The Gipper Posted September 2, 2017 Report Share Posted September 2, 2017 2 minutes ago, Vagitron said: Good thing his contract is incentive laden. If he doesnt and hes great we know who will be sad. Incentive laden? I thought that the Steelers were giving him a straight 7 million bucks. Are you saying that if he sucks he won't collect all that? As for who will be sad....PoG maybe. Right now it seems that the Browns defense is better off without him...even if he does reasonably well over there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dutch Oven Posted September 2, 2017 Report Share Posted September 2, 2017 7 minutes ago, PoeticG said: I find that hard to believe. I'm a coach so I know what to look for in talent. My soccer team went to the championship last year and we are undefeated this season. This guy can't be real. There's no way someone would actually say this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vagitron Posted September 2, 2017 Report Share Posted September 2, 2017 Just now, The Gipper said: Incentive laden? I thought that the Steelers were giving him a straight 7 million bucks. Are you saying that if he sucks he won't collect all that? As for who will be sad....PoG maybe. Right now it seems that the Browns defense is better off without him...even if he does reasonably well over there. He gets that but the following 2 years he can be cut without a ton of dead money. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Gipper Posted September 2, 2017 Report Share Posted September 2, 2017 2 minutes ago, PoeticG said: I have a player on my team that also plays football, he's actually doing both right now. I started coaching him when I was still tying his shoes. He's a playmaker and actually scored twice today. His Older brother was just signed by the Broncos. Devante Thomas? Hope he makes the cut. When you are hired by the Broncos...or any NFL team let us know. Just because you have a nefarious association with a guy doesn't make you a talent evaluator. My nephew graduated HS with LeBron James. Does that mean that the Cavs should hire me as a scout? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Gipper Posted September 2, 2017 Report Share Posted September 2, 2017 Just now, Vagitron said: He gets that but the following 2 years he can be cut without a ton of dead money. OK, right. Well, that is any NFL contract basically (except Brock Osweiler's Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bjh2130 Posted September 2, 2017 Report Share Posted September 2, 2017 2 hours ago, Gafreleets said: Yes, but do you understand that whether it was a new contract or restructuring of a old one....... they were STILL willing to pay him 7mill a year. That's just not something you do for someone who isn't starter capable or is (as one of your posters said) the 4th or 5th best CB on the team. Know what every other team in the NFL pays CBs that aren't starter capable or are the 4th or 5th best CB on their team? Me neither, but I guarantee it isn't 7 million dollars. So must be something left in the tank if you guys were willing to part with that type of money. Potentially trying to get him to restructure in order to make him more enticing for a trade? No one would trade for a broke down cb commanding 11 million a year. You are saying you guys still wanted to pay him 7 million a year like we were offering him a new contract. He was already under a contract we had him regardless. If the rumor is true we were offering to eat part of his salary in a trade then if we really wanted to keep him at 7 why just cut him outright at 11 million unless we truly didn't want him? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bjh2130 Posted September 2, 2017 Report Share Posted September 2, 2017 3 hours ago, PoeticG said: Make no mistake. Joe is 100% again and every bit worth the contract he was given two years ago. We fucked up. Just admit it. We got cute and disrespected Joe and be burned us for doing so. Lol we cut him. It's not like we got cute and offered him a smaller contract as a free agent and he left us for our rivals. We saw him get burnt time and time again by our middling wr core and cut ties cause he can't hack it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vagitron Posted September 2, 2017 Report Share Posted September 2, 2017 17 minutes ago, bjh2130 said: Lol we cut him. It's not like we got cute and offered him a smaller contract as a free agent and he left us for our rivals. We saw him get burnt time and time again by our middling wr core and cut ties cause he can't hack it. I dont know what to expect from him but you cut him because you didnt want to pay him 11m. The browns offered him 7 which is what the steelers are paying and he declined. So yes you cut him but the browns would have kept him if he accepted the reduced salary. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tour2ma Posted September 2, 2017 Report Share Posted September 2, 2017 4 hours ago, PoeticG said: Vintage and a Heathy Joe Haden. Jamar Taylor. Body-Count. Peppers. Kindred. Pryor. I would be perfectly content with that backfield over ANY other in the NFL. There you go again... You've not been without your share of hits, but you have to let go of some of your misses to get credit for the hits. For example... 4 hours ago, PoeticG said: Trent Richardson had a better season his rookie year with Weeden at QB than Crowell has had in 3 seasons. The most salient fact in your comparison is that Crow has had three seasons with which to compare TR's pre-bust, one-hit wonder... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bjh2130 Posted September 4, 2017 Report Share Posted September 4, 2017 On 9/2/2017 at 3:16 PM, Vagitron said: I dont know what to expect from him but you cut him because you didnt want to pay him 11m. The browns offered him 7 which is what the steelers are paying and he declined. So yes you cut him but the browns would have kept him if he accepted the reduced salary. Who is to say they weren't offering that to make him more trade friendly? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vagitron Posted September 5, 2017 Report Share Posted September 5, 2017 6 hours ago, bjh2130 said: Who is to say they weren't offering that to make him more trade friendly? How does that even make any sense? They asked him to reduce his salary and he said no and he was released. The browns wanting him or not wanting him isnt going to effect how other teams evaluate him. Frankly despite his recent injuries i think the browns with all the cap room made a mistake in cutting him. I guess we will all find out soon enough. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hoorta Posted September 5, 2017 Report Share Posted September 5, 2017 On 9/2/2017 at 0:04 PM, PoeticG said: I find that hard to believe. I'm a coach so I know what to look for in talent. My soccer team went to the championship last year and we are undefeated this season. Believe it. Soccer has about nothing to do with football. Sure, Richardson had a semi-decent rookie year, and then totally flamed out with 2 different teams. It was more than not having a FB to block for him. He's out of football- probably for good. I'll grant you Mathieu and Carr, but Derek wasn't exactly rocket science. My opinion was anyone but Manziel. BTW, Tyrann got kicked off of LSU for repeated drug violations, and posted a whopping (harhar) 4 reps at 225. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bjh2130 Posted September 5, 2017 Report Share Posted September 5, 2017 1 hour ago, Vagitron said: How does that even make any sense? They asked him to reduce his salary and he said no and he was released. The browns wanting him or not wanting him isnt going to effect how other teams evaluate him. Frankly despite his recent injuries i think the browns with all the cap room made a mistake in cutting him. I guess we will all find out soon enough. They knew that other teams would be more likely to trade for him if he didn't have as high of a salary? Maybe they knew no one would trade for a cb who is getting paid lock down corner money at 11 mil/yr when he is no longer a lock down corner. If he is only making 7 maybe a team would be willing to trade for him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TexasAg1969 Posted September 5, 2017 Report Share Posted September 5, 2017 On 9/2/2017 at 11:04 AM, PoeticG said: I find that hard to believe. I'm a coach so I know what to look for in talent. My soccer team went to the championship last year and we are undefeated this season. Ok I have to admit I laughed. My first thought was that sounds like the guy who knows how things work because he stayed at the Holiday Inn Express last night. I don't want to take away from that soccer accomplishment, but it's not football, just futbol. Totally different skill sets except for kickers (GB's Crosby converted from the soccer field in HS) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
miktoxic Posted September 5, 2017 Report Share Posted September 5, 2017 Yeah so can we get to week one already when everyone will bitch and point fingers? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
broganreynik Posted September 5, 2017 Report Share Posted September 5, 2017 On 9/2/2017 at 11:04 AM, PoeticG said: I find that hard to believe. I'm a coach so I know what to look for in talent. My soccer team went to the championship last year and we are undefeated this season. This is sarcasm, right? Has to be. Although the following posts make it seem more straight-shooting. Please tell me this is just great deadpan self-depracating sarcasm. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nickers Posted September 5, 2017 Report Share Posted September 5, 2017 On 9/2/2017 at 11:58 AM, Vagitron said: The guy has been playing on a bad groin for the last two seasons. He wont have to be the number one corner and the steelers wouldnt have paid him 7m if they didnt think he had anything left. I have no expectations but if hes fully healthy the signing is substantial. I dont believe he will be prime joe haden but i think he will be solid and thats all the steelers need. Solid. Once you have groin tears its pretty hard to get back to any respectable level.. With Joe you basically have to keep everything in front of him.. But I expect joe to get burned.. And often.. It just is what it is... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Gipper Posted September 5, 2017 Report Share Posted September 5, 2017 12 hours ago, Vagitron said: How does that even make any sense? They asked him to reduce his salary and he said no and he was released. The browns wanting him or not wanting him isnt going to effect how other teams evaluate him. Frankly despite his recent injuries i think the browns with all the cap room made a mistake in cutting him. I guess we will all find out soon enough. Well.....there may be the rub. Despite having all that cap room....the Browns FO, with their analytics based approach still believe that despite the fact that they have tons of cap room do NOT want to overpay for players based on performance....unless absolutely necessary. It WAS necessary for them to eat Osweiler's contract. But how do you think this FO analyzed that...to come up with a solution? Cut that 16 mill from the roster somewhere else. And Haden and Greco were that somewhere else. Get rid of aging veterans with high salaries that are not performing up to their salaries. That IS a mantra of this FO....n/w/s anything having to do with how much cap space they may have. And, another side of this is that they may be adhering to the Bill Belichick philosophy: Better to get rid of a guy a year early than a year late. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tour2ma Posted September 5, 2017 Report Share Posted September 5, 2017 4 hours ago, nickers said: Once you have groin tears its pretty hard to get back to any respectable level.. With Joe you basically have to keep everything in front of him.. But I expect joe to get burned.. And often.. It just is what it is... Which for a corner is pretty much the game... in a zone... The ESPN analysis of Joe's game that I referred to a few days ago made your point. Showed him in his prime vs now. Before he had no fear of trailing. Now he was turning very early to keep the play in front of him. And when the WR cut off the route his recovery cuts were now rounded. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dutch Oven Posted September 5, 2017 Report Share Posted September 5, 2017 How much was Greco going to make this year? I was more upset about them cutting him than Haden... Nice to have versatile veteran backups, especially when Bitonio has not been exactly the most durable player. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tour2ma Posted September 6, 2017 Report Share Posted September 6, 2017 Greco was due to make $3.2mm IIRC... I know it was $3-something. Were he the same Greco I saw going into 2016, then I'd agree... but he wasn't. It is worth noting that John has not yet been signed by anyone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Gipper Posted September 6, 2017 Report Share Posted September 6, 2017 12 minutes ago, Tour2ma said: Greco was due to make $3.2mm IIRC... I know it was $3-something. Were he the same Greco I saw going into 2016, then I'd agree... but he wasn't. It is worth noting that John has not yet been signed by anyone. So, I suspect it was certainly not all about the money in ditching Greco...as apparently he wasn't making all that much. I guess they just wanted to ditch just about everyone over a certain age. Now...only JT, Colquitt and McCourty are on this team who are 30 or over. JT and Colquitt both 32, McCourty is 30. That includes anyone on the IR or PS. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tour2ma Posted September 6, 2017 Report Share Posted September 6, 2017 16 minutes ago, The Gipper said: I guess they just wanted to ditch just about everyone over a certain age. Bad guess... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mjp28 Posted September 6, 2017 Report Share Posted September 6, 2017 16 minutes ago, The Gipper said: So, I suspect it was certainly not all about the money in ditching Greco...as apparently he wasn't making all that much. I guess they just wanted to ditch just about everyone over a certain age. Now...only JT, Colquitt and McCourty are on this team who are 30 or over. JT and Colquitt both 32, McCourty is 30. That includes anyone on the IR or PS. This is where the FO earns it's money (if you can say that now $$$$), almost as important as picking the draft picks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
medicineman Posted September 6, 2017 Report Share Posted September 6, 2017 Who gives a shit now they are gone, Let's talk about moving forward and see if they will lower ticket prices since we can't put together a winning ef'n team. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Gipper Posted September 6, 2017 Report Share Posted September 6, 2017 29 minutes ago, Tour2ma said: Bad guess... Perfectly accurate guess.....as except for JT....who this FO would likely have traded if Jimmy had not put the kibosh on it, and a punter.....only McCourty is 30.....and he is just 30. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tour2ma Posted September 6, 2017 Report Share Posted September 6, 2017 No... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Gipper Posted September 6, 2017 Report Share Posted September 6, 2017 10 minutes ago, Tour2ma said: No... Then lets hear your twisted logic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gafreleets Posted September 7, 2017 Report Share Posted September 7, 2017 I think the Clowns may have well and truly f*cked up. By all accounts Haden is having no speed or quickness issues and is in no way overmatched on either AB or Bryant. Also reported that he was able to match step for step with DHB.... arguably the fastest player on our team. http://pit.247sports.com/Bolt/LOOK-Joe-Haden-takes-on-Martavis-Bryant-in-practice-107052846 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Gipper Posted September 7, 2017 Report Share Posted September 7, 2017 5 minutes ago, Gafreleets said: I think the Clowns may have well and truly f*cked up. By all accounts Haden is having no speed or quickness issues and is in no way overmatched on either AB or Bryant. Also reported that he was able to match step for step with DHB.... arguably the fastest player on our team. http://pit.247sports.com/Bolt/LOOK-Joe-Haden-takes-on-Martavis-Bryant-in-practice-107052846 Sounds like a self serving ...and not necessarily true, statement. If he is so fast and quick....why was that not the case throughout the preseason here? Because it was not. He couldn't keep up with Rashard Higgins and Ricardo Louis.....not quite on par with AB. Was he faking it or dogging it because he didn't want to play for Greg Williams, who had challenged him? Or, maybe, as many have said...including your ilk: Haden will perform better in the Steeler's zone rather than in the man to man that Williams runs. Maybe that is what is happening Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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