TexasAg1969 Posted January 7, 2017 Report Share Posted January 7, 2017 Sounds like the hillbilly way to me... Uh, or maybe 2016? I swear if we trade down below Garrett/Allen then fire the whole damn analytic group of baseball pickers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gftChris Posted January 8, 2017 Report Share Posted January 8, 2017 If Sashi and Company want job security, they will draft a QB #1. It will give them an automatic 3 years.. You can't fire a regime and coaching staff when they have a developing QB. Maybe I'm wrong, but when was the last time a regime got fired the year after they drafted their "franchise" guy? If we take Mitch #1 and he plays all season and we go 3-13, I don't think anyone is getting fired because we have a franchise QB who is growing who needs continuity around him. If we take Garrett #1 and go 3-13, more than likely heads will roll. Well Jeff Fisher was fired less than 16 games after drafting Goff, if that counts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ballpeen Posted January 8, 2017 Report Share Posted January 8, 2017 From a pure PR perspective taking Mitch #1 overall is a better move than Garrett. Most fans will give the hometown kid some time. There will always be a few idiots screaming he isn't playing like Elway or Manning right out of the gate. Isn't this supposed to be a deep defensive draft? Better odds of getting a defensive stud than a great QB there @ #12. Silly season is here. I would take Mitch at #33. I don't give a shit if he is from Cleveland. The team can't make stupid decisions based on that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tour2ma Posted January 8, 2017 Report Share Posted January 8, 2017 Silly season is here. I would take Mitch at #33. I don't give a shit if he is from Cleveland. The team can't make stupid decisions based on that. Yeah... I remember when Johnny was a good pick because of the "excitement" he brought... *sigh* Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Gipper Posted January 9, 2017 Report Share Posted January 9, 2017 Silly season is here. I would take Mitch at #33. I don't give a shit if he is from Cleveland. The team can't make stupid decisions based on that. I would take him at #33 too, but, you are right peen. It is silly season. It is silly of you to think he would last that long. Even if Browns don't take him, he will go Top 5. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
darren15 Posted January 13, 2017 Report Share Posted January 13, 2017 http://www.cleveland.com/browns/index.ssf/2017/01/should_the_browns_trade_for_ji.html An insight into Jimmy G Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zombo Posted January 13, 2017 Report Share Posted January 13, 2017 http://www.cleveland.com/browns/index.ssf/2017/01/should_the_browns_trade_for_ji.html An insight into Jimmy G Good stuff. There is also three years of preseason film on him, and he has played well. Certainly more polished and quicker release than Kessler. Certainly more patient and accurate than Griffin. We can have Myles Garrett and Jimmy G. And we'd be instantly better on both sides of the ball. If you're into that sort of thing. Zombo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Gipper Posted January 13, 2017 Report Share Posted January 13, 2017 Good stuff. There is also three years of preseason film on him, and he has played well. Certainly more polished and quicker release than Kessler. Certainly more patient and accurate than Griffin. We can have Myles Garrett and Jimmy G. And we'd be instantly better on both sides of the ball. If you're into that sort of thing. Zombo Well, that would be an acceptable Plan B for me if they don't go for MT. However...NOT at the price the Pats want. Highest I would give is our 2d second round pick....#52? Plus maybe a lower pick thrown in. NOT #1 certainly. NOT #12, NOT #33. If we go the Garropolo route, then I want those draft picks for defense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DKAllDay Posted January 13, 2017 Author Report Share Posted January 13, 2017 Well, that would be an acceptable Plan B for me if they don't go for MT. However...NOT at the price the Pats want. Highest I would give is our 2d second round pick....#52? Plus maybe a lower pick thrown in. NOT #1 certainly. NOT #12, NOT #33. If we go the Garropolo route, then I want those draft picks for defense. So you're saying a QB with one year of college experience and 0 NFL experience is worth the #1 pick, but a guy who has shown he can perform extremely well in the NFL with limited opportunities, and has 3 years of experience isn't worth the #12, or even the #33 pick? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tour2ma Posted January 13, 2017 Report Share Posted January 13, 2017 This ought to be good... Popcorn time! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Gipper Posted January 13, 2017 Report Share Posted January 13, 2017 So you're saying a QB with one year of college experience and 0 NFL experience is worth the #1 pick, but a guy who has shown he can perform extremely well in the NFL with limited opportunities, and has 3 years of experience isn't worth the #12, or even the #33 pick? Yes. I did not stutter. I don't see where JGs talent evaluation now is any different than when he was drafted in the middle of the second round. So, to me, a mid 2d round pick is what we should at most give up. (and maybe throw in a bone of a later round pick) Scott Mitchell performed "extremely well" in his limited opportunities before he was given a starting job. Unless you can guarantee me that he will have a Brett Favre like career, yes, I would rather take a risk on a draftee than on another team's reject. If he was that good, we should have taken him the year he came out. Sure, he is probably better than what we have now, but, he will also be in the last year of his contract. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TexasAg1969 Posted January 13, 2017 Report Share Posted January 13, 2017 This ought to be good... Popcorn time! +1 LOL! :lol: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DKAllDay Posted January 13, 2017 Author Report Share Posted January 13, 2017 Yes. I did not stutter. I don't see where JGs talent evaluation now is any different than when he was drafted in the middle of the second round. So, to me, a mid 2d round pick is what we should at most give up. (and maybe throw in a bone of a later round pick) 502 yds, 4 TDs and 0 INTs in two games against the Cardinals and the Dolphins hardly sounds like 2nd round talent to me. Scott Mitchell performed "extremely well" in his limited opportunities before he was given a starting job. I'm 24, idk who Scott Mitchell is. I googled him and got a guy from The Biggest Loser. Looks like he was a 4th round pick... not 2nd. Unless you can guarantee me that he will have a Brett Favre like career, yes, I would rather take a risk on a draftee than on another team's reject. Are you guaranteeing Trubisky to be Favre? Because he better be if we take him instead of Garrett. And any QB behind Brady is hardly a "reject". They are simply stuck behind a fucking Alien. My dad once told me Michael Jordan was an alien. I believe it, and so is Tom Brady. 30 of the starting QBs would be stuck behind Brady, and the Patriots would be looking to trade them. Shit, even Aaron Rodgers would be sitting on the bench behind Brady. I'd love Aaron Rodgers to be a reject behind Brady that we could trade for. If he was that good, we should have taken him the year he came out. I'll just leave this here. https://www.google.com/amp/www.patspulpit.com/platform/amp/2016/4/28/11525384/browns-coaching-staff-wanted-to-take-jimmy-garoppolo-instead-of-manziel?client=safari Sure, he is probably better than what we have now, but, he will also be in the last year of his contract. And that's a beautiful thing. He's not a rookie, so he has no excuse of needing years to develop. If he's gonna be good in this league, he will be good instantly. If not, we drop him at the end of the season. If he shows flashes, but is still iffy (ala Kirk Cousins), we franchise him for one year and make him prove it. All the while we can use this draft to build the defense and o line. Look, I think Mitch is the best QB in the draft, but the absolute best thing for this team is to trade for Garoppolo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Gipper Posted January 13, 2017 Report Share Posted January 13, 2017 502 yds, 4 TDs and 0 INTs in two games against the Cardinals and the Dolphins hardly sounds like 2nd round talent to me. Scott Mitchell performed "extremely well" in his limited opportunities before he was given a starting job. I'm 24, idk who Scott Mitchell is. I googled him and got a guy from The Biggest Loser. Looks like he was a 4th round pick... not 2nd. Scott Mitchell is a guy who in his first two game had like 502 yards, 4 TDs and 0 ints.......but then became "The Biggest Loser. And any QB behind Brady is hardly a "reject". Hoyer, Cassell, Mallet were eminently "rejectable. And that's a beautiful thing. He's not a rookie, so he has no excuse of needing years to develop. If he's gonna be good in this league, he will be good instantly. If not, we drop him at the end of the season. If he shows flashes, but is still iffy (ala Kirk Cousins), we franchise him for one year and make him prove it. All the while we can use this draft to build the defense and o line. If you invest a first round pick in him, and you can't keep him or he turns out a bust....that is far worse in my opinion than drafting a QB. I ain't giving up a first round pick for a one year rental. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DKAllDay Posted January 13, 2017 Author Report Share Posted January 13, 2017 502 yds, 4 TDs and 0 INTs in two games against the Cardinals and the Dolphins hardly sounds like 2nd round talent to me. Scott Mitchell performed "extremely well" in his limited opportunities before he was given a starting job. I'm 24, idk who Scott Mitchell is. I googled him and got a guy from The Biggest Loser. Looks like he was a 4th round pick... not 2nd. Scott Mitchell is a guy who in his first two game had like 502 yards, 4 TDs and 0 ints.......but then became "The Biggest Loser. And any QB behind Brady is hardly a "reject". Hoyer, Cassell, Mallet were eminently "rejectable. And that's a beautiful thing. He's not a rookie, so he has no excuse of needing years to develop. If he's gonna be good in this league, he will be good instantly. If not, we drop him at the end of the season. If he shows flashes, but is still iffy (ala Kirk Cousins), we franchise him for one year and make him prove it. All the while we can use this draft to build the defense and o line. If you invest a first round pick in him, and you can't keep him or he turns out a bust....that is far worse in my opinion than drafting a QB. I ain't giving up a first round pick for a one year rental. Way to edit out parts of my arguement, only leaving what fits your narrative. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Gipper Posted January 13, 2017 Report Share Posted January 13, 2017 Way to edit out parts of my arguement, only leaving what fits your narrative. Welcome to the world of grownups. I only quoted the pieces of what you said that I wished to respond to. Your post can stand on its own without me having to regurgitate the whole thing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DKAllDay Posted January 13, 2017 Author Report Share Posted January 13, 2017 Welcome to the world of grownups. I only quoted the pieces of what you said that I wished to respond to. Your post can stand on its own without me having to regurgitate the whole thing. Oh ok, now it makes sense why as a kid I always knew grown ups were full of shit. I mean your post was almost as bad as MSNBC. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tim Couch Pulls Out Posted January 14, 2017 Report Share Posted January 14, 2017 The problem with your argument for JG is that it completely disregards the fact that every QB who has filled in for Brady has performed exceedingly well for the most part, which makes a true evaluation of JG awfully hard. He's worth no later than a second round pick, however I wouldn't sacrifice a top 15 pick for a guy in the last year of his contract. It doesn't make any sense from a cap perspective. You're essentially sacrificing four years of rookie wages for a guy that, in all honesty, is still almost as much of an unknown. Could he be great? Sure. But so could the rookie you draft at #12. I'm not going to trade away four years of cheap "could" for one year of cheap "could". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DKAllDay Posted January 14, 2017 Author Report Share Posted January 14, 2017 The problem with your argument for JG is that it completely disregards the fact that every QB who has filled in for Brady has performed exceedingly well for the most part, which makes a true evaluation of JG awfully hard. He's worth no later than a second round pick, however I wouldn't sacrifice a top 15 pick for a guy in the last year of his contract. It doesn't make any sense from a cap perspective. You're essentially sacrificing four years of rookie wages for a guy that, in all honesty, is still almost as much of an unknown. Could he be great? Sure. But so could the rookie you draft at #12. I'm not going to trade away four years of cheap "could" for one year of cheap "could". The advantage would be instant gratification, and a quicker rebuild. With Haslam's trigger finger, that instant success is necessary. Any way you acquire a QB is a risk, and eventually you're going to have to pay him if he's franchise material. I actually really like Mitch, hence my username. It's just the logic that an inexperienced rook would be worth the #1 pick, but a guy who has shown success (albeit short term) wouldn't even be worth #33. If we want to be competitive next year, the smart thing to do would be sacrifice #33 and something next year for a QB, and capitalize on the deep defensive talent in this draft. If we take Mitch, which I would be fine with, it's gonna be a few years before we are competitive, and is Haslam really going to wait that long? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richiswhere Posted January 14, 2017 Report Share Posted January 14, 2017 The advantage would be instant gratification, and a quicker rebuild. With Haslam's trigger finger, that instant success is necessary. Any way you acquire a QB is a risk, and eventually you're going to have to pay him if he's franchise material. I actually really like Mitch, hence my username. It's just the logic that an inexperienced rook would be worth the #1 pick, but a guy who has shown success (albeit short term) wouldn't even be worth #33. If we want to be competitive next year, the smart thing to do would be sacrifice #33 and something next year for a QB, and capitalize on the deep defensive talent in this draft. If we take Mitch, which I would be fine with, it's gonna be a few years before we are competitive, and is Haslam really going to wait that long? I guess you are a young one Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zombo Posted January 14, 2017 Report Share Posted January 14, 2017 The problem with your argument for JG is that it completely disregards the fact that every QB who has filled in for Brady has performed exceedingly well for the most part, which makes a true evaluation of JG awfully hard. He's worth no later than a second round pick, however I wouldn't sacrifice a top 15 pick for a guy in the last year of his contract. It doesn't make any sense from a cap perspective. You're essentially sacrificing four years of rookie wages for a guy that, in all honesty, is still almost as much of an unknown. Could he be great? Sure. But so could the rookie you draft at #12. I'm not going to trade away four years of cheap "could" for one year of cheap "could". Oh, Jeezus. Watch the film. He is better than our QBs. He is 25 and can paid an incentive based contact. What is wrong with you homos? Z Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
medicineman Posted January 14, 2017 Report Share Posted January 14, 2017 I agree with TCPO on this 1. He makes a great point and less not forget, New England is a entire team of All Pros so even if 1 of them would go down they still do win games even if the 1 that went down was #12. I am all for keeping Collins and Pryor and Kessler, We already have him, get him some stud Oline Vets from FA and a stud tall vet WR then stack our D with draft picks. Not that what any of us say makes a difference but............... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
One Post Posted January 14, 2017 Report Share Posted January 14, 2017 I agree with TCPO on this 1. He makes a great point and less not forget, New England is a entire team of All Pros so even if 1 of them would go down they still do win games even if the 1 that went down was #12. I am all for keeping Collins and Pryor and Kessler, We already have him, get him some stud Oline Vets from FA and a stud tall vet WR then stack our D with draft picks. Not that what any of us say makes a difference but...............Yes Jim G. is a system player but that's a good thing. Hoyer came from NE as well and Jim G is better than he is. Yes get him or the Polock fuck it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tim Couch Pulls Out Posted January 14, 2017 Report Share Posted January 14, 2017 Oh, Jeezus. Watch the film. He is better than our QBs. He is 25 and can paid an incentive based contact. What is wrong with you homos? Z He doesn't have to accept an incentive based contract, and he won't. No QB in his right mind would. Us "homos" just don't get a boner for the next flavor of the week QB that threw a pretty pass and ESPN jams down our throats. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zombo Posted January 14, 2017 Report Share Posted January 14, 2017 He doesn't have to accept an incentive based contract, and he won't. No QB in his right mind would. Us "homos" just don't get a boner for the next flavor of the week QB that threw a pretty pass and ESPN jams down our throats. "I didn't look at the video. I'm dumb and would like to draft the big name of the year ... Because I'm really, really dumb." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stillmotion Posted January 14, 2017 Report Share Posted January 14, 2017 He doesn't have to accept an incentive based contract, and he won't. No QB in his right mind would. Us "homos" just don't get a boner for the next flavor of the week QB that threw a pretty pass and ESPN jams down our throats. Dude is gonna be a stud. but you'd probably rather have a project, another black tarkenton, or bortles, right? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
strglzer Posted January 14, 2017 Report Share Posted January 14, 2017 If we take Trubisky we give up the 1st pick in the draft for our QB, and we are out of the race for the top Def. players in the draft. We still have 12,33,65 to pick up Def. players to help this team. Jimmy G. could be the right direction to go but people think a 1 and 4 is to much to spend on him. But remember this, there are what about 6 teams looking for there QB, Jimmy G. is not going to go cheep. I would try to set the deal in stone now before the draft, and teams start bidding on his services. I would go hard after Jimmy, I would offer NE our 2nd. (65) this year, and our 2nd. next year. We still have 3 top picks for Def. and we walk out with our QB, the top Def. pick, and 12 and 33 to boot. If Jimmy is a top 20 QB he is worth the 2 seconds, if Trubisky is a top 20 QB he is worth the 1st pick, If both bomb out I would rather loose 2 seconds than the first pick. Both are going to have risks but I do think that Jimmy is the lower risk..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harry Buffalo Posted January 14, 2017 Report Share Posted January 14, 2017 How many of Brady's back ups have gone on to have careers as at least average starters? Every fucking one was touted as the next coming of Christ but they all never lived up to the bill. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zombo Posted January 14, 2017 Report Share Posted January 14, 2017 How many of Brady's back ups have gone on to have careers as at least average starters? Every fucking one was touted as the next coming of Christ but they all never lived up to the bill. So let's not look at him because he plays for the Patriots. While we have our head in the sand, let's stay clear of coaches who have been fired and defenders who played in the Big 12. Zombo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tour2ma Posted January 14, 2017 Report Share Posted January 14, 2017 Could he be great? Sure. But so could the rookie you draft at #12. I'm not going to trade away four years of cheap "could" for one year of cheap "could". Don't forget the 5th year option... The advantage would be instant gratification, and a quicker rebuild. Neither of which this FO has shown any signs of being interested in. I'm with them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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