The Gipper Posted July 8, 2015 Report Share Posted July 8, 2015 Having small, shifty, slot receivers is cool and all - but a big bodied pass catcher that can use a tall frame to shield the defender away is a damn nice thing to have. Hartline isn't all that "tall to shield a defender away from him" is he? In context with Tiamat63's statement he is.....our "small, shifty, slot receivers are 5-7" and 5-8".....so thats a 6"+ difference..... How tall is Hartline? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mudfly Posted July 8, 2015 Report Share Posted July 8, 2015 He's 6-2..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Gipper Posted July 8, 2015 Report Share Posted July 8, 2015 He's 6-2..... I see Pryor is listed at 6'4" I thought he was more like 6'6" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mudfly Posted July 8, 2015 Report Share Posted July 8, 2015 yep...Pryor would be the tallest 6-4, Gordon 6-3, Bowe, Mayle and Hartline are at 6-2.......but our "little" guys are extremely small....smurfish actually.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tiamat63 Posted July 8, 2015 Report Share Posted July 8, 2015 When you're 5'10- 11 going against a 6'2 receiver, believe me it makes a difference. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mudfly Posted July 9, 2015 Report Share Posted July 9, 2015 ... and undeniably the weakest link compared to our other starting four. Hey! Someone has to be... but Mitch always has had Z's love to see him through. Exactly right on Bito... he was an easy call last year. Bito's combination of athleticism and technique rocketed him to third place behind Joe and Mack. The only thing he lacks is height and reach to be a great LT... make that height as surprisingly Joe lacks the "required" arm length as well... lol... Player .......... Ht / Arm Length / 3-cone / Shuttle Joe Thomas .. : 6'6.5 / 32-1/2 / 7.95 / 4.84 https://www.google.com/search?sourceid=ie7&q=joel+bitonio+combine+results&rls=com.microsoft:en-US:IE-Address&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8&rlz=1I7TSNF_en&gws_rd=ssl#q=joe+thomas+nfl+combine+results+arm+length Joel Bitonio .... : 6'4.2 / 33-7/8 / 7.37 / 4.44 http://www.nfl.com/combine/profiles/joel-bitonio?id=2543737 Cam Eving ..... : 6'5.4 / 34-1/8 / 7.48 / 4.63 http://www.nfl.com/draft/2015/profiles/cameron-erving?id=2552240 Mitch Schwartz: 6'5.3 / 33-1/2 / 7.86 / 4.87 http://www.nfl.com/combine/profiles/mitchell-schwartz?id=2532945 Michael Bowie : 6'4.5 / 31-1/2 / 8.06 / 4.84 http://www.nfldraftscout.com/ratings/dsprofile.php?pyid=90268&draftyear=2013&genpos=ot Like I said, Cam makes it more interesting this year. Hmmm......Cams 2 arms are longer than Hawkins and Gabe are tall.....(probably weigh about the same too)....HA! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tour2ma Posted July 10, 2015 Author Report Share Posted July 10, 2015 lol... and thus was the O-line thread completely transformed to a WR thread... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mudfly Posted July 11, 2015 Report Share Posted July 11, 2015 quicky little o-line spot from Browns.com.....nothing much new here.....none the less, here it is for those who need a few crumbs(like me)... http://www.clevelandbrowns.com/media-center/videos/Browns-Huddle-Offensive-Line-Breakdown/a2e49cca-1962-4064-92a6-558f4dab5ea0 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flugel Posted July 12, 2015 Report Share Posted July 12, 2015 Replace Pryor with Hartline and I agree with your statement. As for Macks injury, we now have an upper tier replacement in Greco. Thus Cam can move in at RG. Flip has expressly said he's getting his backs involved, which I'm all in agreement for. I can't begin to stress how difficult it can be as a linebacker to track a back and then make an open field stop, more specifically after there's been an assignment change from motion. That Greco replacement idea at Center is a comfort IF an inexperienced guy is capable of beating him out at RG especially when he's coming off the best football of his career. Some of these 340 pound DTs excel at getting up underneath taller lankier guys like McQuistan, who remained better suited to face taller and lighter guys coming off the edge than what we needed from him. We thought he could be used interchangeably here and learned the hard way it wasn't as possible here as it was for a Superbowl Champion. I'm very intrigued and excited about Erving; but I'm not as confident in how immediately ready he is for that fate. I say that in the sense of sizing up the horse for the race - looks like he needs more muscle, power and explosion to go with his athletic feet and agility. I see him as a red shirt guy; BUT I'm wrong a lot when I put on my football psychic hat. I just hope people don't panic or call him a bust if he's not starting right away. Sometimes that's a good thing. Greco only started something like 4 games filling in for injury the 3 years he was in St Louis. The first year he was in Cleveland, if we started him just once we lost a conditional 4th or 5th round pick so he didn't start once that year. When he did start for us - he left a lot to be desired before he finally showed up about 20 pounds lighter to achieve the highest rankings he's had at OG in 2014. Erving shouldn't take that long; but the bigger point is success isn't always immediate. In particular, I'm thinking of Paul Farren who eventually started at 3 different positions here after his late round draft pick red shirted him early. He was a guy that loved football so his tireless work ethic and commitment would persevere for him/us. He was a pretty good LT on a playoff team here which says all it has to about what the right innerchest can accomplish when we have the right setup here. Erving kind of reminds me of him. As for the setting, the strength and conditioning coaches will pack that frame will more power, size and explosion necessary for giddy up and get after it in the trenches. I'm looking forward to seeing what a well healed Michael Bowie brings to the table. He started at 3 different positions on Seattle's Superbowl Championship running game. The roster for the Browns in Pro Football Weekly Preview 2015 lists him at only 23 years of age. Therefore, he's young and experienced - how cool is that? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mudfly Posted July 12, 2015 Report Share Posted July 12, 2015 Good post Flugel...Im down with the Erving on the bench part too. We needed immediate depth and he fills that role just fine from the bench. The beauty is that once he develops and becomes the starter, we have "upgraded" at a position that is now filled by a player currently ranked 6th at his position..... A nice steak is great.....fillet mignon...even better Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tour2ma Posted July 12, 2015 Author Report Share Posted July 12, 2015 quicky little o-line spot from Browns.com.....nothing much new here.....none the less, here it is for those who need a few crumbs(like me)... http://www.clevelandbrowns.com/media-center/videos/Browns-Huddle-Offensive-Line-Breakdown/a2e49cca-1962-4064-92a6-558f4dab5ea0 Greco "good"; Schwartz "amazing"??? That part was new... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tour2ma Posted August 5, 2015 Author Report Share Posted August 5, 2015 Update from Camp... Day 5 from http://www.dawgsbynature.com/2015/8/4/9096469/cleveland-browns-training-camp-report-day-5 4. A Peek at the Offensive Line: If things have been going hot for NT Danny Shelton, they haven't been so hot for the team's other first-round pick, OL Cameron Erving. The Browns continue using Erving at right guard with the second-team offense. He isn't struggling in camp by any means, but his primary competition right now is RG John Greco, and there haven't been any signs of a change coming with the first-team offensive line. My projection right now is that Erving starts the season as a backup, but would be the first player to enter the game is an injury should occur. Here is what offensive line coach Andy Moeller said about Greco after practice: "Last year, John did a great job for us. John really exceeded my expectations a year ago. He has played well this fall. He is a competitive guy. He is a veteran. He knows how to play. He is smart. John is obviously an important guy, and I like the way he has played so far." Moeller also talked about OL Michael Bowie, who has lost 40 pounds since February. Moeller praised his effort to get in shape, but also noted that he needs to be more consistent. The language Moeller used didn't seem to indicate that Bowie is any form of a threat to Mitchell Schwartz' starting job this camp. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tour2ma Posted August 11, 2015 Author Report Share Posted August 11, 2015 Tweet from today's, Tuesday's camp... Andrew Gribble @Andrew_Gribble Joe Thomas not in pads today but he's in good spirits and stretching with the team. Cam is getting his 1st team reps. Bowie to go with the 2's. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mudfly Posted August 11, 2015 Report Share Posted August 11, 2015 turned on WKNR yesterday and they were talking to someone about OL......the guy was uber intelligent and spoke so eloquently and with a thorough knowledge of the OL, their assignments and gave a good assessment of the players....and I was thinking this HAS to be Andy Moeller or DeLione.....but it wasnt....it was Mitchell Schwartz Very impressive to hear him speak.....sounds like he really has a grip on the game and his role with the team......and a great sense of humor about being the worst guy on the best line.....wish I had a link to post, cause it was a great interview.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
calfoxwc Posted August 11, 2015 Report Share Posted August 11, 2015 Doesn't an offensive lineman have a lot more to learn than a defensive lineman? I don't get the idea that Irving isn't a big a talent as Shelton just because he hasn't stepped in and locked up a starting postion on the oline. Maybe it's just me..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gftChris Posted August 11, 2015 Report Share Posted August 11, 2015 Schwartz is known as the oracle, for his smarts, I believe? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mudfly Posted August 11, 2015 Report Share Posted August 11, 2015 Schwartz is known as the oracle, for his smarts, I believe? could be....I always hear how smart our O line guys are, though wasnt aware it was Schwartz..... Ive only heard him a few times commenting after games, as its rare that he speaks(usually Thomas or Mack)....but he sounds like a freaking brain surgeon...ha! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gftChris Posted August 11, 2015 Report Share Posted August 11, 2015 http://espncleveland.com/common/more.php?m=49&r=17&post_id=38311 The Oracle (Mitchell Schwartz) “We call him the Oracle because he’s so smart, he knows everything,” said Joe Thomas. “He knows all and sees all,” said John Greco. “He’s the ever-knowing being. And our big thing is he’s never wrong. But even if he is, he convinces you that you’re wrong and he’s right.” Schwartz accepts the nickname as a badge of honor. “It’s a cool nickname,” Schwartz said. “I don’t like being wrong. In this job, you can be out of a job just as easily for mental errors as you can for physical ones. I always try to be on top of everything. “I do have a good memory for specific plays a year or two ago, or like a scheme we did last year against a certain team. I just have a good memory for that stuff.” Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mudfly Posted August 11, 2015 Report Share Posted August 11, 2015 http://espncleveland.com/common/more.php?m=49&r=17&post_id=38311 The Oracle (Mitchell Schwartz) “We call him the Oracle because he’s so smart, he knows everything,” said Joe Thomas. “He knows all and sees all,” said John Greco. “He’s the ever-knowing being. And our big thing is he’s never wrong. But even if he is, he convinces you that you’re wrong and he’s right.” Schwartz accepts the nickname as a badge of honor. “It’s a cool nickname,” Schwartz said. “I don’t like being wrong. In this job, you can be out of a job just as easily for mental errors as you can for physical ones. I always try to be on top of everything. “I do have a good memory for specific plays a year or two ago, or like a scheme we did last year against a certain team. I just have a good memory for that stuff.” Thanks for that.....The Oracle....ha! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mudfly Posted August 11, 2015 Report Share Posted August 11, 2015 here's the podcast..... http://www.stationcaster.com/player_skinned.php?s=70&c=476&f=4699363 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tiamat63 Posted August 11, 2015 Report Share Posted August 11, 2015 Doesn't an offensive lineman have a lot more to learn than a defensive lineman? I don't get the idea that Irving isn't a big a talent as Shelton just because he hasn't stepped in and locked up a starting postion on the oline. Maybe it's just me..... In a sense you could say oline requires a bit more situatonal awareness and quick thinking. However on the flip side you have to be just as quick as well. Ultimately I'd yield to Oline as being the more cerebral group of the two. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wargograw Posted August 11, 2015 Report Share Posted August 11, 2015 As far as cerebral I don't think there's any doubt. Rarely see a DL that sounds much smarter than Retard, but for OL it's the norm. As for which has more to learn....yeah that's OL too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Canton Dawg Posted August 11, 2015 Report Share Posted August 11, 2015 Thanks for that.....The Oracle....ha! I've heard "The Schwartz" on a couple of interviews last year, and you're right the dude is cerebral. You gotta think that after his playing days are over, a coaching spot could be in his future. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gftChris Posted August 11, 2015 Report Share Posted August 11, 2015 I've heard "The Schwartz" on a couple of interviews last year, and you're right the dude is cerebral. You gotta think that after his playing days are over, a coaching spot could be in his future. JT must have an OL coaching job for life in cleveland - heck, he's probably already doing the job. Being his position coach must be like being Peyton's OC. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Gipper Posted August 11, 2015 Report Share Posted August 11, 2015 http://espncleveland.com/common/more.php?m=49&r=17&post_id=38311 The Oracle (Mitchell Schwartz) “We call him the Oracle because he’s so smart, he knows everything,” said Joe Thomas. “He knows all and sees all,” said John Greco. “He’s the ever-knowing being. And our big thing is he’s never wrong. But even if he is, he convinces you that you’re wrong and he’s right.” Schwartz accepts the nickname as a badge of honor. “It’s a cool nickname,” Schwartz said. “I don’t like being wrong. In this job, you can be out of a job just as easily for mental errors as you can for physical ones. I always try to be on top of everything. “I do have a good memory for specific plays a year or two ago, or like a scheme we did last year against a certain team. I just have a good memory for that stuff.” Well, he is a deity: "May The Schwartz be with you". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mudfly Posted August 12, 2015 Report Share Posted August 12, 2015 ok....eye opening article on Joe Thomas(who has NEVER missed a snap in his 8 years of nfl ball) and his knee bump the other day..... According to Thomas, he has torn his MCL 3 times and suffered 2 high ankle sprains(the worst kind)....yet, he plays on.... One of the main reasons why Thomas was so confident it wasn’t serious? He’s had serious knee issues before, most of which he’s discretely played through during his eight-years-and-counting run as the Browns’ cornerstone left tackle. Thomas said he’s torn his MCL three times and suffered two high ankle sprains over the past eight seasons. How’s he done it? “You suck it up. You’re a lineman,” Thomas said. “The great part about being a lineman is you need to be quick and fast, but you don’t need to be that quick and fast. If you lose a little bit because you’re hurting, you can make it up with technique.” http://www.clevelandbrowns.com/news/article-5/Browns-OT-Joe-Thomas-walks-away-from-injury-scare-with-humor-intact-/ec8f8144-6c4c-4c83-b17b-8f37eb085af3 Wow....I now have even more admiration for his legacy(if thats possible)...... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tour2ma Posted August 12, 2015 Author Report Share Posted August 12, 2015 That's some serious, old-school attitude there... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mudfly Posted August 14, 2015 Report Share Posted August 14, 2015 gotta say...of all the things that bothered me from the Washington game, the play of the 2nd team OL bothered me most. Honestly, they were terrible. Seymour - Painter - Barton picked up right were they left off last season.....(getting beat).....Bowie wasn't good either.....(Ima give Cam a pass, even though he had a rough game, simply because hes had barely any reps at OT) So....#1) praying to avoid injury on the OL.....#2) Hoping they dont carry too many of these 2nd tier OL guys(if any) in lieu of some better skilled players at other spots..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wargograw Posted August 14, 2015 Report Share Posted August 14, 2015 I think we are in for no major injuries on the OL this year but we will have multiple starters miss a game here or there, which is the norm for most teams. I mentioned it the other day Mud but I'll just reiterate, you can't expect 4 guys to not miss a snap again. We got lucky with that (or maybe our luck was neutral given Mack's injury, whatever). But I was definitely disappointed in Bowie too. You going to practice tomorrow? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mudfly Posted August 14, 2015 Report Share Posted August 14, 2015 Yeah...I dont expect it....though I have grown accustomed to uber reliable guys.....Schwartz and Thomas have never missed a snap.....ever.....and, until last season, Mack had never missed a snap either...so having 3 back ups on the active roster makes no sense to me, as its been years since we needed that many... So, while I understand that anyone can go down on any play, historically this group has proven to be as reliable as any. And if we have a couple guys who can play several positions, Id say a couple back ups are enough to start. These other OL guys can be stashed on the PS and brought up if needed or just waived and resigned later(or maybe we sign someone better??).....etc etc.... Was gonna go to practice on sat, but now have another engagement I gotta go to....kinda bummed Ill miss it....oh well Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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