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Wtf is happening in Charlottesville?

htownbrown

By htownbrown
in POLITICAL DISCUSSION

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calfoxwc Grand Master

calfoxwc

Posted
Posted

and, there is a historical motive to erasing the history - you can re-fake history

and create a new country. Fighting out Constitution at every turn is part of that.

Fighting against God

 

https://www.ammoland.com/2017/08/if-we-erase-our-history-who-are-we/?utm_source=Ammoland+Subscribers&utm_campaign=5194b5b5ac-RSS_EMAIL_CAMPAIGN&utm_medium=email&utm_term=0_6f6fac3eaa-5194b5b5ac-20770865#axzz4ppopU0tE

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Westside Steve Grand Master

Westside Steve

Posted
Posted

Butcher? Definitely makes it sound worse.... But you're telling me the world is different now? Weird.

 

Also, this really has nothing to do with the specific territorial boundaries.

 

Yes, we defected during the revolution. We were rebels. Got it. From our perspective, as the USA, that's clearly different than the leaders that attempted to defect against us.

 

Yes, I realize they were still Americans at the time, many fought because they had no choice, etc etc. I still don't see why we would honor and celebrate those that led the rebellion against us.

http://listverse.com/2013/03/17/10-war-crimes-of-the-us-civil-war/

 

So should statues and Memorials of both armies from the Civil War be eradicated? And if not why?

 

WSS

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MLD Woody Grand Master

MLD Woody

Posted
Posted

 

The pulling down of the confederate statue in North Carolina by a mob was ISIS like. Let the people decide these things such as the mayors and city councils not an unruly anarchist mob. The mayors and city councils are representing the people and the will of the people in their cities.

Protestors had Nazi flags and doing Nazi solutes. Can I say the American right are basically Nazis now?
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Sober Poet Newbie

Sober Poet

Posted
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On my lunch break, so no time to go on and on. I'll be brief.

 

Lots of talk about Civil War monuments here. I lived in Gettysburg for 7 years and worked next door to the college's Civil War Institute, which was run by an R E Lee expert. I even offered battlefield tours.

 

Perhaps there is a distinction between a battlefield memorial and other types? Battlefield memorials are essentially a static history lesson. Men (typically) were featured in the geographic areas where they served and their actions and deeds were memorialized with statues, sometimes by their home states or their military units, and sometimes by grateful private investors. Ironically, I see it as a form of healing the nation after the conflict.

 

The issue gets cloudy when the statues are erected in other places that are not battlefields. For instance, many of the men featured in these types of statues were also leaders in other areas: civics, economics, etc., in their home states. In my opinion, it is not out of place to have memorials of these particular men that are not on battlefields, since they achieved and served their states outside the war itself. If all a man did was kill and maim during the war, no matter how impressive a man he was, I would be less supportive of memorializing him off a battlefield proper for the reasons I have cited, except perhaps in his hometown. I think the residents there should decide for themselves.

 

So, Lee at Charlottesville then. Actually, the Battle of Rio Hill near Charlottesville involved some of the major players in the entire war. I am talking about George Custer and JEB Stuart in particular. Stuart was Lee's right hand man essentially (after Stonewall Jackson), and the battle was within miles of town, so I personally do not see a huge issue with the Lee statue (I admit I do not know the statue's particular history at this point).

 

Now, Jefferson Davis's direct descendant (great grandson) actually believes the Lee memorial should be moved:

 

“The [Confederate] monuments reflect a part of history that needs to be still preserved,” Bertram Hayes-Davis, a direct descendant of the president of the short-lived Confederate States of America, tells Newsweek. But “if such monuments are on public property and they offend any part of our population, then they should appropriately be relocated to a place where that history can still be taught without affecting those who don’t want to have that history.”

 

Again, I disagree with the "public property" qualifier (I consider the Gettysburg Battlefield to be "public property" for instance). Hayes-Davis thinks they should be placed in a museum for instance. I consider battlefields to be museums essentially.

 

Henry Adams has one of the most famous quotes about Lee:

 

"I think [Robert E.] Lee should have been hanged. It was all the worse that he was a good man, had a good character, and acted conscientiously. It's always the good men who do the most harm."

I do not agree with Adams personally. Lee's surrender was honorable and prevented ongoing massive guerrilla conflicts. His efforts and cachet were instrumental in closing the war and ending conflict.

 

Ironically, I hear that both the left and right are "ISIS" in that the one tears down statues (like in Iraq) while the other runs over people (like in Europe) to express political opinions. Obviously, in this instance, one is far worse than the other, since statues can be recreated and lives cannot.

 

People calling for a new civil war are misguided in my view. I think they overlook the devastation that accompanied the last civil war. Face it, Americans are fighters and would do a hell of a lot of damage, except this time, whoever controls the drones and surveillance (and, let us not forget, nukes and chemicals) is pretty much unstoppable. It would not even be close.

 

I see a need to dial back the rhetoric all the way around. If you are ready to die for your cause, maybe you should consider setting yourself on fire as a protest, it would be the same result, more or less.

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calfoxwc Grand Master

calfoxwc

Posted
Posted

all this is liberal activist phony offense. They take down a confederate historical war hero

statue because he had slaves.

 

but it's okay with them that the democrats started our being racist oriented. they are fine with

Byrd of WV...who was a member of the KKK.

 

They dishonestly manufacture victimhood and offense for political expediency and free stuff.

 

Some blacks owned slaves. Do they want to tear down all black folks? tear down a statue of

MLK ?

 

There were white slaves and servants, too.

 

http://www.ironbarkresources.com/slaves/whiteslaves09.htm

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calfoxwc Grand Master

calfoxwc

Posted
Posted

http://conservative-headlines.com/2012/03/americas-first-slave-owner-was-a-black-man/

 

"By 1830 there were 3,775 black families living in the South who owned black slaves. By 1860 there were about 3,000 slaves owned by black households in the city of New Orleans alone."

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BaconHound Newbie

BaconHound

Posted
Posted

Maybe you did disagree with Obama for never saying Muslim terrorists even after the hundreds of thousands of people died. In this case there's one. And people, your friends in the media, are freaking out because Trump didn't come to the podium in a frenzy. Beyond the Muslim terrorist reference did President Obama ever refer to the BLM group has black terrorists even after the police officers were murdered? Or ever? And if you disagreed with that do you think there was an equal Firestorm across the board in the media?

 

WSS

 

 

Not equal but measured. I do believe there are more media outlets that lean liberal but that's not to say the Fox News, Blaze, etc. didn't take a pound of flesh from Obama.

 

But back to the original point, if 3 things are wrong why should we excuse any of them?

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Westside Steve Grand Master

Westside Steve

Posted
Posted

 

 

Not equal but measured. I do believe there are more media outlets that lean liberal but that's not to say the Fox News, Blaze, etc. didn't take a pound of flesh from Obama.

 

But back to the original point, if 3 things are wrong why should we excuse any of them?

I put Fox News as the opposite of MSNBC, but they aren't close to as rabid as MSNBC. I don't even really count The Blaze they are alike Salon Mother Jones Etc.

And even though I don't read The Blaze Fox News was never as 24/7 Obama hate as MSNBC is. But again back to the original point maybe I'm lost but what are the three wrong things that somebody is or isn't excusing?

 

WSS

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Unsympathetic Rising Star

Unsympathetic

Posted
Posted

I'm happy that every neo-nazi who is getting identified as going down to Charlottesville is losing their job. Gotta love the snowflakes who can't handle a private company exercising their free right to disagree with hate speech. The first amendment concerns the GOVERNMENT -- not private companies. There will very well be consequences for that speech -- just not from the .gov.

 

I think it's fun that the Nazis quoted "USA" even though.. the confederacy was precisely not America.

 

The chant of the group was "Blood and Soil" - the old Nazi chant.

 

 

James Alex Fields

The guy who ran people down was not a member of a leftist organization -- nice try, but his high school teachers and friends confirm he was fascinated with Nazi Germany. "The quiet boy was deeply into Adolf Hitler and white supremacy."

 

Also -- he's on record beating his mother.. on multiple occasions. She's disabled and uses a wheelchair. Just stop - now - because each person posting attempting to defend this guy is simply showing themselves to be a monster. He, as a person, is indefensible. And furthermore his mother was watching his cat this weekend.

 

And he killed a woman. What a brave boy!

 

Vanguard America [not "american vanguard"] is neither socialist nor leftist -- of course it's a white nationalist hate group. Thanks, but the southern poverty law center has much more credibility than your alt-right poster.

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DieHardBrownsFan Rookie

DieHardBrownsFan

Posted
Posted

I'm happy that every neo-nazi who is getting identified as going down to Charlottesville is losing their job. Gotta love the snowflakes who can't handle a private company exercising their free right to disagree with hate speech. The first amendment concerns the GOVERNMENT -- not private companies. There will very well be consequences for that speech -- just not from the .gov.

 

I think it's fun that the Nazis quoted "USA" even though.. the confederacy was precisely not America.

 

The chant of the group was "Blood and Soil" - the old Nazi chant.

 

 

James Alex Fields

The guy who ran people down was not a member of a leftist organization -- nice try, but his high school teachers and friends confirm he was fascinated with Nazi Germany. "The quiet boy was deeply into Adolf Hitler and white supremacy."

 

Also -- he's on record beating his mother.. on multiple occasions. She's disabled and uses a wheelchair. Just stop - now - because each person posting attempting to defend this guy is simply showing themselves to be a monster. He, as a person, is indefensible. And furthermore his mother was watching his cat this weekend.

 

And he killed a woman. What a brave boy!

 

Vanguard America [not "american vanguard"] is neither socialist nor leftist -- of course it's a white nationalist hate group. Thanks, but the southern poverty law center has much more credibility than your alt-right poster.

It's a Soro's spy. "unsympathetic", the MA fag.

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jbluhm86 Enthusiast

jbluhm86

Posted
Posted

They're all lying, including Fox

 

20799546_1412994768737266_89156108057514

 

 

He's been on the roster of the Cleveland based chapter for 7 yrs

 

Uh, idk what you've been reading, but Vanguard America is a white supremacist org; probably the last place a SJW would be welcome:

 

https://www.splcenter.org/hatewatch/2017/08/12/alleged-charlottesville-driver-who-killed-one-rallied-alt-right-vanguard-america-group

 

 

fields-vanguardamerica.png

The driver is second from the left in the photo. Not exactly the outfit of a SJW.

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OldBrownsFan Newbie

OldBrownsFan

Posted
Posted

I'm happy that every neo-nazi who is getting identified as going down to Charlottesville is losing their job. Gotta love the snowflakes who can't handle a private company exercising their free right to disagree with hate speech. The first amendment concerns the GOVERNMENT -- not private companies. There will very well be consequences for that speech -- just not from the .gov.

 

I think it's fun that the Nazis quoted "USA" even though.. the confederacy was precisely not America.

 

The chant of the group was "Blood and Soil" - the old Nazi chant.

 

 

James Alex Fields

The guy who ran people down was not a member of a leftist organization -- nice try, but his high school teachers and friends confirm he was fascinated with Nazi Germany. "The quiet boy was deeply into Adolf Hitler and white supremacy."

 

Also -- he's on record beating his mother.. on multiple occasions. She's disabled and uses a wheelchair. Just stop - now - because each person posting attempting to defend this guy is simply showing themselves to be a monster. He, as a person, is indefensible. And furthermore his mother was watching his cat this weekend.

 

And he killed a woman. What a brave boy!

 

Vanguard America [not "american vanguard"] is neither socialist nor leftist -- of course it's a white nationalist hate group. Thanks, but the southern poverty law center has much more credibility than your alt-right poster.

 

And the chant of black lives matter was pigs (police) in a blanket fry em like bacon. Unlike the mainstream left most mainstream conservatives roundly condemn hate groups like the KKK or neo nazis and the mainstream left needs to start denouncing the haters on the left.

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MLD Woody Grand Master

MLD Woody

Posted
Posted

Uh, idk what you've been reading, but Vanguard America is a white supremacist org; probably the last place a SJW would be welcome:

 

https://www.splcenter.org/hatewatch/2017/08/12/alleged-charlottesville-driver-who-killed-one-rallied-alt-right-vanguard-america-group

 

 

fields-vanguardamerica.png

The driver is second from the left in the photo. Not exactly the outfit of a SJW.

If Axe sees it in a meme, it has to be true

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BaconHound Newbie

BaconHound

Posted
Posted

I put Fox News as the opposite of MSNBC, but they aren't close to as rabid as MSNBC. I don't even really count The Blaze they are alike Salon Mother Jones Etc.

And even though I don't read The Blaze Fox News was never as 24/7 Obama hate as MSNBC is. But again back to the original point maybe I'm lost but what are the three wrong things that somebody is or isn't excusing?

 

WSS

 

 

Obama not mentioning Islamic Terrorism and more stringently denouncing violence against law enforcement as retaliation. Trump not condemning the "white nationalist" movement as racist and not referring to the attack as domestic terrorism.

 

All wrong in my book.

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calfoxwc Grand Master

calfoxwc

Posted
Posted

here's what I don't get. All this outrage over Trump not saying the white nationalists are bad....

 

but making a general statement.

 

would they want him to talk about the black guy with a homemade hand flamethrower?

I saw that clearly on Fox News.

 

sure..."antifa not hateful"... "black lives only matter" not racist. All more

fake posturing for political power leverage to stop the president that isn't

the one they wanted.

 

bunch of asswholes - both the white nationalist AND blm are very bad. and antifa is worse.

I agree with what Trump said the first time.

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