OldBrownsFan Posted February 17, 2017 Report Share Posted February 17, 2017 Washington Supreme Court: Gov’t can force florist to participate in gay ‘wedding’ OLYMPIA, Wash. – A Washington floral artist says she will ask the U.S. Supreme Court to reverse a decision Thursday by the state’s high court that concluded the government can force her—and, by extension, other Washingtonians—to create artistic expression and participate in events with which they disagree. Alliance Defending Freedom attorneys represent Richland floral artist Barronelle Stutzman, whom the state attorney general and the American Civil Liberties Union sued for acting consistently with her faith. “This case is about crushing dissent. In a free America, people with differing beliefs must have room to coexist,” said ADF Senior Counsel Kristen Waggoner, who argued before the court together with co-counsel George Ahrend in November of last year. “It’s wrong for the state to force any citizen to support a particular view about marriage or anything else against their will. Freedom of speech and religion aren’t subject to the whim of a majority; they are constitutional guarantees.” “Our nation has a long history of protecting the right to dissent, but simply because Barronelle disagrees with the state about marriage, the government and ACLU have put at risk everything she owns,” Waggoner continued. “This includes not only her business, but also her family’s savings, retirement funds, and home. It’s no wonder that so many people are rightly calling on President Trump to sign an executive order to protect our religious freedom. Because that freedom is clearly at risk for Barronelle and so many other Americans, and because no executive order can fix all of the threats to that freedom, we will ask the U.S. Supreme Court to hear this case and reverse this grave injustice.” A lower court ruled that Stutzman must pay penalties and attorneys’ fees for declining to use her artistic abilities to design custom floral arrangements for a long-time customer’s same-sex ceremony. Rather than participate, Stutzman referred Rob Ingersoll, whom she considers a friend and had served for nearly 10 years, to several other florists in the area who were comfortable promoting and participating in their ceremony. The two continued to chat about the wedding, they hugged, and Ingersoll left. “Rob Ingersoll and I have been friends since very nearly the first time he walked into my shop all those years ago,” said Stutzman (with friends like this who needs enemies OBF). “There was never an issue with his being gay, just as there hasn’t been with any of my other customers or employees. He just enjoyed my custom floral designs, and I loved creating them for him. But now the state is trying to use this case to force me to create artistic expression that violates my deepest beliefs and take away my life’s work and savings, which will also harm those who I employ. I’m not asking for anything that our Constitution hasn’t promised me and every other American: the right to create freely, and to live out my faith without fear of government punishment or interference.” In addition to Ahrend, attorney John “Jack” Connelly is also counsel of record for Stutzman and her business in the lawsuits, State of Washington v. Arlene’s Flowers and Ingersoll v. Arlene’s Flowers. https://www.lifesitenews.com/news/washington-supreme-court-govt-can-force-florist-to-participate-in-gay-weddi Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
calfoxwc Posted February 17, 2017 Report Share Posted February 17, 2017 some "friend". What a disgrace. Gays aren't the only people who dishonestly want to win a legal contrived lottery of "damages", imho. More like, leftist social engineering intimidation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clevfan4life Posted February 17, 2017 Report Share Posted February 17, 2017 I read the ruling and in this particular case she wasnt being asked to attend the wedding or participate in any way. Thats why the court decided providing flowers wasnt asking hervti endorse gay marriage. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Westside Steve Posted February 17, 2017 Report Share Posted February 17, 2017 I read the ruling and in this particular case she wasnt being asked to attend the wedding or participate in any way. Thats why the court decided providing flowers wasnt asking hervti endorse gay marriage. From a loyal follower of Judge Judy here is the best plan of attack. Accept the gig, put together some ugly ass Arrangements and bad tasting food and show up an hour or two late. You'll get sued in small claims court but that's all. A couple thousand bucks and you go home and they have learned their lesson. The lesson being don't do things just to shock and offend people. Try to be a little bit cool and realize there are some people out there who also want to be assholes. Let It Be. WSS Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OldBrownsFan Posted February 17, 2017 Author Report Share Posted February 17, 2017 She says she will appeal this to the Supreme Court but I don't think they are going to be on the side of religious rights. The Supreme Court made gay marriage the law of the land even when Anthony Scalia was on the bench with a 5-4 vote. Even if Gorsuch gets on the Supreme Court that would only get the court back to the 5-4 split on gay marriage. We'll see. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clevfan4life Posted February 17, 2017 Report Share Posted February 17, 2017 If u dont have to show up for the wedding i dont see the issue, i really dont. I think that court decision was the right one in this case Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OldBrownsFan Posted February 17, 2017 Author Report Share Posted February 17, 2017 If u dont have to show up for the wedding i dont see the issue, i really dont. I think that court decision was the right one in this case It is a matter of conscience. She served this gay person at her store for many years without a problem. She doesn't want to participate in a gay wedding. I think it is more than the gay couple picking up a floral arrangement and now she will be forced to go to where the gay wedding is taking place and set up the arrangement? That would be more of being forced to be a participant. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Westside Steve Posted February 17, 2017 Report Share Posted February 17, 2017 Plus we still have provisions in which Native Americans are allowed to do shit that's against the law and certain groups of Christians can't be forced to fight in the armed services. And shouldn't be forced to pay for other people's abortions. I know it bums you out but... WSS Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OldBrownsFan Posted February 17, 2017 Author Report Share Posted February 17, 2017 From a loyal follower of Judge Judy here is the best plan of attack. Accept the gig, put together some ugly ass Arrangements and bad tasting food and show up an hour or two late. You'll get sued in small claims court but that's all. A couple thousand bucks and you go home and they have learned their lesson. The lesson being don't do things just to shock and offend people. Try to be a little bit cool and realize there are some people out there who also want to be assholes. Let It Be. WSS Yep there are more ways than one to skin a cat but I guess the catch 22 is that wouldn't be the 'Christian' thing to do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MLD Woody Posted February 17, 2017 Report Share Posted February 17, 2017 From a loyal follower of Judge Judy here is the best plan of attack. Accept the gig, put together some ugly ass Arrangements and bad tasting food and show up an hour or two late. You'll get sued in small claims court but that's all. A couple thousand bucks and you go home and they have learned their lesson. The lesson being don't do things just to shock and offend people. Try to be a little bit cool and realize there are some people out there who also want to be assholes. Let It Be. WSS So this gay person trying to get the same service a straight would get is them being an asshole And the solution is to be a bigger awhile back, as you attempt to ruin the wedding? Which I imagine won't look good for your business Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
calfoxwc Posted February 17, 2017 Report Share Posted February 17, 2017 a hamburger, no problem. being forced to violate a society standard of decency and mentally healthy existence, and violating core commonly held moral beliefs.... that is 1984. Defying one's belief system, or be dominated and coerced by the state? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Westside Steve Posted February 17, 2017 Report Share Posted February 17, 2017 So this gay person trying to get the same service a straight would get is them being an asshole And the solution is to be a bigger awhile back, as you attempt to ruin the wedding? Which I imagine won't look good for your business Let's not pretend they didn't select these people just to fuck with them Woody. There are probably a thousand businesses in town that would be happy to do it. This was a hatchet job.They didn't care about the wedding he cared about sticking it in these people's eye. Your buddy Cleve was just advocated spitting in the police officers food. WSS Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BaconHound Posted February 17, 2017 Report Share Posted February 17, 2017 The scary part is these are the same arguments made for Brown v Board of Education and Plessy v Ferguson. What boggles the mind is all the "constitutionalists" who ignore the 14th Amendment even though the highest court in the land has used it to settle case involving discrimination over the years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clevfan4life Posted February 17, 2017 Report Share Posted February 17, 2017 It is a matter of conscience. She served this gay person at her store for many years without a problem. She doesn't want to participate in a gay wedding. I think it is more than the gay couple picking up a floral arrangement and now she will be forced to go to where the gay wedding is taking place and set up the arrangement? That would be more of being forced to be a participant. Than thsts obviously different but reading the ruling thats not what it sounded like Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clevfan4life Posted February 17, 2017 Report Share Posted February 17, 2017 Your buddy Cleve was just advocated spitting in the police officers food. WSS Excuse you i did no such thing!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Westside Steve Posted February 17, 2017 Report Share Posted February 17, 2017 Excuse you i did no such thing!! I see you went back and deleted it. I should have actually quoted. Something for cops... WSS Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clevfan4life Posted February 17, 2017 Report Share Posted February 17, 2017 I see you went back and deleted it. I should have actually quoted. Something for cops... WSS I didnt delete anything, i said "whoppers for cops" tongue firmly in cheek. You know what movie thats from right? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MLD Woody Posted February 17, 2017 Report Share Posted February 17, 2017 Let's not pretend they didn't select these people just to fuck with them Woody. There are probably a thousand businesses in town that would be happy to do it. This was a hatchet job. They didn't care about the wedding he cared about sticking it in these people's eye. Your buddy Cleve was just advocated spitting in the police officers food. WSS And you advocated ruining a gay wedding to prove a point... So... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DieHardBrownsFan Posted February 18, 2017 Report Share Posted February 18, 2017 Let's not pretend they didn't select these people just to fuck with them Woody. There are probably a thousand businesses in town that would be happy to do it. This was a hatchet job. They didn't care about the wedding he cared about sticking it in these people's eye. Your buddy Cleve was just advocated spitting in the police officers food. WSS It's been reported to the authorities good buddy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clevfan4life Posted February 18, 2017 Report Share Posted February 18, 2017 It's been reported to the authorities good buddy. Baahahahahahahahahahaha Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Westside Steve Posted February 18, 2017 Report Share Posted February 18, 2017 I didnt delete anything, i said "whoppers for cops" tongue firmly in cheek. You know what movie thats from right?I haven't got the slightest idea what piece of shit it's from. I'm assuming, and you could tell me otherwise if it's true, but I doubt it, that it's about spitting in police officers food. And you and Woody aren't stupid enough oh, well maybe I'm going too far, to think that the gay people could only find this one baker or florist or caterer to give them a nice wedding they're doing it to be assholes. Even if the Caterers are being assholes too. WSS Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Westside Steve Posted February 18, 2017 Report Share Posted February 18, 2017 And Cleve I'm really not trying just to give you shit here but think about this for one minute. If it was me and it was some group of people, no idea who, but somebody it would be offended by me, even if I thought it was ridiculous and it would really bum them out to have me perform at their affair I think I would just tell them look guys I understand he probably be happier with somebody else. No harm no foul. I can't imagine there aren't thousands caterers, especially florist, you could do as good or better job that would fit you're somewhat skewed lifestyle. Or if they were really uncomfortable working for me I think I could find it in my heart to just let them off the hook. I think if we just treat each other with a little bit of respect bite the bullet and not try to be so fucking confrontational all the time we'd be better off. Even if I think they are wrong. WSS Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clevfan4life Posted February 18, 2017 Report Share Posted February 18, 2017 Never saw supertroopers? Not the greatest movie ever made but it had its moments. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Westside Steve Posted February 18, 2017 Report Share Posted February 18, 2017 Never saw supertroopers? Not the greatest movie ever made but it had its moments. I see a lot so many of them fall through the cracks. WSS Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clevfan4life Posted February 18, 2017 Report Share Posted February 18, 2017 https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=U0s0czlJ4xA Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clevfan4life Posted February 18, 2017 Report Share Posted February 18, 2017 Jog ur memory? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
htownbrown Posted February 18, 2017 Report Share Posted February 18, 2017 Steve that's not what he said. Pretty sure your thinking of a post in the refusing service thread. Had nothing to do with cops. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clevfan4life Posted February 18, 2017 Report Share Posted February 18, 2017 Heres the scene i was referencing earlier.... https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=7V5Bbe0kfuU "No i was just tellin him that so he makes it good".....omfg im dyin again Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
calfoxwc Posted February 18, 2017 Report Share Posted February 18, 2017 http://constitution.com/christian-persecution-america-possibly-costs-christian-home-assets/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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