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Zombo

Kamp Kizer

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Other than the bad arm comment, I'm with Rooster. A rocket arm with no brain guiding it nets you a Brandon Wee-done or a Jeff George. I won't hold Kizer guilty to the flops of the other ND bums Quinn and Clausen pickle, but I have an aversion to Golden Domers. Plus, I have to trust my own eyes. The times I've watched Kaiser he's pretty much sucked.

 

Trubisky or bust. No interest in Watson or Kizer. If we're going developmental, give me Mahomes.

 

Ok, his "brains" are considered an asset, so we'll bypass that.

 

We'll bypass the personal Notre Dame thing, doesn't mean a damn thing.

 

You say you've watched him and he "sucked". OK. I'll respect that.

 

The one time I watched Trub he kinda sucked too.

 

Kizer looked like the big classic pocket passer to me, with ideal size and mobility to boot.

 

His problem has been inconsistency, that is a tag on Trub too.

 

Watson seems like the "safe" pick, Kizer seems the most pro-ready and best athlete, Trub has a tantalizing arm and a high ceiling.

 

I ain't going with the safe guy. And from what I've seen and read of Kizer and Trub, I am significantly more impressed with Kizer as pro prospect.

 

So ... you go ahead and go "Trub or Bust" ... I'm going to respectfully disagree, Kizer is easily at the top of the three for me, but I could see the Browns liking any of them.

 

Zombo

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Most men do in the mornings

Ah....maybe one player the Browns have in mind does

 

Who is that top FA? Cialis Campbell DE currently with the Cards?

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Not sure why yet another QB thread has to be turned into a Trubs debate, but whatever...

 

 

On Kizer...

 

I was in this "Kamp" early. My basis was a holdover memory of Kizer's 2015 play. In the little I saw in 2016 there was no drop off that I could not attribute to inferior talent around him. Then I broke down his tape and promptly folded my tent.

 

His release is too slow. His wandering throwing motion is too elongated. It's not even close to being adequate. For a comparison I needed to look no further than Josh McCown. In the end it will render every positive attribute he has, or develops, moot.

 

 

And no, it cannot be fixed...

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I like Trubisky better but I'm perfectly content to roll with Kessler (or Griffin) and use the pick to develop the rest of the team.

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And no, it cannot be fixed...

 

Because .... ?

 

Zombo

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If tall with big hands is all we are really looking for then let's go sign Yao Ming to play QB.

 

Guess I should've used the pink font eh?

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My concern with the QB Hue decides on is "who are we on offense." Mitch has a major upside on deep ball accuracy throws over anybody in this draft. But our OL allows no time to get deep or WR's get held up at line mostly legally & some our just bad at route running to open areas. Mitch gets & got in trouble against a fair Stanford back end on things I've seen all season..Mitch at times holds the ball at times that then comes out late on mid yardage routes. Both were picked off by Stanford. If Hue wants to continue to play a semi WCO & get the ball out of the QB's hands Nate Peterman at Pitt is a guy you can get later, that I like over Webb. Watson will work as hard as Jamius Winstead at his game but without his frame or arm strength. Kizer has the frame, just not much touch on any of his passes. No leadership skills in this QB class might be the desperately missing thing again we need with this young group. That leaves Me with WaTson hopefully growing into Kizer's size

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Guess I should've used the pink font eh?

OOPs, yep.....unless I was actually serious. Maybe Yao is a bit old.

 

But hell....look at this:

 

Here's a list of hand spread measurements of notable NBA players:

LeBron James - 9.25"

 

Trubisky has larger hands. Hell....I HAVE larger hands

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Ok, his "brains" are considered an asset, so we'll bypass that.

 

We'll bypass the personal Notre Dame thing, doesn't mean a damn thing.

You say you've watched him and he "sucked". OK. I'll respect that.

 

The one time I watched Trub he kinda sucked too.

 

Kizer looked like the big classic pocket passer to me, with ideal size and mobility to boot.

His problem has been inconsistency, that is a tag on Trub too.

 

Watson seems like the "safe" pick, Kizer seems the most pro-ready and best athlete, Trub has a tantalizing arm and a high ceiling.

 

I ain't going with the safe guy. And from what I've seen and read of Kizer and Trub, I am significantly more impressed with Kizer as pro prospect.

 

So ... you go ahead and go "Trub or Bust" ... I'm going to respectfully disagree, Kizer is easily at the top of the three for me, but I could see the Browns liking any of them.

 

Zombo

 

I wasn't talking about his intelligence Z no doubt he's a smart kid. (if that was a big selling point- Ryan Fitzpatrick should be one of the best qbs in the NFL.) I was talking about on field smarts. Too many dumb decisions. I don't want to turn this into another Mitch thread, but he probably has the fastest release of the top prospects. I'm no mechanics guru, but I'll trust Tour's opinion about Mr Slow windup.

 

Sure Trubs tossed a terrible pick six against Stanford, but what pro qb hasn't had the same thing happen to him? Sorry if this is morphing into another qb debate, but it's getting deep into the silly season.

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Well, this is a Camp Kizer thread....so it should be part of the QB debate. As for it being the silly season....well, I have seen sillier seasons.....like when I used to play golf.

 

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OOPs, yep.....unless I was actually serious. Maybe Yao is a bit old.

 

But hell....look at this:

 

Here's a list of hand spread measurements of notable NBA players:

LeBron James - 9.25"

 

Trubisky has larger hands. Hell....I HAVE larger hands

 

Johnny "Big Hands" measured out at 10". Makes it easier to grab one of those 1.75s of Don Julio. FWIW, Deforest Buckner tied the record with 11 3\4 mitts.

 

There was an article on DBN that pretty much said hand size is a poor predictor of NFL qb success. As long as you're 9-1\2 (average) it's no big deal.

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Johnny "Big Hands" measured out at 10". Makes it easier to grab one of those 1.75s of Don Julio. FWIW, Deforest Buckner tied the record with 11 3\4 mitts.

 

There was an article on DBN that pretty much said hand size is a poor predictor of NFL qb success. As long as you're 9-1\2 (average) it's no big deal.

What is foot size indicative of?

AdultRoasters7.png

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What is foot size indicative of?

 

 

Bigger shoes

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Ah....maybe one player the Browns have in mind does

 

Who is that top FA? Cialis Campbell DE currently with the Cards?

 

Well, scratch Trumaine Johnson off the list. :(

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What is foot size indicative of?

AdultRoasters7.png

 

That the odds are better of getting them stepped on (if you're a qb) by your center?

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Well, scratch Trumaine Johnson off the list. :(

You mean the guy with the True Main Johnson?

( I thought that was Lyndon)

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Because .... ?

 

Zombo

 

Because after playing QB for years and years throwing motions don't change. You can tinker around the edges with grip. You can focus and improve footwork. You can even modify arm angle. But the path the ball takes from two hands on it around mid-torso to the release point is locked in early.

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Because after playing QB for years and years throwing motions don't change. You can tinker around the edges with grip. You can focus and improve footwork. You can even modify arm angle. But the path the ball takes from two hands on it around mid-torso to the release point is locked in early.

 

You sound so authoritative, that I hate to ask if there is another school of thought.

 

Doesn't that former middling relief pitcher, Tom House, retrain QBs how to throw and improve their mechanics?

 

Zombo

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I wasn't talking about his intelligence Z no doubt he's a smart kid. (if that was a big selling point- Ryan Fitzpatrick should be one of the best qbs in the NFL.) I was talking about on field smarts. Too many dumb decisions. I don't want to turn this into another Mitch thread, but he probably has the fastest release of the top prospects. I'm no mechanics guru, but I'll trust Tour's opinion about Mr Slow windup.

 

Sure Trubs tossed a terrible pick six against Stanford, but what pro qb hasn't had the same thing happen to him? Sorry if this is morphing into another qb debate, but it's getting deep into the silly season.

 

To add to that, the problem isn't even that he makes questionable decisions or tight throws that don't go his way. His bad decisions are inexcusably bad types of plays that to me just don't bode well.

 

This isn't to shit on your parade but to me Kizer is someone I wouldn't touch with a ten foot pole before the late 2nd round. I just don't see him making up that between the ears gap.

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You sound so authoritative, that I hate to ask if there is another school of thought.

 

Doesn't that former middling relief pitcher, Tom House, retrain QBs how to throw and improve their mechanics?

 

Zombo

Sometimes awkward Mechanics are not a problem. Bernie Kosar anyone? Phillip Rivers? Not that I am riding on your sand worm Muad'dib....I am just saying it may not be the thing that deters me from considering him.

 

(more geek poking)

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Not that I am riding on your sand worm Muad'dib...

 

(more geek poking)

 

Yeah ... Whatever amuses you people.

 

I have you speaking geek to me, I have Ghoolie penning love songs to me ... it's still almost two months to the draft.

 

Soooo ... let's just go ahead and see if TCPO's boss is watching:

 

Here's three chicks and a monkey copping a feel:

 

monkey-with-three-hot-girls-in-bikinis-o

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lol Look at that fucker's face ^

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You sound so authoritative, that I hate to ask if there is another school of thought.

 

Doesn't that former middling relief pitcher, Tom House, retrain QBs how to throw and improve their mechanics?

lol... and I did not stay at a Holiday Inn Express... ever...

 

There are any number of QB Whisperers out there. Few of whom were ever better than middling anythings. There is something to the old adage, "Those that can't do, teach."

 

Any certitude I have displayed here is an extrapolation of my experience as a golfer... studying, playing, being taught and even teaching. It is hard, damn hard to remake a swing. It takes months... even years to overwrite bad habits piece by piece... one at a time. And that's in a game where you are alone with no one trying to break you in two and a distraction is a bird breaking into song.

 

In other words by comparison I think it's easier to change a golf swing than a throwing motion... and it is really fucking hard to change a golf swing.

 

Let's take one little thing that coaches have tried to train out of more QBs than I can count... patting the ball. No one wants this starting their motion because it costs a tenth of a second right at the start. Yet it has been the "trigger" for QBs both great and not so great forever.

 

Hoyer did it. Elway did, too. As did Young, Marino... On the other hand P. Manning did not. Brady does not.

 

And here's the kicker... most of those who do not "pat", simply cannot because they start their motion from a position with two hands already on the ball, the most desirable ball security practice.

 

So a simple attempt to change a practice that delays release, patting, and replace it with a better, ball-security practice, two hands, should be a no-brainer. Yet time after time the attempted change is abandoned in the name of "QB comfort".

 

Get 'em young and teach 'em well...

 

 

But feel free to ask away...

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Never thought I'd envy a chimp, but I :P do now.

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lol... and I did not stay at a Holiday Inn Express... ever...

 

There are any number of QB Whisperers out there. Few of whom were ever better than middling anythings. There is something to the old adage, "Those that can't do, teach."

 

Any certitude I have displayed here is an extrapolation of my experience as a golfer... studying, playing, being taught and even teaching. It is hard, damn hard to remake a swing. It takes months... even years to overwrite bad habits piece by piece... one at a time. And that's in a game where you are alone with no one trying to break you in two and a distraction is a bird breaking into song.

 

In other words by comparison I think it's easier to change a golf swing than a throwing motion... and it is really fucking hard to change a golf swing.

 

Let's take one little thing that coaches have tried to train out of more QBs than I can count... patting the ball. No one wants this starting their motion because it costs a tenth of a second right at the start. Yet it has been the "trigger" for QBs both great and not so great forever.

 

Hoyer did it. Elway did, too. As did Young, Marino... On the other hand P. Manning did not. Brady does not.

 

And here's the kicker... most of those who do not "pat", simply cannot because they start their motion from a position with two hands already on the ball, the most desirable ball security practice.

 

So a simple attempt to change a practice that delays release, patting, and replace it with a better, ball-security practice, two hands, should be a no-brainer. Yet time after time the attempted change is abandoned in the name of "QB comfort".

 

Get 'em young and teach 'em well...

 

 

But feel free to ask away...

Okay, I'll ask.

 

Why in the actual hell is my golf game regressing?

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