thenew23 Posted February 15, 2015 Report Share Posted February 15, 2015 Foolish? Browns? OK, give away the house for another in a long line of QB's. ...none of which were drafted in the top 20... It makes sense to watch failure-after-failure at the QB position when we've never had the balls to draft somebody early enough because of being "afraid" we might "miss." It's much safer to continue drafting lesser talent with the HOPE they will develop. Then, when you throw them into a game and they suck balls you can say things like... "well, they were only a 3rd (or 4th or 7th) round pick." I'm not saying this is the perfect year to trade up, but WHY NOT? There are 2 pretty darn good looking QBs coming out and "pretty darn good looking" is better than anything we've had in the last 16 years... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
miktoxic Posted February 15, 2015 Report Share Posted February 15, 2015 well if you figure someone might be willing to trade with us to move up (and garner yet another first rounder for next year) considering our 'beast' schedule which everyone is already picking us to finish worse than last season, wouldn't we be in better shape to do that next year? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zombo Posted February 15, 2015 Report Share Posted February 15, 2015 A lot more foolish to ignore the needs of the team that have cost us success by squandering resources on 3 quarterbacks every season. WSS We gotta get one. Brady Wilson Rodgers Luck Manning Romo Flacco Cam Those were the Quarterbacks of the last eight teams standing last year. We have Manziel and Shaw. C'mon man. If you don't get the Qb right, everything else goes to waste. Zombo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tiamat63 Posted February 15, 2015 Report Share Posted February 15, 2015 The idea of getting the QB right is when the opportunity presents its self and all can see. To me, that isn't Mariota. As by the day I see Winston being the #1 overall now that Tampa has let McCown go. You're right, thus team does need to invest a top 10 pick into a QB eventually. This isn't the year for that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TexasAg1969 Posted February 15, 2015 Report Share Posted February 15, 2015 The idea of getting the QB right is when the opportunity presents its self and all can see. To me, that isn't Mariota. As by the day I see Winston being the #1 overall now that Tampa has let McCown go. You're right, thus team does need to invest a top 10 pick into a QB eventually. This isn't the year for that. Agree-Right now BH (with a healthy and reinforced OL thru draft/fa) is the best bet we got going this year. Pay the man to stay a couple more years. Use the picks to build the rest of the team. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clevfan4life Posted February 15, 2015 Report Share Posted February 15, 2015 If Winston were a "can't miss", he'd be impossible to get. 99% of the can't miss prospects are had by luck (no pun intended). Winston's on field performance has very few flaws. He'd be a can't miss if not for one instance - the rape allegation. Crab legs, the cafe incident...wouldn't be mentioned if not for the rape allegation. Cam Newton stole laptops from classmates at Florida and was caught. Peyton Manning rubbed his bare ass and balls on a female trainer's face. Tom Brady left his pregnant girlfriend for someone else. Ben Roethlisberger may have sexually accosted someone. Brett Favre was a pill-popping drunk. Every QB has a flaw somewhere. It's about finding the QB with the flaws you can manage or iron out. Comparing Manziel and Winston just because they have off the field issues is like comparing Dalton and Weeden because they both have red hair. We don't know the Manziel won't be a perennial Pro Bowler. However, if Winston can be had for the right price, I think it would be worth it to take a guy with the same amount of off the field questions but with a much, much more complete skill set. Dude he's on video casually strolling out of a grocery store with a bag, of all things, of fucking crab legs.......but of course it would be talked about rape allegations or not. The café incident...amongst hundreds of smartphone obsessed college students all live tweeting the whole thing.....offff cccooouurrrssee it's going to be talked about if you're a prospect like Winston. Some MAC starter? No, who gives a shit...the guy that's contending his team for a national championship and angling himself to be the #1 pick? What times are we living in? These kids can't take a sideways shit without someone writing about it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clevfan4life Posted February 15, 2015 Report Share Posted February 15, 2015 I can't believe that this team, seeing our high QB pick failures, is even contemplating a high pick QB that we're gonna have to give up "a lot" to move up for. It would be one thing if we had one of those top picks, to look at a QB....but leveraging our draft for the next year or two on another skinny read option QB with a medium arm? It just doesn't make sense. If we're gonna have a small read option QB scampering out of the pocket for his life on every down i'd pretty much rather it be Manziel cause A) we already have him don't have to give up shit and He's short but sturdier than Mariota, a lot sturdier. Mariota is faster but he will get Vick'ed out of the league in a few years if whatever team he goes to has him running consistently. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Westside Steve Posted February 15, 2015 Report Share Posted February 15, 2015 We gotta get one. Brady Wilson Rodgers Luck Manning Romo Flacco Cam Those were the Quarterbacks of the last eight teams standing last year. We have Manziel and Shaw. C'mon man. If you don't get the Qb right, everything else goes to waste. Zombo And which of them struggled there first year as a starter? And what are the consistency numbers like? And how many of the coaching staffs had been around for less than 2 years? WSS Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hoorta Posted February 15, 2015 Report Share Posted February 15, 2015 The idea of getting the QB right is when the opportunity presents its self and all can see. To me, that isn't Mariota. As by the day I see Winston being the #1 overall now that Tampa has let McCown go. You're right, thus team does need to invest a top 10 pick into a QB eventually. This isn't the year for that. Agreed- I'm not a Mariota fan- and Winston needs to prove he isn't a shoplifter\rapist. If it means sticking with Hoyer or Manziel- and we "Fail for Cardale" so be it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zombo Posted February 15, 2015 Report Share Posted February 15, 2015 And which of them struggled there first year as a starter? And what are the consistency numbers like? And how many of the coaching staffs had been around for less than 2 years? WSS Nothing wrong with developing and I am all for continuity and keeping this staff together. But if they make a call that they don't think Johnny is the answer there is absolutely nothing wrong with bringing in somebody who might be. I mean, we are talking about an undersized guy that showed lack of discipline and character his first year and looked completely lost running the offense. He is also a guy with a special skill set that must be built around him, IMO. So, if they make the judgement call that he is not worth it and look for another starter, I am OK with that. You sure give Manziel a lot of benefit of the doubt, maybe more than a prudent team in our position should. Sometimes there is honor in admitting you were probably wrong and launching a Plan B rather than just probably wasting a year because every first round pick "deserves" at least a full season of being the starter. I think we would be absolute fools to just say "we drafted him, so we are going forward with him" without weighing other options. Manziel was not committed to he team, not sure why the team has to be committed to him. Zombo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zombo Posted February 15, 2015 Report Share Posted February 15, 2015 The importance of a franchise QB is essential but putting one on the Browns right now would be a waste. What's that mean? You grab a franchise QB whenever you can get one, numbnuts. We were 7-6 with Hoyer, you don't think a better QB improves us? You must be the dumbest motherfucker on earth. Zombo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tiamat63 Posted February 15, 2015 Report Share Posted February 15, 2015 The importance of a franchise QB is essential but putting one on the Browns right now would be a waste. Id also like to point out that the teams those QB's had when they started out were quite good talent wise around their young QB. Wilson had a strong run game and defense to rely on. Cam had a similar situation plus the resurgence of Steve Smith. Peyton might have had the worse situation, but that still including Marvin Harrison, Faulk and Terik Glenn on offense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zombo Posted February 15, 2015 Report Share Posted February 15, 2015 You can't apply the rules of a functional organization with a realistically close team to the Browns Pusscakes. Despite the coolaid you drink, and the lies you tell yourself, a franchise QB would improve the Browns record enough to see them come a game or two closer to third place in the division but would still be a waste until they build a team starting with FO, coaching, and core players.....after they have that in place for a few years in a row then a franchise QB would be the ticket. So, we wouldn't just beat up on the Steelers, 31-10, we would also gain some spots in th estandings? What's not to like? Zombo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tiamat63 Posted February 15, 2015 Report Share Posted February 15, 2015 You can't apply the rules of a functional organization with a realistically close team to the Browns Pusscakes. Despite the coolaid you drink, and the lies you tell yourself, a franchise QB would improve the Browns record enough to see them come a game or two closer to third place in the division but would still be a waste until they build a team starting with FO, coaching, and core players.....after they have that in place for a few years in a row then a franchise QB would be the ticket. So having someone like Aaron Rodgers on this team, with the offense and defense staying healthy- we finish no better than 3rd in the division? And you honestly believe that? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thenew23 Posted February 15, 2015 Report Share Posted February 15, 2015 well if you figure someone might be willing to trade with us to move up (and garner yet another first rounder for next year) considering our 'beast' schedule which everyone is already picking us to finish worse than last season, wouldn't we be in better shape to do that next year? "There's always next year" How long have we been saying that? Why do we always think the next great QB will be there for us next year? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tiamat63 Posted February 15, 2015 Report Share Posted February 15, 2015 "There's always next year" How long have we been saying that? Why do we always think the next great QB will be there for us next year? Because there are no 'next great' QB's this year....? Might have something to do with. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DieHardBrownsFan Posted February 15, 2015 Report Share Posted February 15, 2015 Who the hell knows when there will be a great Quarterback? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tiamat63 Posted February 15, 2015 Report Share Posted February 15, 2015 Who the hell knows when there will be a great Quarterback? That's besides the point. I'd rather put high picks into players that will contribute at other positions as opposed to drafting QB's that are most likely going to end up like Blaine Gabbert. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DieHardBrownsFan Posted February 15, 2015 Report Share Posted February 15, 2015 That's besides the point. I'd rather put high picks into players that will contribute at other positions as opposed to drafting QB's that are most likely going to end up like Blaine Gabbert. besides the point is who gives a fuck who you would rather pick? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tiamat63 Posted February 15, 2015 Report Share Posted February 15, 2015 besides the point is who gives a fuck who you would rather pick? Uhhhh. I do, for starters. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zombo Posted February 16, 2015 Report Share Posted February 16, 2015 My point is not that we need to go all in on Mariotta or whoever, it is: 1.You are always looking for QBs it is by far the most important position. 2. You dont shy away from anyone just because you have the fabulous Johnny Football on your roster. 3. The position needs a big upgrade over what we currently have pencilled in for 2015. Let's not pretend we can count on JM for anything right now. If you enjoy losing to the Ravens, Steelers and Bungles every year, then fuck it, grab a Guard and a DT and lots and lots of Wrs and put your faith in Johnny and Conner. They are spunky! Z Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tiamat63 Posted February 16, 2015 Report Share Posted February 16, 2015 My point is not that we need to go all in on Mariotta or whoever, it is: 1.You are always looking for QBs it is by far the most important position. 2. You dont shy away from anyone just because you have the fabulous Johnny Football on your roster. 3. The position needs a big upgrade over what we currently have pencilled in for 2015. Let's not pretend we can count on JM for anything right now. If you enjoy losing to the Ravens, Steelers and Bungles every year, then fuck it, grab a Guard and a DT and lots and lots of Wrs and put your faith in Johnny and Conner. They are spunky! Z So you believe a team lead by Mariota would beat those three? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Canton Mike Posted February 16, 2015 Report Share Posted February 16, 2015 I'm certainly no expert, so I'll defer those who are, but I AM of the belief that there may not be a franchise type QB in any given draft. I don't want to see us trading up JUST to take a QB. If the experts think there IS one or more worthy of such a move, they'll make it. When I look at the number of contributing players they brought in last off season, I'll trust them on this one. Right now, the draft is purely speculation, so we'll see what happens. Mike Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hoorta Posted February 16, 2015 Report Share Posted February 16, 2015 My point is not that we need to go all in on Mariotta or whoever, it is: 1.You are always looking for QBs it is by far the most important position. 2. You dont shy away from anyone just because you have the fabulous Johnny Football on your roster. 3. The position needs a big upgrade over what we currently have pencilled in for 2015. Let's not pretend we can count on JM for anything right now. If you enjoy losing to the Ravens, Steelers and Bungles every year, then fuck it, grab a Guard and a DT and lots and lots of Wrs and put your faith in Johnny and Conner. They are spunky! Z Z, as others have said Mariota got exposed by Ohio State. I certainly didn't like what I saw either. MHO- is he's JFF II- without the outside baggage. Certainly not worth risking the three years of hell if he busts- It's going to take the Browns an RG III type deal to move up high enough to draft him. He is NOT a surefire, can't miss prospect- you can look up the scouting reports if you don't believe me. Neither is Winston for that matter- but if I had to roll the dice selling the ranch to move up- I'll put my money on Famous Jameis instead. He at least ran a pro style offense. PS- and I'd take Cardale Jones over either of them. 12 Guage continues on his current pace- he's going to be the 2016 #1 overall- and no one will trade out of it either. Yes indeed we're in quarterback hell once again. But barring a JFF miracle, I don't see any viable way out this year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tour2ma Posted February 16, 2015 Report Share Posted February 16, 2015 The idea of getting the QB right is when the opportunity presents its self and all can see. You're right, thus team does need to invest a top 10 pick into a QB eventually. This isn't the year for that. As has been said... when all can see, then you have to have (or get) the #1 overall. I agree Jameis is first off the board. I agree MM is not the one. But we also do not stand pat. Somewhere in this draft is enough promise to invest a pick. You always have o be searching for your next QB. If we're gonna have a small read option QB scampering out of the pocket for his life on every down i'd pretty much rather it be Manziel cause A) we already have him don't have to give up shit and He's short but sturdier than Mariota, a lot sturdier. Mariota is faster but he will get Vick'ed out of the league in a few years if whatever team he goes to has him running consistently. I don't want to go all in on MM either, but not due to his running. I see nothing Manziel frantic in Mariota's running. Who the hell knows when there will be a great Quarterback? Exactly why you have to keep casting the net... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tiamat63 Posted February 16, 2015 Report Share Posted February 16, 2015 As has been said... when all can see, then you have to have (or get) the #1 overall. I agree Jameis is first off the board. I agree MM is not the one. But we also do not stand pat. Somewhere in this draft is enough promise to invest a pick. You know whom my feelings are on that one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tour2ma Posted February 16, 2015 Report Share Posted February 16, 2015 Z, as others have said Mariota got exposed by Ohio State. What does that mean? I saw MM under a great deal of pressure once our D figured out how to beat Fisher inside and isolated Grasu. Pressure exposes a lot of QBs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tour2ma Posted February 16, 2015 Report Share Posted February 16, 2015 You know whom my feelings are on that one. Lovelocke? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tiamat63 Posted February 16, 2015 Report Share Posted February 16, 2015 Lovelocke? I can honestly say I've never watched him. I presume I should? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
miktoxic Posted February 16, 2015 Report Share Posted February 16, 2015 this is my position on the whole deal draft-wise. what are our major holes on defense? a defense that could be top 5 in the league next year if prospects are drafted correctly? 1-2 DL (rubin gone, taylor hurt)? ILB? that's 3 right off the top. so instead of upgrading and cementing the D to be the best in our conference, if not the division, we waste those 3 picks and hope on a wing and a prayer that one of these 2 QBs would pan out and be a starter from day one? GTFO. give me those 3 D picks a WR a backup C and a RT then in between if a guy like hundley or petty or mannion present themselves by all means throw in the card. but to think the browns are only a QB away from being true contenders is ridiculous at this point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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