The Gipper Posted May 20, 2015 Report Share Posted May 20, 2015 OK, we have "played" this game before. The following list or people are "borderline" HOF candidates. You simply say if that person should be in or out. This was prompted by the Stabler/Plunkett conversation on another thread. (Note....I am leaving off some sure fire HOF guys like Ray Lewis/Favre/Moss/Urlacher/Ed Reed/LDT/Kurt Warner..as they are not borderline imo): Jerry Kramer LC Greenwood Kevin Greene Lester Hayes Tommy Nobis Roger Craig Ken Stabler Jim Plunkett Steve Atwater Neil Smith Ken Anderson Leroy Butler Marvin Harrison Jim Marshall Morten Andersen Tony Boselli Chris Hinton Terrelle Davis London Fletcher Steve McNair Edgerinn James Sterling Sharpe Henry Ellard Ed Too Tall Jones Dick Shafrath Joe Klecko Clay Matthews Cornelius Bennett Albert Lewis Steve Tasker Ben Coates Hanford Dixon Rod Smith Eddie George Ricky Watters Ken Easley Greg Lloyd Sam Mills Donovan McNabb Drew Bledsoe Randall Cunningham Boomer Esiason Jim Hart Isaac Bruce Cliff Harris Bob Keuchenberg Karl Mecklenberg Nate Newton Jim Tyrer Isaiah Robertson Charlie Hennigan Deron Cherry Terrelle Owens Ronde Barber Kevin Mawae Jason Taylor Zach Thomas Alan Faneca John Hadl Vinny Testaverde Lomas Brown Steve Wisniewski. Or anyone else you may think of. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Browns149 Posted May 20, 2015 Report Share Posted May 20, 2015 I only see 3 guys that should be in IMO D. McNabb T.O. Marvin Harrison Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mudfly Posted May 20, 2015 Report Share Posted May 20, 2015 Jerry Kramer LC Greenwood Kevin Greene Lester Hayes Tommy Nobis Roger Craig Ken Stabler Jim Plunkett Steve Atwater Neil Smith Ken Anderson Leroy Butler Marvin Harrison Jim Marshall Morten Andersen Tony Boselli Chris Hinton Terrelle Davis London Fletcher Steve McNair Edgerinn James Sterling Sharpe Henry Ellard Ed Too Tall Jones Dick Shafrath Joe Klecko Clay Matthews Cornelius Bennett Albert Lewis Steve Tasker Ben Coates Hanford Dixon Rod Smith Eddie George Ricky Watters Ken Easley Greg Lloyd Sam Mills Donovan McNabb Drew Bledsoe Randall Cunningham Boomer Esiason Jim Hart Isaac Bruce Cliff Harris Bob Keuchenberg Karl Mecklenberg Nate Newton Jim Tyrer Isaiah Robertson Charlie Hennigan Deron Cherry Terrelle Owens Ronde Barber Kevin Mawae Jason Taylor Zach Thomas Alan Faneca John Hadl Vinny Testaverde Lomas Brown Steve Wisniewski. Or anyone else you may think of. My HOF picks are in green Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Gipper Posted May 20, 2015 Author Report Share Posted May 20, 2015 Per the PFR career production average the 25 players that have had the most productive careers to date that are not in the HOF include the following (both inactive and active, eligible and non eligible): Peyton Manning Brett Favre Tom Brady Drew Brees Ray Lewis Ladanian Tomlinson Marvin Harrison Randy Moss Jeff Saturday Ken Anderson Julius Peppers Brian Urlacher Terrelle Owens Reggie Wayne Phillip Rivers Ed Reed Edgerrin James Donovan McNabb Randall Cunningham Ronde Barber Champ Bailey Kevin Mawae Jason Taylor Zach Thomas Alan Faneca. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
miktoxic Posted May 20, 2015 Report Share Posted May 20, 2015 a lot of really really good players but only one name jumps out at me in name is mecklenberg and believe me i LOATHE the broncos. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Gipper Posted May 20, 2015 Author Report Share Posted May 20, 2015 OK, we have "played" this game before. The following list or people are "borderline" HOF candidates. You simply say if that person should be in or out. This was prompted by the Stabler/Plunkett conversation on another thread. (Note....I am leaving off some sure fire HOF guys like Ray Lewis/Favre/Moss/Urlacher/Ed Reed/LDT/Kurt Warner..as they are not borderline imo): Here are my personal choices from this list: Jerry Kramer LC Greenwood Kevin Greene Lester Hayes Tommy Nobis Roger Craig Ken Stabler Jim Plunkett Steve Atwater Neil Smith Ken Anderson Leroy Butler Marvin Harrison Jim Marshall Morten Andersen Tony Boselli Chris Hinton Terrelle Davis London Fletcher Steve McNair Edgerinn James Sterling Sharpe Henry Ellard Ed Too Tall Jones Dick Shafrath Joe Klecko Clay Matthews Cornelius Bennett Albert Lewis Steve Tasker Ben Coates Hanford Dixon Rod Smith Eddie George Ricky Watters Ken Easley Greg Lloyd Sam Mills Donovan McNabb Drew Bledsoe Randall Cunningham Boomer Esiason Jim Hart Isaac Bruce Cliff Harris Bob Keuchenberg Karl Mecklenberg Nate Newton Jim Tyrer (he has all the creds, but will never make it due to his murder/suicide of his wife and himself) Isaiah Robertson Charlie Hennigan Deron Cherry Terrelle Owens Ronde Barber Kevin Mawae Jason Taylor Zach Thomas Alan Faneca John Hadl Vinny Testaverde Lomas Brown Steve Wisniewski. yes, there are a few homer choices, like Shafrath and Matthews, and former fellow Zip Taylor. Or anyone else you may think of. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Gipper Posted May 20, 2015 Author Report Share Posted May 20, 2015 Per the PFR career production average the 25 players that have had the most productive careers to date that are not in the HOF include the following (both inactive and active, eligible and non eligible): Peyton Manning Brett Favre Tom Brady Drew Brees Ray Lewis Ladanian Tomlinson Marvin Harrison Randy Moss Jeff Saturday Ken Anderson Julius Peppers Brian Urlacher Terrelle Owens Reggie Wayne Phillip Rivers Ed Reed Edgerrin James Donovan McNabb Randall Cunningham Ronde Barber Champ Bailey Kevin Mawae Jason Taylor Zach Thomas Alan Faneca. highlighted are my choices from this list....the others are borderline. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zombo Posted May 20, 2015 Report Share Posted May 20, 2015 Jerry Kramer LC Greenwood Kevin Greene Lester Hayes Tommy Nobis Roger Craig Ken Stabler Jim Plunkett Steve Atwater Neil Smith Ken Anderson Leroy Butler Marvin Harrison Jim Marshall Morten Andersen Tony Boselli Chris Hinton Terrelle Davis London Fletcher Steve McNair Edgerinn James Sterling Sharpe Henry Ellard Ed Too Tall Jones Dick Shafrath Joe Klecko Clay Matthews Cornelius Bennett Albert Lewis Steve Tasker Ben Coates Hanford Dixon Rod Smith Eddie George Ricky Watters Ken Easley Greg Lloyd Sam Mills Donovan McNabb Drew Bledsoe Randall Cunningham Boomer Esiason Jim Hart Isaac Bruce Cliff Harris Bob Keuchenberg Karl Mecklenberg Nate Newton Jim Tyrer Isaiah Robertson Charlie Hennigan Deron Cherry Terrelle Owens Ronde Barber Kevin Mawae Jason Taylor Zach Thomas Alan Faneca John Hadl Vinny Testaverde Lomas Brown Steve Wisniewski. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DieHardBrownsFan Posted May 20, 2015 Report Share Posted May 20, 2015 Wish In and Out Burger would have a franchise in the Cleveland area...... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Gipper Posted May 20, 2015 Author Report Share Posted May 20, 2015 I will add Nobis, Atwater and Tasker (as a pure ST player) to my list. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Suomi Posted May 22, 2015 Report Share Posted May 22, 2015 They can all stay out. My philosophy on any Hall of Fame is that it should be reserved for the best of the best. If that philosophy is not applied you end up with the Baseball Hall of Fame. While many of these players were outstanding I wouldn't go so far as to claim that any of them were the obvious best of their era. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nickers Posted May 22, 2015 Report Share Posted May 22, 2015 Jerry Kramer yes LC Greenwood no Kevin Greene no Lester Hayes yes Tommy Nobis no Roger Craig no Ken Stabler yes Jim Plunkett yes Steve Atwater yes Neil Smith no Ken Anderson no Leroy Butler no Marvin Harrison yes Jim Marshall no Morten Andersen yes Tony Boselli no Chris Hinton no Terrelle Davis Hell no London Fletcher no Steve McNair no Edgerinn James yes Sterling Sharpe no Henry Ellard no Ed Too Tall Jones no Dick Shafrath yes Joe Klecko no Clay Matthews yes Cornelius Bennett yes Albert Lewis no Steve Tasker hell no Ben Coates maybe Hanford Dixon yes Rod Smith no Eddie George no Ricky Watters no Ken Easley maybe Greg Lloyd no Sam Mills no Donovan McNabb no, he's a choke artist when it counted Drew Bledsoe maybe Randall Cunningham fuck no! Boomer Esiason NO! Jim Hart no Isaac Bruce maybe Cliff Harris no Bob Keuchenberg no Karl Mecklenberg yes Nate Newton yes Jim Tyrer no Isaiah Robertson no Charlie Hennigan no Deron Cherry yes Terrelle Owens no,hes a dumb asshole. Ronde Barber no Kevin Mawae maybe Jason Taylor no Zach Thomas yes Alan Faneca yes John Hadl no Vinny Testaverde Hell fucking NO! Lomas Brown yes Steve Wisniewski. yes Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Gipper Posted May 22, 2015 Author Report Share Posted May 22, 2015 They can all stay out. My philosophy on any Hall of Fame is that it should be reserved for the best of the best. If that philosophy is not applied you end up with the Baseball Hall of Fame. While many of these players were outstanding I wouldn't go so far as to claim that any of them were the obvious best of their era. Except that a few of them very well may be the best of the best. Take Jim Marshall......he is ranked by Career average as the 26th best player of all time. ONLY Reggie White, Bruce Smith, and running mates Carl Eller and Alan Page rank out as better defensive linemen than him. And that is part of his problem....the HOF really doesn't want to put a third member of those Purple People eaters in the HOF....even though it seems he deserves it. Marshall ranks out higher than the likes of Merlin Olsen, Michael Strahan, Chris Doleman, Randy White, Warren Sapp, Jack Youngblood, Joe Greene, Dan Hampton, Richard Dent and others that are in the HOF And I know Zombo doesn't want to hear this.....but also: Ken Anderson. He is ranked as the 31st most productive player of all time, and the 12th best QB of all time. He didn't win a Super Bowl, but then neither did the likes of Dan Fouts, Warren Moon, Dan Marino, Tarkenton. His career average ranks better than the likes of Bob Griese, Len Dawson, Sonny Jurgenson, Jim Kelly...and others. And there may be a few others...but those are two that come to mind. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wargograw Posted May 23, 2015 Report Share Posted May 23, 2015 Wish In and Out Burger would have a franchise in the Cleveland area...... Overrated. We just got one in Austin (the overrated food capital of the world). You can have it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vagitron Posted May 25, 2015 Report Share Posted May 25, 2015 I can't believe the number of people that breezed over Alan Faneca. He was one of the best guards in the game. He's going to get in at some point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vagitron Posted May 25, 2015 Report Share Posted May 25, 2015 Overrated. We just got one in Austin (the overrated food capital of the world). You can have it. Comparing them to other fast food burgers NOT overrated. Comparing to best burgers you've ever eaten, yes overrated. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flugel Posted May 25, 2015 Report Share Posted May 25, 2015 I must have adult onset ADD or something because all I did in this thread was look to see if people remembered how many years of excellent football Clay Matthews contributed with a flexibility to play any of 4 LBer positions here. At a banquet I once attended where Joe Delamielleure was the guest speaker - he said Clay Matthews was not only our toughest LBer but one of the toughest SOBs he's ever had to block in a career full of Pro Bowls. When you really think about it - that first round of 1978 with Ozzie and Clay helped set up a lot of playoff appearances for this franchise throughout the 80s for a team that's only won about 1 playoff game since they retired. Think about that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Gipper Posted May 26, 2015 Author Report Share Posted May 26, 2015 I can't believe the number of people that breezed over Alan Faneca. He was one of the best guards in the game. He's going to get in at some point. Probably because he is a guard....and a Steeler. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Gipper Posted May 26, 2015 Author Report Share Posted May 26, 2015 I must have adult onset ADD or something because all I did in this thread was look to see if people remembered how many years of excellent football Clay Matthews contributed with a flexibility to play any of 4 LBer positions here. At a banquet I once attended where Joe Delamielleure was the guest speaker - he said Clay Matthews was not only our toughest LBer but one of the toughest SOBs he's ever had to block in a career full of Pro Bowls. When you really think about it - that first round of 1978 with Ozzie and Clay helped set up a lot of playoff appearances for this franchise throughout the 80s for a team that's only won about 1 playoff game since they retired. Think about that. Honestly.....winning was the issue. Had the Browns won a couple of SBs, he would likely be in. But he also came into the league about the same time as Lawrence Taylor, Singletary and a few others, so he gets overlooked. And while his sack numbers weren't bad....they weren't as good as some others....expecially some DEs of the era. Making a splash with sacks got others noticed more. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flugel Posted May 26, 2015 Report Share Posted May 26, 2015 Honestly.....winning was the issue. Had the Browns won a couple of SBs, he would likely be in. But he also came into the league about the same time as Lawrence Taylor, Singletary and a few others, so he gets overlooked. And while his sack numbers weren't bad....they weren't as good as some others....expecially some DEs of the era. Making a splash with sacks got others noticed more. I'm afraid you're right Gipper about how much they weigh HOF candidates appearing in Superbowls (outside of a few exceptions). That sucks. Here's the thing, Cleveland was pretty awful in significant parts of the 70s before they drafted Matthews and Newsome. That was a day and age teams didn't go from worst to first overnight. I can say without hesitation my golden years as a fan was in 80s. We made the playoffs 7 times. From 1990 to 2014, Cleveland only made the playoffs twice. After drafting Matthews & Newsome in the 1st round of 1978 - here's our records up through 1989: 1978 8-8 1979 9-7 1980 11-5 (playoffs 0-1) 1981 5-11 1982 4-5 (playoffs 0-1) 1983 9-7 1984 5-11 1985 8-8 (playoffs 0-1) 1986 12-4 (playoffs 1-1) AFC Championship Game 1987 10-5 (playoffs 1-1) AFC Championship Game 1988 10-6 (playoffs 0-1) 1989 9-6-1 (playoffs 1-1) AFC Championship Game As Joe Delamielleure said, Clay played all 4 different LBer positions extremely well. That shouldn't have worked against him the way that it did. Classic Clay Matthews was intercepting Jim Kelly at the goal to seal a playoff win; and get Cleveland to their 3rd AFC Championship Game in 4 years. If we asked Matthews to be what we drafted Chip Banks for - all we gotta do gotta do is see what one of his polliwogs ended up doing for Green Bay in that role. That's okay though. What set Clay apart to me was his 1st step instinct and pre-snap diagnosis. That was invaluable against the point of attack and covering the hook zones or flats. A franchise that never makes the playoffs, made them 7 times with 3 AFC Championship appearances in the 80s leaning heavily on the talent and leadership of Matthews and Newsome. That type/length of spike should have been acknowledged better especially considering we've only made the playoffs twice from 1990-2014. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ballpeen Posted May 27, 2015 Report Share Posted May 27, 2015 OK, we have "played" this game before. The following list or people are "borderline" HOF candidates. You simply say if that person should be in or out. This was prompted by the Stabler/Plunkett conversation on another thread. (Note....I am leaving off some sure fire HOF guys like Ray Lewis/Favre/Moss/Urlacher/Ed Reed/LDT/Kurt Warner..as they are not borderline imo): Jerry Kramer................IN LC Greenwood Kevin Greene Lester Hayes Tommy Nobis.......IN Roger Craig Ken Stabler Jim Plunkett Steve Atwater Neil Smith Ken Anderson Leroy Butler Marvin Harrison IN Jim Marshall IN Morten Andersen IN Tony Boselli Chris Hinton Terrelle Davis London Fletcher Steve McNair Edgerinn James Sterling Sharpe Henry Ellard Ed Too Tall Jones Dick Shafrath Joe Klecko Clay Matthews Cornelius Bennett Albert Lewis Steve Tasker Ben Coates Hanford Dixon Rod Smith Eddie George Ricky Watters Ken Easley IN Greg Lloyd Sam Mills Donovan McNabb Drew Bledsoe Randall Cunningham Boomer Esiason Jim Hart Isaac Bruce Cliff Harris Bob Keuchenberg Karl Mecklenberg Nate Newton Jim Tyrer Isaiah Robertson Charlie Hennigan Deron Cherry Terrelle Owens Ronde Barber Kevin Mawae Jason Taylor Zach Thomas Alan Faneca John Hadl Vinny Testaverde Lomas Brown Steve Wisniewski. Or anyone else you may think of. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Gipper Posted May 27, 2015 Author Report Share Posted May 27, 2015 Peen: I always thought that Kenny Easly would be a good choice as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Gipper Posted May 27, 2015 Author Report Share Posted May 27, 2015 Per the PFR career production average the 25 players that have had the most productive careers to date that are not in the HOF include the following (both inactive and active, eligible and non eligible): Peyton Manning Brett Favre Tom Brady Drew Brees Ray Lewis Ladanian Tomlinson Marvin Harrison Jim Marshall Randy Moss Jeff Saturday Ken Anderson Julius Peppers Brian Urlacher Terrelle Owens Reggie Wayne Phillip Rivers Ed Reed Edgerrin James Donovan McNabb Randall Cunningham Ronde Barber Champ Bailey Kevin Mawae Jason Taylor Zach Thomas Alan Faneca. The players in bold are currently eligible for induction and have been passed over at least one time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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