Kamp Kizer

[D Bone]

If tall with big hands is all we are really looking for then let's go sign Yao Ming to play QB.

 

Guess I should've used the pink font eh?

[gumby73]

My concern with the QB Hue decides on is "who are we on offense." Mitch has a major upside on deep ball accuracy throws over anybody in this draft. But our OL allows no time to get deep or WR's get held up at line mostly legally & some our just bad at route running to open areas. Mitch gets & got in trouble against a fair Stanford back end on things I've seen all season..Mitch at times holds the ball at times that then comes out late on mid yardage routes. Both were picked off by Stanford. If Hue wants to continue to play a semi WCO & get the ball out of the QB's hands Nate Peterman at Pitt is a guy you can get later, that I like over Webb. Watson will work as hard as Jamius Winstead at his game but without his frame or arm strength. Kizer has the frame, just not much touch on any of his passes. No leadership skills in this QB class might be the desperately missing thing again we need with this young group. That leaves Me with WaTson hopefully growing into Kizer's size

[The Gipper]

 

Guess I should've used the pink font eh?

OOPs, yep.....unless I was actually serious. Maybe Yao is a bit old.

 

But hell....look at this:

 

Here's a list of hand spread measurements of notable NBA players:

LeBron James - 9.25"

 

Trubisky has larger hands. Hell....I HAVE larger hands

[hoorta]

 

Ok, his "brains" are considered an asset, so we'll bypass that.

 

We'll bypass the personal Notre Dame thing, doesn't mean a damn thing.

You say you've watched him and he "sucked". OK. I'll respect that.

 

The one time I watched Trub he kinda sucked too.

 

Kizer looked like the big classic pocket passer to me, with ideal size and mobility to boot.

His problem has been inconsistency, that is a tag on Trub too.

 

Watson seems like the "safe" pick, Kizer seems the most pro-ready and best athlete, Trub has a tantalizing arm and a high ceiling.

 

I ain't going with the safe guy. And from what I've seen and read of Kizer and Trub, I am significantly more impressed with Kizer as pro prospect.

 

So ... you go ahead and go "Trub or Bust" ... I'm going to respectfully disagree, Kizer is easily at the top of the three for me, but I could see the Browns liking any of them.

 

Zombo

 

I wasn't talking about his intelligence Z no doubt he's a smart kid. (if that was a big selling point- Ryan Fitzpatrick should be one of the best qbs in the NFL.) I was talking about on field smarts. Too many dumb decisions. I don't want to turn this into another Mitch thread, but he probably has the fastest release of the top prospects. I'm no mechanics guru, but I'll trust Tour's opinion about Mr Slow windup.

 

Sure Trubs tossed a terrible pick six against Stanford, but what pro qb hasn't had the same thing happen to him? Sorry if this is morphing into another qb debate, but it's getting deep into the silly season.

[The Gipper]

Well, this is a Camp Kizer thread....so it should be part of the QB debate. As for it being the silly season....well, I have seen sillier seasons.....like when I used to play golf.

 

[hoorta]

OOPs, yep.....unless I was actually serious. Maybe Yao is a bit old.

 

But hell....look at this:

 

Here's a list of hand spread measurements of notable NBA players:

LeBron James - 9.25"

 

Trubisky has larger hands. Hell....I HAVE larger hands

 

Johnny "Big Hands" measured out at 10". Makes it easier to grab one of those 1.75s of Don Julio. FWIW, Deforest Buckner tied the record with 11 3\4 mitts.

 

There was an article on DBN that pretty much said hand size is a poor predictor of NFL qb success. As long as you're 9-1\2 (average) it's no big deal.

[The Gipper]

 

Johnny "Big Hands" measured out at 10". Makes it easier to grab one of those 1.75s of Don Julio. FWIW, Deforest Buckner tied the record with 11 3\4 mitts.

 

There was an article on DBN that pretty much said hand size is a poor predictor of NFL qb success. As long as you're 9-1\2 (average) it's no big deal.

What is foot size indicative of?

[Mark O]

What is foot size indicative of?

 

 

Bigger shoes

[hoorta]

Ah....maybe one player the Browns have in mind does

 

Who is that top FA? Cialis Campbell DE currently with the Cards?

 

Well, scratch Trumaine Johnson off the list.

[hoorta]

What is foot size indicative of?

 

That the odds are better of getting them stepped on (if you're a qb) by your center?

[The Gipper]

 

Well, scratch Trumaine Johnson off the list.

You mean the guy with the True Main Johnson?

( I thought that was Lyndon)

[Tour2ma]

Because .... ?

 

Zombo

 

Because after playing QB for years and years throwing motions don't change. You can tinker around the edges with grip. You can focus and improve footwork. You can even modify arm angle. But the path the ball takes from two hands on it around mid-torso to the release point is locked in early.

[Zombo]

 

Because after playing QB for years and years throwing motions don't change. You can tinker around the edges with grip. You can focus and improve footwork. You can even modify arm angle. But the path the ball takes from two hands on it around mid-torso to the release point is locked in early.

 

You sound so authoritative, that I hate to ask if there is another school of thought.

 

Doesn't that former middling relief pitcher, Tom House, retrain QBs how to throw and improve their mechanics?

 

Zombo

[jrb12711]

 

I wasn't talking about his intelligence Z no doubt he's a smart kid. (if that was a big selling point- Ryan Fitzpatrick should be one of the best qbs in the NFL.) I was talking about on field smarts. Too many dumb decisions. I don't want to turn this into another Mitch thread, but he probably has the fastest release of the top prospects. I'm no mechanics guru, but I'll trust Tour's opinion about Mr Slow windup.

 

Sure Trubs tossed a terrible pick six against Stanford, but what pro qb hasn't had the same thing happen to him? Sorry if this is morphing into another qb debate, but it's getting deep into the silly season.

 

To add to that, the problem isn't even that he makes questionable decisions or tight throws that don't go his way. His bad decisions are inexcusably bad types of plays that to me just don't bode well.

 

This isn't to shit on your parade but to me Kizer is someone I wouldn't touch with a ten foot pole before the late 2nd round. I just don't see him making up that between the ears gap.

[The Gipper]

 

You sound so authoritative, that I hate to ask if there is another school of thought.

 

Doesn't that former middling relief pitcher, Tom House, retrain QBs how to throw and improve their mechanics?

 

Zombo

Sometimes awkward Mechanics are not a problem. Bernie Kosar anyone? Phillip Rivers? Not that I am riding on your sand worm Muad'dib....I am just saying it may not be the thing that deters me from considering him.

 

(more geek poking)

[Zombo]

Not that I am riding on your sand worm Muad'dib...

 

(more geek poking)

 

Yeah ... Whatever amuses you people.

 

I have you speaking geek to me, I have Ghoolie penning love songs to me ... it's still almost two months to the draft.

 

Soooo ... let's just go ahead and see if TCPO's boss is watching:

 

Here's three chicks and a monkey copping a feel:

 

[D Bone]

lol Look at that fucker's face ^

[Tour2ma]

 

 

You sound so authoritative, that I hate to ask if there is another school of thought.

 

Doesn't that former middling relief pitcher, Tom House, retrain QBs how to throw and improve their mechanics?

lol... and I did not stay at a Holiday Inn Express... ever...

 

There are any number of QB Whisperers out there. Few of whom were ever better than middling anythings. There is something to the old adage, "Those that can't do, teach."

 

Any certitude I have displayed here is an extrapolation of my experience as a golfer... studying, playing, being taught and even teaching. It is hard, damn hard to remake a swing. It takes months... even years to overwrite bad habits piece by piece... one at a time. And that's in a game where you are alone with no one trying to break you in two and a distraction is a bird breaking into song.

 

In other words by comparison I think it's easier to change a golf swing than a throwing motion... and it is really fucking hard to change a golf swing.

 

Let's take one little thing that coaches have tried to train out of more QBs than I can count... patting the ball. No one wants this starting their motion because it costs a tenth of a second right at the start. Yet it has been the "trigger" for QBs both great and not so great forever.

 

Hoyer did it. Elway did, too. As did Young, Marino... On the other hand P. Manning did not. Brady does not.

 

And here's the kicker... most of those who do not "pat", simply cannot because they start their motion from a position with two hands already on the ball, the most desirable ball security practice.

 

So a simple attempt to change a practice that delays release, patting, and replace it with a better, ball-security practice, two hands, should be a no-brainer. Yet time after time the attempted change is abandoned in the name of "QB comfort".

 

Get 'em young and teach 'em well...

 

 

But feel free to ask away...

[TexasAg1969]

Never thought I'd envy a chimp, but I do now.

[Tim Couch Pulls Out]

 

 

 

 

lol... and I did not stay at a Holiday Inn Express... ever...

 

There are any number of QB Whisperers out there. Few of whom were ever better than middling anythings. There is something to the old adage, "Those that can't do, teach."

 

Any certitude I have displayed here is an extrapolation of my experience as a golfer... studying, playing, being taught and even teaching. It is hard, damn hard to remake a swing. It takes months... even years to overwrite bad habits piece by piece... one at a time. And that's in a game where you are alone with no one trying to break you in two and a distraction is a bird breaking into song.

 

In other words by comparison I think it's easier to change a golf swing than a throwing motion... and it is really fucking hard to change a golf swing.

 

Let's take one little thing that coaches have tried to train out of more QBs than I can count... patting the ball. No one wants this starting their motion because it costs a tenth of a second right at the start. Yet it has been the "trigger" for QBs both great and not so great forever.

 

Hoyer did it. Elway did, too. As did Young, Marino... On the other hand P. Manning did not. Brady does not.

 

And here's the kicker... most of those who do not "pat", simply cannot because they start their motion from a position with two hands already on the ball, the most desirable ball security practice.

 

So a simple attempt to change a practice that delays release, patting, and replace it with a better, ball-security practice, two hands, should be a no-brainer. Yet time after time the attempted change is abandoned in the name of "QB comfort".

 

Get 'em young and teach 'em well...

 

 

But feel free to ask away...

Okay, I'll ask.

 

Why in the actual hell is my golf game regressing?

[hoorta]

Okay, I'll ask.

 

Why in the actual hell is my golf game regressing?

 

Ha- depends on how much you're playing- or practicing. You might have picked up a glitch you're not aware of. And regardless of how good you are, eventually you reach a point where more practice will not improve your game. And when you get to that point, if you slack off, you regress. See below- hitting tennis balls for 8 hours instead of 3-4 was never going to get me good enough to play the game as a pro. Probably obvious on the elite football level, Cody Kessler can work out in the weight room all day, and throw for an hour, but he's never going to be able to toss the rock like John Elway.

 

I'll give you a comparison to what Tour is talking about. Used to play golf- badly. I played competitive tennis for several years- earned a couple college letters. To my mind serving a tennis ball and teeing off with a driver, though they involve different muscle groups are the same in that they're repetitive learned motions. Like throwing a football.

 

Difference is in tennis and golf- there's not as much of a time constraint in your windup or backswing as there is in throwing a football. 10ths of a second do matter on the NFL pro level. And once you get yourself "locked in" with something that feels comfortable- it's mighty hard to change.

[RoyceRolls]

wow yep he's pretty big wish he could play QB

Coming from the guy who likes Davis "weeden jr." Webb

[joedawg69]

Maybe we should talk to the chimp's agent and see if we can get him for a cheap price?

[LondonBrown]

What's his name, my college knowledge is somewhat limited...

[TexasAg1969]

Okay, I'll ask.

 

Why in the actual hell is my golf game regressing?

 

Just take up racquetball where you can have a terrible mishit that wraps around and rolls out making you look brilliant. Plus it never drops in a lake or the woods. Problem solved.

[The Gipper]

 

Yeah ... Whatever amuses you people.

 

I have you speaking geek to me, I have Ghoolie penning love songs to me ... it's still almost two months to the draft.

 

Soooo ... let's just go ahead and see if TCPO's boss is watching:

 

Here's three chicks and a monkey copping a feel:

 

Monkey see, monkey do. I like the cut of your jib.

 

Of course, I could do more geek poking of you and ask of you: Is that Caesar?

[jbluhm86]

 

Thank you, Rooster Dick.

 

He does not have a bad arm, it is well known that he's got a strong arm.

 

Bad decision-making? Maybe, probably. That's a lot of young QBs. They don't look like Tom Brady when they are 20. Lord knows Tom Brady didn't. But lots to work with here.

 

Zombo

Didn't we have a strong armed QB with bad decision making once before?

 

 

Strong arms and dim wits rarely make for a winning QB.

[Tour2ma]

Okay, I'll ask. Why in the actual hell is my golf game regressing?

 

Is your body changing? Are you adding/losing muscle mass? Adding/losing body fat? In the upper torso/chest area? Arms vs. legs?

 

Any injury? Muscle? Joint? Even one you've "recovered from?"

 

If yes, consult: https://www.amazon.com/Exercises-Better-Golf-Researched-Centinela/dp/B0027BFDES

It's the best book I know of on the golf body.

 

If no, find a good teaching pro.

 

Difference is in tennis and golf- there's not as much of a time constraint in your windup or backswing as there is in throwing a football. 10ths of a second do matter on the NFL pro level. And once you get yourself "locked in" with something that feels comfortable- it's mighty hard to change.

 

I remember hearing during a Wimbleton, mens-finals broadcast years ago, Ivan Lendl years ago, that from a kinesiology standpoint the most incompatible sport with golf is tennis. Ivan was an avid golfer.

[Tim Couch Pulls Out]

 

Is your body changing? Are you adding/losing muscle mass? Adding/losing body fat? In the upper torso/chest area? Arms vs. legs?

 

Any injury? Muscle? Joint? Even one you've "recovered from?"

 

If yes, consult: https://www.amazon.com/Exercises-Better-Golf-Researched-Centinela/dp/B0027BFDES

It's the best book I know of on the golf body.

 

If no, find a good teaching pro.

 

 

I remember hearing during a Wimbleton, mens-finals broadcast years ago, Ivan Lendl years ago, that from a kinesiology standpoint the most incompatible sport with golf is tennis. Ivan was an avid golfer.

 

Losing weight and mass, I guess.

 

I've dropped about 8 strokes over the past month and a half. It's pretty awful. Granted, that's only going from low 80's to high 80's but it's still annoying.

[Tour2ma]

Losing weight and mass, I guess.

 

I've dropped about 8 strokes over the past month and a half. It's pretty awful. Granted, that's only going from low 80's to high 80's but it's still annoying.

 

There ya go... Seriously, check out the "30 Exercises..." book: https://www.amazon.c...a/dp/B0027BFDES

It's all about flexibility and golf-functional strength. It's one of the three indispensable golf books on my shelf alongside the classic Ben Hogan's Five Lessons and Toski-Flick's How to Become a Complete Golfer.

 

One last question/thought... Anything aching after a round or a day or two after? Muscle or joint... big or barely noticeable... can provide a clue about what has changed. It's a feedback mechanism for positive changes as well.