Clevfan4life Posted April 27, 2016 Report Share Posted April 27, 2016 Please give an example. I was stating that it seems like our laws would be based around denying service for something the customer can't control (gender, race, sexual orientation). Though, it would be nice if we didn't need any of those laws. well but now you'll butt into the age old argument that sexual orientation is indeed controllable. Gay men specifically choose hog over vag. Like they were all about vag at one point in their lives and then were like "hey, wait a minute.....I may have been going about this all wrong" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bbedward Posted April 27, 2016 Report Share Posted April 27, 2016 well but now you'll butt into the age old argument that sexual orientation is indeed controllable. Gay men specifically choose hog over vag. Like they were all about vag at one point in their lives and then were like "hey, wait a minute.....I may have been going about this all wrong" Sexual Orientation isn't a choice - but that indeed is a controversy still sadly. Also you get into religion, which is a choice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Cysko Kid Posted April 27, 2016 Report Share Posted April 27, 2016 Please give an example. I was stating that it seems like our laws would be based around denying service for something the customer can't control (gender, race, sexual orientation). Though, it would be nice if we didn't need any of those laws. That's why I gave you two scenarios. I doubt they were denied service for being gay. If a gay guy came in and wanted a banana nut muffin I highly doubt the bakers would have shouted "get the fuck out of here, faggot!" But bring asked to create something they're uncomfortable with is a different story. And yes the gays in question did choose...they chose to target a christian baker who they could feel pretty sure would find their request uncomfortable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Cysko Kid Posted April 27, 2016 Report Share Posted April 27, 2016 Please give an example. I was stating that it seems like our laws would be based around denying service for something the customer can't control (gender, race, sexual orientation). Though, it would be nice if we didn't need any of those laws. I already gave you an example. Please attempt to keep up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MLD Woody Posted April 27, 2016 Report Share Posted April 27, 2016 How many other goods and services related to weddings would you ok with gay weddings being denied? And again, I'd love to think that they'd just have the option to go somewhere else but 1) should it really have to get to that point 2) depending on how this grows, that might be even less of an option. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gftChris Posted April 27, 2016 Report Share Posted April 27, 2016 Personally, I'd be generally fine serving pretty much anyone, if I were a baker. Cake is cake. It's not like me giving them a nice dessert is going to further 'the cause'. But I would be a lot more comfortable serving people whose 'cause' is a positive one (let gay people get married in this instance) rather than a negative one (all insert-group-here should be killed/enslaved/other). If I'm a doctor, I've sworn a Hippocratic oath, not a hypocritical one. Hey-oh! But seriously, as has been said many times before, we shouldn't need to even discuss this - the baker should bake the damn cake and not give a shit about what someone else does with their genitals. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Cysko Kid Posted April 27, 2016 Report Share Posted April 27, 2016 You don't know that a guy with a swastika tattoo actually hates. Maybe he went to prison. You've gotta get by by any means possible. Again. Don't target the Christian bakery and this isn't an issue. This was a deliberate targeting which all of you seem to be fine with. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gftChris Posted April 27, 2016 Report Share Posted April 27, 2016 You don't know that a guy with a swastika tattoo actually hates. Maybe he went to prison. You've gotta get by by any means possible. Again. Don't target the Christian bakery and this isn't an issue. This was a deliberate targeting which all of you seem to be fine with. I thought we were talking in general. At least, you keep trying to make general points. Obviously, deliberately targeting something with the intention of causing trouble is stupid. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Westside Steve Posted April 27, 2016 Report Share Posted April 27, 2016 Personally, I'd be generally fine serving pretty much anyone, if I were a baker. Cake is cake. It's not like me giving them a nice dessert is going to further 'the cause'. But I would be a lot more comfortable serving people whose 'cause' is a positive one (let gay people get married in this instance) rather than a negative one (all insert-group-here should be killed/enslaved/other). If I'm a doctor, I've sworn a Hippocratic oath, not a hypocritical one. Hey-oh! But seriously, as has been said many times before, we shouldn't need to even discuss this - the baker should bake the damn cake and not give a shit about what someone else does with their genitals. But, and we've been through this before, I don't think you would destroy the business of a black bakery that refused to make it for the Ku Klux Klan, or a Jewish delicatessen that refused to cater a Nazi party event. WSS Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Cysko Kid Posted April 27, 2016 Report Share Posted April 27, 2016 I thought we were talking in general. At least, you keep trying to make general points. Obviously, deliberately targeting something with the intention of causing trouble is stupid.I'm not making general points I'm making highly specific points. Here's another one: should a screen printer be forced to make something objectionable? I had a shirt made once in brown with orange block letters that said "Fuck the fuckin steelers" in huge print on the front. Now if I went to Pittsburgh and tried to have that made would you have a huge problem if they refused to? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clevfan4life Posted April 27, 2016 Report Share Posted April 27, 2016 were those bakers just asked to make the cake or actually attend the wedding? cause that changes the calculus Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gftChris Posted April 27, 2016 Report Share Posted April 27, 2016 But, and we've been through this before, I don't think you would destroy the business of a black bakery that refused to make it for the Ku Klux Klan, or a Jewish delicatessen that refused to cater a Nazi party event. WSS I would not, no. But that's not exactly the right analogy - it would be the other way around here, a WBC couple ordering from a gay bakery. You're very quick to equate being gay with being in the KKK or nazism, as if being gay is an evil thing that people choose to do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DieHardBrownsFan Posted April 27, 2016 Report Share Posted April 27, 2016 So if Woody and Cleve go dressed as usual holding hands into a Mooslem bakery and order a gay cake, do you think they would get it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gftChris Posted April 27, 2016 Report Share Posted April 27, 2016 So if Woody and Cleve go dressed as usual holding hands into a Mooslem bakery and order a gay cake, do you think they would get it? Contrary to what you might think, I wouldn't want to give any special treatment to muslims. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bbedward Posted April 27, 2016 Report Share Posted April 27, 2016 Contrary to what you might think, I wouldn't want to give any special treatment to muslims. Do you think it would have made national news if it was a muslim bakery? I think LGBT are above muslims on the privilege scale now. White cisgender men are still at the top, of course. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clevfan4life Posted April 27, 2016 Report Share Posted April 27, 2016 So if Woody and Cleve go dressed as usual holding hands into a Mooslem bakery and order a gay cake, do you think they would get it? do they turn you down on the weekends at the I-77 rest area's? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
calfoxwc Posted April 27, 2016 Author Report Share Posted April 27, 2016 still waiting for an answer to DH's question. the reluctance is understandable. Liberals don't like honest questions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gftChris Posted April 27, 2016 Report Share Posted April 27, 2016 still waiting for an answer to DH's question. the reluctance is understandable. Liberals don't like honest questions. About the muslims? I thought I answered that. In any case, it would vary from baker to baker but I imagine that in some eor many the would be rejected. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MLD Woody Posted April 27, 2016 Report Share Posted April 27, 2016 I think Muslims should be allowed to refuse to bake gay cakes, but not Christians. Oh no! Cal got me! My hypocrisy and hate for Christians has been found out! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Westside Steve Posted April 27, 2016 Report Share Posted April 27, 2016 I think Muslims should be allowed to refuse to bake gay cakes, but not Christians. Oh no! Cal got me! My hypocrisy and hate for Christians has been found out! Aww shucks Woody, we knew that. We still love you. WSS Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clevfan4life Posted April 27, 2016 Report Share Posted April 27, 2016 I think Muslims should be allowed to refuse to bake gay cakes, but not Christians. IKR? Like why would we even think about requiring the same of mooslims? Makes no sense. Ofc they get a free pass many blessings be onto the prophet . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Cysko Kid Posted April 27, 2016 Report Share Posted April 27, 2016 I'm not making general points I'm making highly specific points. Here's another one: should a screen printer be forced to make something objectionable? I had a shirt made once in brown with orange block letters that said "Fuck the fuckin steelers" in huge print on the front. Now if I went to Pittsburgh and tried to have that made would you have a huge problem if they refused to? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gftChris Posted April 28, 2016 Report Share Posted April 28, 2016 I'm not making general points I'm making highly specific points. Here's another one: should a screen printer be forced to make something objectionable? I had a shirt made once in brown with orange block letters that said "Fuck the fuckin steelers" in huge print on the front. Now if I went to Pittsburgh and tried to have that made would you have a huge problem if they refused to? I think you'd be a dick for doing that, and I think they'd be taking themselves far too seriously if they turned it down. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Cysko Kid Posted April 28, 2016 Report Share Posted April 28, 2016 Enough people have lover that shirt that I thought about starting a website to produce them. If there's one thing that's universal in sports it's haters. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Cysko Kid Posted April 28, 2016 Report Share Posted April 28, 2016 But back to printers: should a christian screen printer be forced to make material related to pornography? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gftChris Posted April 28, 2016 Report Share Posted April 28, 2016 But back to printers: should a christian screen printer be forced to make material related to pornography? No. But that's different, that's not discriminating based on an inherent biological trait. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clevfan4life Posted April 28, 2016 Report Share Posted April 28, 2016 can someone answer my question about were the bakers asked to cater the wedding, like show up there and smile an whatnot....or was it just a cake? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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