Hoyer will start !

[USFBrown]

If that's not what you're saying, then your comparison is invalid.

 

No that's not what i'm saying. What i was saying is that Rogers was arguably more gifted at QB when he entered the league than Favre was at his stage in his career. I.e. Manziel is probably a better QB than Hoyer.

 

Favre was winning games but arguably Rogers could have won more. Hoyer was winning games, but JF might win more.

 

They let Rogers sit and learn. It turned out pretty well for them.

 

So I am was saying that letter Rogers sit and learn wasn't such a bad thing, but he could have arguably came in and been much better than Favre. The same can be said in our case, Manziel might come in and win more games than Hoyer. But you never know how a guy will perform in NFL from college.

 

Johnny is still a young man. You're still maturing physically as well as mentally in your early twenties. The NFL is trial by fire now with these rookie QBs.

 

I think the Packers did it right in letting him sit. But who knows it may have been better to set Brett packing earlier (pun intended).

 

Anyways it was no a comparison between Hoyer and Favre as it was the situation with a rookie QB who potentially is a better QB than the current QB. That is all.

[gftChris]

Are you so insecure in your opinions that you want to hide them behind such a teeny tiny font?

 

All I can say is: I hope you are right.

It's just so that the old people don't read it and run him out of town.

[StocktonShorts]

 

No that's not what i'm saying. What i was saying is that Rogers was arguably more gifted at QB when he entered the league than Favre was at his stage in his career. I.e. Manziel is probably a better QB than Hoyer.

 

Favre was winning games but arguably Rogers could have won more. Hoyer was winning games, but JF might win more.

 

They let Rogers sit and learn. It turned out pretty well for them.

 

So I am was saying that letter Rogers sit and learn wasn't such a bad thing, but he could have arguably came in and been much better than Favre. The same can be said in our case, Manziel might come in and win more games than Hoyer. But you never know how a guy will perform in NFL from college.

 

Johnny is still a young man. You're still maturing physically as well as mentally in your early twenties. The NFL is trial by fire now with these rookie QBs.

 

I think the Packers did it right in letting him sit. But who knows it may have been better to set Brett packing earlier (pun intended).

 

Anyways it was no a comparison between Hoyer and Favre as it was the situation with a rookie QB who potentially is a better QB than the current QB. That is all.

Rodgers was stuck behind a legend and sat for...what 3 years?

 

You can't bench Brett Favre in Green Bay. That's all that situation was about. Had nothing to do with getting Rodgers ready.

 

You can bench Brian Hoyer in Cleveland. Ex player after Ex player will tell you, you learn nothing sitting on the sidelines. Go out, make a ton of mistakes, and learn. By year 2 you're a vet.

[USFBrown]

Rodgers was stuck behind a legend and sat for...what 3 years?

 

You can't bench Brett Favre in Green Bay. That's all that situation was about. Had nothing to do with getting Rodgers ready.

 

You can bench Brian Hoyer in Cleveland. Ex player after Ex player will tell you, you learn nothing sitting on the sidelines. Go out, make a ton of mistakes, and learn. By year 2 you're a vet.

 

You can if he's going to win you superbowls. They eventually let Favre go. You can't let a legend go either right?

[D Bone]

Go out, make a ton of mistakes, and learn. By year 2 you're a vet.

 

That worked well for Couch........ He was a beaten down, broken, skittish vet who never recovered.

[StocktonShorts]

First off Couch mightve sucked anyway. He was on an expansion team, he was destroyed because of no help. Different situation here. Theres a ton of guys who sat and wet awful and guys who started day 1 and were bad. If youre good then getting the mistakes out of the way is the best thing for you. You learn by playing not watching.

[USFBrown]

First off Couch mightve sucked anyway. He was on an expansion team, he was destroyed because of no help. Different situation here. Theres a ton of guys who sat and wet awful and guys who started day 1 and were bad. If youre good then getting the mistakes out of the way is the best thing for you. You learn by playing not watching.

 

How is the situation different? You new guys argue everything said to the extreme unless it doesn't agree with your opinion. It's tiring.

 

Johnny is smaller and could get broken and beat down too. Give him a couple years to physically mature and he may be better off.

[TXDawg]

i can see the logic with having johnny wait. especially with Gordon probably being out all year. I don't agree but it's logical.

[DieHardBrownsFan]

 

That worked well for Couch........ He was a beaten down, broken, skittish vet who never recovered.

Couch had the derelicts of the NFL around him in all fairness.

[Kvoethe]

Cbs reporting hoyer starting in preseason opener against lion. Cameron will not play in game ( shoulder)

[StocktonShorts]

 

How is the situation different? You new guys argue everything said to the extreme unless it doesn't agree with your opinion. It's tiring.

 

Johnny is smaller and could get broken and beat down too. Give him a couple years to physically mature and he may be better off.

How is it different? Tim Couch had an expansion team around him. Probably the worst OLine in the NFL his first year.

 

Not the same situation. Not even close. Plenty of QBs who you know and think are great in the NFL didn't sit out their entire first year. They got in and played.

[hoorta]

How is it different? Tim Couch had an expansion team around him. Probably the worst OLine in the NFL his first year.

 

Not the same situation. Not even close. Plenty of QBs who you know and think are great in the NFL didn't sit out their entire first year. They got in and played.

 

 

Really- no one is arguing Manziel won't get his chance- just depends on how Hoyer plays.

[miktoxic]

weeden barely made it to 2 years before he became a vet and the new FO kicked his ass out of town.

 

2 years means shit. either you got it or you don't.

[miktoxic]

i don't wish bad on anyone. hopefully that texas air will get him playing like he did in OK.

 

but he did look great in TC for us also. he had a hard time reading defenses and feeling pressure around him, and when he did he reacted terribly.

[D Bone]

 

Weeden has looked pretty good in camp. Should be interesting to see what he does tomorrow night. He is the starter, Romo not playing. Most players are given 3 season to prove if they can play at this level.

 

LMAO All you Cowgirl fans who have been trying to run Romo out of town the last few years may get your wish........... Careful what you wish for, you just may get it.

[Zombo]

Weeden looked terrific in last year's preseason as well.

 

Then the games started to count and the shitting of the bed commenced.

 

Z

[Tim Couch Pulls Out]

 

No that's not what i'm saying. What i was saying is that Rogers was arguably more gifted at QB when he entered the league than Favre was at his stage in his career. I.e. Manziel is probably a better QB than Hoyer.

 

Favre was winning games but arguably Rogers could have won more. Hoyer was winning games, but JF might win more.

 

They let Rogers sit and learn. It turned out pretty well for them.

 

So I am was saying that letter Rogers sit and learn wasn't such a bad thing, but he could have arguably came in and been much better than Favre. The same can be said in our case, Manziel might come in and win more games than Hoyer. But you never know how a guy will perform in NFL from college.

 

Johnny is still a young man. You're still maturing physically as well as mentally in your early twenties. The NFL is trial by fire now with these rookie QBs.

 

I think the Packers did it right in letting him sit. But who knows it may have been better to set Brett packing earlier (pun intended).

 

Anyways it was no a comparison between Hoyer and Favre as it was the situation with a rookie QB who potentially is a better QB than the current QB. That is all.

 

 

Right. I was just busting your chops.

 

I, too, believe that Manziel should sit and learn. There's nothing to gain by rushing him into the starting lineup if he isn't ready.

 

However, there is one key difference between the two situations.

 

Favre was headed to the HOF well before Rodgers was even drafted.

 

Favre had 8 Pro Bowls under his belt before Rodgers was drafted. It wasn't that hard of a decision to let the hot hand ride, because the hot hand was the greatest quarterback to play for the Packers, better than Bart Starr. Rodgers, more than likely, would not have beaten Favre out in a fair, straight up training camp QB competition.

 

Manziel may beat out Hoyer straight up.

 

Hoyer won a couple games, true, but he's coming off a major injury, is in a new system with new coaches, new receivers and new backs. It's all just as new to Hoyer as it is to Manziel.

 

I think Manziel would benefit by sitting but I also believe that whoever gives us the best chance to win come Week 1 should be our starter.

[Gumboner76]

Interesting to here quotes from players like Joe Thomas calling Hoyer like Brady. As reported by mike freeman of the bleacher report Andrew Hawkins says Manziel has not shown anything. See attached link.

 

http://network.yardbarker.com/nfl/article_external/johnny_manziel_reportedly_not_standing_out_in_practice/16982905?linksrc=story_team_cleveland_browns_auto_module_head_16982905

 

As reported by la canforna, Hoyer is quicker. Breaking the huddle calling plays reading defenses. And the fact by most notable writers Hoyer has outplayed manziel thus far.

 

But yet I hear all the talk to start manziel. Being the browns fan that I am it seriously drives me ape s@&t to hear all this talk about Johnny football. By counts on practices manziel throws 2-3 interceptions more per day than Hoyer. How in the hell will that win us games?

 

Get over it people and listen to the real writers and don't follow the hype. Manziel isn't a professional he doesn't act like it or play like it.

 

Hoyer is our best chance to win!!!

[D Bone]

boner has spoken

[The Gipper]

 

Dont include me among those idiots. Losing Romo would be a huge loss. After watching the Browns 2013 season on NFL Rewind i was horrified to see how Weeden played. I wanted Manziel because i was worried about Romos health. Weeks later Romo is having problems throwing the deep ball and rehabbing 4 hours a day on his back. Hopefully he is ready for the season.

I would love to see Weeden starting for the Cowboys. It would be great entertainment. Better than watching Romo roam around for another season. The Cowboys would lose...badly perhaps....but that is part of the entertainment.

[Tour2ma]

_{Johnny just wins or dies trying.}

It's that second part that worries some of us...

 

Welcome to the forum...

 

It's a shame, you used to be interesting when you talked about football.

That is the sad part... then came the Jesus complex and avatar and it all went south...

 

You learn by playing not watching.

Not the first time you've made this argument and it's still bullshit. If you don't learn by watching, then why are there video sessions? Games and practices...

 

You want to argue that you learn faster by playing? Fine, but it's not an all or nothing deal. As a #2 you get to play everyday, but game day... on the practice field... Somewhat less than you do as a number 1, but you still get reps.

 

You want more reps? Earn them...

[Tour2ma]

The only reason i would want Johnny to sit this season is because of the shitty WR core the Browns have put together. (minus Gordon of course).

 

That said I think the Browns will need Johnnys legs to move the chains.

You and TxDawg already setting up your JM excuses?

 

May need his legs to move the chains... we'll see. But I guarantee you that every time he misses a read, pulls it down and takes off in practice, he loses ground.

 

Plenty of QBs who you know and think are great in the NFL didn't sit out their entire first year. They got in and played.

Name one that was given the job to learn rather than earning it by learning the job.

 

Favre was headed to the HOF well before Rodgers was even drafted.

Agree, but also have to remember that Rogers had fallen from golden boy status prior to the '05 draft. It's the reason he fell to 24th overall...

[StocktonShorts]

Why do you keep talking about "Given the job" and "Earn the Job"?

What do you think is happening right now? I mean I don't know of a single player who was drafted and the team went "Well we're not even going to have the QBs practice, he gets the job and we'll see him week 1". If anything Hoyer is the one who is being given the job and its Manziel has to beat him out.

Here is a list someone put together of the last, 10 years I believe of when Rookie QBs have started. Draw your own conclusions.

http://justblogbaby.com/2014/08/05/list-rookie-quarterbacks-first-starts-shows-success-towards-week-one-rookie-starters/

[Tour2ma]

Hoyer is quicker. Breaking the huddle calling plays reading defenses.

First... Dude... Screen name??? Really???

 

Second... yes, so far, it looks like Hoyer, but it's still early.

 

Third... welcome to the forum...

 

Hoyer is still ahead but Manziel is closing in.

Closing in, but still not close...

 

We'll see what Saturday brings...

[Tour2ma]

Why do you keep talking about "Given the job" and "Earn the Job"?

Because you keep posting like JM should be given the job?

 

That said, at least you engaged on a topic this time...

[StocktonShorts]

Because you keep posting like JM should be given the job?

 

That said, at least you engaged on a topic this time...

I post like Manziel is going to have the job. Which you should clearly see unless you have a very small football IQ. He was drafted to be the starter, and he will be the starter the minute the coaches determine he's ready (which if you believe the reports this week, is getting closer and closer). If you want you can consider that as him "earning" it, I mean he does have to learn a certain amount before they'll let him start.

 

You seem to be under the very wrong idea that the coaches are going "Well we have Manziel AND Hoyer, and let's let them battle it out to see who our QB of the future is". Nope. It's already been decided, the minute the Browns picked Manziel at 22. NOW if you're saying that doesn't mean he'll be great, then you're right. Who knows exactly how good Manziel will be, but the idea that he's somehow not going to be the Browns starter at some point, and most likely some point very soon, is....wrong....so very, very wrong.

[Tour2ma]

You can bench Brian Hoyer in Cleveland. Ex player after Ex player will tell you, you learn nothing sitting on the sidelines. Go out, make a ton of mistakes, and learn. By year 2 you're a vet.

If youre good then getting the mistakes out of the way is the best thing for you. You learn by playing not watching.

I post like Manziel is going to have the job. Which you should clearly see unless you have a very small football IQ.

Not sure how I got the impression you want the job handed to JM... Silly me.

 

And don't start with the insults. I have not insulted you... yet. That said, anytime you want to match IQs, football or otherwise, just let me know.

[USFBrown]

I post like Manziel is going to have the job. Which you should clearly see unless you have a very small football IQ. He was drafted to be the starter, and he will be the starter the minute the coaches determine he's ready (which if you believe the reports this week, is getting closer and closer). If you want you can consider that as him "earning" it, I mean he does have to learn a certain amount before they'll let him start.

 

You seem to be under the very wrong idea that the coaches are going "Well we have Manziel AND Hoyer, and let's let them battle it out to see who our QB of the future is". Nope. It's already been decided, the minute the Browns picked Manziel at 22. NOW if you're saying that doesn't mean he'll be great, then you're right. Who knows exactly how good Manziel will be, but the idea that he's somehow not going to be the Browns starter at some point, and most likely some point very soon, is....wrong....so very, very wrong.

You have no idea as well as anyone else on here how soon manziel is going to be the qb.

 

Quit acting like everything you say is gospel and all others are stupid. You'll have a tough time around here.

 

I doubt you watched a single game Hoyer played in last season to even give the man judgement. You're just a Manziel groupie and will follow where ever he goes.

[StocktonShorts]

Not sure how I got the impression you want the job handed to JM... Silly me.

 

And don't start with the insults. I have not insulted you... yet. That said, anytime you want to match IQs, football or otherwise, just let me know.

Manziel won the job the minute he was drafted. Look at that link I posted. Tell me how many of those 1st round QBs have "Never" next to their first starts?

 

If you think Brian Hoyer is going to be the Browns QB long term, you have a low football IQ. We can match football IQs. You take the "Brian Hoyer is the next Kurt Warner" angle and I'll call you an idiot and we'll see how this plays out in history.

[StocktonShorts]

You have no idea as well as anyone else on here how soon manziel is going to be the qb.

 

Quit acting like everything you say is gospel and all others are stupid. You'll have a tough time around here.

 

I doubt you watched a single game Hoyer played in last season to even give the man judgement. You're just a Manziel groupie and will follow where ever he goes.

I don't know how soon Manziel will be the starter, you're right. I do know he WILL be the starter at some point. That can not be denied. If you think I'm wrong, by all means tell me so.

 

And I did watch Hoyer last year. From his 3 INT game against Minny to his very good game where they didn't ask him to do much against the Bengals, to the brief appearance in the Buffalo game where he attempted the most nonathletic slide in NFL history. I watched every second.

 

Those who think Brian Hoyer is a good, quality, NFL QB....you are the ones I question if you actually watched those games.

 

You can talk about "Manziel Fanboys" all you want around here, but none of this has anything to do with Manziel. Its the "Hoyer Fanboys" who have somehow reinvented a career backup into a future HOF off of two complete games, neither of which did he look much better than say a Mark Sanchez.

 

You seem to ignore the fact that the Browns themselves decided they love Hoyer so much, that they took a QB in the 1st round. Doesn't matter it was Manziel, it would've been Teddy B otherwise, but either way they went into the draft saying "We need a QB, and badly" and went out and got one. That's how good the Browns think Brian Hoyer is.

 

You can try to pretend that you're fighting these "Manziel Trolls" all you want, but some people are smart enough to realize that the future QB is Manziel, so might as well get on board now and hope he's good. Hoyer is a bookmark until the Manziel era begins. Thats not being a fanboy, thats understanding NFL football.