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Anatomy of a Play


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#1 Earl34

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Posted 26 October 2010 - 11:07 PM

I started looking back at this play after another poster claimed that Colt underthrew Cribbs "by a mile". This isn't meant to be antagonistic. Once I started watching this play again, I noticed some stuff that I liked. Being one to love learning X's and O's, I figured I would share. If anyone can add to the discussion please feel free. Below are some stills of various points in this play.

Score: Browns 3- Saints 0
Situation: 7 minutes left 1st Q. Peyton Hillis just ran for 6 yards off of right tackle.
Down: 1st and 10 on +42.

1. Pre-snap


This is the presnap read. The Browns are in a power I strong right formation.

#1 shows an overshifted seven man front geared towards a strong-side run.

#2 shows the safety as the 8th man in the box. He's buzzed to stop the run but notice he's split outside of the 9-technique Sam backer. He's also eyeing Cribbs. This coupled with the depth of the corner are making me think he's bailing to the short zone in the flat.

#3 is ten yards off the ball and is either in man-to-man with high-low bracket with the safety (#2) or dropping to cover the deep half or third.

#4 is showing zone coverage off of Mitchell and has deep safety help to his side (that safety is off the screen to the left)


2. Drop back



Colt drops into a seven step drop which is telling me his first thought is an intermediate to deep ball. Vickers releases to the flat and Hillis stays in to block. Watson releases over the middle.

#1 shows the Mike dropping deep; TAMPA 2 ! (that's the MLB dropping to cover the deep third with two DBs covering the outside thirds. This leaves four men in zones underneath. Vulnerabilities are the seams and the 7-route (corner/flag)

#2 safety and Sam (who was on the line) drop into zones. Even if the Sam had blitzed, Hillis was there to pick him up.

#3 shows four linemen rushing with six blockers. Thomas is 1-on-1 and seems like he might be getting beat on the speed rush with a dip. The others are in various doubling situations but the protection is 'so far so good'

3. Keeping Colt upright



Joe Thomas gets paid lots of dough to keep the QB upright and even though it seems like he might be beaten, he does what any good left tackle will do (not hold...)...he uses the rusher's momentum to take him past Colt's set up point. Good recovery Joe! Also notice Steinbach about to get dropped on his keister. Colt is in good balance. Shoulders are square and has the ball in good position. Eyes are downfield.

4. The Release



Just to show Colt's release on this throw. His weight is slightly back and he doesn't step into the throw as much as you'd like. Not terrible and it's a little nitpicky. I would chalk it up to Steinbach's man who is bearing down on him. He releases the ball on the 50.

5. The Underthrow (sorry,...couldn't resist)



While the ball may be underthrown a tad, we don't know if he was trying to make it a back shoulder throw to induce interference or it was just underthrown. He threw it 48-49 yards in the air and put it within arms' reach of Cribbs hitting Jenkins in the helmet.

Analysis (my own)
- I think that the first challenge on this play was for Colt to read the coverage properly. Gregg Williams was doing what good coordinators do. He was not showing the coverage too early and presnap, the kid might've been confused. This play was Colt's to make. Vickers was a dump off (covered), Watson was covered as well. Mitchell at split end was probably covered but we don't see that on TV. Cribbs was the play and the kid made the right decision. He had enough time to deliver the ball even though the protection was difficult against only four rushers. He placed a reasonably nice ball accurately. It was certainly a better deep ball 50 yards downfield than Quinn ever threw.

Just an attempt at talking football. I hope you guys liked it. (It also gave me an excuse to use some neat screen capture and photo editing stuff on my computer!)
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#2 tshirtfan

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Posted 26 October 2010 - 11:48 PM

Very interesting post!

The kid does not have the same noodle arm he had when he was 18 and weighed 180 pounds. He weighs in at around 210 pounds now. That's right, he put on 30 pounds of muscle at Texas. I remember hearing a story that before his junior year of college. He was in the weight room with literally over a hundred teammates all huddled around him, and he benched 300 pounds for the first time. When he completed the press, the entire team erupted around him. That's a cool college story for Texas fans, but it also lets you know that he's he's probably hit the limits of what the strength and conditioning program at Texas can do for him. Having seen the facilities first hand I can tell you I find it unlikely that the Browns can bulk him up much more.

I do think he's hit his ceiling in terms of arm strength, but, remember, Colt (and probably Brady Quinn) can hurl the football 70+ yards without much accuracy today. The key for him to stretch the defense will be to extend his accuracy to the 35-45 yard throws, especially when you're leading the receiver vertically instead of across the field. The most encouraging thing about his play so far is that he's already extended his accuracy form 15-25 yard throws to 25-35 yard throws in about nine months. If he can squeeze out just 10 more yards, he'll have the physical tools to be a franchise quarterback. At that point, whether or not he grows into that role is probably not a function of his throwing arm. Remember, he threw a really nice pass to the tight end at the end of the Steelers game that flew at least 45 yards in the air. Fourth quarter accuracy is important; you can't start missing your receivers when your arm gets tired.

This means good things for the Browns, actually. For the front office to decide to bring in a first round QB next season, they have to find someone who beats Colt not only in terms of arm strength but also intangibles, decision making, football IQ, etc. That means two things:

1. They won't waste a draft pick on a guy who has less upside than McCoy, so they could easily use their best draft picks to either acquire or trade for better talent around him, or..
2. They'll pick a once-in-a-decade type QB.

I'm personally not sold on Andrew Luck, because he hasn't played at a consistently high level for more than a single season (remember, McCoy would have been a much higher pick if he left after '08, but a worse quarterback). Locker is a complete project from the ground up (seriously, no pocket presence whatsoever). Mallett is decent but possesses questionable intangibles.

Basically, even the people who want to draft a QB next season have to love McCoy's abilities, because he sets the bar extremely high. They'll need a guy who's got everything Colt has and more.
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#3 Earl34

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Posted 27 October 2010 - 12:08 AM

QUOTE (tshirtfan @ Oct 27 2010, 12:48 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Very interesting post!

The kid does not have the same noodle arm he had when he was 18 and weighed 180 pounds. He weighs in at around 210 pounds now. That's right, he put on 30 pounds of muscle at Texas. I remember hearing a story that before his junior year of college. He was in the weight room with literally over a hundred teammates all huddled around him, and he benched 300 pounds for the first time. When he completed the press, the entire team erupted around him. That's a cool college story for Texas fans, but it also lets you know that he's he's probably hit the limits of what the strength and conditioning program at Texas can do for him. Having seen the facilities first hand I can tell you I find it unlikely that the Browns can bulk him up much more.

I do think he's hit his ceiling in terms of arm strength, but, remember, Colt (and probably Brady Quinn) can hurl the football 70+ yards without much accuracy today. The key for him to stretch the defense will be to extend his accuracy to the 35-45 yard throws, especially when you're leading the receiver vertically instead of across the field. The most encouraging thing about his play so far is that he's already extended his accuracy form 15-25 yard throws to 25-35 yard throws in about nine months. If he can squeeze out just 10 more yards, he'll have the physical tools to be a franchise quarterback. At that point, whether or not he grows into that role is probably not a function of his throwing arm. Remember, he threw a really nice pass to the tight end at the end of the Steelers game that flew at least 45 yards in the air. Fourth quarter accuracy is important; you can't start missing your receivers when your arm gets tired.

This means good things for the Browns, actually. For the front office to decide to bring in a first round QB next season, they have to find someone who beats Colt not only in terms of arm strength but also intangibles, decision making, football IQ, etc. That means two things:

1. They won't waste a draft pick on a guy who has less upside than McCoy, so they could easily use their best draft picks to either acquire or trade for better talent around him, or..
2. They'll pick a once-in-a-decade type QB.

I'm personally not sold on Andrew Luck, because he hasn't played at a consistently high level for more than a single season (remember, McCoy would have been a much higher pick if he left after '08, but a worse quarterback). Locker is a complete project from the ground up (seriously, no pocket presence whatsoever). Mallett is decent but possesses questionable intangibles.

Basically, even the people who want to draft a QB next season have to love McCoy's abilities, because he sets the bar extremely high. They'll need a guy who's got everything Colt has and more.


Do you remember when he was competing as a redshirt freshman with Jevan Snead? He was so scrawny we were all thinking "Who the hell invited the sixth grader?". After that Bennett hit against A&M he decided he needed to bulk up which is where your story comes in. Nice!

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#4 secondwave

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Posted 27 October 2010 - 12:42 AM

So hold on...

here in the Browns board, people get TONS of "thanks" when they post some "the Browns are number 1! YEAH!" bullshit, but when 2 really intelligent posts like these are put up, nothing? :S
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#5 secondwave

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Posted 27 October 2010 - 12:48 AM

QUOTE (tshirtfan @ Oct 27 2010, 12:48 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Very interesting post!

The kid does not have the same noodle arm he had when he was 18 and weighed 180 pounds. He weighs in at around 210 pounds now. That's right, he put on 30 pounds of muscle at Texas. I remember hearing a story that before his junior year of college. He was in the weight room with literally over a hundred teammates all huddled around him, and he benched 300 pounds for the first time. When he completed the press, the entire team erupted around him. That's a cool college story for Texas fans, but it also lets you know that he's he's probably hit the limits of what the strength and conditioning program at Texas can do for him. Having seen the facilities first hand I can tell you I find it unlikely that the Browns can bulk him up much more.

I do think he's hit his ceiling in terms of arm strength, but, remember, Colt (and probably Brady Quinn) can hurl the football 70+ yards without much accuracy today. The key for him to stretch the defense will be to extend his accuracy to the 35-45 yard throws, especially when you're leading the receiver vertically instead of across the field. The most encouraging thing about his play so far is that he's already extended his accuracy form 15-25 yard throws to 25-35 yard throws in about nine months. If he can squeeze out just 10 more yards, he'll have the physical tools to be a franchise quarterback. At that point, whether or not he grows into that role is probably not a function of his throwing arm. Remember, he threw a really nice pass to the tight end at the end of the Steelers game that flew at least 45 yards in the air. Fourth quarter accuracy is important; you can't start missing your receivers when your arm gets tired.

This means good things for the Browns, actually. For the front office to decide to bring in a first round QB next season, they have to find someone who beats Colt not only in terms of arm strength but also intangibles, decision making, football IQ, etc. That means two things:

1. They won't waste a draft pick on a guy who has less upside than McCoy, so they could easily use their best draft picks to either acquire or trade for better talent around him, or..
2. They'll pick a once-in-a-decade type QB.

I'm personally not sold on Andrew Luck, because he hasn't played at a consistently high level for more than a single season (remember, McCoy would have been a much higher pick if he left after '08, but a worse quarterback). Locker is a complete project from the ground up (seriously, no pocket presence whatsoever). Mallett is decent but possesses questionable intangibles.

Basically, even the people who want to draft a QB next season have to love McCoy's abilities, because he sets the bar extremely high. They'll need a guy who's got everything Colt has and more.


I'd like to give McCoy some more time, even after this season. I have faith that he's our guy.

Luck being dubbed "Peyton Manning-lite" is too much atm. When you're a once-in-a-generation QB under a great QB coach like Harbaugh, you need to put up much better numbers no matter the talent around you. I like him, but he reminds me more of a mobile Matt Ryan than Peyton Manning.

Mallett is not going to succeed in the NFL. He lacks the fundamental skills and intangibles you look for. He can haul it 70 yards, but can't make a shovel pass? C'mon dude.

Locker could be something special. He's got a ridiculous ceiling, but a low basement. He's a hit-or-miss, and i'm not willing to take a chance on that shit. We've had 2 decades of that crap.

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#6 ballpeen

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Posted 27 October 2010 - 05:37 AM

I don't see it as Colt under throwing the ball. He gave it all he had....and that is about all he has for a deep ball...which is fine. You don't have to have a QB who can launch it 65 yards in the air. Colt's 45-50 is good enough.

What Colt has to do is throw it a little sooner. I don't know at what point on the field Cribbs was when Colt released the ball....lets say the 30 which might be about right...what he needs to do is start releasing it when Cribbs is on the 35 which is in essence adding 5 yards to the throws. At that point the ball is out in front of Cribbs and not in to the defender. Not to mention the ball is being released about the time you see Steinbachs man breaking free rather than free and heading towards the qb.

It isn't so much a arm issue. It is a timing issue....and that can be corrected.

Kosars bombs weren't the same kind of bombs Testraverde threw, but people cheered loud and hard none the less.

Just start tossing it a split sooner. I like the odds Cribbs is going to carry his guy in to the endzone, and if not, who's going to complain about a 45 yard gain to the 5??

The coaching staff may need to make adjustments in the way we run routes on deep balls. If the routes are geared for 50 yards, we may need to adjust the cuts and breaks for 40 yards.

All simple stuff if everybody gets on the same page.
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#7 USFBrown

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Posted 27 October 2010 - 05:53 AM

QUOTE (secondwave @ Oct 27 2010, 01:42 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
So hold on...

here in the Browns board, people get TONS of "thanks" when they post some "the Browns are number 1! YEAH!" bullshit, but when 2 really intelligent posts like these are put up, nothing? :S



If there was a 'Cookie' button, i'd give you a virtual cookie. Sounds like you need one. Or a virtual pat on the back.

biggrin.gif

PS... it's ok, he posted it pretty late for us working folks to see it yet. The Thanks will come.
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#8 Earl34

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Posted 27 October 2010 - 06:53 AM

QUOTE (ballpeen @ Oct 27 2010, 06:37 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
I don't see it as Colt under throwing the ball. He gave it all he had....and that is about all he has for a deep ball...which is fine. You don't have to have a QB who can launch it 65 yards in the air. Colt's 45-50 is good enough.

What Colt has to do is throw it a little sooner. I don't know at what point on the field Cribbs was when Colt released the ball....lets say the 30 which might be about right...what he needs to do is start releasing it when Cribbs is on the 35 which is in essence adding 5 yards to the throws. At that point the ball is out in front of Cribbs and not in to the defender. Not to mention the ball is being released about the time you see Steinbachs man breaking free rather than free and heading towards the qb.

It isn't so much a arm issue. It is a timing issue....and that can be corrected.

Kosars bombs weren't the same kind of bombs Testraverde threw, but people cheered loud and hard none the less.

Just start tossing it a split sooner. I like the odds Cribbs is going to carry his guy in to the endzone, and if not, who's going to complain about a 45 yard gain to the 5??

The coaching staff may need to make adjustments in the way we run routes on deep balls. If the routes are geared for 50 yards, we may need to adjust the cuts and breaks for 40 yards.

All simple stuff if everybody gets on the same page.


Now that you mention it, I can see the issue of the timing. It's a little difficult though because you can't see what Cribbs is doing downfield. Personally, I'm just glad he picked a guy in single coverage who seems to have been the correct read based on what the defense was doing. As you say, it can be corrected and timing is typically something Colt was very good at in college. Just takes a lot of reps.

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#9 c-dawg

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Posted 27 October 2010 - 08:06 AM

I have to take a second to share some much-deserved praise for earl34's work here.

Love the analysis and technical skills. You've elevated the discussion and have talent. I appreciate the knowledge and willingness to share.

This freaking forum rocks!

Go Browns!
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#10 halfsane

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Posted 27 October 2010 - 08:13 AM

QUOTE (c-dawg @ Oct 27 2010, 01:06 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
I have to take a second to share some much-deserved praise for earl34's work here.

Love the analysis and technical skills. You've elevated the discussion and have talent. I appreciate the knowledge and willingness to share.

This freaking forum rocks!

Go Browns!



I totally agree. It is great to see this kind of break down of a play and learn a little bit. Do more, Earl!


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#11 tshirtfan

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Posted 27 October 2010 - 08:25 AM

QUOTE (secondwave @ Oct 27 2010, 12:48 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
I'd like to give McCoy some more time, even after this season. I have faith that he's our guy.

Luck being dubbed "Peyton Manning-lite" is too much atm. When you're a once-in-a-generation QB under a great QB coach like Harbaugh, you need to put up much better numbers no matter the talent around you. I like him, but he reminds me more of a mobile Matt Ryan than Peyton Manning.

Mallett is not going to succeed in the NFL. He lacks the fundamental skills and intangibles you look for. He can haul it 70 yards, but can't make a shovel pass? C'mon dude.

Locker could be something special. He's got a ridiculous ceiling, but a low basement. He's a hit-or-miss, and i'm not willing to take a chance on that shit. We've had 2 decades of that crap.


I think Colt's got "it," too. I'm just saying even the doubters should be happy about his level of play, because Holmgren/Heckert won't draft a kid who isn't clearly better.

Luck put up extremely mediocre numbers when he was handing off to Toby Gerhart. He's clearly got a lot of skill, and he's winning in the air more, but one good season in the PAC-10 is not necessarily an NFL pedigre... yet.

Whatever happens, if McCoy heads in to the spring as "the guy," I'd expect he'll be spending a lot of extra time working with receivers. He'll learn exactly where Cribbs is going to be after a seven step drop back. And he was pretty close already.
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#12 tshirtfan

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Posted 27 October 2010 - 08:28 AM

QUOTE (Earl34 @ Oct 27 2010, 12:08 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Do you remember when he was competing as a redshirt freshman with Jevan Snead? He was so scrawny we were all thinking "Who the hell invited the sixth grader?". After that Bennett hit against A&M he decided he needed to bulk up which is where your story comes in. Nice!


If I recall correctly, he didn't really compete with Snead until his sophomore season in '07. Snead was a good example of all measurables, no intangibles.
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#13 Gips

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Posted 27 October 2010 - 08:31 AM

QUOTE (c-dawg @ Oct 27 2010, 09:06 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
I have to take a second to share some much-deserved praise for earl34's work here.

Love the analysis and technical skills. You've elevated the discussion and have talent. I appreciate the knowledge and willingness to share.

This freaking forum rocks!

Go Browns!


/agree nice job earl34!
Colt has plenty of room to get stronger actually his arm is already stronger than when he first came to cleveland, we have some very good assistants and carl smith is no exception...
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#14 tampadawgs

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Posted 27 October 2010 - 08:34 AM

great post!!!!!!!!!!!!

I am just not sold on Colt yet, we will see.....I will say this he is 1-1 as a starter with no WRs
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#15 The Gipper

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Posted 27 October 2010 - 10:18 AM

QUOTE (secondwave @ Oct 27 2010, 01:42 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
So hold on...

here in the Browns board, people get TONS of "thanks" when they post some "the Browns are number 1! YEAH!" bullshit, but when 2 really intelligent posts like these are put up, nothing? :S



Considering that he made that post at 12:07 AM, and you made your post at 1:42 AM, it is probable that most of us were at home in bed. You are bitching because a ton of "Thanks" didn't come in between midnight and 2 in the morning?
Most of us have jobs to get up and go to in the morning. Why don't you think about getting one?

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#16 ballpeen

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Posted 27 October 2010 - 10:36 AM

QUOTE (Earl34 @ Oct 27 2010, 07:53 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Now that you mention it, I can see the issue of the timing. It's a little difficult though because you can't see what Cribbs is doing downfield. Personally, I'm just glad he picked a guy in single coverage who seems to have been the correct read based on what the defense was doing. As you say, it can be corrected and timing is typically something Colt was very good at in college. Just takes a lot of reps.




No doubt he read it correctly.

As for the timing, on shorter routes a QB can do a bit more on changing when the ball arrives. He can lead a bit more and take some off the throw or in a tight window can put a little more mustard on the throw, or do something in between.

On deep balls you are already throwing it 'all out", so the only thing you can do it toss it out there a little earlier.

I am sure part of the deal is coaches probably teach to underthrow a bit because your receiver can fight for the catch or you can draw interference calls as the defender runs up the receivers back.

In theory though, on long balls, a qb should probably overthrow just as many as they underthrow.


It's just more practice. Keep working the timing and toss them out there a little sooner.

A good drill for this would be to have Colt work on out throwing the receiver for a while, giving him a better visual for when he needs to release the ball. Sooner or later he will start dropping them in the basket.

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#17 halfsane

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Posted 27 October 2010 - 11:02 AM

QUOTE (The Gipper @ Oct 27 2010, 03:18 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Considering that he made that post at 12:07 AM, and you made your post at 1:42 AM, it is probable that most of us were at home in bed. You are bitching because a ton of "Thanks" didn't come in between midnight and 2 in the morning?
Most of us have jobs to get up and go to in the morning. Why don't you think about getting one?



I always get pissed when I get home from the bar and not enough thanks are given out on the browns board!

angry.gif
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#18 ballpeen

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Posted 27 October 2010 - 11:27 AM

QUOTE (halfsane @ Oct 27 2010, 12:02 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
I always get pissed when I get home from the bar and not enough thanks are given out on the browns board!

angry.gif


Must be pretty tough when the half sane part is drunk. wink.gif

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#19 halfsane

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Posted 27 October 2010 - 01:06 PM

QUOTE (ballpeen @ Oct 27 2010, 05:27 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Must be pretty tough when the half sane part is drunk. wink.gif



It is a constant battle wink.gif
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#20 longhorn

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Posted 27 October 2010 - 06:02 PM

QUOTE (ballpeen @ Oct 27 2010, 05:37 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
I don't see it as Colt under throwing the ball. He gave it all he had....and that is about all he has for a deep ball...which is fine. You don't have to have a QB who can launch it 65 yards in the air. Colt's 45-50 is good enough.



I live in Texas and watched Colt play his whole career at Texas. He can easily throw the ball 65 yards.....just saying.

I believe he put the ball where he wanted.
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