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jiggins7919

Jimmy Garoppolo Speculation

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The only greater NOPE I can give you is the one I have reserved for Gerbil Peppers.

I thought that might get some reaction.

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OK, you got a hard on for this guy- we get it. If you can 1\2 believe Hue, all the options are on the table including Garropolo. Stand pat @ qb, draft Trubisky or one of the other qbs in damn near any round, Go defense with Garrett or Allen. Combine isn't for a month, that may change things, including the rumor Mitch isn't 6'3". For all we know Shanahan may like Jimmy better than anyone else.

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Just watched the JG throws against the Fins, and I came away pretty damn impressed. It's obvious the kid has a good pocket presence. Numerous throws displayed JG moving up or around in the pocket while keeping his head down the field. He doesn't hesitate to throw across the middle, and he appears to have a compact, quick release. While he doesn't look "fast", he certainly doesn't look slow or immobile. His deep throws were a bit off, but that usually takes a few weeks to get measured out. All of his touchdown throws were simply awesome, and I think they all came against pressure. He also had some impressive "3rd and long" throws that were spot on. We all know it's one game, but it was impressive. Obviously he got injured and had to leave the game, but I don't think that should be held against him.

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What exactly are highlights supposed to tell anyone? Weeden has a highlight video as well...? Terribly misleading, and not a tool used by real evaluators.

 

Sure does provide fans with something to talk about though.

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Weeden has NFL highlights?

 

Absolutely... he had whole games where we'd think "he's getting it," only to crash to earth the following week.

 

Your earlier, "It's the system" comment was exactly what struck me about the stat grouping of Brady-Garrop-Cassell.

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Its been a long day and you have told so many lies today that I dont know where to begin.

 

The 3 to 4 posts that I glanced over are full of deception.

 

I am going have to get back to you when I can.

I am sorry that you can't handle the truth.

-you-can39t-handle-the-truth-meme-30007.

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The first of many lies.

 

No, wrong, not 1992. 1993 Tommy Flanagan. Remember him from SNL? A compulsive liar?

 

Exhibit A http://www.pro-football-reference.com/teams/cle/1993.htm

 

OK, what the fuck ever. It has been 24-25 years ago, and I was going from memory. So I was off a year. All this is is an admission on your part that you are a pluperfect pedantic prick.

 

Kosar started the 1993 season (unless it was all a mirage) and was taken out of 3rd game of the season and replaced by Testaverde. Not Philcox as the OP (Mr Tommy Flanagan) has stated in other lies and deceit in this forum.

 

Thank you Capt Obvious.

 

How old are you? I doubt you are even old enough to remember. Earlier in the year, Vinny may have replaced Bernie....but Vinny got hurt. Then Bernie started the next couple or three games. Then against Denver, Bernie wrote up the play "in the dirt" and threw a TD pass instead of doing the Metcalf up the middle play that BB wanted him to run. Then BB benched Bernie. Philcox started the next 3 games....all losses. Later, Vinny recovered and replaced Philcox. By that time I think BK had been cut. Bernie was fine to play, BB just was having his little snit. It cost the Browns a chance at the playoffs.

 

 

 

Not even 2.5 years had past after we correct your lies. "Several" is a crock of sheet and implies that a substantial period of time had past giving credence that correct decision had been made.

Well....again, pedantic.

Merriam Webster: Several: b : more than two but fewer than many

2.5 is more than two

 

 

No, Belichick was hated in Cleveland by the media and fan base. They never forgave him for sending the home town boy packing.

Well, that may be the ONE item you got right.

 

 

Because owners listen to the fan base and monitor the mood in smaller football towns like Cleveland and Buffalo and KC.

 

BB was run out by the media and fans and no Tommy Flanagan can change that now.

Now you are just ignorant. If that were the case.....BB would have been gone 2 years earlier. He would have been run out of Cleveland by the fans and media then. But....lo and behold....he was still in Cleveland 2.5 years and a playoff berth later. Odd that.

He was then run out of Baltimore by the team owner.

Anyone that believes otherwise is a mental midget.

 

Browns fans are passionate fans and sometimes things can get out of hand.

Maybe.....but as you can tell from the record over the last 17 years....no amount of passion or getting out of hand can improve poor team management/ownership.

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MKC is now bringing in reinforcements...

Kyle Shanahan liked Derek Carr and Jimmy Garoppolo 1 and 2 in 2014, but Browns drafted Johnny Manziel

HOUSTON -- Kyle Shanahan admitted at the Super Bowl Thursday that he really liked Patriots backup quarterback Jimmy Garoppolo coming out in 2014 when he was offensive coordinator of the Browns, and a source said he had him ranked right behind Derek Carr on his QB list.

But the Browns traded up in the first round and took Johnny Manziel No. 22 instead -- despite the fact Shanahan, now the Falcons' offensive coordinator, was not in favor of drafting him or Teddy Twatwater.

"They (the Farmer FO) had me look at every quarterback and evaluate every quarterback,'' he said at the Super Bowl Thursday. "That's everywhere. They ask you to evaluate everyone and you give grades and you tell people who you want and you wait to see what happens."

Is the report true that he really liked Garoppolo, who's about to become the hottest QB commodity of the off-season?

"Yes, I did,'' he said.

http://www.cleveland.com/browns/index.ssf/2017/02/kyle_shanahan_liked_derek_carr.html#incart_2box

Article includes a couple other interesting tidbits as well...

  • "Everybody wants a quarterback,'' he said. "You've just got to hope that there is one and you always take the guy who gives you the best chance to win, and usually that's a quarterback but it could be a D-lineman. Everybody wants to have a great quarterback right away, but if it were easy to have one, everyone would have one.''
  • "Kirk is a natural thrower who's fearless and lets it rip,'' said Shanahan. "(As for) guys who can process and go fast in the pocket, Kirk's as good as anybody.''
  • Regarding Manziel, Shanahan liked him as a person, and believed he could develop as an NFL quarterback. "I'm not sure (if he'll make it back into the league),'' Shanahan said.

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How many cases do you win?

 

I wont resort to calling you an idiot. http://www.pro-football-reference.com/boxscores/199309260clt.htm Testavere started the 4th game in 1993 and threw a TD pass unless Philcox was actually wearing Testaverdes jersey and in disguise. That is plausible and I am positive that you can run with that narrative. After Kosar started games 1,2 and 3 Vinnie Testaverde replaced Kosar. If you would like to call him Vinnie Philcox go ahead.

 

 

You are wrong about a fanbase firing a coach too. It happened in KC with Pioli and Crennel.

Do you bother to read what you post? Here is the order of things in that 1993 season:

 

1. Game 1. Bengals, Bernie starts, Browns win 27-14 1-0

2. Game 2. 49ers, Bernie starts, Browns win 23-17. 2-0

3. Game 3. Raiders BK starts, gets hurt, Vinny finishes Browns win 19-16 3-0

4. Game 4. Colts. Vinny starts. gets hurt, Bernie finishes Lose 23-10 3-1

5. Game 4. Dolphins. Bernie starts Lose 24-14 3-2

(this is the game in which Dan Marino tears his achilles heel and is replaced by the immortal Scott Mitchell...who torches BBs defense) BK also hurt again

6. Game 6. Bengals Vinny starts. Browns win 28-17 4-2

7. Game 7. Steelers Vinny starts, gets hurt, BK comes in Browns win 28-27 go to 5-2

8. Game 8. Broncos Bernie starts. The critical game of the season. BBs defense can't handle Elway. Broncos go up by 29-7 in the 4th quarter. Late in the game, Bernie changes a play call from a run up the middle to a pass play. He hits Michael Jackson for a TD. It still only makes the Final score Broncos 29, Browns 14. Browns go to 5-3

BK line in this game: 16-30 226 yards. 2 TDs -0- ints. 6 sacks.

Sound like a diminished QB there? What was diminished was the shitty fucking defense that BB had to combat Elway. And the shitty Offensive line they had in place to protect the QB. 6 sacks.

But BB in his wisdom....and being in a snit because BK knew more about how to call plays than he did....and because his defense played like shit, cuts BK.

9. Game 9. Seahawks Philcox replaces Bernie because BK is gone and Vinny is still hurt. Lose 22-5 Go to 5-4

10. Game 10. Oilers. Philcox starts. Lose 27-20 Go to 5-5

11. Game 11. Falcons. Philcox starts. Lose 17-14 Go to 5-6

12. Game 12. Saints. Philcos starts. Vinny is able to play and replaces Philcox. Browns win 17-13 Go to 6-6

13. Game 13. Oilers. Vinny starts. Browns lose 19-17 go to 6-7

14. Game 14. Pats. Vinny starts. Browns lose 20-17 go to 6-8

15. Game 15. Rams Vinny starts. Browns win 42-14 (in one of best games he or any Browns QB ever played. He was like 22-24)

Browns go to 7-8

16. Game 16. Steelers Vinny starts. Browns lose 16-9. Finish season 7-9.

 

Point is this: Bernie starts season, He gets hurt. Vinny takes over. Vinny gets hurt. Bernie takes over. Bernie gets hurt again, Vinny takes over. Vinny gets hurt again, Bernie takes over. Bernie improvises on a play to score a TD.....BB gets mad (as much at himself for having a suckass O Line and for bad defense) He puts in Philcox. Who proceeds to lose, lose, lose and take Browns out of playoff contention.

While perhaps Vinny may have been the better ultimate option for the Browns, and where Bernie was getting hurt behind the Browns terrible O Line (as was Vinny).....even a 50% Bernie would have been better than a 100% Todd Philcox.

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MKC is now bringing in reinforcements...

 

Kyle Shanahan liked Derek Carr and Jimmy Garoppolo 1 and 2 in 2014, but Browns drafted Johnny Manziel

HOUSTON -- Kyle Shanahan admitted at the Super Bowl Thursday that he really liked Patriots backup quarterback Jimmy Garoppolo coming out in 2014 when he was offensive coordinator of the Browns, and a source said he had him ranked right behind Derek Carr on his QB list.

But the Browns traded up in the first round and took Johnny Manziel No. 22 instead -- despite the fact Shanahan, now the Falcons' offensive coordinator, was not in favor of drafting him or Teddy Twatwater.

"They (the Farmer FO) had me look at every quarterback and evaluate every quarterback,'' he said at the Super Bowl Thursday. "That's everywhere. They ask you to evaluate everyone and you give grades and you tell people who you want and you wait to see what happens."

Is the report true that he really liked Garoppolo, who's about to become the hottest QB commodity of the off-season?

"Yes, I did,'' he said.

http://www.cleveland.com/browns/index.ssf/2017/02/kyle_shanahan_liked_derek_carr.html#incart_2box

Article includes a couple other interesting tidbits as well...

  • "Everybody wants a quarterback,'' he said. "You've just got to hope that there is one and you always take the guy who gives you the best chance to win, and usually that's a quarterback but it could be a D-lineman. Everybody wants to have a great quarterback right away, but if it were easy to have one, everyone would have one.''
  • "Kirk is a natural thrower who's fearless and lets it rip,'' said Shanahan. "(As for) guys who can process and go fast in the pocket, Kirk's as good as anybody.''
  • Regarding Manziel, Shanahan liked him as a person, and believed he could develop as an NFL quarterback. "I'm not sure (if he'll make it back into the league),'' Shanahan said.

 

So? Who DO we blame for that debacle? Pettine? Farmer? Apparently not Shanahan. Haslam? The homeless guy?

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So? Who DO we blame for that debacle? Pettine? Farmer? Apparently not Shanahan. Haslam? The homeless guy?

 

 

 

 

I think it's pretty safe to say he wasn't Pettine's choice either.

 

That points to Haslam and the homeless guy in the 2014 draft.

 

 

IIRC, didnt Lombardi get fired because he wanted a different QB than Manziel. Maybe it was Garroplo?

 

Again- was that some Haslam meddling? That 2014 Farmer first round draft may go down as one of the worst in history. Only passed on 11 or so guys who made the Pro Bowl, notably Kalil Mack, Odell Beckham, and Derek Carr. I have a feeling if the Browns had gone Mack and Carr, they wouldn't have gone 1-15 last year.

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That points to Haslam and the homeless guy in the 2014 draft.

 

 

Again- was that some Haslam meddling? That 2014 Farmer first round draft may go down as one of the worst in history. Only passed on 11 or so guys who made the Pro Bowl, notably Kalil Mack, Odell Beckham, and Derek Carr. I have a feeling if the Browns had gone Mack and Carr, they wouldn't have gone 1-15 last year.

True. A bit back I did a thread on like the worst 10-15 first round draft picks of the last 10 years. Both Gilbert and JMZ were in there. I think the Browns were the only team to have 2 on the list....let alone 2 in the same draft. Matt Ryan was one of the best.

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Its all about creating matchups and spreading the field does just that.

 

Running a couple dozen pick-plays a game doesn't hurt either... many are even legal.

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Other teams run them on NE. In Super Bowl 49 Seattle used the referee to pick Revis for a TD.

 

So two wrongs do make a right... cool...

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Points are awarded for picks now? I did not know that...

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Let them. Though I think that your more likely suitors would be the 49ers (rumor says Shanahan wants him), the Bears, and now perhaps the Cards.

And BR's claim that he may retire is all bombast. So, they probably won't be in the market.

 

Besides...why would you...as a Pats fan, want to give him up.

Do you see no future with him? If he is so mediocre as to have no future with the Pats, why should others overpay for him.

Well......

A. That's very true.

B. We are going to overpay for somebody.

 

WSS

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B. Not if we grow our own... not immediately anyway. Hopefully eventually...

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B. Not if we grow our own... not immediately anyway. Hopefully eventually...

Sure. Later round picks sometimes turn into top-flight quarterbacks.

 

Hit that 20 dealer. There are four aces in the deck right?

:)

WSS

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The Browns will get Garoppolo if they want him. Why?

 

- Chicago or SF are probably not willing to give up their 1st round pick for him.

 

- Cleveland made two trades with the Pats in 2016 and have established a relationship of trust. They got a 5th round pick for a prior regime's bust who has yet to make an impact with the Patriots and was nowhere to be seen in the Super Bowl last night, and they got a Pro Bowl caliber linebacker for a 3rd round compensatory pick (or a 4th round one if the Browns don't get one)

 

- If I'm Cleveland, I'm thinking I got the better end of those deals, and if I'm New England, I'm thinking I got the better end of that deal. Meaning, the Browns are fair trade partners.

 

- Browns have more draft capital to spend that is more valuable than the picks in equivalent rounds for either the Bears or 49ers.

 

I don't think it will take pick #12 to get him, but if the Browns really think he is the guy, they can pay that price and still have pick the best player in the draft.

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I agree if they want him they will get him. I don't want to give up a first round pick to do so, but I'd be ok packaging say a second and a fourth. That still gives us plenty of room to address other holes on the roster - two firsts on DE, CB/S, a second on another S/CB, third on an OC, and we have a starting QB in the mix? OK then.

 

I'm not worried about the length of his contract - he has a year to go on the rookie deal and would most likely be franchised afterwards if he doesn't sign a big deal before then.

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I agree if they want him they will get him. I don't want to give up a first round pick to do so, but I'd be ok packaging say a second and a fourth. That still gives us plenty of room to address other holes on the roster - two firsts on DE, CB/S, a second on another S/CB, third on an OC, and we have a starting QB in the mix? OK then.

 

I'm not worried about the length of his contract - he has a year to go on the rookie deal and would most likely be franchised afterwards if he doesn't sign a big deal before then.

That makes two years with the Browns which should just about be the exact length of Hue Jackson's leash.

WSS

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That makes two years with the Browns which should just about be the exact length of Hue Jackson's leash.

WSS

Sad as it may be, that's probably the case. If, two years from now, we're no closer to winning (and I don't mean more 4-12 stuff) then yeah he's probably gone.

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The Browns will get Garoppolo if they want him. Why?

 

- Chicago or SF are probably not willing to give up their 1st round pick for him.

 

- Cleveland made two trades with the Pats in 2016 and have established a relationship of trust. They got a 5th round pick for a prior regime's bust who has yet to make an impact with the Patriots and was nowhere to be seen in the Super Bowl last night, and they got a Pro Bowl caliber linebacker for a 3rd round compensatory pick (or a 4th round one if the Browns don't get one)

 

- If I'm Cleveland, I'm thinking I got the better end of those deals, and if I'm New England, I'm thinking I got the better end of that deal. Meaning, the Browns are fair trade partners.

 

- Browns have more draft capital to spend that is more valuable than the picks in equivalent rounds for either the Bears or 49ers.

 

I don't think it will take pick #12 to get him, but if the Browns really think he is the guy, they can pay that price and still have pick the best player in the draft.

 

That's the big question to me. Will 49's or Bears REALLY give up their extremely high 1st round pick in order to complete a Garoppolo deal? A part of me says they might, but another part of my brain says that is SO ridiculous. I know Shanahan wanted JG pretty badly, and he's on record saying he wanted him or Carr (weird...that's who I wanted too). We're obviously not trading our first pick for a QB with a couple starts, so that's not even worth entertaining. How do I know that? I just do and my head won't let me even think about it one second longer.

 

Here's a thought: Instead of outright trading the #12 pick to New England for JG, can we maybe SWITCH with the Patriots? They get 12, and we get 32? The deal would need more than just that, but that could be a starting point, AND we'd technically still have two first rounders, even though one would be at the very end. We'll know soon enough. If either of those teams package their first pick, I think that immediately knocks us out. UNLESS we simply overwhelm the Pats with a bevy of picks to pump up the deal.

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Here's a thought: Instead of outright trading the #12 pick to New England for JG, can we maybe SWITCH with the Patriots? They get 12, and we get 32? The deal would need more than just that, but that could be a starting point, AND we'd technically still have two first rounders, even though one would be at the very end. We'll know soon enough. If either of those teams package their first pick, I think that immediately knocks us out. UNLESS we simply overwhelm the Pats with a bevy of picks to pump up the deal.

 

That idea was floated by Nathan Zigura on CBD last week, and I think it's a possibility. It's also possible the Browns trade the #12 pick for Garoppolo and a later round pick. Or #12 for Garoppolo and another player.

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I'd be open to trading #12 for #32 and Jimmy G. If they have any other all-pro calibre guys sitting around they want to get rid of then I could be talked in to taking them too.

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Sure. Later round picks sometimes turn into top-flight quarterbacks.

 

Hit that 20 dealer. There are four aces in the deck right?

 

Or I simply prefer my mirages to yours... ;)

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I'd be open to trading #12 for #32 and Jimmy G. If they have any other all-pro calibre guys sitting around they want to get rid of then I could be talked in to taking them too.

 

I think we'd have to give up a little more for that deal to work, like a day 2 or day 3 pick.

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I think it comes down to 49's and Bears and what they decide to do with their first pick. If either team somehow falls in absolute love with JG and offers up THAT high of a draft pick, I think that might knock us out. If they aren't willing to part with such a high commodity, I think we'll make the deal. JG is also from the Chicago area I think, but not sure that means too much. Here's something else to keep in mind...there are probably going to be a few interesting free agent or cut QB's available. We don't know for sure, but here's an estimate of QB's that probably will be with a new team: Tyrod Taylor, Collin Kaepernick, Jay Cutler, Jimmy Garoppolo, and POSSIBLY Carson Palmer (I recently read that Palmer withdrew his children from school and put his house on the market...not sure what that means?). Let's take Palmer out of it, and focus on the first four. Those are the guys we can almost be sure will be playing for a new team. So who are the teams that will most likely be starting a new QB? Chicago, San Francisco, Cleveland, Houston, and Buffalo (there will probably be others, but those are just the five that pop into my head).

 

Figuring out which player will go to which team is just guessing at this point, but that's what this part of the season is for! I don't LOVE Tyrod or Kaepernick, but I have to admit, both possess the athletic traits our coach apparently desires (which makes the Kessler selection so puzzling). Kaepernick had pretty good stats, better than you might think. He obviously didn't win many games, but he had 16 TD's to 4 INT's and a QB rating of 91. That's nothing to scoff at. Problem is, I don't love his accuracy or ability to read the field. He seems to rely a lot on "backyard football" skills, and he's also a magnificent douche bag. Tyrod Taylor is a solid selection, too. I'm guessing JG is our #1 choice (I have nothing to support that, just a total guess), but if the price is too high (which I think it WILL be), I'm thinking we're going to see Tyrod of Kaepernick in a Browns uniform.

 

Edit: Tony Romo will most likely be out there too, but I don't see ANY way we go after him. I project him going to Houston or Chicago.

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