Tour2ma Posted July 15, 2015 Report Share Posted July 15, 2015 With so many assets in place, it's put up or shut up time for Cleveland Browns' defense http://www.cleveland.com/browns/index.ssf/2015/07/with_so_many_assets_in_place_i.html Tad longer than most articles, but a good read and worth a click... Here's one late exerpt about our DC that I don't want anyone to miss: "O'Neil is a former nose guard at Towson University who used to start a brawl at the beginning of spring football campaigns to let the offense know "who runs the show." His energy is infectious." The above college comment includes an embedded link to this January article also by Reed that I don't remember seeing: How Jim O'Neil went from 'meathead' college player to Cleveland Browns' energetic defensive coordinator http://www.cleveland.com/browns/index.ssf/2015/01/jim_oneil_cleveland_browns.html It's an even better read... Here's how that article starts: "Browns defensive coordinator Jim O'Neil and his wife, Stacy, used to head butt each other as student-athletes at Towson University. (later followed by) Asked if they still head-butt each other, she added: 'Only after a few drinks.' " Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Gipper Posted July 15, 2015 Report Share Posted July 15, 2015 What a guy! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TexasAg1969 Posted July 15, 2015 Report Share Posted July 15, 2015 Thank God he's on the D. Otherwise JF would be tempted to compete in that drinking/head butting contest. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wargograw Posted July 16, 2015 Report Share Posted July 16, 2015 Yeah I thought we didn't like guys with anything but choir boy personalities? That wife-headbutt thing is really weird. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frenchie Posted July 16, 2015 Report Share Posted July 16, 2015 Good article, and I have to agree - its put-up time for this D. It has flirted with an identity for the last few years but has rarely put together a string of strong games. I like what I see on paper and if Tank Carder / Scott Solomon descriptions are accurate, We have two (or more) quality players at each position. Probably the deepest we've been since the new era began. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
miktoxic Posted July 16, 2015 Report Share Posted July 16, 2015 Yeah I thought we didn't like guys with anything but choir boy personalities? well if you mean stop acting like an asshole and start acting like a choir boy when you are out and about and under a microscope....then yeah. learn the playbook and be a demon on the field. but above all: learn the playbook. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
D Bone Posted July 16, 2015 Report Share Posted July 16, 2015 Yeah I thought we didn't like guys with anything but choir boy personalities? Tough guys are always welcome. Now punks on the other hand........... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mudfly Posted July 16, 2015 Report Share Posted July 16, 2015 Tough guys are always welcome. Now punks on the other hand........... Ha!....exactly...... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wargograw Posted July 17, 2015 Report Share Posted July 17, 2015 Yeah that's all good and well except the discussion was based on things on the field. I put head butting your own wife or intentionally "starting brawls" with your own teammates more in the Retard category than flicking people off but I suppose I'm not abreast of the nuanced standards around here. To put my understanding here in simple terms: Fight starter-tough guy/welcomed Fight winner-punk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tiamat63 Posted July 17, 2015 Report Share Posted July 17, 2015 Yeah, because I'm sure Jim headbutts his wife literally. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wargograw Posted July 17, 2015 Report Share Posted July 17, 2015 What was/is it then? A head tap? A rhetorical head butt? An argument? If so, why is it relevant to his "tough guy" persona? Why is it mentioned next to him being a "meathead" and starting brawls? My best friend and I argue a lot because we love politics. He might even say we "butt heads." I must be a really tough guy! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
miktoxic Posted July 17, 2015 Report Share Posted July 17, 2015 What was/is it then? A head tap? A rhetorical head butt? An argument? If so, why is it relevant to his "tough guy" persona? Why is it mentioned next to him being a "meathead" and starting brawls? My best friend and I argue a lot because we love politics. He might even say we "butt heads." I must be a really tough guy! ok. now you are anti o'neil because he gets support from fans who otherwise would criticize manziel for what you think is the same behavior? why are you so friggin defensive? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TexasAg1969 Posted July 17, 2015 Report Share Posted July 17, 2015 My best friend and I argue a lot because we love politics. Sicko. LOL! I bet you like Rick Perry too. :P Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tour2ma Posted July 17, 2015 Author Report Share Posted July 17, 2015 I must be a really tough guy! Nah... just a killjoy. One person figured out how to both mature and retain an infectious personality while carving out a promising NFL career. That's the story here. You should hope that your maligned, fellow former does half as well... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wargograw Posted July 17, 2015 Report Share Posted July 17, 2015 Well. I did. And that's the point. I said I hoped he was good and had the same flair, because it is fun to watch. I was promptly treated to lectures about how choir boys are better and nobody likes a hothead. But in our DC (someone whom we like and don't criticize just to criticize) it's all the rage!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
miktoxic Posted July 17, 2015 Report Share Posted July 17, 2015 Well. I did. And that's the point. I said I hoped he was good and had the same flair, because it is fun to watch. I was promptly treated to lectures about how choir boys are better and nobody likes a hothead. But in our DC (someone whom we like and don't criticize just to criticize) it's all the rage!! wrong! we'd had loved it (and still will) if he had the fire and smack talk and could get it done on the field. too bad he looked like a little kid in a grown-up sport when trying to play in the nfl last year. it was really sad AND hard to watch. hey, he could always be a qb coach. HA!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DieHardBrownsFan Posted July 17, 2015 Report Share Posted July 17, 2015 Gotta lot of JFF haters on here obviously. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
miktoxic Posted July 17, 2015 Report Share Posted July 17, 2015 Gotta lot of JFF haters on here obviously. nah, don't hate him, just disappointed so far. farmer's first draft and the guys in the later rounds out-performed the 2 first round picks in gilbert and manziel. just tired of wasted picks. the sit on the bench and learn bullshit is done and gone IMO in the nfl. what, we've had one qb in the past 10 years that has actually done that in rodgers? 2 years tops. show us what you got or get to steppin. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wargograw Posted July 17, 2015 Report Share Posted July 17, 2015 wrong! we'd had loved it (and still will) if he had the fire and smack talk and could get it done on the field. too bad he looked like a little kid in a grown-up sport when trying to play in the nfl last year. it was really sad AND hard to watch. hey, he could always be a qb coach. HA!! Ok well then you and I are in agreement. But I was berated for suggesting as much on another thread. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JAFBF Posted July 17, 2015 Report Share Posted July 17, 2015 The more I think about, the more I'm undecided on our D this year : Taylor's status coming back from two injuries last year has me questioning if he'll even be available for TC, plus it raises pretty big durability questions. Shelton ? Is he the real deal or another swing and miss we're so prone too, and is he healthy/durable ? We lost Rubin, Sheard (?), and Skrine that I can think of - their replacements are question marks (ability wise) to me right now. Gilbert I'm hoping the switch gets/has gotten flipped, but I think I saw a blurb where he was having to take care of a "personal" issue again - which is what sank him last year. I like Dansby, but he's getting up there in years for the position he plays. Gibson came in injured after holding out and recovering from the knee injury last year . . . so WTF? Kirksey and Mingo I really hope start pulling it together, and I'm cutting Mingo slack since he was playing with one good arm last year. If we can get a handle on our Run D and maintain our Pass D we might be looking at something Sorry to sound like such a downer or rain on people's parade, but we've been sold a lousy Bill of goods about an awesome Defense too many times for me to keep buying it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
calfoxwc Posted July 18, 2015 Report Share Posted July 18, 2015 Your glass is half empty, and the other half doesn't have anything in it. Too bad.Will all our draft picks get taken away on spaceships, and not come back until the season is over? Will a meteorite fall on the Browns' field at midnight sat, and the game is the next day, and all our players will trip and fall over the debris? With the depth and the talent, this team is excitingly on the rise. I don't care that the season hasn't started and they haven't won eight games in ten, only won seven. Whatever. Buck up, dammit. Questions should not lead to depression. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zombo Posted July 18, 2015 Report Share Posted July 18, 2015 The more I think about, the more I'm undecided on our D this year : Taylor's status coming back from two injuries last year has me questioning if he'll even be available for TC, plus it raises pretty big durability questions. Shelton ? Is he the real deal or another swing and miss we're so prone too, and is he healthy/durable ? We lost Rubin, Sheard (?), and Skrine that I can think of - their replacements are question marks (ability wise) to me right now. Gilbert I'm hoping the switch gets/has gotten flipped, but I think I saw a blurb where he was having to take care of a "personal" issue again - which is what sank him last year. I like Dansby, but he's getting up there in years for the position he plays. Gibson came in injured after holding out and recovering from the knee injury last year . . . so WTF? Kirksey and Mingo I really hope start pulling it together, and I'm cutting Mingo slack since he was playing with one good arm last year. If we can get a handle on our Run D and maintain our Pass D we might be looking at something Sorry to sound like such a downer or rain on people's parade, but we've been sold a lousy Bill of goods about an awesome Defense too many times for me to keep buying it. Rubin, Skrine and Sheard?? Rubin is done and wouldn't make this team, Skrine was replaced by a better player (Williams) with a Top Ten pick in the wings, and Sheard just didnt fit the system, didnt make sense to pay him what he could make on the open market when you look at what his role with us would have been. Z Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wargograw Posted July 18, 2015 Report Share Posted July 18, 2015 Why was Sheard not regarded as a fit? I've seen this elsewhere too and was always curious. 6'3" 260, 4.7 kinda guy. Pretty good pass rusher. Is he too big for the 3-4 at OLB? Kruger is bigger than him. Von Miller is the best 3-4 OLB in the league and he is smaller than Sheard. So I assume it had something to do with his skill set, but what was it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tiamat63 Posted July 18, 2015 Report Share Posted July 18, 2015 Why was Sheard not regarded as a fit? I've seen this elsewhere too and was always curious. 6'3" 260, 4.7 kinda guy. Pretty good pass rusher. Is he too big for the 3-4 at OLB? Kruger is bigger than him. Von Miller is the best 3-4 OLB in the league and he is smaller than Sheard. So I assume it had something to do with his skill set, but what was it? Sheard has a very still set of hips and lacks Krugers Ability To Be More Fluid In Space. He's also awful as a pass rusher Fron a 2point. The best 34 9tech is Huston by far. Von plays in a system that protects him and his lack of size on early down. It's more of a 43 over with the donkeys subbing out either end for Von on passing downs and essentially playing a 33. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wargograw Posted July 18, 2015 Report Share Posted July 18, 2015 Hmm. Thanks. In the games I'm watching, his pass rush is pretty solid so that's surprising. Not to go all Gipper on you, but I could only go off the PFF scores, where Von was better than all but two players, regardless of position, regardless of side of the ball. But I did get confused as Denver is (well, was) a 4-3 team, not 3-4. Von was out of position at 4-3 OLB but like you said, they did maximize his ability on passing downs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tour2ma Posted July 18, 2015 Author Report Share Posted July 18, 2015 In any 3-4, Pet's included, you can sacrifice pass coverage ability in one of your regular OLBs, but not two. I think Sheard was #2. Add that to his contract situation, and Mingo's emerging coverage skills and healed shoulder... Sheard was the odd-man out... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Gipper Posted July 18, 2015 Report Share Posted July 18, 2015 The more I think about, the more I'm undecided on our D this year : Taylor's status coming back from two injuries last year has me questioning if he'll even be available for TC, plus it raises pretty big durability questions. Well, I see him as getting healthy.....and I see him as having his work load reduced somewhat with the additions....thus he can be more productive in his time in there. Shelton ? Is he the real deal or another swing and miss we're so prone too, and is he healthy/durable ? How can anyone know that until he gets in and plays? We lost Rubin, Sheard (?), and Skrine that I can think of - their replacements are question marks (ability wise) to me right now. To me, their replacements are no bigger question mark than those guys would have been . Gilbert I'm hoping the switch gets/has gotten flipped, but I think I saw a blurb where he was having to take care of a "personal" issue again - which is what sank him last year. I like Dansby, but he's getting up there in years for the position he plays. Gibson came in injured after holding out and recovering from the knee injury last year . . . so WTF? Who is this? We do not have a player on the roster by that name. Kirksey and Mingo I really hope start pulling it together, and I'm cutting Mingo slack since he was playing with one good arm last year. Agree.....but I also have hopes for Hayes Pullard to contribute well at MLB. If we can get a handle on our Run D and maintain our Pass D we might be looking at something Let's stay healthy.....I see that as the biggest factor of all along our front 7 Sorry to sound like such a downer or rain on people's parade, but we've been sold a lousy Bill of goods about an awesome Defense too many times for me to keep buying it. Fair enough. As I noted for last year....the Bill of goods came with some defects because we lost so many game days off the DL because of injury. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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