The problem with Wentz (maybe why we passed on him)

[sdballis]

https://www.yahoo.com/sports/news/theres-something-wrong-with-carson-wentzs-throwing-style-and-much-of-nfl-has-caught-on-011427565.html

 

Essentially, he has a really long throwing motion, which affects his accuracy and ability to get the ball out quickly.

 

 

"The motion was also something that concerned the Cleveland Browns in their scouting evaluations of Wentz, prior to their trading of the No. 2 overall pick to the Eagles. A Browns source told Yahoo Sports Wentz’s motion was noted in draft evaluations – though he also maintained trading the No. 2 pick was more about netting draft picks than not liking Wentz."

[DKAllDay]

Eh, bit of an overreaction. Just like the overreaction when he started 3-0.

 

Kid is a winner though, no denying it. You can see it in him, he has the "it". He will be a good QB.

[Babernakle]

Weather they took him or not, or even took dak or Geoff. It wouldn't have mattered they would be on the IR or would have been this year. To take another qb is suicid. The qb will not be able to develop while under constant pressure. Hence why dak looks so good and why wentz looked good early because he had time. Before investing in another qb they need to solidify the oline through fa or the draft and well as getting more help on the defense like a true pass rusher a safety and maybe a hybrid lb-pass rusher. Like a clay Mathews or bobby Wagner. Passing on wentz was a good call and I believe they should stay away from the position again this year. If they were to make qb move getting garoppolo would be a great get, but would cost a high pick if they could get him at all. Personally I feel they should get rid of all there qbs besides hogan and pick up and bigger qb such as cardell jones someone with a big arm and could take some hits.

[Tour2ma]

If Wentz's motion is "long"... what adjective do we use to describe McC's?

[hoorta]

If Wentz's motion is "long"... what adjective do we use to describe McC's?

Slow as a glacier?

[tiamat63]

If Wentz's motion is "long"... what adjective do we use to describe McC's?

Horse Dong.

[TexasAg1969]

"and maybe a hybrid lb-pass rusher. Like a clay Mathews or bobby Wagner."

 

His name is Reuben Foster. You can watch him against Washington. I would give anything to have Bama's starting defense (with no injuries) as the Browns starting D. They have more quality NFL starters on that D than any other 3 teams combined. Tony Brown was the best 5* player in Texas and he is 2nd string CB as a Jr. When the starter went down Sat. he came in and they never missed a beat.

[gftChris]

So we're saying Wentz, a rookie from a small school program, hasn't been perfect in his first NFL season after spending his offseason being told he's not ready or going to start and being 3rd string? Outrageous. The kid will be fine, but he's not Andrew Luck or Peyton Manning so I'm not any more bothered about him not being our QB than Carr, Mariota, Big Ben, Rodgers and the rest.

[flyingfooldoug]

If Wentz's motion is "long"... what adjective do we use to describe McC's?

Old

[jiggins7919]

Eh, bit of an overreaction. Just like the overreaction when he started 3-0.

 

Kid is a winner though, no denying it. You can see it in him, he has the "it". He will be a good QB.

 

This, all of this. I was guilty of overreacting during the first three weeks, but still, he certainly has the "it" factor in my opinion. He can move, he has a strong arm, and he throws a dynamite slant. If he progresses from one year to the next, the Eagles have their man. Wentz also has terrific size, and that's something that shouldn't be understated.

 

One of the goals for our 2016 season was to find our franchise QB. By most accounts, we've failed that goal. Cody appears to be a solid backup, but I stress that he COULD progress from his rookie season, and significantly improve. Would I bet on it? Hell no, but is it POSSIBLE? Of course it is. My biggest concern with Kessler has nothing to do with arm strength. Would it be better if he had a stronger arm? Of course it would be, but that's not his main issue. His problems have to do with his extreme lack of "escapability", his immense lack of strength to take a little hit and shake it off, and how flat out SLOW he is. Like I've said a million times, Cody has missed SO MANY yards by not running up the field. Obviously, we don't want our QB taking off running all the damn time, but he's had some running lanes that could've resulted in HUGE yards...and a slide.

 

For example, I saw Wentz run for a 3rd and 14 the other night, and then ran out of bounds. As silly as it might sound, that can be the difference in a game. A huge 3rd down conversion is demoralizing to a defense, and energizes an offense. Kessler isn't as fast as Wentz, nowhere NEAR (I don't care what the 40 times might say), but some of the running lanes I've seen were big enough for Honey Boo-Boo to pick up 20 yards.

[The Gipper]

 

His name is Reuben Foster. You can watch him against Washington. I would give anything to have Bama's starting defense (with no injuries) as the Browns starting D. They have more quality NFL starters on that D than any other 3 teams combined. Tony Brown was the best 5* player in Texas and he is 2nd string CB as a Jr. When the starter went down Sat. he came in and they never missed a beat.

So, Bama has had these great defenses.......yet let's ask this: how many of them have done all that well when it comes to their NFL careers?

Alabama has had good receivers: Julio Jones, Amari Cooper.

But what defenders have been really good? One guy, maybe, the LB, that plays for the Ravens perhaps (Upshaw?) Anyone else?

 

Or, is the East German effect in play here?

[gftChris]

So, Bama has had these great defenses.......yet let's ask this: how many of them have done all that well when it comes to their NFL careers?

Alabama has had good receivers: Julio Jones, Amari Cooper.

But what defenders have been really good? One guy, maybe, the LB, that plays for the Ravens perhaps (Upshaw?) Anyone else?

 

Or, is the East German effect in play here?

CJ Mosley is the Raven you're thinking of. Take your pick from here:

http://www.al.com/sports/index.ssf/2016/05/55_former_alabama_players_on_n.html

[Tour2ma]

Horse Dong.

 

lol... we have a winner!

 

So we're saying Wentz, a rookie from a small school program, hasn't been perfect in his first NFL season after spending his offseason being told he's not ready or going to start and being 3rd string? Outrageous. The kid will be fine, but he's not Andrew Luck or Peyton Manning so I'm not any more bothered about him not being our QB than Carr, Mariota, Big Ben, Rodgers and the rest.

 

I'm shocked you're not considerably less bothered compared to that group...

 

As jiggy enumerated in Carson there are a lot of physical assets to admire... and maybe the "it" is there as well. But without the head, something most of your group displayed in their rookie campaigns (and the rest have shown in their second), the sum of his talents will always be less than the minimum NFL requirement.

 

The readiness of Wentz's head is what people got wrong early, but now see as it is. Next year may be the year his light switch flips on as it now seems Mariota's has...

 

Or not...

[gftChris]

We saw a similar thing with Blake Bortles - small school guy with all the physical attributes you could ask for, nobody had heard of him before january, then suddenly he's shooting up boards all over the place, gets drafted #3, showed 'promise' in the first year, but has really regressed in year 3. People were casting envious glances in the direction of jacksonville this time a year ago, like they are with Philly, but now it's not so much the case.

[D Bone]

We saw a similar thing with Blake Bortles - small school guy with all the physical attributes you could ask for, nobody had heard of him before january, then suddenly he's shooting up boards all over the place, gets drafted #3, showed 'promise' in the first year, but has really regressed in year 3. People were casting envious glances in the direction of jacksonville this time a year ago, like they are with Philly, but now it's not so much the case.

 

ahhhh, the combine strikes again - along with the draft 'experts' that pump up the latest D8 stud that looks good in shorts and a tank.

[jiggins7919]

We saw a similar thing with Blake Bortles - small school guy with all the physical attributes you could ask for, nobody had heard of him before january, then suddenly he's shooting up boards all over the place, gets drafted #3, showed 'promise' in the first year, but has really regressed in year 3. People were casting envious glances in the direction of jacksonville this time a year ago, like they are with Philly, but now it's not so much the case.

 

Yeah, that's a good point Chris. Many MANY analysts predicted big things for Jacksonville, and who could blame them? Their offense was downright explosive, they had a young, upcoming QB, and they drafted Jalen Ramsey AND were getting their previous first rounder back from injury on defense. What happened? They can't run the ball, and their QB is IMMENSELY inaccurate. Like...the worst accuracy in the universe.

 

We're in a pretty big pickle right now. The QB position is SO important, that if Hue Jackson could SOMEHOW get THAT right, he'd probably guarantee himself two more years. People would say, "Well, the Browns have their QB, and now they need to build around him. They have cap space, and a willing owner, so it's a matter of time before they get stronger." But we probably DON'T have our QB on the roster, and the upcoming talent isn't overwhelming. The pressure...is real.

[The Gipper]

CJ Mosley is the Raven you're thinking of. Take your pick from here:

http://www.al.com/sports/index.ssf/2016/05/55_former_alabama_players_on_n.html

OK, In terms of career production DeMeco Ryans Dareus, Roman Harper have been the best.

Some good players...but nothing dominant in comparison to how they dominate in college.

 

(In comparison....over the same period, Ohio State has produced as many or more good pro defenders as Alabama)

[The Gipper]

We saw a similar thing with Blake Bortles - small school guy with all the physical attributes you could ask for, nobody had heard of him before january, then suddenly he's shooting up boards all over the place, gets drafted #3, showed 'promise' in the first year, but has really regressed in year 3. People were casting envious glances in the direction of jacksonville this time a year ago, like they are with Philly, but now it's not so much the case.

Yes, Bortles seemingly has all the physical tools. But, of course, it is primarily the mental tools that make a great QB: See Tom Brady, Joe Montana, Bernie (not your greatest physical specimen).

[gftChris]

Yes, Bortles seemingly has all the physical tools. But, of course, it is primarily the mental tools that make a great QB: See Tom Brady, Joe Montana, Bernie (not your greatest physical specimen).

Which is why is stupid when people get all excited over a guy who *jon gruden voice* 'has prototypical size, has a great arm, can make all the throws, is tough to bring down' - that could describe a whole lot of backups and guys who just flat out failed.

[The Gipper]

Which is why is stupid when people get all excited over a guy who *jon gruden voice* 'has prototypical size, has a great arm, can make all the throws, is tough to bring down' - that could describe a whole lot of backups and guys who just flat out failed.

Yes, but it would be appropriate to get excited over those who would succeed. The problem, of course, is telling the difference early on.

[Tour2ma]

We saw a similar thing with Blake Bortles - small school guy with all the physical attributes you could ask for, nobody had heard of him before january, then suddenly he's shooting up boards all over the place, gets drafted #3, showed 'promise' in the first year, but has really regressed in year 3. People were casting envious glances in the direction of jacksonville this time a year ago, like they are with Philly, but now it's not so much the case.

 

... and Tannehill. Folks have been on and off the Tannehill wagon many times..

[wargograw]

So, Bama has had these great defenses.......yet let's ask this: how many of them have done all that well when it comes to their NFL careers?

Alabama has had good receivers: Julio Jones, Amari Cooper.

But what defenders have been really good? One guy, maybe, the LB, that plays for the Ravens perhaps (Upshaw?) Anyone else?

 

Or, is the East German effect in play here?

Hightower. Collins. Mosley. Dareus. Kirkpatrick. McClain. Clinton-Dix. Jackson. Barron.

[Bob806]

Hightower. Collins. Mosley. Dareus. Kirkpatrick. McClain. Clinton-Dix. Jackson. Barron.

Don't forget about Cornelius Bennet and Antonio Langham.

[The Gipper]

Hightower. Collins. Mosley. Dareus. Kirkpatrick. McClain. Clinton-Dix. Jackson. Barron.

Decent, not dominant, as some might expect.

[The Gipper]

Don't forget about Cornelius Bennet and Antonio Langham.

We were kind of looking at basically the Saban era at Alabama, or just a bit before.

 

If you want to look historically, the Univ. of Illinois produced both Dick Butkus and Ray Nitschke.

Miami had Ted Hendricks, Ray Lewis, and Warren Sapp.

 

Historically, Alabama has produced far more offensive stars. See their list of HOFers:

 

John Hannah , Don Hutson , Joe Namath , Ozzie Newsome , Ken Stabler , Bart Starr , Dwight Stephenson , Derrick Thomas

All but Thomas on offensed.

[browns52]

https://www.yahoo.com/sports/news/theres-something-wrong-with-carson-wentzs-throwing-style-and-much-of-nfl-has-caught-on-011427565.html

 

Essentially, he has a really long throwing motion, which affects his accuracy and ability to get the ball out quickly.

 

 

"The motion was also something that concerned the Cleveland Browns in their scouting evaluations of Wentz, prior to their trading of the No. 2 overall pick to the Eagles. A Browns source told Yahoo Sports Wentz’s motion was noted in draft evaluations – though he also maintained trading the No. 2 pick was more about netting draft picks than not liking Wentz."

we actually have scouting.....did not know that....you are wrong....wentz is a winner, eagles just need more weapons...

[Tour2ma]

Decent, not dominant, as some might expect.

 

Decent?

[wargograw]

This year they'll add Allen, Humphrey, Foster, Williams (all likely first rounders), Anderson (great value puck in the middle rounds--but I'm betting he goes higher than currently projected), Tomlinson, and Hamilton.

 

To say nothing of Ragland, Robinson, Reed, Jones all drafted last year but I don't believe are starting yet. And I'm probably missing a guy or two.

[gftChris]

 

Decent?

Landon Collins, DPOY candidate - decent.

[TexasAg1969]

This year they'll add Allen, Humphrey, Foster, Williams (all likely first rounders), Anderson (great value puck in the middle rounds--but I'm betting he goes higher than currently projected), Tomlinson, and Hamilton.

 

To say nothing of Ragland, Robinson, Reed, Jones all drafted last year but I don't believe are starting yet. And I'm probably missing a guy or two.

 

And we haven't even mentioned true sophs (NG and both safeties) they start that could come out in 2018. Yep, trade for the whole team and the Browns would win.