarkenton. Seriously, Kizer Blows

 

 

 

What about our bet?

You are predicting that Kizer gets knocked out vs the Ravens next game. I say that he will not. So, whats the wager?

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nickers    251
9 hours ago, Zombo said:

What the fuck do you guys want out of a 21 year old starting against a Final Four Steeler team in his first time out ... Seriously, wtf?

And yes, Westside Steve, I gave the same leniency to Brady Quinn and Johnny Manziel ... difference is ... I already knew they sucked. This kid is special.

 

Z

Theres nothing special about him that I saw.. I saw a kid who had all day to throw and held on to the ball , way too long!

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jcam222    234
31 minutes ago, nickers said:

Theres nothing special about him that I saw.. I saw a kid who had all day to throw and held on to the ball , way too long!

Are you sure you were watching the Browns game? He needs to get it out quicker and said so himself. Having said that there were sacks where he didn't have anything like " plenty of time". Also if you didn't see some throws that made you excited about his potential I'm amazed. 

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Kizer looks real. Strong arm, will learn to throw it away if there is nothing there. Based on a small one game sample he looks like the best thing they have come up with.

Oline did not play well, despite the $$$ spent on it.

Pgh had serious rust, esp. Bell. It is selfish to skip training camp.

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FairHooker11    386

didnt see much pass rush either  - although run stopping was real good 

take the punt block td  away and .....

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nickers    251
17 minutes ago, jcam222 said:

Are you sure you were watching the Browns game? He needs to get it out quicker and said so himself. Having said that there were sacks where he didn't have anything like " plenty of time". Also if you didn't see some throws that made you excited about his potential I'm amazed. 

I've seen a lot of guys with great arms.. Jeff George comes to mind.. I want to see a consistent body of work before christening the kid...

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boo fagley    137
7 minutes ago, nickers said:

I've seen a lot of guys with great arms.. Jeff George comes to mind.. I want to see a consistent body of work before christening the kid...

The Steelers were playing stuff the Browns run game and forcing Kizer to throw. He almost burnt their asses. Crowell only had 1.9 per carry @ 17 carries. Kizer had a better day rushing 3.4 @ 5 carries for 1 TD. At certain downs and periods in the game the Steelers brought on the pass rush when they did not need to respect the run.

The Steelers only allowed the Browns 57 rushing yards and forced Kizer to throw.

The Browns only allowed the Steelers 43 rushing yards (ben lost 8 more yards) and forced Ben to throw.

The Browns OC needs to stick with the run game longer and take some pressure off Kizer.

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Osiris    112
16 hours ago, Ghoolie said:

He got sacked 6 times. He holds the fucking ball too long. QB of the future? Are you people out of your fucking minds? His football lifeline is about 9 games long. This fucking guy is going to get physically destroyed. ENjoy him while you can. HE HOLDS ON TO THE BALL TOO TOO TOO,,,,,, WAY TOO FUCKING LONG. That, can't be fixed. He is a dimwit.

Says the guy who pegged Paxton Lynch as the best QB of the 2016 draft. Paxton Lynch, who couldn't beat a 7th round pick for a starting role. QB guru you are not. The kid is smart, but most dumb people don't recognize intelligence when they see it. 

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Ibleedbrown    54

I definitely think he's a pass first guy. Maybe a little hampered that game with only 3 WR with whom he went through camp. The chemistry will develop. More intriguing than past rookie QBs we've had. Looking forward to seeing more from the guy.

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Westside Steve    1,714
10 hours ago, Zombo said:

What the fuck do you guys want out of a 21 year old starting against a Final Four Steeler team in his first time out ... Seriously, wtf?

And yes, Westside Steve, I gave the same leniency to Brady Quinn and Johnny Manziel ... difference is ... I already knew they sucked. This kid is special.

 

Z

Not that I expected him to be Tom Brady right out of the box but the quarterback Whisperer decided that he is the best quarterback we had in a field of four. So I expect at least decent play which is what we had. I am assuming qw will advise him on the dangers of holding onto the fucking ball forever.

As I said quite a while back I am now on the kids side. He isn't the guy I wanted but he's here now. It will be wholeheartedly in his corner once he beats the Steelers. He doesn't seem like a punk and he looks like he's ready to work hard and learn.

Of my disappointments one is the durability of Myles Garrett and one is the lack of pressure on fucking Roethlisberger. I'd have been happier to see him spend more time on the turf. 

WSS

 

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Tour2ma    1,423
18 hours ago, LondonBrown said:

Yeah, he has it. Mistakes were made of course but he can be a franchise QB. There's no doubt. 

Nah... there's doubt... just less of it than we are used to...

Kizer has a great fastball... but every pitcher needs another pitch and that's what I did not see. Every ball seemed to travel the flattest trajectory possible to its target... or over its target in some cases. Touch is a wonderful thing. Flat and hard just makes any window over the under coverage smaller, e.g., TJW's fine INT yesterday.

Other things a modicum of touch brings to the passing game? Receiver adjustments for one... something we did not see yesterday. Medium and Deep accuracy for another... did we see a downfield Receiver hit in stride yesterday?

But before you can anticipate with touch you have to read the D... and clearly yesterday Kizer was not even asked to read. Hell he wasn't even asked to look beyond his primary on most plays. Most of the time he was not given a secondary target in the half of the field he turned to.

Still... baby steps... there may be a lot there to bring along. No progress since his last preseason appearance is acceptable... Week 1. Afraid it will have to be Week 2 as well on the road in BLT. Week 3 in Indy? Better see more...

 

And again... for the "get rid of the ball" crowd...

  1. To get rid of the ball you need to process options... quickly. Kizer is not being asked to do that at this time.
  2. To dump the ball, you have to be out of the pocket. Teams are going to play to contain Kizer, to keep him in the pocket. That's what the Steelers did. The times when the timer did go off in his head, he had no escape route.

And if you are in the pocket and dump the ball only two things can happen: a flag or an INT.

 

Positives? Saw some... his mechanics seemed to hold up as did his generalship in playcalling and getting to the LOS.

Babysteps...

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nickers    251
16 minutes ago, Tour2ma said:

Nah... there's doubt... just less of it than we are used to...

Kizer has a great fastball... but every pitcher needs another pitch and that's what I did not see. Every ball seemed to travel the flattest trajectory possible to its target... or over its target in some cases. Touch is a wonderful thing. Flat and hard just makes any window over the under coverage smaller, e.g., TJW's fine INT yesterday.

Other things a modicum of touch brings to the passing game? Receiver adjustments for one... something we did not see yesterday. Medium and Deep accuracy for another... did we see a downfield Receiver hit in stride yesterday?

But before you can anticipate with touch you have to read the D... and clearly yesterday Kizer was not even asked to read. Hell he wasn't even asked to look beyond his primary on most plays. Most of the time he was not given a secondary target in the half of the field he turned to.

Still... baby steps... there may be a lot there to bring along. No progress since his last preseason appearance is acceptable... Week 1. Afraid it will have to be Week 2 as well on the road in BLT. Week 3 in Indy? Better see more...

 

And again... for the "get rid of the ball" crowd...

  1. To get rid of the ball you need to process options... quickly. Kizer is not being asked to do that at this time.
  2. To dump the ball, you have to be out of the pocket. Teams are going to play to contain Kizer, to keep him in the pocket. That's what the Steelers did. The times when the timer did go off in his head, he had no escape route.

And if you are in the pocket and dump the ball only two things can happen: a flag or an INT.

 

Positives? Saw some... his mechanics seemed to hold up as did his generalship in playcalling and getting to the LOS.

Babysteps...

Great post!

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mjp28    156

As soon as he emerged as the guy I kept thinking about the Kizer vs Kosar comparisons.  Well Bernie had a lot of more college experience including a national championship and might have been a better raw NFL talent but Kizer has some good upside including a fairly good NFL arm. Bernie was also a very young starting QB, it was quite exciting back then but he had an established team around him.

It's still real early in his becoming a good NFL QB, needs his WRs to get even better, a running game to emerge and he has to stay alive for many games yet (sorry we've been through this before ).

Will be interesting to see where this goes.

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OldBrownsFan    956
1 hour ago, Tour2ma said:

Nah... there's doubt... just less of it than we are used to...

Kizer has a great fastball... but every pitcher needs another pitch and that's what I did not see. Every ball seemed to travel the flattest trajectory possible to its target... or over its target in some cases. Touch is a wonderful thing. Flat and hard just makes any window over the under coverage smaller, e.g., TJW's fine INT yesterday.

Other things a modicum of touch brings to the passing game? Receiver adjustments for one... something we did not see yesterday. Medium and Deep accuracy for another... did we see a downfield Receiver hit in stride yesterday?

But before you can anticipate with touch you have to read the D... and clearly yesterday Kizer was not even asked to read. Hell he wasn't even asked to look beyond his primary on most plays. Most of the time he was not given a secondary target in the half of the field he turned to.

Still... baby steps... there may be a lot there to bring along. No progress since his last preseason appearance is acceptable... Week 1. Afraid it will have to be Week 2 as well on the road in BLT. Week 3 in Indy? Better see more...

 

And again... for the "get rid of the ball" crowd...

  1. To get rid of the ball you need to process options... quickly. Kizer is not being asked to do that at this time.
  2. To dump the ball, you have to be out of the pocket. Teams are going to play to contain Kizer, to keep him in the pocket. That's what the Steelers did. The times when the timer did go off in his head, he had no escape route.

And if you are in the pocket and dump the ball only two things can happen: a flag or an INT.

 

Positives? Saw some... his mechanics seemed to hold up as did his generalship in playcalling and getting to the LOS.

Babysteps...

Good analysis Tour except I would say his baby steps were very good ones . Zombo summed it up that this was a rookie QB playing his first NFL game against the Steelers and overall gave a very good account of himself. He should only get better with more experience. Everything I read about Kizer is that he has excellent work habits and Hue should be able to develop him. Hate to lose to the Steelers but we gave them all they could handle. 

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The Gipper    1,168
19 hours ago, Ghoolie said:

He got sacked 6 times. He holds the fucking ball too long. QB of the future? Are you people out of your fucking minds? His football lifeline is about 9 games long. This fucking guy is going to get physically destroyed. ENjoy him while you can. HE HOLDS ON TO THE BALL TOO TOO TOO,,,,,, WAY TOO FUCKING LONG. That, can't be fixed. He is a dimwit.

You claim it cannot be fixed.  Yet such a thing has happened to many, many young QBs....and they were fixed.   Why do you think it cannot be fixed in Kizer when so many others were able to do so?

Or is it actually you saying "I know it can probably be fixed...I just don'w want it to be so that I can continue to make myself happy by being an old whiny, griping, cranky, growling malcontent...who feeds off the misery of others".?

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Tour2ma    1,423
1 hour ago, mjp28 said:

As soon as he emerged as the guy I kept thinking about the Kizer vs Kosar comparisons.  Well Bernie had a lot of more college experience including a national championship and might have been a better raw NFL talent but Kizer has some good upside including a fairly good NFL arm. Bernie was also a very young starting QB, it was quite exciting back then but he had an established team around him.

For Bernie the switch had already flipped... he could read a D game one. Almost a case of "had to" as he did not have the physical gifts Kizer does. Seems like physical gifts Retard the development of young QBs UNLESS they are sons of QBs or coaches. One thing Bernie had in abundance? Touch...

Good point on the relative teams Bernie and Kizer joined. The '85 Browns were further along than we are.

36 minutes ago, OldBrownsFan said:

Good analysis Tour except I would say his baby steps were very good ones .

Thanks... and just to be clear I'm not down on Kizer, but he's got a long way to go.

  • Upvote 1

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The Gipper    1,168
11 hours ago, Ghoolie said:

I was at the Browns Backers get together with my friends. Ron Fittes, Ron Darling, Mike Fittes and a few other long timers. I told them I fully expected a successful 2 point conversion.................followed by Ben and company making plays to end the game. I boasted that the TD and conversion meant absolutely nothing. SO, the look on my face was calm. I expected it. What I would have liked to see, was the looks on your faces when Ben broke the Browns back with a really well thrown long ball.........

Ahhhhhh................not THOSE would have been some sour faces.

A scare? How was it a scare? he Steelers had the ball and the lead? What scare are you talking about? 

You know, this is the same shit with you guys every fucking year. And still, no matter how many times I tell you jackoffs ahead of time EXACLTY what you will say after the loss, you guys STILL say this stupid shit.............

If only we make that play......If the ref doesn't throw that flag, we win.......Take away that one play, and we win. Fuck dude, it doesn't work that way. From the Steeler side there are just as many IF only moments.............he Steelers basically gave the browns 75% of the yards on their last drive. IF THE STEELERS DON'T MAKE THOSE STUPID PENALTIES THEY WIN BY 18 POINTS.    IF BEN DOESN'T UNCHARACTERISTICALLY MISS TWO WIDE OPEN WRS ON LONG PASSES, THIS IS A BLOWOUT........

The Browns got beat. They got outplayed. When they needed plays, they had no playmakers. Big Bad Greg Williams sure didn't do anything but kiss Bens nutsack on the last Steeler drive, did he?

7 sacks. All I head for the last 17 years is how we need a great OL. So you got it. What difference did it make in this game? 7 fucking sacks. Why? NO PLAYMAKERS ON OFFENSE. The blocked punt meant nothing. We were punting deep and Ben would have had great field position. The would have driven for a TD in all likelyhood. Then the Browns last TD never would have happened, time woudl have expired.

Look dude, you can't rewrite the fucking game. The Browns got their ass handed to them at home. 0 -1 and the Ravens won't be any easier. Once again, the Browns players got laid out. Without all the bad ref calls, The Steelers win this by 18 points. None of that shit matters. They made plays, they wiped their ass with WIlliams pussy ass defense, and they sacked the living shit out of Black Tarkenton. Seriously, Kizer Blows.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

So....if BR misses long passes...its just fluky.  But if Kizer misses long passes its that he is a bad QB. I mean, Jesus, you really are a cuntservative....the kind that lies to everyone...but mostly lies to himself.  I mean,  have you been to the gynocologist lately...because your menstrual cyle really is off kilter.:o

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The Gipper    1,168
3 hours ago, nickers said:

I've seen a lot of guys with great arms.. Jeff George comes to mind.. I want to see a consistent body of work before christening the kid...

And just how are you going to see that in a guy that has played one game in his career.  I don't think anyone is 
Christening him....(but note....a Christening comes right after birth...so maybe a "christening IS appropriate".   Perhaps what you want to say is that you are not "Confirming" him or "Ordaining" him.

Those would be more accurate analogies.

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Tour2ma    1,423

Jeff George did not have the work ethic...

 

Good summary article in The Sporting News... http://www.sportingnews.com/nfl/news/deshone-kizer-cleveland-browns-quarterback-qb-stats-sacks-steelers/1un8i5udifdxp1oac088mkynvt

A couple excerpts... underlining added...

Quote

There's no need to anoint Kizer as the guy — future, franchise or any other superlative — after one game. The Browns are starting their second trip through the quarterback alphabet since 1999, and Kizer, i.e. No. 27, showed enough in his debut that Cleveland should be comfortable monitoring his progress. Browns coach Hue Jackson made it clear Kizer earned the right to be in this position.

 

Kizer didn't get a chance at the end of game, but he prepared as if that would happen. Cleveland fans should be prepared for what's next. This doesn't feel like the false hope given by former first-round picks such as Tim Couch, Brady Quinn, Brandon Weeden and Johnny Manziel. Couch presided over a 43-0 loss to Pittsburgh in the Browns' return to Cleveland in 1999. Weeden threw four interception in his debut in 2012.

This Week 1 felt different even though it came in a loss. Browns fans have heard that speech 27 times, but perhaps Kizer is that player. Who else played the Steelers this close right away? That's why Jackson emphasized protecting the second-round pick. The defense did its part. Now the protection and running game must follow.

 

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nickers    251
1 hour ago, The Gipper said:

And just how are you going to see that in a guy that has played one game in his career.  I don't think anyone is 
Christening him....(but note....a Christening comes right after birth...so maybe a "christening IS appropriate".   Perhaps what you want to say is that you are not "Confirming" him or "Ordaining" him.

Those would be more accurate analogies.

Anoint works but all the same.. I'm not putting all My eggs in his basket..  I just want to see a few games before proclaiming him the savior.

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