choco Posted March 19, 2012 Report Share Posted March 19, 2012 People are still screaming we're not trying to get better Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Browns57 Posted March 19, 2012 Report Share Posted March 19, 2012 I honestly knew we we're going to get RG3. But I'm in the minority that thinks Colt at least deserves a shot with decent players around him. With that being said I still would have taken RG3 in a heartbeat if we had to trade up, but will content with Colt. But wishing we go with Blackmon at 4. It has to be an offensive weapon, and he is the only one worth 4th. Richardson is someone I still have doubts about, especially at 4. Watching the Championship against LSU his backup played better for most of the game. Rich seemed to only run for about 1-2 yards every carry until the end of the game. So in reality that is what we will see every week until our line steps up. Tanahill (sp?) would be awful at 4th and I really don't even think he's worth the 22. I think most Browns fans will forgive H&H if we can pick up Blackmon & Richardson. Is it possible? probably not. But right now that's the best scenario we can have. Worst? would be trading down again to stock pile even more picks for future drafts. I'm tired of that! we're impatient in Cleveland and need to win NOW! We have better options than you portray in your post. The Browns will likely recieve offers. I am looking at the Rams. They've got their QB and they have picks BUT they don't have a RECEIVER to throw to! Their recievers EXCEPT LLOYD who is gone now are not good. We shall see, but if we are willing to give up the 4 spot we could end up picking 2 times in the first round with our first pick being at 6 and twice in the early second. That would be a pretty good scenario for us. I am staying optimistic. BUT if they don't nail this draft I am DONE! BTW I want Blackmon on our team bad, but for the right price I give up that pick. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Browns57 Posted March 19, 2012 Report Share Posted March 19, 2012 It wasn't geared toward anyone in particular, I'm just getting fed up with every thread being full of "fuck us were never going to get better nobody knows how to run this team blah blah". I don't believe Colt is a franchise QB, but I never expected him to be. I've been saying for the last two years that Colt was meant to be the guy before the guy. He's a placeholder, someone that won't wow us, but won't singlehandedly lose games himself either. While we implement the new offense and acclimate the coaches and build the team, Colt will be the same Colt he is every week. And then, when he's surrounded by talent, they'll unceremoniously pull the rug out from under him and draft our franchise guy. McCoy is just like Alex Smith. When our team gets better, and our play calling gets better McCoy will get better and will be able to lead this team. Nobody should have ever expected him to be the next Drew Brees. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hoorta Posted March 20, 2012 Report Share Posted March 20, 2012 That is really interesting and believable.. Peter King's articles are always insightful. I'm happy we didn't give up that much for any one guy. I wish Holmgren didnt come out and say what he did, but you know what? If he didn't, everyone on these boards would be screaming that we weren't trying to get better!! Just a bad situation for our FO and I wish us fans could have a little more patience and trust. Lets build this team right which is not with quick easy fixes... The key in today's NFL to get better for the long term is to get a legit Franchise QB. Holmgren's story of the RGIII fiasco fits. The Rams had a silent bid auction, H&H put in what they thought was a reasonable bid- the Redskins beat it, and when H&H tried to up the ante they were told- bidding's closed. A little more patience and trust? H&H have already used up this fan's trust allotment, and my patience is down to this season. I can find better things to do on a Sunday afternoon in the fall that sit around a TV and watch the Browns lose. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ballpeen Posted March 20, 2012 Report Share Posted March 20, 2012 People are still screaming we're not trying to get better I am not screaming, nor even saying we aren't trying. I am saying the results show we aren't trying hard enough. Homie and Heck blew the deal for RGIII. It's obvious that was the guy we wanted. They couldn't look far enough ahead to see Washington had to toss in that extra pick to beat our trump card, the extra 1st round pick this year. I agree, the draft is the way to lasting success. FA is the way you fill some needs. It would be nice if we had a need or two filled before heading in to the draft. When you are a bad team, the draft is a slow way of getting things done....impossible IMO. Yolu have to bring in some help. Here is how i look at it. Free agent signing are like adding average 3rd round picks. You know what you are getting. Maybe no superstars to be had, but few busts either. You are getting a proven player. Sure, you can hire a bum, but I trust we know enough not to sign any of those. Let's get a couple of guys who can start for a year or two UNTIL some of these draft choices accumulate and start to pan out. It does speed up the process. As bad as we have been for a decade, I am all for speeding things up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BadNewsBrowns Posted March 20, 2012 Report Share Posted March 20, 2012 I agree that you use free agency to get your supplemental players and focus on your key positions through the draft. They seem to want to build solely through the draft which is going to be a risky and long process. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Westside Steve Posted March 20, 2012 Report Share Posted March 20, 2012 I prefer to light a fire under Colt's ass. Last year he went in with hand hold and told he was going to be the guy. Know he sees the team trying to go after RGIII and say they don't know if it will be him of Wallace. Goofy faced bastard better get his shit together. So in your opinion the reason for the lack of success was that mccoy was un motivated or lazy? WSS Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrownsKidd Posted March 20, 2012 Report Share Posted March 20, 2012 Personally, as much as I wanted RGIII, I'm thinking we did well in not giving everything away to get him. The Rams said what will give, and we gave our first offer not knowing what everyone else was doing. That's all we could do. We will move forward. And I do agree that the draft brings long term success. I would have loved to have seen Winston and Hillis sign. Not sure why we didn't, but the one thing that we can all agreen on is that H&H said we would not be making waves in the FA market and they stuck to there guns. Yet, we are getting all upset because they are doing exactly what they told us they were going to do. I think we will still draft a QB somewhere in the draft. I do not believe we will go into Training camp with just McCoy and Seneca. Remember guys, Brady was a 7th round pick. Yes he has targets and weapons, and I think we are going that direction in the draft. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cribbs is the man Posted March 20, 2012 Report Share Posted March 20, 2012 The key in today's NFL to get better for the long term is to get a legit Franchise QB. Holmgren's story of the RGIII fiasco fits. The Rams had a silent bid auction, H&H put in what they thought was a reasonable bid- the Redskins beat it, and when H&H tried to up the ante they were told- bidding's closed. A little more patience and trust? H&H have already used up this fan's trust allotment, and my patience is down to this season. I can find better things to do on a Sunday afternoon in the fall that sit around a TV and watch the Browns lose. So 2 seasons and youre ready to move on? Thats why we suck now...zero consistency... H&H didnt know what the Redskins were going to offer. That is 4 supposedly starting caliber/great players for one player. Why is RGIII a sure thing? Russell, Leaf, Couch, Akili Smith, Alex Smith.... QBs bust even if they are thought of as a "great talent" (let alone last years QBs)!! So if RGIIIs potential doesnt translate to our offense for whatever reason, or he isnt as good as people think cause hype has built him up we are screwed. Its just wayyy too big a risk for me to take, for the SECOND best QB in this draft.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Gipper Posted March 20, 2012 Report Share Posted March 20, 2012 I am not screaming, nor even saying we aren't trying. I am saying the results show we aren't trying hard enough. Homie and Heck blew the deal for RGIII. It's obvious that was the guy we wanted. They couldn't look far enough ahead to see Washington had to toss in that extra pick to beat our trump card, the extra 1st round pick this year. I agree, the draft is the way to lasting success. FA is the way you fill some needs. It would be nice if we had a need or two filled before heading in to the draft. When you are a bad team, the draft is a slow way of getting things done....impossible IMO. Yolu have to bring in some help. Here is how i look at it. Free agent signing are like adding average 3rd round picks. You know what you are getting. Maybe no superstars to be had, but few busts either. You are getting a proven player. Sure, you can hire a bum, but I trust we know enough not to sign any of those. Let's get a couple of guys who can start for a year or two UNTIL some of these draft choices accumulate and start to pan out. It does speed up the process. As bad as we have been for a decade, I am all for speeding things up. Actually, this supports my theory that the Browns knew what the Redskins would likely bid for RGIII....and purposely offered a bid that would just fall short and which they knew would be rejected. I believe that the Browns did not really want RGIII at the price it was apparently going to cost to move up 2 spots to get him, but they also didn't want it to look like they weren't trying to get him, so they offered something just slightly less than they knew it would take. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hoorta Posted March 20, 2012 Report Share Posted March 20, 2012 So 2 seasons and youre ready to move on? Thats why we suck now...zero consistency... H&H didnt know what the Redskins were going to offer. That is 4 supposedly starting caliber/great players for one player. Why is RGIII a sure thing? Russell, Leaf, Couch, Akili Smith, Alex Smith.... QBs bust even if they are thought of as a "great talent" (let alone last years QBs)!! So if RGIIIs potential doesnt translate to our offense for whatever reason, or he isnt as good as people think cause hype has built him up we are screwed. Its just wayyy too big a risk for me to take, for the SECOND best QB in this draft.. One thing the Browns have done consistently in recent history is SUCK. Ghoolie was laughing at me when I told him I saw "Linear Improvement" in the Browns. Is it too much to hope that "Linear Improvement" will start translating into wins this year? Is losing Hillis and having no RT to speak of improvement? I don't need a crystal ball to tell you every pre-season NFL Rag is going to pick the Browns to finish dead last in the AFC North again. Since 1990- the Browns have had 3 winning seasons. The last time they made the playoffs was 10 years ago. FYI in the same time frame, the Steelers have had 3 LOSING seasons. So sure- we can follow the 49er model- have great drafts for 6 years- and finally field a Super Bowl caliber team in 2016- about the time Joe Thomas is ready to retire- and Joe Haden has moved on in Free Agency. Outside of Heckert's drafting- the current Front Office- with the moves that have been made\not made in the last two seasons has given me zero confidence they can do what they said they were going to do. And that's build for the long haul, and win now. Remember that one? I do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
choco Posted March 20, 2012 Report Share Posted March 20, 2012 addition by subtraction. this RB and RT you speak of we're both plagued by injuries, which suggests that their contributions were minimal. pashos gave a little more than hillis, but was still ineffective with the bad wheel. so what did we really lose....even if you add in steiny? ill agree to disagree on the importance of these players....we had 1 more win in '10 than '11...with a healthy hillis. pashos has never been healthy. steiny missed an entire season. we sucked with them...sucked without them. perhaps, they're not worth worrying about? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ballpeen Posted March 21, 2012 Report Share Posted March 21, 2012 Actually, this supports my theory that the Browns knew what the Redskins would likely bid for RGIII....and purposely offered a bid that would just fall short and which they knew would be rejected. I believe that the Browns did not really want RGIII at the price it was apparently going to cost to move up 2 spots to get him, but they also didn't want it to look like they weren't trying to get him, so they offered something just slightly less than they knew it would take. Sorry Gipper, we didn't do that, but I will say you could have a career as a political spin doctor. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Gipper Posted March 21, 2012 Report Share Posted March 21, 2012 Sorry Gipper, we didn't do that, but I will say you could have a career as a political spin doctor. Well, it may be that it is Holmgren and Heckert that are the political spin doctors. They have everyone believing (including you) that they were hot on the trail of RGIII and that they were willing to sell the farm to get him, when, as I theorize, they were only in it for the show and not for the dough. Those guys may be happy, happy, joy, joy over the fact that they did not have to give up the family jewels to get RG....and they are happy that so many Browns fans think they would have given their left nut to do so. I think they really wanted to keep their nuts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ballpeen Posted March 22, 2012 Report Share Posted March 22, 2012 Well, it may be that it is Holmgren and Heckert that are the political spin doctors. They have everyone believing (including you) that they were hot on the trail of RGIII and that they were willing to sell the farm to get him, when, as I theorize, they were only in it for the show and not for the dough. Those guys may be happy, happy, joy, joy over the fact that they did not have to give up the family jewels to get RG....and they are happy that so many Browns fans think they would have given their left nut to do so. I think they really wanted to keep their nuts. Spin doctors don't spin negative PR in their direction. I'll start working on a nice tinfoil hat for you which I will present to you at the next tailgate. You know me, it's going to look like Cowboy hat, but if you would rather it be a beanie, I;ll start looking for a pinwheel. You know I am just messing with you, right?? But I do think you are not only in left field on this one, but way out of position to boot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tim Couch Pulls Out Posted March 22, 2012 Report Share Posted March 22, 2012 I'm in agreeance with Gip on this one. It's not too hard to imagine that Holmgren is just talking out of both sides of his mouth. It seems to me that maybe, just maybe, Holmgren might not be as successful as Team President as he was as coach. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Gipper Posted March 22, 2012 Report Share Posted March 22, 2012 Spin doctors don't spin negative PR in their direction. I'll start working on a nice tinfoil hat for you which I will present to you at the next tailgate. You know me, it's going to look like Cowboy hat, but if you would rather it be a beanie, I;ll start looking for a pinwheel. You know I am just messing with you, right?? But I do think you are not only in left field on this one, but way out of position to boot. If you make me a hat, make it so I can share it with Howie and Gareth and let them take it home: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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