Actual Browns Thread

[The Gipper]

All this conjecture about players the Browns don't even have yet.....and will not have at all except for a select few. Why don't we talk about ACTUAL Cleveland Browns players...and what these guys may do to contribute to the Browns actually winning some games. Let's make an assumption that the Browns are NOT going to start 22 rookies on this team. Further, lets make an assumption that the Browns will actually not have any rookies on the roster...or that rookies will make much of a contribution to winning (they really didn't last year) Lets look at the roster as is.

 

Start with the offense:

 

A. Quarterbacks. We have Brock Osweiler, Cody Kessler and Kevin Hogan

First question: who starts.....and what does each bring to help winning games?

2d question: do we need to replace/enhance this position?

 

B. Runninig Backs: Crowell, Duke, George Atkinson

A "winning" combination or do we need to enhance this position?

 

C. TEs Barnidge, DeValve, Telfer

A winning combination or is help needed?

 

D. Coleman, Britt, Higgins, Louis et al.

Winning combination? More help needed? (Gordon?)

 

E. OC: Tretter, Marcus Martin, Reiter

Two FA pickups here.

Winning combination?

 

F. Zeitler, Bitonio, Drango, Greco

Winning combination?

 

G. Thomas, Erving, Shon Coleman

JT secure....what about duel between Erving/Coleman...or do we need another?

[The Gipper]

Defense:

 

DEs: Starters are listed as Meder and Ogbah, backed up by Nassib and X. Cooper.

Winning combination? Help needed?

 

DTs: Shelton backed up by Gabe Wright and Nile Lawrence-Stample (Des Bryant?)

First Question here......are Browns converting to base 4-3?

If so....do these guys fit the bill...or is help needed?

 

OLBs: Starters Jamie Collins and Joe Schobert, backed up by Nate Ochard and Cam Johnson

Winning combo? Help needed?

 

ILBs: Starters are Demario Davis and Christian Kirksey, backed up by Tank Carder

Winning combo? Enhancement needed?

 

CBs: Starters: Joe Haden and Jamar Taylor, backups Boddy-Calhoun and Marcus Burley (who?)

Winning comination? Help needed?

 

Safeties: Starters listed are Ed Reynolds (who?) and Ibrahim Campbell backup Trey Caldwell Tyvus Powell. (Derrick Kindred listed on DL)

Winning combination? Need enhancement?

 

Punter: Britton Colquitt

Kicker: Cody Parkey

LS: Charley Hughlett

PR: Duke Johnson

KR: George Atkinson

[Tour2ma]

We're talking about the draft because we still need a lot of help... essentially everywhere.

[The Gipper]

All this conjecture about players the Browns don't even have yet.....and will not have at all except for a select few. Why don't we talk about ACTUAL Cleveland Browns players...and what these guys may do to contribute to the Browns actually winning some games. Let's make an assumption that the Browns are NOT going to start 22 rookies on this team. Further, lets make an assumption that the Browns will actually not have any rookies on the roster...or that rookies will make much of a contribution to winning (they really didn't last year) Lets look at the roster as is.

 

Start with the offense:

 

A. Quarterbacks. We have Brock Osweiler, Cody Kessler and Kevin Hogan

First question: who starts.....and what does each bring to help winning games?

2d question: do we need to replace/enhance this position?

 

Again: assuming no draft help, BO I think starts, Kessler is backup (or vice versa). In any case...NO, not a winning combination. One of the worst in the league.

 

B. Runninig Backs: Crowell, Duke, George Atkinson

A "winning" combination or do we need to enhance this position?

I think we are fairly well set. I do not expect any high pick used here. Maybe a 6th/7th rounder, maybe a UDFA

 

C. TEs Barnidge, DeValve, Telfer

A winning combination or is help needed?

Barnidge dropping off. The others are young/unknown commodities. At this point, questionable quality.

 

D. Coleman, Britt, Higgins, Louis et al.

Winning combination? More help needed? (Gordon?)

Gordon would help a lot...if he were the Gordon we once knew. 4 WRs taken last year, all on team....all questionable talent. Coleman and Britt need to step up. Overall, I am not fully satisfied with this spot.

 

E. OC: Tretter, Marcus Martin, Reiter

Two FA pickups here.

Winning combination?

I think we are pretty well set. Fabiano another possibility.

 

F. Zeitler, Bitonio, Drango, Greco

Winning combination?

Strong combination. Perhaps the best in the league. Greco as a backup is quality. Drango can/should improve

 

G. Thomas, Erving, Shon Coleman

JT secure....what about duel between Erving/Coleman...or do we need another?

Not sold on the right side. Not sure why Erving listed as starter. I think Coleman should take spot.

Help high in the draft would not be unwarranted.

[The Gipper]

We're talking about the draft because we still need a lot of help... essentially everywhere.

We are not talking about the draft per se in this thread. We are talking about the current state of the Browns. Like 85-90% of the Browns players this coming year are going to be guys that are currently here. THESE are the guys that matter. One or two rookie starters are not going to have a vast effect on the performance of this team.

[The Gipper]

Defense:

 

DEs: Starters are listed as Meder and Ogbah, backed up by Nassib and X. Cooper.

Winning combination? Help needed?

IF these guys play up to their draft slots, they could be serviceable. These guys will STILL be the core of the Browns pass rush, no matter what.

 

DTs: Shelton backed up by Gabe Wright and Nile Lawrence-Stample (Des Bryant?)

First Question here......are Browns converting to base 4-3?

If so....do these guys fit the bill...or is help needed?

Shelton is solid. The rest are not IMO. Bryant could help...but further help necessary...moreso than at DE IMO.

 

OLBs: Starters Jamie Collins and Joe Schobert, backed up by Nate Ochard and Cam Johnson

Winning combo? Help needed?

Collins playing out of position, but still the best we have. Schobert seems backup/rotational material. Orchard a bit disappointing. Needs to step up.

Again, I see this as a postion more in need of help than DE...not that this defense can't use help anywhere

 

ILBs: Starters are Demario Davis and Christian Kirksey, backed up by Tank Carder

Winning combo? Enhancement needed?

Seems pretty solid as far as starters go. Would be even more so if Collins could be moved to his natural position inside, but the Browns lack of talent at OLB dictates he stay out there.

 

CBs: Starters: Joe Haden and Jamar Taylor, backups Boddy-Calhoun and Marcus Burley (who?)

Winning comination? Help needed?

Help definitely needed. Haden's health can be an issue. Taylor serviceable at best IMO. Backup B-C had a few nice moments, but over meh on CB backups.

No real move in FA to get help disturbing.

 

Safeties: Starters listed are Ed Reynolds (who?) and Ibrahim Campbell backup Trey Caldwell Tyvus Powell. (Derrick Kindred listed on DL)

Winning combination? Need enhancement?

Possibly worse than CB...no proven pro like Haden. Kindred the best imo...but he has been hurt.

A serious, serious need.

 

Punter: Britton Colquitt...solid

Kicker: Cody Parkey....do we need competion here? They have a guy named Brett Maher on the roster. Not a proven spot by any means.

LS: Charley Hughlett....good enough. (Isn't he highest paid LS in the game?)

PR: Duke Johnson

KR: George Atkinson

For PR/KR we could use men like Josh Cribbs and Travis Benjamin again.

Maybe Woody gets his wish and the Browns take Peppers. While there are issues about his coverage skills, he seems a first rate kick returner.

[Tour2ma]

OK... I'll play...

A. Quarterbacks. We have Brock Osweiler, Cody Kessler and Kevin Hogan... First question: who starts.....and what does each bring to help winning games? 2d question: do we need to replace/enhance this position?

Priority: High

Draft: Weak with possible depth

Clearly the area of the greatest need based upon 2016. Need makes the position a high priority... a level that is unfortunately not matched by the talent available.

If Kessler ups his game, if he trusts his reads and his arm to hit the windows he sees, then he might become a serviceable bridge-strarter to a QB not yet on the roster.

The Brockweiler has all the above issues and more, i.e., he doesn't make reads and lacks Kess' pocket presence. Might he grow? I'm not holding my breath.

Hogan? If Brock isn't gone, then he will be. Either way, at minimum a Day Two or Three prospect will be added this draft... a value "shot", IF one of the "top prospects" does not fall into our lap on Day 1.

While I still like Kelly to kick off Day 3, his recent wrist/hand surgery and it's 3-month recovery is another hit to his draft stock. A later Round 5 pickmay get him and were he to start off on the PUP list, it would not be the worst thing for him... or us.

B. Runninig Backs: Crowell, Duke, George Atkinson... A "winning" combination or do we need to enhance this position?

Priority: Medium to Low

Draft: Strong and deep, but with "troubled" talent at the top

Not "winning", but in Crow and Duke we have adequate talent. Atkinson has potential, but has failed longer to develop it. Don't sleep on Darius Jackson, our other RB, who flashed in pre-season with the 'Boys last year before getting caught in a numbers game when McFadden was reactivated. We were one of many teams to put in a waivers claim.

There is really good value on Day 3 to add to the mix.

C. TEs: Barnidge, DeValve, Telfer... A winning combination or is help needed?

Priority: Medium-high to High

Draft: Very Strong and Deep

While the pass threat from Devalve is significant and Barn and Telfer are adequate receivers for the postion, we simply lack blocking from the position. And you need TEs that can block if you aspire to be a power team in the NFL.

There are too many prospects with blocking and receiving skills to not take one... starting with OJH at 12 through Kittle likely somewhere on Day 3.

D. WRs: Coleman, Britt, Higgins, Louis et al. Winning combination? More help needed? (Gordon?)

Priority: Low

Draft: Strong and deep

We made a heavy investment in the position in the class of 2016. While the early returns were disappointing for a variety of reasons, the final verdict is not yet in. We added a couple cheap FAs to hedge our bet.

Due to the Gorden question, we might not be able to resist an early faller pushed down by other positions' rise, but most likely we dip into a good Day 3 pool.

E. OC: Tretter, Marcus Martin, Reiter
Two FA pickups here.
Winning combination?

Priority: Now it's low...

Draft: Midling to weak... as is the OL class as a whole

Tretter is penciled in as our starter. Both Rieter and Fabiano (not listed) looked serviceable to promising in late, 2016 auditions. Martin? Has simply never risen to the level of his promise... I don't see him starting to do so now.

All the talk of one or more Centers going in Round 1 has faded. Somewhere around the Day 2/3 cusp a team will take the best value I see at the position, UK's Jon Toth, but it won't be us.

F. OGs: Zeitler, Bitonio, Drango, Greco... Winning combination?

Priority: Low

Draft: Medium Strong to Medium

In Zeitler and Bito we now have one of the best starting tandems in the league. Drango had some quality time subbing in and has swingman potential. Greco is the wild card... if he gets healthy, he's quality depth at OG and has always been rumored to have some game at OT. Also have to remember that Fabs can move to OG. It's likely that Reiter can as well.

All the above combines to ensure we will not spend 2017 draft capital inside... at least not exclusively inside. A projected OG who also carries good OT potential ? More likely, but still not likely... but if we did my guy, Dion Dawkins, will be there on Day 2.

G. OTs:Thomas, Erving, Shon Coleman... JT secure....what about duel between Erving/Coleman...or do we need another?

Priority: Medium

Draft: Weak and shallow

I've said forever that Shon Coleman is our RT. With Greco and Drango (or Drango and Greco) providing OT flexibility, it's hard for me to see Erving making the squad.

We know Cam has real technique, awareness and strength issues. We know Cam is not an option inside, even in a backup capacity, so there is a real numbers game question brewing. While the move to OT minimizes his exposure to confusion and being out-muscled, it eliminates neither. AND his technique issues will be magnified by the move.

 

We currently have 14 OL rostered... 14! The most we will carry are 9 and if there's a route to 8 we will jump on it. Of those rostered, but not listed above, there are more exposed names, but not enough of them. Cam's best chance is if Greco doesn't return to health and at most has to start out on the PUP list.

 

D-side later...

[mjp28]

OK... I'll play...

A. Quarterbacks. We have Brock Osweiler, Cody Kessler and Kevin Hogan... First question: who starts.....and what does each bring to help winning games? 2d question: do we need to replace/enhance this position?

Priority: High

Draft: Weak with possible depth

Clearly the area of the greatest need based upon 2016. Need makes the position a high priority... a level that is unfortunately not matched by the talent available.

If Kessler ups his game, if he trusts his reads and his arm to hit the windows he sees, then he might become a serviceable bridge-strarter to a QB not yet on the roster.

The Brockweiler has all the above issues and more, i.e., he doesn't make reads and lacks Kess' pocket presence. Might he grow? I'm not holding my breath.

Hogan? If Brock isn't gone, then he will be. Either way, at minimum a Day Two or Three prospect will be added this draft... a value "shot", IF one of the "top prospects" does not fall into our lap on Day 1.

While I still like Kelly to kick off Day 3, his recent wrist/hand surgery and it's 3-month recovery is another hit to his draft stock. A later Round 5 pickmay get him and were he to start off on the PUP list, it would not be the worst thing for him... or us.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

 

How absolutely ironic the BROWNS are sitting on #1 and #12 and no real save the day QBs are out there! The complete opposite of a 1983 draft or most any half decent year.

 

[TexasAg1969]

OK... I'll play...

A. Quarterbacks. We have Brock Osweiler, Cody Kessler and Kevin Hogan... First question: who starts.....and what does each bring to help winning games? 2d question: do we need to replace/enhance this position?

Priority: High

Draft: Weak with possible depth

Clearly the area of the greatest need based upon 2016. Need makes the position a high priority... a level that is unfortunately not matched by the talent available.

If Kessler ups his game, if he trusts his reads and his arm to hit the windows he sees, then he might become a serviceable bridge-strarter to a QB not yet on the roster.

The Brockweiler has all the above issues and more, i.e., he doesn't make reads and lacks Kess' pocket presence. Might he grow? I'm not holding my breath.

Hogan? If Brock isn't gone, then he will be. Either way, at minimum a Day Two or Three prospect will be added this draft... a value "shot", IF one of the "top prospects" does not fall into our lap on Day 1.

While I still like Kelly to kick off Day 3, his recent wrist/hand surgery and it's 3-month recovery is another hit to his draft stock. A later Round 5 pickmay get him and were he to start off on the PUP list, it would not be the worst thing for him... or us.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

 

How absolutely ironic the BROWNS are sitting on #1 and #12 and no real save the day QBs are out there! The complete opposite of a 1983 draft or most any half decent year.

 

 

My advice is save as much ammunition for next year where there seems to be better options. Build a tremendous defense and drop in the QB. But then that is just a formula that works so the Browns are likely to do the opposite. Just hop in the running fucking car dammit!

[Tour2ma]

My advice is save as much ammunition for next year where there seems to be better options. Build a tremendous defense and drop in the QB. But then that is just a formula that works so the Browns are likely to do the opposite. Just hop in the running fucking car dammit!

 

On NFL Live yesterday the day's crew were debating the rumored MG-Trubs "decision". The two ex-NFL'ers asked McShay about the QB class of 2018.

 

Todd said there were three with top-five potential, the UCLA kid, Rosen, a kid whose name and school I did not catch and an emerging kid from Wyoming, Josh Allen.

[jiggins7919]

The guy on defense I'm most excited about is Nate Orchard. He had a nasty high-ankle sprain last year, and we really didn't get to see him play much. He could be a real wild card for us, and I really hope he's able to provide a pass rushing spark for our anemic defense.

 

The offensive guy is Corey Coleman. There's been a few recent articles which indicate Hue Jackson expects Corey to "be the guy" this year, and while that's a lot of pressure, it's only natural when a team picks you in the first round. If he's able to "make the jump", it could really open things up for players like Britt, Duke, Devalve/Barnidge, and the running game.

 

At this time, I think Cody Kessler is going to be our day 1 starter, and I'm actually ok with it. I'm ok with it because I expect all rookies to improve from their first year, and QB's can sometimes make the biggest leaps. If that happens, we'll be far from a pushover.

[The Gipper]

 

My advice is save as much ammunition for next year where there seems to be better options. Build a tremendous defense and drop in the QB. But then that is just a formula that works so the Browns are likely to do the opposite. Just hop in the running fucking car dammit!

Again, lets talk here about what we have, not what we don't have or conjecture on what we could have. There are a zillion other threads for that.

[TexasAg1969]

 

On NFL Live yesterday the day's crew were debating the rumored MG-Trubs "decision". The two ex-NFL'ers asked McShay about the QB class of 2018.

 

Todd said there were three with top-five potential, the UCLA kid, Rosen, a kid whose name and school I did not catch and an emerging kid from Wyoming, Josh Allen.

 

Sam Darnold- USC Walter football has him going #1 overall.

 

Next years safety class will be even stronger than this year's if you can believe that. Multiple first round level players at that position.

[The Gipper]

 

Sam Darnold- USC Walter football has him going #1 overall.

When did the Browns sign him. Again, a hundred other threads exist about speculating on future possible players. Talk here about the guys that ARE now members of the Cleveland Browns.

[TexasAg1969]

Desmond Bryant can fill a big need if he is as well as before his injury. Danny needs a running mate in the middle of the 4-3.

[The Gipper]

Desmond Bryant can fill a big need if he is as well as before his injury. Danny needs a running mate in the middle of the 4-3.

Agree.

[browns52]

All this conjecture about players the Browns don't even have yet.....and will not have at all except for a select few. Why don't we talk about ACTUAL Cleveland Browns players...and what these guys may do to contribute to the Browns actually winning some games. Let's make an assumption that the Browns are NOT going to start 22 rookies on this team. Further, lets make an assumption that the Browns will actually not have any rookies on the roster...or that rookies will make much of a contribution to winning (they really didn't last year) Lets look at the roster as is.

 

Start with the offense:

 

A. Quarterbacks. We have Brock Osweiler, Cody Kessler and Kevin Hogan

First question: who starts.....and what does each bring to help winning games?

2d question: do we need to replace/enhance this position?

 

B. Runninig Backs: Crowell, Duke, George Atkinson

A "winning" combination or do we need to enhance this position?

 

C. TEs Barnidge, DeValve, Telfer

A winning combination or is help needed?

 

D. Coleman, Britt, Higgins, Louis et al.

Winning combination? More help needed? (Gordon?)

 

E. OC: Tretter, Marcus Martin, Reiter

Two FA pickups here.

Winning combination?

 

F. Zeitler, Bitonio, Drango, Greco

Winning combination?

 

G. Thomas, Erving, Shon Coleman

JT secure....what about duel between Erving/Coleman...or do we need another?

i like jt...other than that we really really really suck everywhere...maybe tank...can't go wrong with a name like tank...these rb's...mediocre even with a good ol...i like duke as a special team player...he's not a rb...crowell is not the cream of the crop by any means...we have no recievers and crappy qb's...so i am with tourma...we need everything...still....20 yrs later...still need everything...face reality...

[browns52]

When did the Browns sign him. Again, a hundred other threads exist about speculating on future possible players. Talk here about the guys that ARE now members of the Cleveland Browns.

by the way...love the picture of the dude...one of my favorite movies....must have seen it 20 times at least....

[Tour2ma]

by the way...love the picture of the dude...one of my favorite movies....must have seen it 20 times at least....

 

Should be a picture of a judge pounding a gavel... "Order in the court! Stay on topic!"

[The Gipper]

 

Should be a picture of a judge pounding a gavel... "Order in the court! Stay on topic!"

I don't have control here like I do there.

 

And, by the way....the cop with a gun in my court is more effective at controlling order than the gavel. Just a little inside information for you. Would that I could apply that technique here.

[Tour2ma]

Not my style... I learned long ago that once created a thread takes on a life of its own.

 

Sometimes the tangents degrade a thread. However, many more times their mutations enhance them.

 

Over at Steve Hoffman Music Forums, a great place to talk music, whenever I created a thread I closed my OP with: "It's your thread now..."

 

My advice... Turn it loose... if it loves you, it will come back... eventually.

[browns52]

When did the Browns sign him. Again, a hundred other threads exist about speculating on future possible players. Talk here about the guys that ARE now members of the Cleveland Browns.

pretty bleak with the current roster...none of the recievers showed up...one broke his hand which does not bode well for his future...tough injury with those little bones in the hand...probably will have issues throughout his career..the others, pffft, where the fuck were they...i saw dropped balls mostly...no impact what so ever...ol sucks except for jt who has probably hit his peak now...qb's, eh...another boneheaded move by baby huey like the rg3 move and he'll be out the door..the defense...they plain ol suck...no speed, cannot cover backs out of the backfield or te's...no hard hitters...can't get off the field on 3rd downs...you name it and they suck at all of it...THEY NEED HELP.....

[The Gipper]

pretty bleak with the current roster...none of the recievers showed up...one broke his hand which does not bode well for his future...tough injury with those little bones in the hand...probably will have issues throughout his career..the others, pffft, where the fuck were they...i saw dropped balls mostly...no impact what so ever...ol sucks except for jt who has probably hit his peak now...qb's, eh...another boneheaded move by baby huey like the rg3 move and he'll be out the door..the defense...they plain ol suck...no speed, cannot cover backs out of the backfield or te's...no hard hitters...can't get off the field on 3rd downs...you name it and they suck at all of it...THEY NEED HELP.....

Fair summary, except that I think they did a lot to improve their OL in Free Agency.

[browns52]

Fair summary, except that I think they did a lot to improve their OL in Free Agency.

we will see...there is also the other side of this...maybe our assistant coaches really suck and some of the players are not as bad as it appears...it's one or the other....although it could be both.....if so, i quote sorano about jabu....it's bad, its very very bad....

[The Gipper]

we will see...there is also the other side of this...maybe our assistant coaches really suck and some of the players are not as bad as it appears...it's one or the other....although it could be both.....if so, i quote sorano about jabu....it's bad, its very very bad....

I think we improved on the asst. coach front in ditching Horton for William. At least I hope so.

[browns52]

I think we improved on the asst. coach front in ditching Horton for William. At least I hope so.

there's a shit load of asst. coaches though...we should have tried to sign munchak before he went to the steelers...there's lb coaches...dl coaches...secondary etc etc....there may be more than 1 horton....

[The Gipper]

there's a shit load of asst. coaches though...we should have tried to sign munchak before he went to the steelers...there's lb coaches...dl coaches...secondary etc etc....there may be more than 1 horton....

I hear you on Munchak. Though I still think he may again get a HC gig.

[gumby73]

Start with the offense:

 

A. Quarterbacks. Brock Osweiler, Kevin Hogan.........GOT TO GO..WILL FIND A CHEAP VET QB AFTER DRAFT & MAY DRAFT ONE

 

B. Runninig Backs: Crowell, Duke, George Atkinson........WITH JACKSON ADDED THEY WILL HARDBALL CROW TO SIGN OR THEY LOVE 2ND ROUND OR ANY PICK

 

C. TEs Telfer........GOT TO GO..GOOD TE DRAFT TO RETIRE BARNEY

 

G. Erving, Shon Coleman........ONE WINS & THEY GOT TO KEEP THE OTHER..JT NO SPRING CHICKEN..

 

Defense:

 

DEs: X. Cooper.......GONE WITH GARRETT IN

 

DTs: Gabe Wright and Nile Lawrence-Stample .......WINNER STAYS

 

OLBs: Nate Ochard and Cam Johnson.......WINNER STAYS

 

ILBs: Demario Davis and Tank Carder.......NOT SOLD ON NEITHER. HELLO MR.FOSTER

 

CBs: Starters: Marcus Burley (who?)......WITH DRAMON WILLIAMS GONE..IF NOT 1 CB WHY NOT 2?

 

 

Safeties: Starters listed are Ed Reynolds (who?) Tyvus Powell. (Derrick Kindred listed on DL).....WE NEED BOTH..FS & SS

 

 

Punter: Britton Colquitt--HEY WE GOT ONE RIGHT

Kicker: Cody Parkey--DRAFT--PLEASE GOD NO MORE OFF THE STREET PEOPLE

LS: Charley Hughlett---PAID THE MAN

PR: Duke Johnson---WE NEED ONE & DUKE IS NOT MOSERT

KR: George Atkinson---IF YOU CAN CATCH A PUNT? THAN KO's ARE A BREEZE

Never to early to fire some people..It's Draft Season...CAPS^^^

[TexasAg1969]

I think we improved on the asst. coach front in ditching Horton for William. At least I hope so.

 

Night & Day Gip. Just what the doctor ordered.

[Mudfly]

 

Night & Day Gip. Just what the doctor ordered.

Cmon......are there still people who think it's the coaches that make this team suck????.....

 

or a coach that can coach the bad outta them?....

 

Haaaaaahahahaha.........Im still waiting for Hue to make this team 4 games better....instantly.....

 

Whoops.....didnt happen....