FRONT PAGE    SPORTS BOARD  Hop To Forum Categories  Political Discussion    Cass Sunstein on Obama
Page 1 2 3 4 5 

Moderators: Admin, Chicopee John
Go
New
Find
Tools
Reply
  
-star Rating Rate It!  Login/Join 
Hall of Fame Legend
Posted
quote:
Obama: The University of Chicago Democrat


Not so long ago, the phone rang in my office. It was Barack Obama. For more than a decade, Obama was my colleague at the University of Chicago Law School.

He is also a friend. But since his election to the Senate, he does not exactly call every day. On this occasion, he had an important topic to discuss: the controversy over President George W. Bush's warrantless surveillance of international telephone calls between Americans and suspected terrorists. I had written a short essay suggesting that the surveillance might be lawful. Before taking a public position, Obama wanted to talk the problem through. In the space of about 20 minutes, he and I investigated the legal details. He asked me to explore all sorts of issues: the President's power as commander-in-chief, the Constitution's protection against unreasonable searches and seizures, the Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Act, the Authorization for Use of Military Force and more.

Obama wanted to consider the best possible defense of what Bush had done. To every argument I made, he listened carefully and offered a specific counter-argument. After the issue had been exhausted, Obama said that he thought the program was illegal, but now had a better understanding of both sides. He thanked me for my time.

This was a pretty amazing conversation, not only because of Obama's mastery of the legal details, but also because many prominent Democratic leaders had already blasted the Bush initiative as blatantly illegal. He did not want to take a public position until he had listened to, and explored, what might be said on the other side. This is the Barack Obama I have known for nearly 15 years--a careful and even-handed analyst of law and policy, unusually attentive to multiple points of view. The University of Chicago Law School is by far the most conservative of the great American law schools. It helped to provide the academic foundations for many positions of the Reagan administration. But at the University of Chicago, Obama is liked and admired by Republicans and Democrats alike. Some of the local Reagan enthusiasts are Obama supporters. Why? It doesn't hurt that he's a great guy, with a personal touch and a lot of warmth. It certainly helps that he is exceptionally able. But niceness and ability are only a small part of the story. Obama also has a genuinely independent mind, he's a terrific listener and he goes wherever reason takes him.

Many people are emphasizing that Obama is a terrific speaker; they are wondering whether he has substance as well. But those of us who have long known Obama are impressed and not a little amazed by his rhetorical skills. Who could have expected that our colleague, a teacher of law, is also able to inspire large crowds?

The Obama we know is no rhetorician; he shines not because he can move people, but because of his problem-solving abilities, his creativity, his lack of partisanship, and his attention to detail.

In recent months, his speaking talents, and the cult-like atmosphere that occasionally surrounds him, have led people to ask about the substance behind the plea for "change" - whether the soaring phrases might disguise a kind of emptiness and vagueness. But nothing could be further from the truth. He is most comfortable in the domain of policy and detail.

I do not deny that skeptics are raising legitimate questions. After all, Obama has served in the Senate for a short period (less than four years) and he has little managerial experience. Is he really equipped to lead the most powerful nation in the world?

Obama speaks of "change," but it is reasonable to ask: Will he be able to produce large-scale changes in a short time? An independent issue is that all the enthusiasm might serve to insulate him from criticisms and challenges on the part of his own advisers--and, in view of his relative youth, criticisms and challenges are exactly what he requires.

Fortunately, the candidate's campaign proposals offer strong and encouraging clues about how he would govern; what makes them distinctive is that they borrow sensible ideas from all sides. Some people are describing Obama as a conventional liberal, or as "the most liberal person in the Congress," but these descriptions are preposterous. Obama is a pragmatist, first and foremost, and he defies the standard political categories. In this sense, he is not only focused on details but is also a uniter, both by inclination and on principle.

He is strongly committed to helping the disadvantaged, but his University of Chicago background shows. He appreciates the virtues and power of free markets. In some of his most important disagreements with Senator Clinton, he suggested caution about mandates and bans, and stressed the value of freedom of choice.

Transparency and accountability matter greatly to him; they are a defining feature of his proposals. With respect to the mortgage crisis, credit cards, and the broader debate over credit markets, Obama rejects heavy-handed regulation and insists above all on disclosure, so that consumers will know exactly what they are getting.

Expect transparency to be a central theme in any Obama administration, as a check on government and the private sector alike. It is highly revealing that Obama worked with Republican Tom Coburn to produce legislation creating a publicly searchable database of all federal spending.

Obama's healthcare plan places a premium on cutting costs and on making care affordable, without requiring adults to purchase health insurance. (He would require mandatory coverage only for children.) Republican legislators are unlikely to support a mandatory approach, and his plan can be understood, in part, as a recognition of political realities.

But it is also a reflection of his keen interest in allowing people to choose as they see fit. He seeks universal coverage not through unenforceable mandates but through giving people good options.

It should not be surprising that in terms of helping low-income workers, Obama has long been enthusiastic about the Earned Income Tax Credit--an approach, pioneered by Republicans, that supplements wages but does not threaten to throw people out of work. In the environmental domain, Obama is a strong supporter of incentive-based programs, not of command-and-control. Here too, he draws on ideas that have been pressed most prominently by Republicans (and he gives them credit for their initiative in this domain).

But Obama is no a compromiser; he does not try to steer between the poles (or the polls). "Triangulation" has no appeal for him. Both internationally and domestically, he is willing to think big and to be bold. As everyone knows, he publicly opposed the war in Iraq at a time when opposition was exceedingly unpopular. (In his speech opposing the war, by the way, he went out of his way to emphasize, before a largely pacifist audience, that he does not oppose all wars: "After September 11th, after witnessing the carnage and destruction, the dust and the tears, I supported this Administration's pledge to hunt down and root out those who would slaughter innocents in the name of intolerance, and I would willingly take up arms myself to prevent such a tragedy from happening again.")

As everyone also knows, Obama favors high-level meetings with some of the world's worst dictators. He would rethink the embargo against Cuba.

He proposes a $150 billion research budget for climate change. He wants to hold an unprecedented national auction for the right to emit greenhouse gases. (This is an idea, by the way, that has large support among economists and that can be traced to an essay by Ronald Coase on communications policy.) He has offered an ambitious plan for promoting technological innovation, calling for a national broadband policy, embracing network neutrality, and proposing a reform of the patent system.

His campaign has spoken of moving toward "iPod Government"--an effort to rethink public services and national regulations in ways that will make things far simpler and more user-friendly. These are points about policies and substance. As president, Obama would set a new tone in US politics. He refuses to demonize his political opponents; deep in his heart, I believe, he doesn't even think of them as opponents. It would not be surprising to find Republicans and independents prominent in his administration. Obama wants to know what ideas are likely to work, not whether a Democrat or a Republican is responsible for them. Recall the most memorable passage from his keynote address at the 2004 Democratic Convention: "We coach Little League [baseball] in the blue [Democratic-voting] states, and, yes, we've got some gay friends in the red states. There are patriots who opposed the war in Iraq, and there are patriots who supported the war in Iraq."

In his book The Audacity of Hope, he asks for a politics that accepts "the possibility that the other side might sometimes have a point." Remarking that ordinary Americans "don't always understand the arguments between right and left, conservative and liberal," Obama wants politicians "to catch up with them,"

After he received an email from a pro-life doctor, Obama recalls how he softened his website's harsh rhetoric on abortion, writing: "[T]hat night, before I went to bed, I said a prayer of my own--that I might extend the same presumption of good faith to others that the doctor had extended to me."

In short, Obama's own approach is insistently charitable. He assumes decency and good faith on the part of those who disagree with him. And he wants to hear what they have to say. Both in substance and in tone, Obama questions the conventional political distinctions between "the left" and "the right" He has attracted significant support from Republicans and independents, and it is largely for this reason.

From knowing Obama for many years, I have no doubts about his ability to lead. He knows a great deal, and he is a quick learner. Even better, he knows what he does not know, and there is no question that he would assemble an accomplished, experienced team of advisers. His brilliant administration of his own campaign provides helpful evidence here.

But there may be some fragility to the public fervor that has occasionally envelops him. Crowds and cults can be fickle, and if some of his decisions disappoint, or turn out badly, his support will diminish. Some people think it might even collapse.

My own concern involves the importance of internal debate. The greatest American presidents (above all Lincoln and Roosevelt) benefited from robust dialogue and from advisers who avoided saying, "how wonderful you are," and were willing to say: "Mr President, your thinking about this is all wrong." Because Obama himself is exceptionally able, and because so many people are treating him as a near-messiah, his advisers might be too deferential, too unwilling to question. There is a real risk here. But I believe that his humility, and his intense desire to seek out dissenting views, will prove crucial safeguards.

In the 2000 campaign, Bush proclaimed himself a "uniter, not a divider," only to turn out to be the most divisive President in memory. Because of his own certainty, and his lack of curiosity about what others might think, Bush polarized the nation. Many of his most ambitious plans went nowhere as a result.

As president, Barack Obama would be a genuine uniter, drawing ideas from multiple points of view. If he proves able to achieve great things, it will be above all for that reason.

--Cass R. Sunstein
 
Posts: 2139 | Registered: Tue January 29 2008Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete MessageReport This Post
Skipper of the Lake Erie Booze Patrol
Numbers Retired and hangs in the rafters
Picture of Westside Steve
Posted Hide Post
IOW "Justice Stevens, don't take up skydiving until '09."

Resume paper is on sale this week at Office Max.


WSS
 
Posts: 5651 | Location: Norton Ohio USA | Registered: Mon September 15 2003Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete MessageReport This Post
Numbers Retired and hangs in the rafters
Posted Hide Post
This is what qualifies as "an empty suit" on this board.
 
Posts: 8105 | Registered: Wed September 28 2005Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete MessageReport This Post
Numbers Retired and hangs in the rafters
Posted Hide Post
Steve, I was hoping you'd read this. I assume this will mark the end of the "empty suit" talk? Maybe move to, "Okay, he's super smart and hard working and detail oriented and likes to be challenged by really smart people who don't agree with him and he has some really smart and progressive ideas and he's also a tremendous speaker and motivator and, yeah, he's one of those once-every-fifty-years candidates, sure, but..."

I can't really imagine the but, so I'll leave that to you. But I have a gut you'll be voting for him because you're no Cal.
 
Posts: 23654 | Registered: Sat September 13 2003Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete MessageReport This Post
Numbers Retired and hangs in the rafters
Posted Hide Post
What you don't understand, Shep, is that Steve understands that this is just someone trying to get a job in the Obama administration, and so we don't have to respond to any of it.

Otherwise known as an argument ad hominem. But that's okay. He's been slow to pick up on the whole logical fallacy thing. He thinks it makes him seem wise.

So we can't seem to get anybody to tell us why Michelle's a racist or a bitch or a ho or anti-American, and we can't seem to get anyone to tell us why Barack Obama is an empty suit.

Good article, Alo. Thanks.
 
Posts: 8105 | Registered: Wed September 28 2005Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete MessageReport This Post
Skipper of the Lake Erie Booze Patrol
Numbers Retired and hangs in the rafters
Picture of Westside Steve
Posted Hide Post
Shep
quote:
Steve, I was hoping you'd read this. I assume this will mark the end of the "empty suit" talk?


Uh, it should?




Heck Posted Sun June 15 2008 11:16 AM Sun June 15 2008 11:16 AM Hide Post
What you don't understand, Shep, is that Steve understands that this is just someone trying to get a job in the Obama administration, and so we don't have to respond to any of it.

Respond away.
A puff piece, little more than an ad from somebody who'd like to be appointed to the SC.
Yeah guys, I'm sold.

So what makes you guys wet about Obama calling a guy to work out his talking points against McCain via Bush?

Besides Kool Aid seepage?
WSS
 
Posts: 5651 | Location: Norton Ohio USA | Registered: Mon September 15 2003Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete MessageReport This Post
Numbers Retired and hangs in the rafters
Posted Hide Post
How about this, Steve: why don't you make the case that Obama is an "empty suit", as you say.

I can see making the case that McCain has more government experience, more experience in Washington. I've never gotten the "empty suit" label.

Why don't you make that case.
 
Posts: 8105 | Registered: Wed September 28 2005Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete MessageReport This Post
Hall of Fame Legend
Posted Hide Post
I think Obama is intelligent, but that doesn't make him a leader. Being a Senator (in his and McCain's case) is not like running a State. However, in McCain's case, he was a senior Naval Officer and has vast leadership experience. Not to mention real life experience. Obama drones on about "Change". But it has no substance. What is his record? What has he accomplished in life besides going to school? He is not young, even though everyone tries to act like 46 is young. I guess compared to McCain he is, but he has no experience. I think this is a phase that will either pass and he will lose, or he will crash and burn as President and make Jimmy Carter look like Reagan.
 
Posts: 2011 | Location: Cuyahoga County | Registered: Mon September 18 2006Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete MessageReport This Post
calfoxwc
Numbers Retired and hangs in the rafters
Posted Hide Post
Empty suit = zilch experience, extreme naivete based on attending a politically based "church" of racism and entitlement,
many, many strange "present" votes, one of which he was the ONLY ONE WHO DIDN'T SUPPORT THE BILL,

he is a panderer, a socialist agenda, with manipulating others based on crass class struggles, with for some reason, a serious lack of substance as a basis for legit values - and his pandering is his chosen path to success...

and Michelle Obumbla is a racist, nasty, hateful bee-ach.

MOO.
 
Posts: 10553 | Registered: Sun September 14 2003Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete MessageReport This Post
calfoxwc
Numbers Retired and hangs in the rafters
Posted Hide Post
EVEN Jiminy "peanut brain" Carter said Obumbla DOES NOT HAVE THE EXPERIENCE TO BE PRESIDENT OF THE US.

Of course, you will think "yeah, but Jimmy Carter is a long time member of the right wing conspiracy"

But then, you ignore the post rather than admit it.
 
Posts: 10553 | Registered: Sun September 14 2003Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete MessageReport This Post
Numbers Retired and hangs in the rafters
Posted Hide Post
Again, that's the experience case.

Anyone want to make the case that he's an "empty suit" - a guy who doesn't know anything about the job, and is a fraud?

Steve?
 
Posts: 8105 | Registered: Wed September 28 2005Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete MessageReport This Post
Skipper of the Lake Erie Booze Patrol
Numbers Retired and hangs in the rafters
Picture of Westside Steve
Posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by heckofajobBrownie:
How about this, Steve: why don't you make the case that Obama is an "empty suit", as you say.

I can see making the case that McCain has more government experience, more experience in Washington. I've never gotten the "empty suit" label.

Why don't you make that case.


Like I said Heck.
He isn't a moron.
And again as I said just about everybody that knows anything can ask an expert how to frame an opinion.
No matter what his party prescribed position may be.
He got the Harvard law review gig through affirmitive action, speaks well enough and has a pile of leftist pals to carry water.
So he's as "qualified" as anybody.
Even Shep.


I understand you guys need to make a god out of the guy.

he's a lefty lawyer with powerful backers.

That's it.
His pal Sunstein thinks he's hot shit. Goodie.
I bet Orrin Htch likes W.
WSS
 
Posts: 5651 | Location: Norton Ohio USA | Registered: Mon September 15 2003Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete MessageReport This Post
Hall of Fame Legend
Posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by DieHardBrownsFan:
I think Obama is intelligent, but that doesn't make him a leader. Being a Senator (in his and McCain's case) is not like running a State. However, in McCain's case, he was a senior Naval Officer and has vast leadership experience.

I kinda wonder about McCain's "leadership" qualities. Yes, he served his country honorably, but how successful a marshaller of men has he been outside the service?

I remember reading that only five Republican senators endorsed McCain in 2000. What does it say when your own colleagues don't want you to become Commander in Chief?

Obama's got his flaws, but his temperament & leadership style reminds me a lot of Ronald Reagan.
 
Posts: 2139 | Registered: Tue January 29 2008Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete MessageReport This Post
Numbers Retired and hangs in the rafters
Posted Hide Post
There's an affirmative action program at the Harvard Law Review?

Would you like to now back up that charge, too? Where are you getting all of this?

You're really becoming unhinged. He's "an empty suit" whose supporters have "drunk the Kool Aid" and need to "make him a God." Now he "got the Harvard law review gig through affirmitive action."

Nevermind the evidence. Any charge will do.
 
Posts: 8105 | Registered: Wed September 28 2005Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete MessageReport This Post
Hall of Fame Legend
Posted Hide Post
Yeah, the affirmative action comment confused me as well.

From what I've heard, Obama got the gig by being acceptable to all the ideological factions within HLR.
 
Posts: 2139 | Registered: Tue January 29 2008Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete MessageReport This Post
Hall of Fame Legend
Posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by Aloysius:
quote:
Originally posted by DieHardBrownsFan:
I think Obama is intelligent, but that doesn't make him a leader. Being a Senator (in his and McCain's case) is not like running a State. However, in McCain's case, he was a senior Naval Officer and has vast leadership experience.

I kinda wonder about McCain's "leadership" qualities. Yes, he served his country honorably, but how successful a marshaller of men has he been outside the service?

I remember reading that only five Republican senators endorsed McCain in 2000. What does it say when your own colleagues don't want you to become Commander in Chief?

Obama's got his flaws, but his temperament & leadership style reminds me a lot of Ronald Reagan.


I think Bush is the primary reason. The Republican Party was firmly in GWB's camp, along with endorsements and $$. Not to many senators wanted to risk going against the grain. McCain was seen as to "liberal".
 
Posts: 2011 | Location: Cuyahoga County | Registered: Mon September 18 2006Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete MessageReport This Post
Hall of Famer
Posted Hide Post
9-12-01,
republicans,democrats and independants were all behind this country and Bush and he blew it with Iraq.
Arrogance,and tunnel vision without concern for anything other than his own perceptions and he was completely wrong at every turn and McCain was a yes man for the whole thing.

What I love is how everyone loves to pull the "he voted for the authorization for war" card.
It was all manipulated lies and distortions by this administration that nobody was told about,and for that Bush should be censured but at this late in the game im glad his term is over and let him just fade into oblivion.
McCain as a former military man and pow should be more concerned with the welfare of our troops.
There is no victory to be had in Iraq and on day one of a new administration I would love to hear the words,"were out".
Civil war,genocide who gives a shit,they said the same thing about viet nam and guess what,they have baskin robbins and mcdonalds in viet nam now.
Get our troops home,enough already......
 
Posts: 1941 | Location: philadelphia | Registered: Sat May 12 2007Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete MessageReport This Post
Hall of Fame Legend
Posted Hide Post
I don't have any idea of why you posted your comments in this particular subject.
 
Posts: 2011 | Location: Cuyahoga County | Registered: Mon September 18 2006Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete MessageReport This Post
Skipper of the Lake Erie Booze Patrol
Numbers Retired and hangs in the rafters
Picture of Westside Steve
Posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by Aloysius:
Yeah, the affirmative action comment confused me as well.

Me too.
I don't think he's stupid.
But the Harvard Law Review at one time was traditionally given thr highest GPA.
Then other elements were added to make the appointment more "democratic" and to allow for more minority involvement.
WSS



From what I've heard, Obama got the gig by being acceptable to all the ideological factions within HLR.
 
Posts: 5651 | Location: Norton Ohio USA | Registered: Mon September 15 2003Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete MessageReport This Post
Skipper of the Lake Erie Booze Patrol
Numbers Retired and hangs in the rafters
Picture of Westside Steve
Posted Hide Post
quote:
What I love is how everyone loves to pull the "he voted for the authorization for war" card.



And you should love it.
If all you experts were sure Bush was a liar and many Dems thought so why would Kerry be fooled?
He was your military genius.
He talked as tough as anyone when it was supposed to make him sound tough.

Was he fooled or lying or did he believe it all?

Also if that's no problem why pimp Obama's dissent?
WSS
 
Posts: 5651 | Location: Norton Ohio USA | Registered: Mon September 15 2003Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete MessageReport This Post
 Previous Topic | Next Topic powered by eve community Page 1 2 3 4 5  
 

FRONT PAGE    SPORTS BOARD  Hop To Forum Categories  Political Discussion    Cass Sunstein on Obama

Designed by: CreAtens