D Bone Posted November 1, 2016 Report Share Posted November 1, 2016 Haaaaaaaaaahahahaha....... it's so bad, it's become funny...... Like a dead clown Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tour2ma Posted November 1, 2016 Report Share Posted November 1, 2016 So I read this and just laughed and laughed..... And it didnt take long(at all)......(or course most of those people are completely awol right now.....and I also notice the board has zero chatter about "good" stuff, up and coming players, general sunshine pumping, great plays, etc.......why?...... Ah... the good ol' days??? You may have missed the pumping sunshine stage during your hiatus. As for the rest... maybe I just love swimming against the tide, but I'm seeing positives every week. You should read my posts sometime... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mudfly Posted November 1, 2016 Report Share Posted November 1, 2016 Ha!...I always read em Tour.....was also thinking you'd be the most likely to get me off the ledge with some Tour logic.... So I read.....but am still up here waiting for tangibles...... I give you full props for hanging in there.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tour2ma Posted November 1, 2016 Report Share Posted November 1, 2016 Thanks, old friend, but I shit you not... I've really not had to put any effort into it. Aside: The above may not be entirely true... the road trip to Miami may have invested me more in this season than past ones. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mudfly Posted November 1, 2016 Report Share Posted November 1, 2016 Thanks, old friend, but I shit you not... I've really not had to put any effort into it. Maybe Im just blinded by anger.....and NOW, only great players and wins will get me my sight back...dont know... I promise, I positively did not choose to lose faith.....or hate what I see.....it just kind of happened on it own...... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gftChris Posted November 1, 2016 Report Share Posted November 1, 2016 Maybe Im just blinded by anger.....and NOW, only great players and wins will get me my sight back...dont know... I promise, I positively did not choose to lose faith.....or hate what I see.....it just kind of happened on it own...... Give it time brother. Good things are on their way. At the moment we're playing guys who probably won't be on our or any roster next year because we had too many holes to fix in one draft (some voluntary, sure). Meanwhile, here are some positives: - Danny Shelton appears to be developing in to one of the better tackles in the league, and with some consistency will be right up there - Jamie Collins! Woo! Assuming he plays to his level - It looks like we might be switching to a 4-3 front more of the time. We've all said for a while this would be beneficial, and not trying to force Ogbah, Orchard and the rest in to new positions, but making the best use of the talent we have - Speaking of Ogbah... - Campbell can tackle. - Carl Nassib has big arms! - Pryor looks legit. Finally, a Cleveland experiment that succeeds, and he *wants* to be playing here (for Hue at least). - Coleman also looks a quality player and is back in practice this week. - The run game has been surprisingly good, if boom or bust, and that's with the patchwork OL we've had. Imagine how good it could be next year with better blockers, with Bitonio back. - Cody Kessler looks far from the deer in headlights we saw in pre-season and looks like he'll be at the very worst a competent backup if not a starter (Brian Hoyer floor, Alex Smith ceiling?). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flyingfooldoug Posted November 1, 2016 Report Share Posted November 1, 2016 Maybe Im just blinded by anger.....and NOW, only great players and wins will get me my sight back...dont know... I promise, I positively did not choose to lose faith.....or hate what I see.....it just kind of happened on it own...... Just like around town Mud. No one is jumping ship. But the enthusiasm is at an all time low. There has always been some kind of bitching or nitpicking go on. Local enthusiasm has been eroding for the past 20 years and it's nonexistent now. It'll come back with a competitive team. And I don't mean that one to one fantasy bullshit. A team that wins games on a regular basis will win the fans back. Till then??? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mudfly Posted November 1, 2016 Report Share Posted November 1, 2016 Give it time brother. Good things are on their way. At the moment we're playing guys who probably won't be on our or any roster next year because we had too many holes to fix in one draft (some voluntary, sure). Meanwhile, here are some positives: - Danny Shelton appears to be developing in to one of the better tackles in the league, and with some consistency will be right up there - Jamie Collins! Woo! Assuming he plays to his level - It looks like we might be switching to a 4-3 front more of the time. We've all said for a while this would be beneficial, and not trying to force Ogbah, Orchard and the rest in to new positions, but making the best use of the talent we have - Speaking of Ogbah... - Campbell can tackle. - Carl Nassib has big arms! - Pryor looks legit. Finally, a Cleveland experiment that succeeds, and he *wants* to be playing here (for Hue at least). - Coleman also looks a quality player and is back in practice this week. - The run game has been surprisingly good, if boom or bust, and that's with the patchwork OL we've had. Imagine how good it could be next year with better blockers, with Bitonio back. - Cody Kessler looks far from the deer in headlights we saw in pre-season and looks like he'll be at the very worst a competent backup if not a starter (Brian Hoyer floor, Alex Smith ceiling?). all good points Chris.....gonna try to see those lights more often.....it's a work in progress..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gftChris Posted November 1, 2016 Report Share Posted November 1, 2016 all good points Chris.....gonna try to see those lights more often.....it's a work in progress..... If you like I can do a negative version? Just to show solidarity I hate seeing us lose every week, and I get extremely angry at seeing all of the broken tackles. BUT, I do see players who are growing in to legitimate NFL players, not guys who are there by default. A couple more years of that kind of drafting, plus a better approach to retaining our own important free agents, and we'll be pretty much there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TexasAg1969 Posted November 1, 2016 Report Share Posted November 1, 2016 Maybe Im just blinded by anger.....and NOW, only great players and wins will get me my sight back...dont know... I promise, I positively did not choose to lose faith.....or hate what I see.....it just kind of happened on it own...... Mud I was doing my best to keep you (and others) focused on weeks 9-16 and write off the first half by looking at the improvements. But after the second half collapse Sunday, I found myself sitting in the Mudfly booth. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clevfan4life Posted November 1, 2016 Report Share Posted November 1, 2016 Give it time brother. Good things are on their way. At the moment we're playing guys who probably won't be on our or any roster next year because we had too many holes to fix in one draft (some voluntary, sure). Meanwhile, here are some positives: - Danny Shelton appears to be developing in to one of the better tackles in the league, and with some consistency will be right up there - Jamie Collins! Woo! Assuming he plays to his level - It looks like we might be switching to a 4-3 front more of the time. We've all said for a while this would be beneficial, and not trying to force Ogbah, Orchard and the rest in to new positions, but making the best use of the talent we have - Speaking of Ogbah... - Campbell can tackle. - Carl Nassib has big arms! - Pryor looks legit. Finally, a Cleveland experiment that succeeds, and he *wants* to be playing here (for Hue at least). - Coleman also looks a quality player and is back in practice this week. - The run game has been surprisingly good, if boom or bust, and that's with the patchwork OL we've had. Imagine how good it could be next year with better blockers, with Bitonio back. - Cody Kessler looks far from the deer in headlights we saw in pre-season and looks like he'll be at the very worst a competent backup if not a starter (Brian Hoyer floor, Alex Smith ceiling?). Nassib has big arms? Have u seen ogbahs? Thats the one thing about nassib for me, he needs weight room time Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gftChris Posted November 1, 2016 Report Share Posted November 1, 2016 Nassib has big arms? Have u seen ogbahs? Thats the one thing about nassib for me, he needs weight room time I'm talking length. Three batted passes on Sunday (though as the commentary said, that also means he's not getting pressure). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jiggins7919 Posted November 1, 2016 Report Share Posted November 1, 2016 Maybe Im just blinded by anger.....and NOW, only great players and wins will get me my sight back...dont know... I promise, I positively did not choose to lose faith.....or hate what I see.....it just kind of happened on it own...... Mud, if you aren't outraged, you aren't paying attention. I've said some things I really regret, and I've had my fair share of posts that I went back and deleted. I wouldn't mind the losing if we didn't keep inventing new ways to lose. The Jets loss was the worst, as we started the season with our first 5-7 on the road, and I was REALLY hoping for the team to give the home crowd JUST ONE DAMN WIN. But as I saw us with a nice halftime lead, I sat back in my chair and knew what was coming. We all did. Josh McCown played like...Josh McCown. He can get hot and move the ball, but his consistency is a problem. He was also victimized by drops. But to be honest, McCown was victimized by a crappy defense. A defense that refuses to make plays or get turnovers. We had a couple chances for turnovers, but we didn't make them. I believe Jamar Taylor leaped up into the air and had the ball in his hands, but the WR managed to somehow rip it out. I could be wrong, but I think the Jets scored a TD on that drive. THAT'S the kind of shit that makes me enraged. I also want to talk about the tackling, but I don't want my blood pressure to go nuclear. How many draw plays did the Jets have to run before we caught on? 3rd and long...no problem! A draw play! The 35 yard TD run? Yep, draw play, and 4 missed tackles. Our defense is terrible and lacks PLAYMAKERS. We were in deep trouble when we lost Boddy-Calhoun on the Jets' 3rd play of the game. We didn't have anybody in the second half make a play. Nobody stopped the bleeding. Nobody stepped up and took it upon themselves to be the leader. Perhaps Jamie Collins is the guy we need to help things move along. I've been saying for YEARS that I want a middle linebacker that makes plays and can do it all. I BEGGED to find a way to get Luke Kuechly. We needed a badass linebacker, and now we have one. Now, we just have to figure out a way to keep him AND Pryor. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Gipper Posted November 7, 2016 Report Share Posted November 7, 2016 This thread needs revived. We need Horton gone. The defensive problems this team has are far far beyond just having young, unproven talent. The defensive schemes are atrocious. The tackling is atrocious. Players are absolutely confused about what their assignments are. There is some seriously pathetic coaching going on. How can Horton last? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Browns_Fucking_Rule Posted November 7, 2016 Report Share Posted November 7, 2016 I totally agree Gip. I think its time to promote someone and get rid of this waste of a scheme. And note that I use the word scheme quite loosely here. Get a DC who wants to be down there and on the field like a real DC should be (especially when the HC is not a defensive guy) and knows how to find the passion in these men. Horton isn't putting anyone in position to be successful with this read and react bs of a defense. We need to let the wolves off of their leashes and attack. How could it possibly be much worse? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jrb12711 Posted November 7, 2016 Report Share Posted November 7, 2016 So I read this and just laughed and laughed..... Just went back and read a bunch of old threads, with all the ranting about Oneills "scheme" and how the coaches made this D so bad by mis using players and having a bad scheme etc.....one poster(Cal) said the team would be 4 games better just by switching coaches......haaaaaaaaaahahahaha..... After giving up on the battle, trying to convince the lynch mob that talent was the answer(not coaching), I posted......"I cant wait till they fire Oneill and when the new defensive coordinator still cant stop the run or win a game cause he has shit players, then ya'll can start blaming the new coach"... And it didnt take long(at all)......(or course most of those people are completely awol right now.....and I also notice the board has zero chatter about "good" stuff, up and coming players, general sunshine pumping, great plays, etc.......why?...... So, which is it??......Horton sucks? Oneill sucks? the players suck?......all of the above?.......or blame it on Who?......anyone? Haaaaaaaaaahahahaha....... it's so bad, it's become funny...... Eh, I'm not sure if we can't eliminate the variable that both guys just suck equally. Before you go crazy on me, I get the players blow really, really, bad. There's no way in hell any DC in the league could have this unit better than bottom three, and I get that. HOWEVER, that doesn't mean the DC doesn't suck too. I have never gotten the Horton buzz, the dude has had an mediocre track record and more often than not team defense doesn't hurt after he gets the boot. I get the guy may have the mind for it but I just don't see it playing out on paper. There's so many times when I just think to myself "why would you possibly put guys in that position?" I can literally call the play the offense is going to run and yep, there's the gainer. Again, I get it and I always clamored the same speech for O'Neil at the time too. But just because players suck doesn't mean the coordinator can't equally suck too. The problem is, unless we get the "organic" candidate no self-respecting DC worth a lick would come here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Browns_Fucking_Rule Posted November 7, 2016 Report Share Posted November 7, 2016 They need an up and coming college level DC that can grow along side of the youth. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hoorta Posted November 7, 2016 Report Share Posted November 7, 2016 Maybe Im just blinded by anger.....and NOW, only great players and wins will get me my sight back...dont know... I promise, I positively did not choose to lose faith.....or hate what I see.....it just kind of happened on it own...... I realize talent is sorely lacking on defense, but that isn't the entire problem. There were two totally blown coverages Sunday that resulted in ridiculously easy TDs for the Cowboys. Three defensive line ups offsides on one series? Someone should have called a timeout and reamed the offending party for being that dumb. I don't know about losing Faith Mud- but I'm starting to lose Hope that this edition of the Browns has a 2016 win in their future. The Browns have shown a considerable amount of Charity to opposing teams- they're just penciling in a win when they see the Browns on their schedule. Mud, if you aren't outraged, you aren't paying attention. I've said some things I really regret, and I've had my fair share of posts that I went back and deleted. I wouldn't mind the losing if we didn't keep inventing new ways to lose. The Jets loss was the worst, as we started the season with our first 5-7 on the road, and I was REALLY hoping for the team to give the home crowd JUST ONE DAMN WIN. But as I saw us with a nice halftime lead, I sat back in my chair and knew what was coming. We all did. Our defense is terrible and lacks PLAYMAKERS. We were in deep trouble when we lost Boddy-Calhoun on the Jets' 3rd play of the game. We didn't have anybody in the second half make a play. Nobody stopped the bleeding. Nobody stepped up and took it upon themselves to be the leader. Perhaps Jamie Collins is the guy we need to help things move along. I've been saying for YEARS that I want a middle linebacker that makes plays and can do it all. I BEGGED to find a way to get Luke Kuechly. We needed a badass linebacker, and now we have one. Now, we just have to figure out a way to keep him AND Pryor. Coaching, players, I don't much care anymore who's to blame. All I know is this current Browns product stinks to high heaven. Just when I think they can't possibly suck any worse, they exceed my already low expectations. I hope that Cowboys game was the rock bottom. Don't get out the jackhammers, dynamite and start blasting a crater to China. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wargograw Posted November 7, 2016 Report Share Posted November 7, 2016 Yeah, fire Horton because a talentless defense sucks. That will really endear you to potential replacements. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Browns_Fucking_Rule Posted November 7, 2016 Report Share Posted November 7, 2016 No! Fire Horton because he sucks! Not just because the defense is talentless. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richiswhere Posted November 7, 2016 Report Share Posted November 7, 2016 So I read this and just laughed and laughed..... Just went back and read a bunch of old threads, with all the ranting about Oneills "scheme" and how the coaches made this D so bad by mis using players and having a bad scheme etc.....one poster(Cal) said the team would be 4 games better just by switching coaches......haaaaaaaaaahahahaha..... After giving up on the battle, trying to convince the lynch mob that talent was the answer(not coaching), I posted......"I cant wait till they fire Oneill and when the new defensive coordinator still cant stop the run or win a game cause he has shit players, then ya'll can start blaming the new coach"... And it didnt take long(at all)......(or course most of those people are completely awol right now.....and I also notice the board has zero chatter about "good" stuff, up and coming players, general sunshine pumping, great plays, etc.......why?...... So, which is it??......Horton sucks? Oneill sucks? the players suck?......all of the above?.......or blame it on Who?......anyone? Haaaaaaaaaahahahaha....... it's so bad, it's become funny...... Funny thing is the Browns are the 2nd worst defense in the NFL only the 49ers are worse and guess who is their defensive coordinator Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TexasAg1969 Posted November 7, 2016 Report Share Posted November 7, 2016 Funny thing is the Browns are the 2nd worst defense in the NFL only the 49ers are worse and guess who is their defensive coordinator LOL! Let me see. An ex Brown DC? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tour2ma Posted November 7, 2016 Report Share Posted November 7, 2016 This thread needs revived. lol... I'll give you a pass this time... There's so many times when I just think to myself "why would you possibly put guys in that position?" I can literally call the play the offense is going to run and yep, there's the gainer. I'm no Horton fan from his first stint with us, but shouldn't your criticism in part be aimed at the player on the field responsible for calling adjustments? I know that player has to be coached up and that goes back to Horton, but it sounds like you are blaming Ray for not being psychic when he undoubtedly is fed down and distance tendencies by the advanced scouts? We do have advanced scouts, right? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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