heckofajobbrownie Posted February 25, 2009 Report Share Posted February 25, 2009 The verdict seems to be in on this year's crop of corners and safeties - it's not so hot. No one performed particularly well yesterday, either in the timed segments or in the position drills. There was no Rogers-Cromartie running a 4.29 and wowing in the drills this year. Only a few players bested the average 40 time of last year's group. Lower picks like Justin King and Orlando Scandrick ran better than the top picks this year, or anyone else. Two of the top picks, Jenkins and DJ Moore, both disappointed. (And I love Moore.) One of the few guys to move himself up a bit was Darius Butler from UConn. Sean Smith, Kevin Barnes, and Chris Owens also had decent showings. But that's about it. I think one thing is for sure - we're not taking Jenkins at #5 anymore. As McShay said of his workout, "That’s not top-10 cornerback material, folks." So we're back to where we started: Curry, Crabtree, Raji, Orapko, or one of the tackles. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ClevelandFanForLife Posted February 25, 2009 Report Share Posted February 25, 2009 yeah, jenkin's poor time has really hurt his draft stock. there is no way we take him, at least not as a cb Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. T Posted February 25, 2009 Report Share Posted February 25, 2009 There is a ton of talent in this years draft, and by looking at the numbers being shown from Indy (combine) it only makes since to trade down and get more bang out of this years draft than staying at #5 in the first round. One thing good about the poor showing of some of these guys, the more they drop the better for us. we might be able to capatalize in there inability to perform in the combine. We know a lot of these guys are capable we have seen it all year long following college football Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WPB Dawg Fan Posted February 25, 2009 Report Share Posted February 25, 2009 I was never looking for a corner anyway. I think our young guys are fine...and by resigning Holly and Adams we should be fine in that area. But I still would love to get Chung. He is going to be a beast...I just know it. If we need a CB...FA has a few out there for depth...Leigh Bodden comes to mind...as does Chris McAlister Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YtownBrownsBacker Posted February 25, 2009 Report Share Posted February 25, 2009 First, you have to understand that we weren't taking Jenkins with #5 anyway. That was never going to happen. He wasn't that must need position and he wasn't the best player available. That being said after all the knee jerk reactions of the combine settle in these guys still have their pro days which are in most casses more important then the combine. Jenkins will still go in the top half of the first round of the draft, he is too good of a talent. After his unimpressive showing in the combine, Myock says he is still a pro bowl FS. Again their will be more knee jerk reactions when some of these guys have great pro days. I like to look at the whole product and remember he was a difference maker on the field. Like WPB, I am a fan of Chung and would spend our second round pick on a guy who is a clone of Palomalu. He's one SS moving up the charts. To many, SS is a priority ingredient for a successful 3-4 defense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JewDago Posted February 25, 2009 Report Share Posted February 25, 2009 since many people were projecting jenkins to convert to safety, i think his forty time didn't hurt him all that much. i think what hurt him more was his lackluster showing in the position drills and his fifteen reps on the bench press. no one wants a safety who's too weak to bring down a TE or RB. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YtownBrownsBacker Posted February 25, 2009 Report Share Posted February 25, 2009 since many people were projecting jenkins to convert to safety, i think his forty time didn't hurt him all that much. i think what hurt him more was his lackluster showing in the position drills and his fifteen reps on the bench press. no one wants a safety who's too weak to bring down a TE or RB. His pro day will account for more then the combine. All he has to do is shine on his pro day and everybody will forget about the combine. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Aloysius Posted February 25, 2009 Report Share Posted February 25, 2009 Like WPB, I am a fan of Chung and would spend our second round pick on a guy who is a clone of Palomalu. He's one SS moving up the charts. To many, SS is a priority ingredient for a successful 3-4 defense. Chung plays like Polamalu, but he's not as effective. I need to watch some more of him...but from what I saw, dude can get knocked on his butt by big running backs. He's got that headhunter mentality, but he may end up being more impressive (with his hits) than productive in his overall game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
heckofajobbrownie Posted February 25, 2009 Author Report Share Posted February 25, 2009 I see a lot of Oregon games out here and was never all that impressed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JewDago Posted February 25, 2009 Report Share Posted February 25, 2009 His pro day will account for more then the combine. All he has to do is shine on his pro day and everybody will forget about the combine. is he gonna prove he's strong at his pro day? if i were thinking about drafting him as a safety, he'd need to. i'm not really sure what all goes on at a pro day. guys run and do position and agility drills. do they lift, too? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Aloysius Posted February 25, 2009 Report Share Posted February 25, 2009 Not sure Jenkins' pro day is really going to help him. Guys tend to run at least a tenth of a second faster on OSU's fast track, so scouts won't take his time at face value. He'll have to run in the mid-high 4.3's to convince them he's got elite cornerback speed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
heckofajobbrownie Posted February 25, 2009 Author Report Share Posted February 25, 2009 Jenkins is still a solid player. He's one of the best tackling CBs in years, which is a very important and overlooked skill for a CB. But you don't drop top ten money for a CB unless you think you can throw him out there on and island with Randy Moss and Larry Fitzgerald and Steve Smith. And right now, nobody seems to think he's got that kind of premier speed or cover skills. Right now this is a very LB/OL/WR-heavy draft at the top. I expect the CBs and QBs to really fall to the middle and bottom of the first. I think that's going to be the story at the end of that first Saturday. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Aloysius Posted February 25, 2009 Report Share Posted February 25, 2009 New Orleans at #14 would seem to be a good spot for Jenkins. The Saints need help at cornerback and safety, and Jenkins will end up filling one of those spots. A favorite pick for them had been another Buckeye, James Laurinaitis, but his poor combine will push him lower than #14. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YtownBrownsBacker Posted February 25, 2009 Report Share Posted February 25, 2009 Chung plays like Polamalu, but he's not as effective. I need to watch some more of him...but from what I saw, dude can get knocked on his butt by big running backs. He's got that headhunter mentality, but he may end up being more impressive (with his hits) than productive in his overall game. People said that about Bob Sanders and Polamalu, sometimes you just have to work a guy out, look at his body of work and guage his love of the game. Nobody is a sure thing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WPB Dawg Fan Posted February 25, 2009 Report Share Posted February 25, 2009 People said that about Bob Sanders and Polamalu, sometimes you just have to work a guy out, look at his body of work and guage his love of the game. Nobody is a sure thing. Before the knock on Chung was he was too small....then we found out he was BIGGER than Palomalu. Now it turns out he is running 4.5 40's at 212 lbs...among the fastest at the combine...not to mention 25 reps with 225 (3rd best for S)... I also seem to remember a hit he put on in the Senior Bowl I believe. He hit a TE (260+ guy) and LEVELED him...and Chung never went down. I think any knocks on this guy are now more to do with the way he was utilized by the Ducks than any lack in his game. He has proven he has strength, speed, coverage ability, and can lay the wood. Not sure what else he needs to show. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Aloysius Posted February 25, 2009 Report Share Posted February 25, 2009 I also seem to remember a hit he put on in the Senior Bowl I believe. He hit a TE (260+ guy) and LEVELED him...and Chung never went down. He also got planted on his ass by RB-FB Quinn Johnson earlier in the game. I need to see more of him. But my impression is that he's the kind of guy who delivers nice head-first hits but can also get pushed back by big runners. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
heckofajobbrownie Posted February 25, 2009 Author Report Share Posted February 25, 2009 Pete Carroll said Polamalu was the best college player he's ever coached. Everyone was acknowledging at the time that Sanders would be a first rounder if he was only bigger. I really don't think Chung is the same type of player as those two. But if he ends up in multiple Pro Bowls I'll be happy to admit I was wrong. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DTBH Posted February 25, 2009 Report Share Posted February 25, 2009 New Orleans at #14 would seem to be a good spot for Jenkins. I'm going to be interested to see if Buffalo can resist the temptation to take yet another Buckeye secondary player with the 11th pick. I know McGee is a tough player and McKelvin is a stud, they also took a corner named Corner last year. So they might not need it. But they sure do like their OSU DB's. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Solon16 Posted February 26, 2009 Report Share Posted February 26, 2009 Don't surprised if NO takes beanie @14 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Aloysius Posted February 26, 2009 Report Share Posted February 26, 2009 Watched some more of Chung today. To me, he looks like a 3rd Round talent. He's been more durable than Sean Jones, but he's far less talented. I heard Mayock make an interesting comment about Chung's play at the Senior Bowl: he said that Chung looked good in press coverage, but he was less than adequate when asked to play off a guy. Not sure if that translates to success in our defense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
heckofajobbrownie Posted February 26, 2009 Author Report Share Posted February 26, 2009 I'd have him somewhere between picks #55 and #75. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Aloysius Posted February 26, 2009 Report Share Posted February 26, 2009 His teammate, T.J. Ward, could be an interesting guy to watch next year. If Pool doesn't play well, we could end up drafting this guy somewhere in rounds 2-4 - that's if we don't scoop up Eric Berry, Morgan Burnett, or Taylor Mays in Round 1. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
heckofajobbrownie Posted February 26, 2009 Author Report Share Posted February 26, 2009 I think Berry is the best safety prospect since Polamalu and Reed. He's that good. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Aloysius Posted February 26, 2009 Report Share Posted February 26, 2009 I agree. As I've told Dennis, he was the only reason Tennessee was watchable last year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YtownBrownsBacker Posted February 27, 2009 Report Share Posted February 27, 2009 Watched some more of Chung today. To me, he looks like a 3rd Round talent. He's been more durable than Sean Jones, but he's far less talented. I heard Mayock make an interesting comment about Chung's play at the Senior Bowl: he said that Chung looked good in press coverage, but he was less than adequate when asked to play off a guy. Not sure if that translates to success in our defense. That's why he is a SS and not a FS. He is faster then Jones, covers better then Jones, is more durable then Jones, hits harder then Jones and is cheaper then Jones. Saying he is far less talented then Jones is questionable since Jones can't cover anybody, isn't fast enough to provide the 2 deep coverage he is suppose to and is always hurt so he doesn't hit anymore. And, now he wants big bucks and at least a 4 year contract Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Aloysius Posted February 27, 2009 Report Share Posted February 27, 2009 Add "when healthy" to my post, and it makes a lot more sense, Ytown. I'd agree that Chung makes more Tayloresque helmet-first hits in coverage. But when it comes to run support, I think a healthy Sean Jones is better; his size and strength play a big part in that. And when healthy, Sean Jones is much more of a ballhawk than Chung. Jones had 9 picks in the last two years, while Chung only had 3. I don't have a problem with anyone saying that Jones isn't worth the money he wants, especially when his semi-chronic knee issues can seriously hinder his play. But I don't think Chung would completely replace what a healthy Jones brings to our defense. Maybe I just haven't watched the right games. IIRC, I've watched the USC, Cal, and Oklahoma State games, as well as the Senior Bowl. If Chung had a signature game in which he showed elite skills, please let me know & I'll try to watch it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Solon16 Posted February 27, 2009 Report Share Posted February 27, 2009 Aloy...watch much of Louis Delmas??/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Aloysius Posted February 27, 2009 Report Share Posted February 27, 2009 Aloy...watch much of Louis Delmas??/ No, none at all. Which is frustrating, given that he's a guy who might make sense at the top of Round 2. Here are some good reports on how Chung and Delmas performed at the Senior Bowl practices: Pat Chung presented himself as a hard-hitting safety and threw his body around the field most of the week. He lacks the top range and speed to the flanks and was best when the action was in front of him or when he was defending the run. He's likely a third round pick for a zone safety defense. Louis Delmas was terrific and exceeded our expectations. He was physical, showed coverage skills and excellent leadership skills on the field. He relentlessly threw his body around the field and was constantly in the right place at the right time. There's no doubt he improved his draft stock anywhere from 15 slots to a full round based on his performance. Delmas's 12 reps of 225 are somewhat worrisome, though his 6.67 3-cone is pretty awesome. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Solon16 Posted February 27, 2009 Report Share Posted February 27, 2009 when he ets paid to lift weights for a living he'll be much stronger...I never worry bout that stuff. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oldcrow1945 Posted February 27, 2009 Report Share Posted February 27, 2009 : Delmas's 12 reps of 225 are somewhat worrisome, though his 6.67 3-cone is pretty awesome. I think Safeties should be stronger than that but then I stop and think of Jack Tatum. A corner coming out of OSU at 5'10" and 190 lbs. To this day one of the greatest tacklers and hardest hitting safeties in the NFL. Really laying the wood to guys is technique. I haven't seen him much but If Chung is this kind of Safety I'd love to see him here. Make those WR's fear coming across the middle. A Brown's safety hasn't put that kind of fear in WR's in a long, long time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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