wargograw 268 Report post Posted November 17, 2015 They've run analyses on the 4 or 5 recruiting classes that a program signed prior to winning a national championship. I forgot what the conclusion was exactly but I'm almost positive that pretty much every national champion of the BCS era averaged at least in the top 10 on the 4 classes combined. It may be higher. I'll try to find it. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
MLD Woody 366 Report post Posted November 17, 2015 If you say "only 50% of 5* recruits get drafted" that might not sound great. But this argument doesn't exist in a vacuum. What is the percentage for 4*s? 3*s? Here's a hint, its worse. There have been studies on this. Highly rated recruits objectively have a higher chance of succeeding. Recruiting matters Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
The Gipper 1,215 Report post Posted November 17, 2015 Well, what I am saying is that it is a given that the "big schools" are going to get quality recruits. I believe that there is very little difference between the talent on the top 25 recruiting classes. Sure, recruiting matters because the players recruited to go to Ohio State are going to be better than those that go to Akron or other MAC schools. But between the big boys, it is not that significant. Other factors matter more is all I am saying. Michigan may have actually had more quality "recruits" go there over the last 15 years than went to Ohio St. But Ohio St. had Jim Tressel and Urban Meyer coaching......and Michigan didn't. That was a far bigger factor. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
MLD Woody 366 Report post Posted November 17, 2015 I'm pretty sure Tressel did just fine getting high quality recruits (Pryors cars, Clarett, etc). The top class is going to be much better than #22. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
The Gipper 1,215 Report post Posted November 17, 2015 I'm pretty sure Tressel did just fine getting high quality recruits (Pryors cars, Clarett, etc). The top class is going to be much better than #22. But....what I am saying is that a guy like Tressel, Meyer, maybe Harbaugh.....can take the #22 ranked recruiting class and often beat the #1 ranked recruiting class because they know how to get the best out of them. Now, these guys probably get reputations as great coaches, so many of the best recruits want to go there, so it is a self fulfilling prophecy.......but not always. Nick Saban is known as a great coach and the best players want to go there. But sometimes, say take Michigan (or name some other school) they may have still gotten a Top 5 recruiting class....but could do nothing with it because their coach (Hoke/RR) was not up to par. After a while a school may lose their recruiting edge if the coaches they get don't pan out. Nebraska is a team that comes to mind. For 40 years under Bob Devaney and Tom Osborne they were perhaps the premier program in the nation. Not so much now. They are only going .500 for the past number of years. What happened there? (loss of steroids perhaps?) Or just bad coaching. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
wargograw 268 Report post Posted November 17, 2015 Talent is more important than coaching generally. I mean, sure, if you're a bona fife Retard of a coach, yes you can ruin great talent. But for the most part if you stay out of the way they'll be fine. Les Miles is known as a pretty terrible coach but he does ok because he recruits lights out. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
The Gipper 1,215 Report post Posted November 18, 2015 Talent is more important than coaching generally. I mean, sure, if you're a bona fife Retard of a coach, yes you can ruin great talent. But for the most part if you stay out of the way they'll be fine. Les Miles is known as a pretty terrible coach but he does ok because he recruits lights out. Maybe......sure the P5 conferences are going to have better talent than the WAC/MAC etc. But within the P5 I still think coaching is the primary factor. Alabama has been the better SEC team because of coaching.....not because the talent it recruits is oh so much better than the talent Georgia/Florida/Auburn/LSU etc. Ohio State has been better than Mich. MSU, Penn St., Nebraska etc. because of coaching, not talent. Pete Carroll ruled the P-12 when there. That school does not rule so much now.....because of coaching. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
wargograw 268 Report post Posted November 18, 2015 Alabama has something like 5 straight #1 recruiting classes (depending on where you look). Of course Saban is good, but it's recruiting that makes them what they are. Of course, they are at a point now where their image is so good to recruits that they have to make sure they're taking kids that don't want to merely come in and bask in the glory, rather than work to add to it. Ohio State has recruited better the last 15 years than their fellow Big 10 programs. They also recruit nationally more, I believe. Pete Carroll had Ed Orgeron, probably the best recruiter in the country, while he was at USC. Made a huge difference. He killed it in recruiting in the early 2000s. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
The Gipper 1,215 Report post Posted November 18, 2015 Alabama has something like 5 straight #1 recruiting classes (depending on where you look). Of course Saban is good, but it's recruiting that makes them what they are. Of course, they are at a point now where their image is so good to recruits that they have to make sure they're taking kids that don't want to merely come in and bask in the glory, rather than work to add to it. Ohio State has recruited better the last 15 years than their fellow Big 10 programs. They also recruit nationally more, I believe. Pete Carroll had Ed Orgeron, probably the best recruiter in the country, while he was at USC. Made a huge difference. He killed it in recruiting in the early 2000s. Well, it is sort of a chicken and egg situation......but I still think Bum Phillips said it best about coaching.....specifically about Don Shula. He said: "he can take his'n and beat yer'n and he can take your'n and beat his'n." Now, Texas boy.....you go argue with Bum Phillips. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
MLD Woody 366 Report post Posted November 22, 2015 https://twitter.com/J_Schneider/status/668167057024921600 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
MLD Woody 366 Report post Posted December 17, 2015 http://ohiostate.247sports.com/Bolt/Five-star-RB-Kareem-Walker-commits-to-Buckeyes-during-title-game-34689365 So, funny story, guess who just committed to Michigan? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
The Gipper 1,215 Report post Posted December 17, 2015 So, funny story, guess who just committed to Michigan? Boba Fett? Why don't you just fucking tell us. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
The Gipper 1,215 Report post Posted December 17, 2015 Whatever....OSU still has what is considered Top recruiting class: http://www.landgrantholyland.com/2015/12/15/10218752/ohio-state-recruiting-2016-class-rankings-alabama-lsu-michigan And, as I said before.....it doesn't matter who has the #1 or #5 class......it is what you do with them coaching wise. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
MLD Woody 366 Report post Posted December 17, 2015 Boba Fett? Why don't you just fucking tell us. Maybe read through this thread. You'll figure it out Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
The Gipper 1,215 Report post Posted December 18, 2015 Maybe read through this thread. You'll figure it out Maybe if you just tell us outright you won't come out looking like such a douchebag. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
gftChris 427 Report post Posted December 18, 2015 LOL. No longer a 5* recruit though. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
MLD Woody 366 Report post Posted December 18, 2015 I'm just saying... We had the OP pumped this guy committed to OSU. He posted a whole thread about it. With all of the good vibes going to Michigan at the time, he wanted to crush them. Then the recruit started looking around... Then he decommitted... Then he started looking at Michigan... Then he committed to Michigan. It blew up in the OPs face. I even said his commitment was way too early to mean much haha. I'm just enjoying it, that's all. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
gftChris 427 Report post Posted December 18, 2015 Well don't get too carried away. The moral fibre of a kid flip flopping because he sees a team not being as dominant as it was I wouldn't be too excited about. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
MLD Woody 366 Report post Posted December 18, 2015 How do you know that's why he decommitted? Do you have any evidence to back that up? A TON of recruits decommit when they commit they early. If anything we just have a better opportunity for early playing time. Don't take Cysko's path of immediately shit talking the kid and his commitment... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
gftChris 427 Report post Posted December 18, 2015 How do you know that's why he decommitted? Do you have any evidence to back that up? A TON of recruits decommit when they commit they early. If anything we just have a better opportunity for early playing time. Don't take Cysko's path of immediately shit talking the kid and his commitment... I forget sometimes how easy it is to troll you. I can see why others do it Deep breath woody, it's only a game! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
LogicIsForSquares 540 Report post Posted December 18, 2015 I forget sometimes how easy it is to troll you. I can see why others do it Deep breath woody, it's only a game! That recruit really sucks. Amiright?! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
The Gipper 1,215 Report post Posted December 18, 2015 I'm just saying... We had the OP pumped this guy committed to OSU. He posted a whole thread about it. With all of the good vibes going to Michigan at the time, he wanted to crush them. Then the recruit started looking around... Then he decommitted... Then he started looking at Michigan... Then he committed to Michigan. It blew up in the OPs face. I even said his commitment was way too early to mean much haha. I'm just enjoying it, that's all. Well....even to this day it is not final.....maybe he too will be a double douche and change his mind again. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
The Gipper 1,215 Report post Posted December 18, 2015 How do you know that's why he decommitted? Do you have any evidence to back that up? A TON of recruits decommit when they commit they early. If anything we just have a better opportunity for early playing time. Don't take Cysko's path of immediately shit talking the kid and his commitment... Well.....apparently his commitments don't mean much....now do they? So maybe a little shit talking about his commitments is warranted. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
MLD Woody 366 Report post Posted December 18, 2015 I forget sometimes how easy it is to troll you. I can see why others do it Deep breath woody, it's only a game! I think you're overreacting to my reaction. If you think that response was getting a rise out of me... Lol I think any time I respond in the CFB thread someone will claim they trolled me Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
MLD Woody 366 Report post Posted December 18, 2015 Well....even to this day it is not final.....maybe he too will be a double douche and change his mind again. He very well could. Nothing is official until he signs the dotted line Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
